XPost: alt.comp.os.windows-11

On Mon, 1/13/2025 4:42 PM, Chris wrote:

So 2025 will be win10 upgrade year, so what's the cheapest/simplest upgrade path for hardware and software?

I have a home desktop PC based around a Coffee Lake i3 which isn't win11 compatible. It's not often used, but I don't want to get rid of it so
what's the sweet spot cpu/mobo these days? I'd like to keep the RAM, SSD/NVMe, PSU, etc.

Can I transfer my win10 pro license key to win11? What do I lose if just
use an unlicensed version of windows?

Prepare win11 media, using Rufus.ie USB preparation tool. You can run the Setup.exe off the USB stick, when you are finished, and do a W11-over-W10 installation. A backup before hand, is recommended (so you can go back to Windows 10 more easily). Rufus.ie is a web site in Ireland, and that's
the address you'll be entering in your browser. Current version is 4.6p (portable).

[Picture]

https://i.postimg.cc/9Q0kMWTB/Rufus-Boot-Stick-Preparation.gif

If you know your PC doesn't have a TPM, doesn't have 16GB of RAM,
doesn't have an NPU, doesn't have the POPCNT instruction, there
are tick boxes in a separate dialog Rufus puts up, which are
used to disable detection of these kinds of things. My Optiplex 780,
is an example of a machine (E8400 Core2 Duo) that cannot make the trip
to Windows 11. That's an example of how old the machine has to be, to fail entirely.
The E8400 does not have SSE 4.2 or the POPCNT instruction. The E8400 is from the
year 2008.

There is more similar information, in this post.

http://al.howardknight.net/?STYPE=msgid&MSGI=%3Cvlcjv2%24mlb7%241%40dont-email.me%3E

Once Rufus has installed the materials, and Windows 11 has booted, you can check with
this command in an administrator window.

slmgr /dlv

I did the Rufus method on my 4930K (no TPM) and it is installed and running.
I will check now, and see if the license is "copied" to Windows 11.

Notice in this photo, that even though the license for the machine is
based on a sequence of Professional, I have on purpose installed Home
and the Professional license works as a Home license. Part of doing this,
was to make sure that Rufus defeated the encryption of C: for the Home edition.

[Picture]

https://i.postimg.cc/PqHvqrK1/Disk33-dual-boot-Win11-Home-Rufus-PNG.gif

Paul

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XPost: alt.comp.os.windows-11

Chris wrote:

So 2025 will be win10 upgrade year, so what's the cheapest/simplest upgrade path for hardware and software?

I have a home desktop PC based around a Coffee Lake i3 which isn't win11 compatible. It's not often used, but I don't want to get rid of it so
what's the sweet spot cpu/mobo these days? I'd like to keep the RAM, SSD/NVMe, PSU, etc.

Can I transfer my win10 pro license key to win11? What do I lose if just
use an unlicensed version of windows?

Your win 10 licence can be used with win 11. And you can install it on
most machines that are not compatible, especially if they are 212 models
or newer. You can make a usb install stick using rufus and it will
bypass the windows compatibility problems.

Take a look at elevenforums. There are tons of tutorials and threads
addressing this issue.

https://www.elevenforum.com/questions/install-update-activate/

Good luck

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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XPost: alt.comp.os.windows-11

On 13/01/2025 21:42, Chris wrote:

So 2025 will be win10 upgrade year, so what's the cheapest/simplest upgrade path for hardware and software?

I have a home desktop PC based around a Coffee Lake i3 which isn't win11 compatible. It's not often used, but I don't want to get rid of it so
what's the sweet spot cpu/mobo these days? I'd like to keep the RAM, SSD/NVMe, PSU, etc.

Can I transfer my win10 pro license key to win11? What do I lose if just
use an unlicensed version of windows?

The cheapest/simplest upgrade path is to use the same machine but to use
the Windows 11 24H2 ISO file to upgrade. Even if your machine is not compatible, the command I'll give you below will upgrade your machine
and the Windows 10 license will post no problems at all.

The method to upgrade is this:
1) Make a full backup of the hard disk to an external drive if possible
or to a separate partition;

2) Download the full ISO from this official link:

<https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/software-download/windows11>

Scroll down and look for: "Download Windows 11 Disk Image (ISO) for x64 devices"

You want to make sure to download the correct ISO. For English UK you
need multi edition ISO. USA have their own ISO. This is important
because you want to keep all your Apps and personal documents. Wrong ISO
won't allow you to keep any of the Apps but personal docs will remain safe.

