• Re: older copy protection...

    From Al Kossow@21:1/5 to Chris M. Thomasson on Wed May 14 16:37:40 2025
    On 5/14/25 4:04 PM, Chris M. Thomasson wrote:
    On 5/13/2025 3:55 PM, Chris M. Thomasson wrote:
    Does anybody know the hardware used to create the copy protection in the old Dungeon Master game?

     Does anybody know the hardware? Here is a relevant snip from the links: _________________
    As the developer of both Dungeon Master and the software portion of its copy protection, I knew that eventually the copy protection would be
    broken, but that the longer it held out the less damage we would suffer when it was broken. We had the advantage of owning the patent on a
    floppy-disk copy protection scheme that required a $40,000 specialized hardware device to write the disks. It was impossible to create a
    disk image without this hardware, and the hardware itself was out of production. That meant that as long as there were enough layers on the
    copy protection, and these layers took long enough to crack, the only way to own the game was to buy it. The copy protection scheme took a
    couple of weeks to create, and while this added cost to the production without adding value for the customer, it was time well spent. The
    copy protection was based on many redundant, overlapping and isolated checks and cross checks. The copy protection was developed with the
    assumption that the cracker would be armed with a hardware emulator and developed with an awareness of the capabilities and limitations of
    the commonly available emulators of the time.
    _________________


    this has been discussed on the Applesauce discord

    "sector has that criss-cross pattern between the 1st and 2nd signal bands? That is use to put flux transition right at the edge of bitcell
    windows. Slight motor speed fluctuations mean that the nibbles in the area will shift between different values every time you read the sector. "

    so very precise timing changes on only one sector of the disk to make non-deterministic recovered bits.

    the "bands" referred to is looking at a histogram of the flux transition times of the track

    "It was impossible to create a disk image without this hardware"

    The disk has been cloned on the Applesauce.

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  • From John Levine@21:1/5 to All on Mon May 19 02:09:16 2025
    According to Chris M. Thomasson <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com>:
    "It was impossible to create a disk image without this hardware"

    The disk has been cloned on the Applesauce.

    Thanks! I need to ponder on this. Thanks again.

    The usual approach was to patch the program to disable the code
    that checked the copy protection.



    --
    Regards,
    John Levine, johnl@taugh.com, Primary Perpetrator of "The Internet for Dummies",
    Please consider the environment before reading this e-mail. https://jl.ly

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  • From Terje Mathisen@21:1/5 to John Levine on Mon May 19 09:08:48 2025
    John Levine wrote:
    According to Chris M. Thomasson <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com>:
    "It was impossible to create a disk image without this hardware"

    The disk has been cloned on the Applesauce.

    Thanks! I need to ponder on this. Thanks again.

    The usual approach was to patch the program to disable the code
    that checked the copy protection.

    The usual "protection" against this was to distribute the checking code
    across both time and space, only loading/decrypting the next part after verification.

    Terje


    --
    - <Terje.Mathisen at tmsw.no>
    "almost all programming can be viewed as an exercise in caching"

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  • From Vir Campestris@21:1/5 to Chris M. Thomasson on Thu Jun 5 17:09:43 2025
    On 26/05/2025 05:13, Chris M. Thomasson wrote:

    The usual "protection" against this was to distribute the checking code across both time and space, only loading/decrypting the next part after verification.

    One subtle protection method was to make the game really hard to play
    when parts of the protection system had been disabled.

    Andy

    --
    Do not listen to rumour, but, if you do, do not believe it.
    Ghandi.

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  • From MitchAlsup1@21:1/5 to Chris M. Thomasson on Thu Jun 5 22:35:36 2025
    On Thu, 5 Jun 2025 21:52:37 +0000, Chris M. Thomasson wrote:

    On 6/5/2025 9:09 AM, Vir Campestris wrote:
    On 26/05/2025 05:13, Chris M. Thomasson wrote:

    The usual "protection" against this was to distribute the checking
    code across both time and space, only loading/decrypting the next part
    after verification.

    One subtle protection method was to make the game really hard to play
    when parts of the protection system had been disabled.

    The cracker, hacker, thinks I got it! Well, I think so... I get to
    actually play the game, but its on ultra hard. ;^)

    What:: no IDKFA ?!?

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