XPost: alt.comp.os.windows-11

I stalled around for over a week before trying to install
ExplorerPatcher and tonight I spent about 2 hours reading more and
trying to install.

1) windows update tells me that 24H2 is ready to be installed. Should
I install it first, because I read*** I'd have to uninstall
ExplorerPatcher before installing 24H2, OR SHOULD I NEVER INSTALL 24H2
because it will break most of what I want in ExplorerPatcher

What about 25H1 and 25H2, and 26. Will I have to uninstall ExPatcher
before each of those?

2) I've considered reverting to win10, but will I be forced into win11
within a year or so anyhow? Is reverting a bad idea?

3) But I tried to go ahead with the installation and still had trouble.
In addition to the people who post here who were scary, even the page
with the instructions was scary: https://github.com/valinet/ExplorerPatcher/releases/tag/22621.4317.67.1_b93337a I'll complain about that in the footnotes, but my question is how to
install it: At the bottom it has:
Assets 4
ep_setup.exe 10.6 MB 2024-11-02
ep_setup_arm64.exe 11.2 MB 2024-11-02
Source code (zip) Nov 2, 2024
Source code (tar.gz) Nov 2, 2024

I think arm has some special meaning, but I ignored my thoughts on the
matter and only noticed the "64" and, without being certain, tried to
install it. It would not install. Am I correct that I want
ep_setup.exe???? Does arm have a special meaning?

4) It also says in the middle of the page "If you are downloading from
this page, please temporarily disable real-time protection or save to a
folder excluded from antivirus scans." But what happens when I turn on
real time protection again?. Won't the AV find it and complain? Or
will it not matter by then and I can quarantine the executable, because
it's already installed?

5) Do you folks like Windhawk. Is it worth installing?

Footnotes and complaints :-) :
This would have been hard enough to understand and do if I were using
win10, but it's twice as hard with win11, because I haven't installed
Open Shell yet and win 11 is so hard to use.

After reading it 4 times I was able to do this:
For Defender, you can run the following script in PowerShell as an administrator:
Add-MpPreference -ExclusionPath "C:\Program Files\ExplorerPatcher" Add-MpPreference -ExclusionPath "$env:APPDATA\ExplorerPatcher"
Add-MpPreference -ExclusionPath "C:\Windows\dxgi.dll"
Add-MpPreference -ExclusionPath "C:\Windows\SystemApps\Microsoft.Windows.StartMenuExperienceHost_cw5n1h2txyewy" Add-MpPreference -ExclusionPath "C:\Windows\SystemApps\ShellExperienceHost_cw5n1h2txyewy"

6) If I excluded all these files, which why didn't I just exclude the installer too wherever it would be downloaded to. Then wouldn't the
problem in question 4 above not exist?

"We DO NOT recommend using EP on work machines running Windows 11
version 24H2." Because the program errors are tolerable. That's
encouraging. My parents told me I should learn to be tolerant.

***When updating to 24H2, please uninstall EP before starting the
update. You can install EP again with your settings intact after
updating to 24H2. Due to explicit blocks by Microsoft, the update cannot proceed if EP is installed.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

XPost: alt.comp.os.windows-11

On Tue, 2/11/2025 12:47 AM, micky wrote:

I stalled around for over a week before trying to install
ExplorerPatcher and tonight I spent about 2 hours reading more and
trying to install.

1) windows update tells me that 24H2 is ready to be installed. Should
I install it first, because I read*** I'd have to uninstall
ExplorerPatcher before installing 24H2, OR SHOULD I NEVER INSTALL 24H2 because it will break most of what I want in ExplorerPatcher

What about 25H1 and 25H2, and 26. Will I have to uninstall ExPatcher
before each of those?

2) I've considered reverting to win10, but will I be forced into win11 within a year or so anyhow? Is reverting a bad idea?

3) But I tried to go ahead with the installation and still had trouble.
In addition to the people who post here who were scary, even the page
with the instructions was scary: https://github.com/valinet/ExplorerPatcher/releases/tag/22621.4317.67.1_b93337a
I'll complain about that in the footnotes, but my question is how to
install it: At the bottom it has:
Assets 4
ep_setup.exe 10.6 MB 2024-11-02
ep_setup_arm64.exe 11.2 MB 2024-11-02
Source code (zip) Nov 2, 2024
Source code (tar.gz) Nov 2, 2024

I think arm has some special meaning, but I ignored my thoughts on the
matter and only noticed the "64" and, without being certain, tried to
install it. It would not install. Am I correct that I want
ep_setup.exe???? Does arm have a special meaning?

