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  • Words in Gforth manual undefined

    From David Meyer@21:1/5 to All on Sun May 4 23:43:31 2025
    I discovered that some words documented in the Gforth manual, like MAX-U (environment wordset) and u/ (gforth-1.0 wordset), are undefined in my installations of Gforth 0.7.3.

    Is there something messed up with my installations, or is there
    something else (Forth command, installation, Gforth upgrade) to make
    such words/wordsets available in my Gforth environment?

    --
    David Meyer
    Takarazuka, Japan
    papa@sdf.org

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  • From albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl@21:1/5 to papa@sdf.org on Sun May 4 17:53:04 2025
    In article <87cycofncc.fsf@lucy.meyer21c.net>,
    David Meyer <papa@sdf.org> wrote:
    I discovered that some words documented in the Gforth manual, like MAX-U >(environment wordset) and u/ (gforth-1.0 wordset), are undefined in my >installations of Gforth 0.7.3.

    MAX-U is present in gforth 0.7.3 and in the info doc's.
    You must add ENVIRONMENT to the search order before MAX-U is visible.

    u/ is not to be found in the info doc's and not in the executable
    in my official installation of 0.7.3. That suggests a later addition.

    Is there something messed up with my installations, or is there
    something else (Forth command, installation, Gforth upgrade) to make
    such words/wordsets available in my Gforth environment?

    --
    David Meyer

    Groetjes Albert
    --
    Temu exploits Christians: (Disclaimer, only 10 apostles)
    Last Supper Acrylic Suncatcher - 15Cm Round Stained Glass- Style Wall
    Art For Home, Office And Garden Decor - Perfect For Windows, Bars,
    And Gifts For Friends Family And Colleagues.

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  • From Anton Ertl@21:1/5 to David Meyer on Sun May 4 15:57:40 2025
    David Meyer <papa@sdf.org> writes:
    I discovered that some words documented in the Gforth manual, like MAX-U >(environment wordset) and u/ (gforth-1.0 wordset), are undefined in my >installations of Gforth 0.7.3.

    Is there something messed up with my installations, or is there
    something else (Forth command, installation, Gforth upgrade) to make
    such words/wordsets available in my Gforth environment?

    The manual you are using is not the one for the Gforth version you are
    using.

    You can find the manual for Gforth-0.7 on <https://www.complang.tuwien.ac.at/forth/gforth/Docs-html/>.

    Alternatively, you can install a recent snapshot using one of the
    methods mentioned on <https://gforth.org/>.

    If you want to use the words mentioned above, the latter course is the
    one you want to take. Note that the "environment wordset" means that
    the name is intended to be used with "ENVIRONEMENT?", and MAX-U is
    already present in gforth-0.7:

    Gforth 0.7.3, Copyright (C) 1995-2008 Free Software Foundation, Inc.
    Gforth comes with ABSOLUTELY NO WARRANTY; for details type `license'
    Type `bye' to exit
    s" max-u" environment? . u. -1 18446744073709551615 ok

    - anton
    --
    M. Anton Ertl http://www.complang.tuwien.ac.at/anton/home.html
    comp.lang.forth FAQs: http://www.complang.tuwien.ac.at/forth/faq/toc.html
    New standard: https://forth-standard.org/
    EuroForth 2023 proceedings: http://www.euroforth.org/ef23/papers/
    EuroForth 2024 proceedings: http://www.euroforth.org/ef24/papers/

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  • From albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl@21:1/5 to Anton Ertl on Mon May 5 12:03:20 2025
    In article <2025May4.175740@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at>,
    Anton Ertl <anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at> wrote:
    David Meyer <papa@sdf.org> writes:
    I discovered that some words documented in the Gforth manual, like MAX-U >>(environment wordset) and u/ (gforth-1.0 wordset), are undefined in my >>installations of Gforth 0.7.3.

    Is there something messed up with my installations, or is there
    something else (Forth command, installation, Gforth upgrade) to make
    such words/wordsets available in my Gforth environment?

    The manual you are using is not the one for the Gforth version you are
    using.

    However if you are on an official ubuntu/debian distribution like me,
    the manual and the program agree.
    Assuming you have installed it officially. (Mostly 0.7.3).

    <SNIP>

    - anton

    Groetjes Albert
    --
    Temu exploits Christians: (Disclaimer, only 10 apostles)
    Last Supper Acrylic Suncatcher - 15Cm Round Stained Glass- Style Wall
    Art For Home, Office And Garden Decor - Perfect For Windows, Bars,
    And Gifts For Friends Family And Colleagues.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From David Meyer@21:1/5 to Anton Ertl on Fri May 9 23:32:50 2025
    anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) writes:

    David Meyer <papa@sdf.org> writes:
    I discovered that some words documented in the Gforth manual, like MAX-U >>(environment wordset) and u/ (gforth-1.0 wordset), are undefined in my >>installations of Gforth 0.7.3.


    You can find the manual for Gforth-0.7 on <https://www.complang.tuwien.ac.at/forth/gforth/Docs-html/>.

    Alternatively, you can install a recent snapshot using one of the
    methods mentioned on <https://gforth.org/>.

    Thanks for setting me straight. I see I was misreading the manual on
    MAX-U, and that it is available in 0.7.3 if used correctly.

    I tried installing the 0.7.9 snapshot and now u/ is available as
    described.

    The only thing that still mystifies me is why a seemingly basic word
    like u/ wasn't added until so recently.


    --
    David Meyer
    Takarazuka, Japan
    papa@sdf.org

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Anton Ertl@21:1/5 to David Meyer on Fri May 9 17:17:56 2025
    David Meyer <papa@sdf.org> writes:
    The only thing that still mystifies me is why a seemingly basic word
    like u/ wasn't added until so recently.

    The standard has UM/MOD (and that has been in Gforth from the start)
    if / does not satisfy your needs.

    Actually IIRC we did not add U/ because of user demand, but mainly
    because of implementation (speed of U/ vs UM/MOD on various CPUs) and completeness considerations.

    - anton
    --
    M. Anton Ertl http://www.complang.tuwien.ac.at/anton/home.html
    comp.lang.forth FAQs: http://www.complang.tuwien.ac.at/forth/faq/toc.html
    New standard: https://forth-standard.org/
    EuroForth 2023 proceedings: http://www.euroforth.org/ef23/papers/
    EuroForth 2024 proceedings: http://www.euroforth.org/ef24/papers/

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From David Meyer@21:1/5 to Anton Ertl on Sat May 10 10:17:12 2025
    anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) writes:

    David Meyer <papa@sdf.org> writes:
    The only thing that still mystifies me is why a seemingly basic word
    like u/ wasn't added until so recently.

    The standard has UM/MOD (and that has been in Gforth from the start)
    if / does not satisfy your needs.

    Actually IIRC we did not add U/ because of user demand, but mainly
    because of implementation (speed of U/ vs UM/MOD on various CPUs) and completeness considerations.

    I see I should have read Starting Forth more carefully.

    Thanks for the background on U/.

    --
    David Meyer
    Takarazuka, Japan
    papa@sdf.org

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)