3) Now mount the ISO using Windows explorer and note down the drive
letter in the location bar.

4) Launch cmd prompt as Administrator

5) run this command:

E:\setup /product server

This assumes that the drive in step 3 is E:\ but change to whatever you
get on your system;

6) Just follow the online instructions and in about 30 minutes you'll
have Windows 11 up and running.

7) I forgot to mention above that make sure Internet is disabled while
you do this because you don't want updates to clog your machine.

8) When the system is upgraded and booted 2 or three times, you can go
online and download the updates.

9) This will work for you because it worked on my potato machine. You
have the full backup so you are not losing anything.

10) In step 5, although we are using the word server, you only get
either home or professional version NOT SERVER so don't worry about it.

Good luck and post back.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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XPost: alt.comp.os.windows-11

On 1/13/2025 4:42 PM, Chris wrote:

So 2025 will be win10 upgrade year, so what's the cheapest/simplest upgrade path for hardware and software?

I have a home desktop PC based around a Coffee Lake i3 which isn't win11 compatible. It's not often used, but I don't want to get rid of it so
what's the sweet spot cpu/mobo these days? I'd like to keep the RAM, SSD/NVMe, PSU, etc.

Can I transfer my win10 pro license key to win11? What do I lose if just
use an unlicensed version of windows?

I did what Win11 24H2 user did, except that no command line
is required. Just mount to ISO and run setup.exe. Stay offline.
Choose an update. It worked fine for me, despite TPM2 being
disabled. Worth a try.

If you're the type who religiously updates then it might make
sense for you. I just did it out of curiosity, to see how salvageable
Win11 is. It's not too bad. I cleaned it up, removed Edge, installed
Classic Shell... Compared to Win10 there are just a few glitches
so far: The taskbar is a mess and it was hard to get quicklaunch
back. My utility to customize folders doesn't seem to be working.

In general, MS have broken a few things, but basically it's just
Win10. They just picked a version and decided to start calling it
11, in order to force people to accept their crap. But Copilot
and the Apps are now gone on my system, with no problems.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

In article <vm45pn$35746$1@paganini.bofh.team>, fvgtgfrf@juiklopjhy.com (Windows 11
24H2 User) wrote:

*From:* Windows 11 24H2 User <fvgtgfrf@juiklopjhy.com>
*Date:* Mon, 13 Jan 2025 22:40:05 +0000

On 13/01/2025 21:42, Chris wrote:

So 2025 will be win10 upgrade year, so what's the
cheapest/simplest upgrade
path for hardware and software?

I have a home desktop PC based around a Coffee Lake i3 which
isn't win11
compatible. It's not often used, but I don't want to get rid of
it so
what's the sweet spot cpu/mobo these days? I'd like to keep the
RAM,
SSD/NVMe, PSU, etc.

Can I transfer my win10 pro license key to win11? What do I lose
if just
use an unlicensed version of windows?

The cheapest/simplest upgrade path is to use the same machine but
to use the Windows 11 24H2 ISO file to upgrade. Even if your
machine is not compatible, the command I'll give you below will
upgrade your machine and the Windows 10 license will post no
problems at all.

The method to upgrade is this:
1) Make a full backup of the hard disk to an external drive if
possible or to a separate partition;

2) Download the full ISO from this official link:

<https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/software-download/windows11>

Scroll down and look for: "Download Windows 11 Disk Image (ISO) for
x64 devices"

You want to make sure to download the correct ISO. For English UK
you need multi edition ISO. USA have their own ISO. This is
important because you want to keep all your Apps and personal
documents. Wrong ISO won't allow you to keep any of the Apps but
personal docs will remain safe.

3) Now mount the ISO using Windows explorer and note down the drive
letter in the location bar.

4) Launch cmd prompt as Administrator

5) run this command:

E:\setup /product server

This assumes that the drive in step 3 is E:\ but change to whatever
you get on your system;

6) Just follow the online instructions and in about 30 minutes
you'll have Windows 11 up and running.

7) I forgot to mention above that make sure Internet is disabled
while you do this because you don't want updates to clog your
machine.

8) When the system is upgraded and booted 2 or three times, you can
go online and download the updates.