4) It also says in the middle of the page "If you are downloading from
this page, please temporarily disable real-time protection or save to a folder excluded from antivirus scans." But what happens when I turn on
real time protection again?. Won't the AV find it and complain? Or
will it not matter by then and I can quarantine the executable, because
it's already installed?

5) Do you folks like Windhawk. Is it worth installing?

Footnotes and complaints :-) :
This would have been hard enough to understand and do if I were using
win10, but it's twice as hard with win11, because I haven't installed
Open Shell yet and win 11 is so hard to use.

After reading it 4 times I was able to do this:
For Defender, you can run the following script in PowerShell as an administrator:
Add-MpPreference -ExclusionPath "C:\Program Files\ExplorerPatcher" Add-MpPreference -ExclusionPath "$env:APPDATA\ExplorerPatcher" Add-MpPreference -ExclusionPath "C:\Windows\dxgi.dll"
Add-MpPreference -ExclusionPath "C:\Windows\SystemApps\Microsoft.Windows.StartMenuExperienceHost_cw5n1h2txyewy"
Add-MpPreference -ExclusionPath "C:\Windows\SystemApps\ShellExperienceHost_cw5n1h2txyewy"

6) If I excluded all these files, which why didn't I just exclude the installer too wherever it would be downloaded to. Then wouldn't the
problem in question 4 above not exist?

"We DO NOT recommend using EP on work machines running Windows 11
version 24H2." Because the program errors are tolerable. That's encouraging. My parents told me I should learn to be tolerant.

***When updating to 24H2, please uninstall EP before starting the
update. You can install EP again with your settings intact after
updating to 24H2. Due to explicit blocks by Microsoft, the update cannot proceed if EP is installed.

ARM is Acorn RISC Machines, an architecture company that sells CPU licenses. Qualcomm is a licensee and currently makes an ARM64 laptop with the Windows OS on it.
This is indicated by "ARM64". Some previous generations of rubbish may also
fit this description (computers that people tossed away, as too annoying).

AMD is Advanced Micro Devices, which is a CPU company with a varied history.
It has not always been an Intel x86 company, having done BitSlices in the past and RISC processors.

ARM64 That Qualcomm laptop (Intel code runtimes, handled by MSFT emulator so they run on ARM)

x86 32-bit \___ Intel, AMD, and a company in China that bought the VIA license
x86_64 or AMD64 64-bit /

When a installer lacks identifiers, if the file is really old, it is x86 only (32-bit).
If newer, it could be a dual mode installer, automatically detecting whether the
32 bit or 64 bit executable is required.

People using EP, may have locked down their OS in various ways,
to make it easier for EP to work. But then it's a tradeoff, of
what you as an individual, need more. A cute hack. Or a computer
that works :-)

Paul

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

XPost: alt.comp.os.windows-11

On 2/11/2025 12:47 AM, micky wrote:

I stalled around for over a week before trying to install
ExplorerPatcher and tonight I spent about 2 hours reading more and
trying to install.

1) windows update tells me that 24H2 is ready to be installed. Should
I install it first, because I read*** I'd have to uninstall
ExplorerPatcher before installing 24H2, OR SHOULD I NEVER INSTALL 24H2 because it will break most of what I want in ExplorerPatcher

What about 25H1 and 25H2, and 26. Will I have to uninstall ExPatcher
before each of those?

2) I've considered reverting to win10, but will I be forced into win11 within a year or so anyhow? Is reverting a bad idea?

3) But I tried to go ahead with the installation and still had trouble.
In addition to the people who post here who were scary, even the page
with the instructions was scary: https://github.com/valinet/ExplorerPatcher/releases/tag/22621.4317.67.1_b93337a
I'll complain about that in the footnotes, but my question is how to
install it: At the bottom it has:
Assets 4
ep_setup.exe 10.6 MB 2024-11-02
ep_setup_arm64.exe 11.2 MB 2024-11-02
Source code (zip) Nov 2, 2024
Source code (tar.gz) Nov 2, 2024

I think arm has some special meaning, but I ignored my thoughts on the
matter and only noticed the "64" and, without being certain, tried to
install it. It would not install. Am I correct that I want
ep_setup.exe???? Does arm have a special meaning?

4) It also says in the middle of the page "If you are downloading from
this page, please temporarily disable real-time protection or save to a folder excluded from antivirus scans." But what happens when I turn on
real time protection again?. Won't the AV find it and complain? Or
will it not matter by then and I can quarantine the executable, because
it's already installed?

5) Do you folks like Windhawk. Is it worth installing?

Footnotes and complaints :-) :
This would have been hard enough to understand and do if I were using
win10, but it's twice as hard with win11, because I haven't installed
Open Shell yet and win 11 is so hard to use.

