That's artificially pulled out of thin air. I've never had
any problems with realloc.

You could also say that Forth has forgotten garbage collection.

--

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On Thu, 8 May 2025 19:30:57 +1000
dxf <dxforth@gmail.com> wrote:

On 8/05/2025 6:39 pm, LIT wrote:

Aimless fiddlers should just switch to Forth.

In next 20 years they'll figure out how to FORGET
a function.

I can't remember the last time I forgot something.

:-)


--
Bah, and indeed Humbug.

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In article <nnd$3f3c0437$711db4e3@cd8cc85eb802039d>,
Hans Bezemer <the.beez.speaks@gmail.com> wrote:

On 08-05-2025 11:30, dxf wrote:

On 8/05/2025 6:39 pm, LIT wrote:

Aimless fiddlers should just switch to Forth.

In next 20 years they'll figure out how to FORGET
a function.

I can't remember the last time I forgot something.

Actually - I use it daily. Note that 4tH has no word sets and no
namespaces. Coming from C - I never felt I needed them. What I *did*
have was "static" - which allowed me to hide those functions which
weren't important for the API of that module.

So I added HIDE to 4tH, to clean up modules for that very purpose.
Usually, all non-public words are named like (NAME) - according to the
rules set in "Thinking Forth". Which already helps to avoid any
collisions, since even *if* they were previously used, they would be
hidden by now.

So its' not uncommon to see some - or even rather large - lists of HIDEs
at the end of a module. Note I don't have to do them by hand, this one
does it for me: >https://sourceforge.net/p/forth-4th/code/HEAD/tree/trunk/4th.src/makehide.4th

Other Forths had HIDE, so I borrowed it. There is no UNHIDE or
equivalent because 4tH can't. The thing is thrown out of the symbol
table completely on HIDE.

Also, the size of the symbol table is determined by (amongst others)
HIDE. Defining words expand the size of the symbol table, HIDE reduces
it. That's why you can't make HIDE act conditionally by [IF] and [THEN]
- since at that stage, the system is unable to evaluate such expressions.

I guess that you reorder the links fields.

I use a bit flag, so that it can be undone.
'DROP DUP HIDDEN \ easier: `` HIDE DROP '' , but I need the address.
\ no use of `DROP here.
( dea - ) HIDDEN \ Pops up again.

1 2 DROP .S
1

I like NAMESPACE (aka pushing vocabularies).
My lisp namespace totally hides there is a Forth underneath.

Hans Bezemer

Groetjes Albert
--
Temu exploits Christians: (Disclaimer, only 10 apostles)
Last Supper Acrylic Suncatcher - 15Cm Round Stained Glass- Style Wall
Art For Home, Office And Garden Decor - Perfect For Windows, Bars,
And Gifts For Friends Family And Colleagues.

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On 08/05/2025 13:43, Hans Bezemer wrote:

On 08-05-2025 11:30, dxf wrote:

On 8/05/2025 6:39 pm, LIT wrote:

Aimless fiddlers should just switch to Forth.

In next 20 years they'll figure out how to FORGET
a function.

I can't remember the last time I forgot something.

Actually - I use it daily. Note that 4tH has no word sets and no
namespaces. Coming from C - I never felt I needed them. What I *did*
have was "static" - which allowed me to hide those functions which
weren't important for the API of that module.

So I added HIDE to 4tH, to clean up modules for that very purpose.
Usually, all non-public words are named like (NAME) - according to the
rules set in "Thinking Forth". Which already helps to avoid any
collisions, since even *if* they were previously used, they would be
hidden by now.

So its' not uncommon to see some - or even rather large - lists of HIDEs
at the end of a module. Note I don't have to do them by hand, this one
does it for me: https://sourceforge.net/p/forth-4th/code/HEAD/tree/ trunk/4th.src/makehide.4th

Other Forths had HIDE, so I borrowed it. There is no UNHIDE or
equivalent because 4tH can't. The thing is thrown out of the symbol
table completely on HIDE.

Also, the size of the symbol table is determined by (amongst others)
HIDE. Defining words expand the size of the symbol table, HIDE reduces
it. That's why you can't make HIDE act conditionally by [IF] and [THEN]
- since at that stage, the system is unable to evaluate such expressions.

In fact, that's where I use 'forget' in 8th. When I "need" a library
file, it can have "private" words which go in a special namespace. At
the end of processing the library, I forget that namespace and so the
words are truly invisible outside of the library scope.

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On Thu, 8 May 2025 11:11:52 +0000, albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl wrote:
[..]

My lisp namespace totally hides there is a Forth underneath.

Why? I think it is useful to add lisp functions to a Forth
program if that is appropriate to the task at hand. Or
even more useful if one could add Forth words to a lisp
interpreter that is written in Forth (like I did for the tinykiss
compiler https://iforth.nl/crenshaw/mchapter17/tinykiss.frt ).

-marcel

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In article <f32b8e3a546cb4845eb0feb00611fff3@www.novabbs.com>,
mhx <mhx@iae.nl> wrote:

On Thu, 8 May 2025 11:11:52 +0000, albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl wrote:
[..]

My lisp namespace totally hides there is a Forth underneath.

Why? I think it is useful to add lisp functions to a Forth
program if that is appropriate to the task at hand. Or
even more useful if one could add Forth words to a lisp
interpreter that is written in Forth (like I did for the tinykiss
compiler https://iforth.nl/crenshaw/mchapter17/tinykiss.frt ).

I can't think of any lisp functions that enhance Forth.
I'm more ambitious. I think Forth is a good substrate to implement lisp.
My ideal:
OTOH lisp enthusiast discovering that the most capable lisp is
implemented in ... Forth.

Compare my lisp implementation in git to the original of Mark Probst.
His implementation doesn't look like lisp to a lisper, because he must
start up gforth first. The largest part of his effort is to rewrite
a special read-evaluate-loop in Forth, ignoring that Forth itself is
an interpreter, and only minor modifications are sufficient to understand
lisp.

gforth is implemented in c. Imagine that you have to start gforth,
initiating from a c-compiler/interpreter.

-marcel

Groetjes Albert
--
Temu exploits Christians: (Disclaimer, only 10 apostles)
Last Supper Acrylic Suncatcher - 15Cm Round Stained Glass- Style Wall
Art For Home, Office And Garden Decor - Perfect For Windows, Bars,
And Gifts For Friends Family And Colleagues.

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