9) This will work for you because it worked on my potato machine.
You have the full backup so you are not losing anything.

10) In step 5, although we are using the word server, you only get
either home or professional version NOT SERVER so don't worry about
it.

Good luck and post back.

Microsoft are now allowing Windows 11 to be installed on unsupported hardware: https://youtu.be/TfUjB7k59kE although they don't guarantee that it will keep working.
The MS page announcing it and detailing what Regedit keys to add is here: https://tinyurl.com/4tctpdja

--
Regards
John

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

XPost: alt.comp.os.windows-11

Newyana2 wrote:

On 1/13/2025 4:42 PM, Chris wrote:

So 2025 will be win10 upgrade year, so what's the cheapest/simplest
upgrade
path for hardware and software?

I have a home desktop PC based around a Coffee Lake i3 which isn't win11
compatible. It's not often used, but I don't want to get rid of it so
what's the sweet spot cpu/mobo these days? I'd like to keep the RAM,
SSD/NVMe, PSU, etc.

Can I transfer my win10 pro license key to win11? What do I lose if just
use an unlicensed version of windows?

I did what Win11 24H2 user did, except that no command line
is required. Just mount to ISO and run setup.exe. Stay offline.
Choose an update. It worked fine for me, despite TPM2 being
disabled. Worth a try.

  If you're the type who religiously updates then it might make
sense for you. I just did it out of curiosity, to see how salvageable
Win11 is. It's not too bad. I cleaned it up, removed Edge, installed
Classic Shell... Compared to Win10 there are just a few glitches
so far: The taskbar is a mess and it was hard to get quicklaunch
back. My utility to customize folders doesn't seem to be working.

  In general, MS have broken a few things, but basically it's just
Win10. They just picked a version and decided to start calling it
11, in order to force people to accept their crap. But Copilot
and the Apps are now gone on my system, with no problems.

It does take a while to pick through all the settings to adjust things
to a sane choice, and turn off advertizing and rediculous "helpfull"
stuff. Also need to cull rubbish programs you don't need or want.

There are several programs that can address the screwed up taskbar, so
maybe you can find one you like.

And you're right, it's basically win 10 under the hood. They just added
a lot of crapware, then renamed everything and moved everything around,
but once you've gone through it, you'll realize ... It's just win 10
with a different color lipstick.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

XPost: alt.comp.os.windows-11

On 1/13/2025 8:09 PM, Hank Rogers wrote:

It does take a while to pick through all the settings to adjust things
to a sane choice, and turn off advertizing and rediculous "helpfull"
stuff. Also need to cull rubbish programs you don't need or want.

There are several programs that can address the screwed up taskbar, so
maybe you can find one you like.

I did finally figure that one out. There's a program that I forget
the name of now. It puts a context menu on the taskbar, which
then provides the old Toolbars menu. From there I was able to get
a Quicklaunch bar. The other problem was that it was too high and
no longer adjustable. That turned out to be an option in the Registry.
One can set icon size and then the taskbar automaticaly sizes in
accordance.
It's a but mysterious, though. Why did they break two such handy
things? It seems to be part of a gradual move toward blocking all
customizing, restricting software choice, and generally defining Windows devices as MS property that we get to rent. I was stunned to see
the cacaphony of News and Interests having ads on it, along with
piles of nonsense headlines. I didn't know it had gone so depraved.
But it seems that virtually all the crap is removable and virtually all customizing is still doable. It's just taking more work than it used to,
so that hardly anyone will do it.

The one thing I haven't yet confronted is the folder windows that
are way too wide aand rangey. On WinXP I figured out how to make
all folders the same size. On Win7 they broke the whole thing, but I
figured out how to work with the new setup. Win10 brought still more
breakage, but it was doable. Win11? I'm not sure yet. My Win10 tools
don't seem to work.

And you're right, it's basically win 10 under the hood. They just added
a lot of crapware, then renamed everything and moved everything around,
but once you've gone through it, you'll realize  ... It's just win 10
with a different color lipstick.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

In article <vm5fkm$2cjfg$1@dont-email.me>, winstonmvp@gmail.com (...w¡ñ§±¤ñ) wrote:

*From:* ...w¡ñ§±¤ñ <winstonmvp@gmail.com>
*Date:* Tue, 14 Jan 2025 03:52:04 -0700

John K.Eason wrote on 1/13/25 5:40 PM:

Microsoft are now allowing Windows 11 to be installed on
unsupported hardware:
https://youtu.be/TfUjB7k59kE although they don't guarantee that
it will keep
working.
The MS page announcing it and detailing what Regedit keys to add
is here:
https://tinyurl.com/4tctpdja

Just an fyi..
The youtube article(first link above) was written/published on
Dec 11, 2024

The MS page(the second link above) was revised on Dec 12, 2024.
=> i.e. The article has been revised and now excludes the
information on the registry key changes. Those reg key
modifications can still be found on other web sites.