After reading it 4 times I was able to do this:
For Defender, you can run the following script in PowerShell as an administrator:
Add-MpPreference -ExclusionPath "C:\Program Files\ExplorerPatcher" Add-MpPreference -ExclusionPath "$env:APPDATA\ExplorerPatcher" Add-MpPreference -ExclusionPath "C:\Windows\dxgi.dll"
Add-MpPreference -ExclusionPath "C:\Windows\SystemApps\Microsoft.Windows.StartMenuExperienceHost_cw5n1h2txyewy"
Add-MpPreference -ExclusionPath "C:\Windows\SystemApps\ShellExperienceHost_cw5n1h2txyewy"

6) If I excluded all these files, which why didn't I just exclude the installer too wherever it would be downloaded to. Then wouldn't the
problem in question 4 above not exist?

"We DO NOT recommend using EP on work machines running Windows 11
version 24H2." Because the program errors are tolerable. That's encouraging. My parents told me I should learn to be tolerant.

***When updating to 24H2, please uninstall EP before starting the
update. You can install EP again with your settings intact after
updating to 24H2. Due to explicit blocks by Microsoft, the update cannot proceed if EP is installed.

I can tell you what I know. First, I don't know of any purpose
for EP on Win10. Most of the options are just Registry settings.
I haven't really looked at them. I use EP on Win11 only, for two
reasons:

1) Quick Launch is missing on Win11 and I hate "pinning" because
it conflates shortcuts with open program "badges". Very poor design.

2) The taskbar on Win11 is broken and designed not to be sizable.

EP, along with a Registry setting for taskbar height, fixes all that.

You want ep_setup.exe.

After installing you get a weird context menu on the taskbar.
At the top there's a choice for taskbar style. Pick Windows10 style.
You'll then have a normal context menu that allows you to add toolbars.

Unfortunately, a lot of software is not explained and doesn't
come with help. They just assume that you're part of their geek
club. And most talented programmers are not so talented in terms
of literacy. They don't think it's their job to write the docs, and
they don't like to have to put effort into communicating with others.
They live in their math head and no one forces them to be fully
socialized, because they're brilliant savants and Einstein forgot to
put on socks, too, right?

Github is the worst example of that that I've seen. Many of the
pages give no indication of what they're even about, providing a
single sentence of description. If you have questions then you can
ask them next week at the clique's Grand Theft Auto Ramen Potluck.

I have no idea whether EP problems are common. For me it was a
simple install and works great. (Finding out how it works was the big
job.) I now have a proper looking taskbar with QL
on Win11. I also disable most of the Windows BS. I remove Search
and other junk from the taskbar. I run as admin with UAC and LUA disabled.
I have Defender allowed but don't enable scans. (If I were concerned
about malware then I'd get a 3rd-party tool.) Windows Defender is like
a hysterical suburban housewife, thinking that anything it doesn't
recognize is a bad guy. It identified dozens of my own VBScripts as
malware because they do things like editing the HOSTS file. Then it
comes up with meaningless, technical sounding names for my "malware"
and warns that those files need to go. They name the offender "SettingsModifier:Win32/PossibleHostsFileHijack". It sounds like
MS hired some of the bright bulbs from the MalwareBytes crew.

Most of the crap on Win10/11 I haven't even really looked at. I
install. I see a chaotic mess of popups, warnings, ads... a Start Menu
taking up 1/6 of the screen but with Programs nowhere in sight... I
don't even consider using Windows at that point until I've cleaned it up.
I want a system that does what I tell it to. I want functional tools.
When I pick up a phillips screwdriver I don't want some clown telling
me that slot screwdrivers are on sale this week, or that I don't have permission to do anything that can't be done with pliers.

As a result, I have very limited experience with the calamity that is Windows 10/11 unhousebroken, shitting all over my monitor and CPU.

Given that, EP works great for me. As the saying goes, YMMV. :)
If you're thinking of installing EP on Win10 then my question would
be why and what do you expect it to do? I don't know of any reason
that it's needed on Win10. I'm running 10-22H2 here, with QL, and
the taskbar is fine. I added GabNetsStats so that I can see online
activity. I fixed the Start Menu with Classic Shell. I got rid of....
who knows what crap icons....

The only possible complaint I can
think of is to ask why the online indicator barely works, tells me nothing useful, and looks like an outline of a TV set with a price sticker on it.
I see things like that and wonder: How did that meeting go? Did
someone propose that showing actual activity and connection status
is a problem? Then someone else presumably piped up, "Hey, I have
a solution. Let's make a crappy icon that looks like a TV set, and let's
make sure that it doesn't even work right." Then everyone else
yelled, "Brilliant, Jeremy!" Cokes and Snickers bars were passed
around and they called it a day. Job well done... How do these things
get past committees and multiple reasonably sane people?

But, I can live with an ugly, irrelevant icon. The rest of my tweaked
system is almost as good as XP, with the added benefit that it runs
64-bit software. So I count my blessings: Win10/11 is ultimately usable,
at least for experienced tweakers. God help the poor masses being
hounded by Copilot and "News and Interests".

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

XPost: alt.comp.os.windows-11

On Tue, 11 Feb 2025 00:47:05 -0500, micky wrote:

[snip]

2) I've considered reverting to win10, but will I be forced into win11 within a year or so anyhow? Is reverting a bad idea?

[snip]

You might. They did it to Win 7 & 8 users. However, there's a program
that's supposed to block forced upgrades.
https://www.grc.com/incontrol.htm

--
Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.us/

"The age of ignorance commenced with the Christian system." -- Thomas
Paine (1737-1809)

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

XPost: alt.comp.os.windows-11

On 2/11/2025 3:20 PM, Mark Lloyd wrote:

On Tue, 11 Feb 2025 00:47:05 -0500, micky wrote:

[snip]

2) I've considered reverting to win10, but will I be forced into win11
within a year or so anyhow? Is reverting a bad idea?

[snip]

You might. They did it to Win 7 & 8 users. However, there's a program
that's supposed to block forced upgrades.
https://www.grc.com/incontrol.htm

As someone pointed out, that might possibly be a way to get security
updates without version update. I'm not sure. For anyone who intends
to stay with 10, if it were me I'd install Simplewall and plan to install Windows Update Blocker after the last security update. The GRC hack will hopefully work until Oct, but after that, the other two are a better way
to just keep MS out of your business altogether.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

XPost: alt.comp.os.windows-11

On Tue, 2/11/2025 3:59 PM, Newyana2 wrote:

On 2/11/2025 3:20 PM, Mark Lloyd wrote:

On Tue, 11 Feb 2025 00:47:05 -0500, micky wrote:

[snip]
 

2)  I've considered reverting to win10, but will I be forced into win11
within a year or so anyhow?  Is reverting a bad idea?

[snip]

You might. They did it to Win 7 & 8 users. However, there's a program
that's supposed to block forced upgrades.
https://www.grc.com/incontrol.htm

  As someone pointed out, that might possibly be a way to get security updates without version update. I'm not sure. For anyone who intends
to stay with 10, if it were me I'd install Simplewall and plan to install Windows Update Blocker after the last security update. The GRC hack will hopefully work until Oct, but after that, the other two are a better way
to just keep MS out of your business altogether.

The GRC program is not exactly a hack. There are four registry locations
with the version controls in them. Before I got the GRC thing, I was
using three of the registry locations already, to do that manually.
(Which means I'd found a recipe somewhere, for how to limit the Upgrade activity, while leaving Windows Update running -- if you stay on one
release long enough, you lose support for Security Updates and it is
roughly like End-Of-Life for you).

A typical usage for me, is to lock a Windows 10 install to 22H2 (the very
last release), so that no auto-upgrader can come along and take a 10 to 11.
I do this, because the machine will already have an 11 on board, and there
is no need to steamroll my 10 and make an 11 out of it. A lot of the
disks here, have ended up with a 10 and an 11 in the fullness of time.
The 11 may be installed by Rufus (for the 11 year old Test Machine for example).

What the GRC buys you, is an easy interface to set the Registry entries, including the one additional location the GRC author found. No DLLs are hacked. No code is injected. It is not based on a 0Patch technique. It's just
plain old Registry settings. I bet it could even map to a GPEDIT policy
(be controllable from such, if you were on Professional).

Paul

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

XPost: alt.comp.os.windows-11

On 2/11/2025 9:20 PM, Paul wrote:

On Tue, 2/11/2025 3:59 PM, Newyana2 wrote:

On 2/11/2025 3:20 PM, Mark Lloyd wrote:

On Tue, 11 Feb 2025 00:47:05 -0500, micky wrote:

[snip]

2)  I've considered reverting to win10, but will I be forced into win11 >>>> within a year or so anyhow?  Is reverting a bad idea?

[snip]

You might. They did it to Win 7 & 8 users. However, there's a program
that's supposed to block forced upgrades.
https://www.grc.com/incontrol.htm

  As someone pointed out, that might possibly be a way to get security
updates without version update. I'm not sure. For anyone who intends
to stay with 10, if it were me I'd install Simplewall and plan to install
Windows Update Blocker after the last security update. The GRC hack will
hopefully work until Oct, but after that, the other two are a better way
to just keep MS out of your business altogether.