Ah ok. Thanks for the heads-up. That MS page has been re-written since I looked at
it a few days ago. :^(


--
Regards
John

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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XPost: alt.comp.os.windows-11

On 1/14/2025 5:28 AM, ...w¡ñ§±¤ñ wrote:

Yes, as you've found there are tweaks/utilities for the QL Bar on Win11.

QL demise/deperecation reasons
 - Old Vista era code retained in Win10 for backward compatibility
 - Based on integration with IE bits(also deprecated in Win11 even
though Edge still supports limited IE mode).

That makes some sense in theory. I can see how they'd think
it was "progress" to remove more of IE. On the other hand, IE is
still fully there. It just can't be started from iexplore.exe without
swapping out the ieframe.dll files for older ones.

And that doesn't explain why they decided to make the taskbar
non-sizable. I started with small icons and medium taskbar. The
taskbar was not adjustable with the mouse. As near as I can tell,
Win11 no longer allows 2-storey taskbars. One can only pick icon
size, and then only via a sectre Registry settings. Then the taskbar theoretically adjusts. mine was buggy, but when I then set the
size to small in the Registry, the bar height fixed itself.

Interestingly, I swapped out ieframe.dll files easily in Win10.
Win11 told me that Explorer was busy using the 64-bit version of
ieframe. Not a big deal, but I like to use IE as default browser and
then block it going online. It makes a quick, handy HTML reader for
local files and provides a way to block FF or Chromium from
jumping online without asking. An increasing number of companies
like to make the browser call home after software install, or they
provide a Help button but actually there is no help. It just calls the
browser to visit their website. With my IE arrangment their tricks
don't work. IE just jumps up and says it can't access the site,
because my firewall is not letting it through.

Originally, I tweaked Win11 to have a QL Bar, but over time, didn't use
it as much as the Win11 Task Bar...

I don't think of them as separate. QL is part of the taskbar. It's
just more compact than "pinning" and isn't connected with open
windows. So I have the shortcuts on one side, with open windows
"badges" clearly separate. It's also nice because some software,
including my own, still provides an installer option to create a QL
shortcut.

I don't like having open windows tied to shortcut icons.
It's confusing and poor design. A shortcut is a shortcut. Making
it serve double duty as some kind of window patriarch doesn't
actually make any sense. I find that it ends up requiring me to
do a kind of micro-analysis every time I deal with the taskbar.
It doesn't flow. I use my computer a lot. For me it's worthwhile
to make everything flow so that I don't have to stop and pay
attention to functionality. It's like reversing water taps or installing
a storm door with the wrong swing. They still work, but each
requires special treatment.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

XPost: alt.comp.os.windows-11

On Mon, 13 Jan 2025 19:09:36 -0600, Hank Rogers <Hank@nospam.invalid>
wrote:

Newyana2 wrote:

On 1/13/2025 4:42 PM, Chris wrote:

So 2025 will be win10 upgrade year, so what's the cheapest/simplest
upgrade
path for hardware and software?

I have a home desktop PC based around a Coffee Lake i3 which isn't win11 >>> compatible. It's not often used, but I don't want to get rid of it so
what's the sweet spot cpu/mobo these days? I'd like to keep the RAM,
SSD/NVMe, PSU, etc.

Can I transfer my win10 pro license key to win11? What do I lose if just >>> use an unlicensed version of windows?

I did what Win11 24H2 user did, except that no command line
is required. Just mount to ISO and run setup.exe. Stay offline.
Choose an update. It worked fine for me, despite TPM2 being
disabled. Worth a try.

  If you're the type who religiously updates then it might make
sense for you. I just did it out of curiosity, to see how salvageable
Win11 is. It's not too bad. I cleaned it up, removed Edge, installed
Classic Shell... Compared to Win10 there are just a few glitches
so far: The taskbar is a mess and it was hard to get quicklaunch
back. My utility to customize folders doesn't seem to be working.