The GRC program is not exactly a hack. There are four registry locations
with the version controls in them. Before I got the GRC thing, I was
using three of the registry locations already, to do that manually.
(Which means I'd found a recipe somewhere, for how to limit the Upgrade activity, while leaving Windows Update running -- if you stay on one
release long enough, you lose support for Security Updates and it is
roughly like End-Of-Life for you).

A typical usage for me, is to lock a Windows 10 install to 22H2 (the very last release), so that no auto-upgrader can come along and take a 10 to 11.
I do this, because the machine will already have an 11 on board, and there
is no need to steamroll my 10 and make an 11 out of it. A lot of the
disks here, have ended up with a 10 and an 11 in the fullness of time.
The 11 may be installed by Rufus (for the 11 year old Test Machine for example).

What the GRC buys you, is an easy interface to set the Registry entries, including the one additional location the GRC author found. No DLLs are hacked.
No code is injected.

I understand. I used the word hack in a general sense --
a hack in the sense of a workaround. So I was just saying
that anyone who wants security updates for the next six
months can try that. But if it were me, I'd keep disk images
just in case and add Simplewall and WUB in Oct. There's no
reason that MS can't break that hack... or rather, setting. :)

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

XPost: alt.comp.os.windows-11

On Tue, 2/11/2025 10:42 PM, Newyana2 wrote:

There's no reason that MS can't break that hack... or rather, setting. :)

Agree with that sentiment.

In fact, one of my applications of that, is precisely for that
aspect -- canary detection of skullduggery. In other words,
I don't really want the next version to be blocked,
but I do want to verify the controls still work.

Paul

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

XPost: alt.comp.os.windows-11

On 12/02/2025 03:42, Newyana2 wrote:

But if it were me, I'd keep disk images
just in case and add Simplewall and WUB in Oct. There's no
reason that MS can't break that hack... or rather, setting.

Why? People will continue using Windows 10 to avoid any updates from
Microsoft. If they want to receive Monthly updates then they should move
to windows 11.

Chances are people do not trust Microsoft and they go to Chinese and
Russian websites to find hacks and all sorts of malware to avoid
Microsoft spying on them. Nobody has yet told them that they can stop
using Windows and start using Linux where Microsoft can't reach them.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

XPost: alt.comp.os.windows-11

On 2/12/2025 12:34 AM, Ehud Omar wrote:

On 12/02/2025 03:42, Newyana2 wrote:

But if it were me, I'd keep disk images
just in case and add Simplewall and WUB in Oct. There's no
reason that MS can't break that hack... or rather, setting.

Why? People will continue using Windows 10 to avoid any updates from Microsoft. If they want to receive Monthly updates then they should move
to windows 11.

Chances are people do not trust Microsoft and they go to Chinese and
Russian websites to find hacks and all sorts of malware to avoid
Microsoft spying on them. Nobody has yet told them that they can stop
using Windows and start using Linux where Microsoft can't reach them.

Actually, I see that advice daily. The Linux fanatics are
worse than Jehovahs Witnesses. Evangelism is the strongest
indicator of lacking faith. Evangelism is essentially trying
to con oneself.

The issue under discussion here is how to avoid Microsoft
pushing Win11 where it's not wanted. Many people want to
get security updates for now, but don't want Win11. So the
issue is how to best do that, given that MS might change
their tricks at any time and have amply demonstrated that
they believe they have a right to change the product after
people have already paid for it and put it into service.

My own approach is to radically fix Win10 and lock MS out
as thoroughly as possible. But personally I don't think I'd mind
using Win11. Aside from the broken taskbar issue it seems to
be almost identical to Win10 (which, of course, it is!) once it's
been cleaned up. I'm running both and have updates blocked
on both. I also block the flurry of spyware on both that tries
to call home.

But you're right, we're all just being difficult. If we stuck
to writing Perl scripts in Emacs on Debian, to organize our
gaming convention photos, then we wouldn't be having
these problems.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

XPost: alt.comp.os.windows-11

On 2/12/2025 12:28 AM, Paul wrote:

On Tue, 2/11/2025 10:42 PM, Newyana2 wrote:

There's no reason that MS can't break that hack... or rather, setting. :)

Agree with that sentiment.

In fact, one of my applications of that, is precisely for that
aspect -- canary detection of skullduggery. In other words,
I don't really want the next version to be blocked,
but I do want to verify the controls still work.

Maybe you should have a website to share your research
with the Windows world. I have an image of you busily
working in several connected room, machines humming in
various states, stopping only occasionally to impatiently
assemble a PBJ sandwich. You could call your site "Windows
Report From the 51st State".

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

XPost: alt.comp.os.windows-11

In alt.comp.os.windows-10, on Tue, 11 Feb 2025 15:59:28 -0500, Newyana2 <newyana@invalid.nospam> wrote:

On 2/11/2025 3:20 PM, Mark Lloyd wrote:

On Tue, 11 Feb 2025 00:47:05 -0500, micky wrote:

[snip]

2) I've considered reverting to win10, but will I be forced into win11
within a year or so anyhow? Is reverting a bad idea?

[snip]

You might. They did it to Win 7 & 8 users. However, there's a program
that's supposed to block forced upgrades.
https://www.grc.com/incontrol.htm

I forgot that there is more than one meaning to "force". I had in mind
more that I wouldn't be able to do things with win10 and that would
force me back to 11. I don't know what new things win10 wouldn't be
able to do, but MS may think of something. I saw once a list of improvements in win11 and it mostly talked about integrating with AI. I
really don't trust and don't want AI.

As someone pointed out, that might possibly be a way to get security
updates without version update. I'm not sure. For anyone who intends
to stay with 10, if it were me I'd install Simplewall and plan to install >Windows Update Blocker after the last security update. The GRC hack will >hopefully work until Oct, but after that, the other two are a better way
to just keep MS out of your business altogether.

Same sort of questions.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

XPost: alt.comp.os.windows-11

On Wed, 2/12/2025 8:15 AM, Newyana2 wrote:

On 2/12/2025 12:28 AM, Paul wrote:

On Tue, 2/11/2025 10:42 PM, Newyana2 wrote:

There's no reason that MS can't break that hack... or rather, setting. :) >>

Agree with that sentiment.

In fact, one of my applications of that, is precisely for that
aspect -- canary detection of skullduggery. In other words,
I don't really want the next version to be blocked,
but I do want to verify the controls still work.

 Maybe you should have a website to share your research
with the Windows world. I have an image of you busily
working in several connected room, machines humming in
various states, stopping only occasionally to impatiently
assemble a PBJ sandwich. You could call your site "Windows
Report From the 51st State".

Um, there are others more skilled than I, who could be doing this :-)

And I don't think there is any peanut butter in the house,
and I'm also all out of jam at the moment.

The standard meme, is I would be eating Pizza Pockets.
Unfortunately, I don't think I've ever eaten any of those.

As for our statehood, we're supposed to fly the Maple Leaf
flag on Saturday this week.

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/d9/Flag_of_Canada_%28Pantone%29.svg/383px-Flag_of_Canada_%28Pantone%29.svg.png

This is our currency (polymer notes, with security features).
We haven't had the penny for a number of years now, the nickel
being the lowest denomination. $5, $10, $20, $50, $100 (the $1000 note was only used for money laundering :-) )

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/9/92/Canadian_Frontier_Banknotes_faces.png

These are our coins. $0.05, $0.10 , $0.25 , $1.00 , $2.00 (the penny, lower left, is extinct)

https://bb.ca/catalogue_images/580x358/3170099.png

The $0.50 exists but is not typically in circulation.
They were hard to find when I was younger.

The $2.00 coin is made of two metals, and for special strikings,
can have a third color added for contrast and to confuse matters.
For some reason, that slug in the center of the coin, never
seems to fall out.

In the news yesterday, we found a small fentanyl lab, and of course
we have to put that in the news, to demonstrate our "tough on crime" credentials. Normally, we go after the big fish, shutting down
organizations, as opposed to dealing with the pond scum at the
bottom of the hierarchy. Because there are more of them
than we can comfortably put in holding cells.

At one time, the fentanyl was arriving through the mail. I
can't imagine what the fascination would be with making
your own. Handling that stuff, first person, is pretty
dangerous (need to keep your naloxone handy, and if you
pass out, your buddy has to revive you).

Paul

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In alt.comp.os.windows-10, on Wed, 12 Feb 2025 20:42:23 -0500, Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> wrote:

In the news yesterday, we found a small fentanyl lab, and of course
we have to put that in the news, to demonstrate our "tough on crime" >credentials. Normally, we go after the big fish, shutting down
organizations, as opposed to dealing with the pond scum at the
bottom of the hierarchy. Because there are more of them
than we can comfortably put in holding cells.

At one time, the fentanyl was arriving through the mail. I
can't imagine what the fascination would be with making
your own. Handling that stuff, first person, is pretty
dangerous (need to keep your naloxone handy, and if you
pass out, your buddy has to revive you).

Paul

I got around to reading my surgical report from 10 years ago and found I
was given 2 doses of fentanyl. I wonder if I'm hooked but don't know
it.

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On Thu, 2/13/2025 2:57 AM, micky wrote:

In alt.comp.os.windows-10, on Wed, 12 Feb 2025 20:42:23 -0500, Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> wrote:

I got around to reading my surgical report from 10 years ago and found I
was given 2 doses of fentanyl. I wonder if I'm hooked but don't know
it.