  In general, MS have broken a few things, but basically it's just
Win10. They just picked a version and decided to start calling it
11, in order to force people to accept their crap. But Copilot
and the Apps are now gone on my system, with no problems.

It does take a while to pick through all the settings to adjust things
to a sane choice, and turn off advertizing and rediculous "helpfull"
stuff. Also need to cull rubbish programs you don't need or want.

There are several programs that can address the screwed up taskbar, so
maybe you can find one you like.

And you're right, it's basically win 10 under the hood. They just added
a lot of crapware, then renamed everything and moved everything around,
but once you've gone through it, you'll realize ... It's just win 10
with a different color lipstick.

Yes, I agree. With Microsoft Windows as well as with other vendors and
software products, they always have a choice between releasing changes
with a new version number or as an update to the existing version.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

XPost: alt.comp.os.windows-11

Chris <ithinkiam@gmail.com> wrote:

Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> wrote:

On Mon, 1/13/2025 4:42 PM, Chris wrote:

So 2025 will be win10 upgrade year, so what's the cheapest/simplest upgrade >>> path for hardware and software?

I have a home desktop PC based around a Coffee Lake i3 which isn't win11 >>> compatible. It's not often used, but I don't want to get rid of it so
what's the sweet spot cpu/mobo these days? I'd like to keep the RAM,
SSD/NVMe, PSU, etc.

Can I transfer my win10 pro license key to win11? What do I lose if just >>> use an unlicensed version of windows?

Prepare win11 media, using Rufus.ie USB preparation tool. You can run the
Setup.exe off the USB stick, when you are finished, and do a W11-over-W10
installation. A backup before hand, is recommended (so you can go back to
Windows 10 more easily). Rufus.ie is a web site in Ireland, and that's
the address you'll be entering in your browser. Current version is 4.6p (portable).

Thanks. Will have a look. What's a recommended backup solution these days?
I have Macrium 7 free edition which I gather isn't supported any more.

It’s still available but hard to find. The last version is V8. Still works fine with win 11, but there’s no more updates. If you want to keep using
it, let me know and I’ll dig up the links to download if.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

XPost: alt.comp.os.windows-11

On Wed, 1/15/2025 2:00 AM, Chris wrote:

Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> wrote:

On Mon, 1/13/2025 4:42 PM, Chris wrote:

So 2025 will be win10 upgrade year, so what's the cheapest/simplest upgrade >>> path for hardware and software?

I have a home desktop PC based around a Coffee Lake i3 which isn't win11 >>> compatible. It's not often used, but I don't want to get rid of it so
what's the sweet spot cpu/mobo these days? I'd like to keep the RAM,
SSD/NVMe, PSU, etc.

Can I transfer my win10 pro license key to win11? What do I lose if just >>> use an unlicensed version of windows?

Prepare win11 media, using Rufus.ie USB preparation tool. You can run the
Setup.exe off the USB stick, when you are finished, and do a W11-over-W10
installation. A backup before hand, is recommended (so you can go back to
Windows 10 more easily). Rufus.ie is a web site in Ireland, and that's
the address you'll be entering in your browser. Current version is 4.6p (portable).

Thanks. Will have a look. What's a recommended backup solution these days?
I have Macrium 7 free edition which I gather isn't supported any more.

I still use Macrium Reflect Free 7 and have it on a USB stick (you can do both backup and restore from their Rescue Media). When making Rescue Media, you
can use WinPE5 or WinPE10 options, as both of those have USB3 support.
And WinPE10 as the flavor would be fine. Going out of support does not
affect the basic function of a "Full" backup.

While the media preparation process for making the Rescue Media includes
a "WinRE based method" for making Rescue Media, I haven't used that
since the program made a mistake, and mixed a 32 bit OS with some 64 bit materials
or vice versa. The WinPE method, even though it involves downloads,
just seemed a more solid method of making Rescue Media. You need Rescue Media to do a Bare Metal restore later (in cases where the original C: is trashed).

Macrium had a problem back around Macrium 5 or Macrium 6, related to how Microsoft manages $BITMAP or something. And that required an emergency patch. That would be an example of how a Macrium 7 could "age out", if Microsoft
made more changes. But nothing like that has happened, so the Macrium 7 I have here, continues to work just fine.

Paul

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