You're conversant.

You're not dead from an O.D.

I'd say you weren't hooked :-)

*******

As a practical matter:

https://cancer.ca/en/treatments/side-effects/pain/concerns-about-pain-medicines

"Many people fear that taking pain medicines can lead to addiction.

Taking pain medicine regularly is very different from addiction. A
key part of addiction is a mental dependence on the drug. This happens
when the need to take a drug becomes a craving or an impulse that is
more than just physical. Addiction to pain drugs while they are being
used to treat cancer pain is not common.

The body can get used to some drugs if they are taken for a long period
of time. This is called physical dependence and it is a normal physical
response. When it’s time to stop taking pain medicines such as opioids
the healthcare team will slowly lower the dose so that the body
has time to adjust.
"

I'm sure the doctor will ask you a few questions, just to make
sure you aren't already an addict :-)

Paul

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XPost: alt.comp.os.windows-11

In alt.comp.os.windows-11, on Tue, 11 Feb 2025 00:47:05 -0500, micky <NONONOmisc07@fmguy.com> wrote:

I stalled around for over a week before trying to install
ExplorerPatcher and tonight I spent about 2 hours reading more and
trying to install.

Even after making a recover disk and a clone of the new Dell laptop (or
should I have made a backup instead?) I was still scared and still
stalled around for almost a day, scared by what happened the first time,
with the file that was 1/10th the proper size.

But I did it tonight and except for the result, the experience was
similar. After saying yes to the AU(?) box, it wasn't clear that it was running, there was no task in the taskboar, and no message of any sort
when it ended. It only took a second or two. I couldn't tell it had
changed anything until I right clicked on a corner of the taskbar and
got a long menu, Maybe 140 possible changes altogether.

Some had been pre-empted by Open Shell.

Many I didn't understand. There is documentation for quite a few of
those, but the one or two I've read so far, I didn't understand.

Some I changed and they didnt' change anything.

No real change to the Taskbar. No higher, still only one row. (I think
he'd fixed that before but MS came and blocked it, because it's now a
sin to have more than one row.) It did allow one to get rid of the
weather, and the search box, and the choose desktop icon, and for
elsewhere, the "Do you want to know aobut this picture".

I also installed Aerotweaker, but not many of them were things I wanted,
only 2 or 3, and even they were not important, And I have installed
Ultimate Windows Tweaker, but again very little of that do I want (and
aiui it only brings to the surface changes one could make anyway.) 7+
Taskbar Tweaker is not going to be updated for win11.

ExplorerPatcher did get back the time at the top in big numbers when you
click on the time in the systray, so it was worth it for that alone.

So I'm stuck. If they had never had a good taskbar, I wouldn't miss it
much now, but I hate to go backwards, and I'm sure they could have made
it work if they'd tried. That is the most annoying part.

Oh yeah, Alt-Tab now shows the programs that are running in the same way
win10 or maybe win7 did (since I'm using open shell on win 10 and I've
lost track of what win10 looks like versus win7, which I never had.)
But some of the programs that are running do not show up when I do
that. Huh? Macrium Replect was like this. Every timne I went to
another program, like Firefox to read about Macrium Reflect settings, MR
was gone when I tried to Alt-tab back. I have to click on the icon in
the taskbar or the three dots to see the overflow bar, and a program may
not be there either.
So I have to bring up the desktop, and to save space, I got rid of the
Choose Desktop button so I have to move the cursor to the right end of
the taskbar and click there. and then click on the desktop, even I think
if it's already running. . All this takes much longer than alt-tabbing
until I get to the program I want. It's a good thing I always put an
icon in the desktop.

Some posters on the web call this the Macification of windows. I don't
like it, no sirree. Don't like it at all.

Micky


----

1) windows update tells me that 24H2 is ready to be installed. Should
I install it first, because I read*** I'd have to uninstall
ExplorerPatcher before installing 24H2, OR SHOULD I NEVER INSTALL 24H2 >because it will break most of what I want in ExplorerPatcher

What about 25H1 and 25H2, and 26. Will I have to uninstall ExPatcher
before each of those?

2) I've considered reverting to win10, but will I be forced into win11 >within a year or so anyhow? Is reverting a bad idea?

3) But I tried to go ahead with the installation and still had trouble.
In addition to the people who post here who were scary, even the page
with the instructions was scary: >https://github.com/valinet/ExplorerPatcher/releases/tag/22621.4317.67.1_b93337a
I'll complain about that in the footnotes, but my question is how to
install it: At the bottom it has:
Assets 4
ep_setup.exe 10.6 MB 2024-11-02
ep_setup_arm64.exe 11.2 MB 2024-11-02
Source code (zip) Nov 2, 2024
Source code (tar.gz) Nov 2, 2024

I think arm has some special meaning, but I ignored my thoughts on the
matter and only noticed the "64" and, without being certain, tried to
install it. It would not install. Am I correct that I want
ep_setup.exe???? Does arm have a special meaning?

4) It also says in the middle of the page "If you are downloading from
this page, please temporarily disable real-time protection or save to a >folder excluded from antivirus scans." But what happens when I turn on
real time protection again?. Won't the AV find it and complain? Or
will it not matter by then and I can quarantine the executable, because
it's already installed?

5) Do you folks like Windhawk. Is it worth installing?

Footnotes and complaints :-) :
This would have been hard enough to understand and do if I were using
win10, but it's twice as hard with win11, because I haven't installed
Open Shell yet and win 11 is so hard to use.

After reading it 4 times I was able to do this:
For Defender, you can run the following script in PowerShell as an
administrator:
Add-MpPreference -ExclusionPath "C:\Program Files\ExplorerPatcher" >Add-MpPreference -ExclusionPath "$env:APPDATA\ExplorerPatcher" >Add-MpPreference -ExclusionPath "C:\Windows\dxgi.dll"
Add-MpPreference -ExclusionPath >"C:\Windows\SystemApps\Microsoft.Windows.StartMenuExperienceHost_cw5n1h2txyewy"
Add-MpPreference -ExclusionPath >"C:\Windows\SystemApps\ShellExperienceHost_cw5n1h2txyewy"

6) If I excluded all these files, which why didn't I just exclude the >installer too wherever it would be downloaded to. Then wouldn't the
problem in question 4 above not exist?

"We DO NOT recommend using EP on work machines running Windows 11
version 24H2." Because the program errors are tolerable. That's >encouraging. My parents told me I should learn to be tolerant.

***When updating to 24H2, please uninstall EP before starting the
update. You can install EP again with your settings intact after
updating to 24H2. Due to explicit blocks by Microsoft, the update cannot >proceed if EP is installed.

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XPost: alt.comp.os.windows-11

On Sun, 2/16/2025 12:06 AM, micky wrote:

In alt.comp.os.windows-11, on Tue, 11 Feb 2025 00:47:05 -0500, micky <NONONOmisc07@fmguy.com> wrote:

I stalled around for over a week before trying to install
ExplorerPatcher and tonight I spent about 2 hours reading more and
trying to install.

Even after making a recover disk and a clone of the new Dell laptop (or should I have made a backup instead?) I was still scared and still
stalled around for almost a day, scared by what happened the first time,
with the file that was 1/10th the proper size.

But I did it tonight and except for the result, the experience was
similar. After saying yes to the UAC(?) box, it wasn't clear that it was running, there was no task in the taskboar, and no message of any sort
when it ended. It only took a second or two. I couldn't tell it had
changed anything until I right clicked on a corner of the taskbar and
got a long menu, Maybe 140 possible changes altogether.

When you clone one 1TB drive to a second 1TB drive, the second drive
is "all tied up" in the experiment.

If the brand new laptop had 20GB of files on the 1TB drive, then
the .mrimg file would be 20GB in size. I could store fifty of those
files on my 1TB external backup drive. This is a more efficient form of storage.

Both of these methods give you an emergency copy.

*******

You can make a EXE to run, complete with entry in task bar. People
can find that easily, and recognize that "something is running".

You can make a "svchost", a service, and that runs as SYSTEM account,
and that can be used as a foothold in the system. Drivers for hardware
can use that method. There might be no visible sign it is running.
Applications like Acronis can salt multiple of those on a running OS.

NVidia uses virtualization and a container for their driver.
They also have several task scheduler entries that you should kill.

You can place a DLL in a folder and use it to "inject" something.
(FRAPS used to inject a DLL into every Program Files folder,
in order to capture the graphics output the user wanted. FRAPS
is no longer maintained, and is not intended for at least W10/W11.)

You can edit a DLL and add a payload to it (easiest to do if the
file is not signed). You should not be able to replace a DLL in
System32 (there is a protection method present), but people will
find a way to do it.

Take the Microsoft Memory Compressor as an example. The executable
has no name. Task Manager does not display things with no name,
even when they are using a lot of CPU. The Sysinternals
Process Explorer, displays the activity of the Memory Compressor.

The OS is filled with nutty stuff, like a "dllhost" to execute
a DLL without a main() program. You have to be The Amazing Kreskin
(mentalist) to figure out what is going on, inside the computer.
Sometimes, you will see multiple of these things running,
and Microsoft set them off.

Paul

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