Kind of amusing to see the lengths that Microsoft keeps going to, toGoshsakes, what's wrong with notepad++? I go through control panel and add the path to
try to bolster its sagging geek cred. Now it is introducing a new command-line-based text editor for 64-bit Windows!
<https://www.theverge.com/news/669318/microsoft-edit-on-windows-command-line-text-editor>
Of all the excuses for reinventing the wheel, I’m not sure whether
this one is particularly creative, particularly lame, or both:
Microsoft also wanted to avoid the “how do I exit vim?” meme, so
it built its own text editor instead of relying on other available
options.
Really?? You wanted to spare your users the horrors of coping with
vim?!? They’re already suffering under Windows, for goshsakes!
Kind of amusing to see the lengths that Microsoft keeps going to, to
try to bolster its sagging geek cred. Now it is introducing a new command-line-based text editor for 64-bit Windows!
<https://www.theverge.com/news/669318/microsoft-edit-on-windows-command-line-text-editor>
Of all the excuses for reinventing the wheel, I’m not sure whether
this one is particularly creative, particularly lame, or both:
Microsoft also wanted to avoid the “how do I exit vim?” meme, so
it built its own text editor instead of relying on other available
options.
Really?? You wanted to spare your users the horrors of coping with
vim?!? They’re already suffering under Windows, for goshsakes!
Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote this post while blinking in Morse code:
Kind of amusing to see the lengths that Microsoft keeps going to, to
try to bolster its sagging geek cred. Now it is introducing a new
command-line-based text editor for 64-bit Windows!
<https://www.theverge.com/news/669318/microsoft-edit-on-windows-command-line-text-editor>
<snip>
Heh, at first I thought you were talking about EDLIN.
Believe it or not, I once worked with a team that used EDLIN to
write MASM code. One of the modules was about a megabyte. Paging to
the end of that file was excruciating... one 64K chunk at a time IIRC.
*WAS text
*WAS
*WAS
*WAS
. . .
Microsoft also wanted to avoid the “how do I exit vim?” meme, so it
built its own text editor instead of relying on other available
options.
Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote this post while blinking in Morse code:
Kind of amusing to see the lengths that Microsoft keeps going to, to
try to bolster its sagging geek cred. Now it is introducing a new
command-line-based text editor for 64-bit Windows!
<https://www.theverge.com/news/669318/microsoft-edit-on-windows-command-line-text-editor>
Of all the excuses for reinventing the wheel, I’m not sure whether
this one is particularly creative, particularly lame, or both:
Microsoft also wanted to avoid the “how do I exit vim?” meme, so
it built its own text editor instead of relying on other available
options.
Really?? You wanted to spare your users the horrors of coping with
vim?!? They’re already suffering under Windows, for goshsakes!
Heh, at first I thought you were talking about EDLIN.
Believe it or not, I once worked with a team that used EDLIN to
write MASM code. One of the modules was about a megabyte. Paging to
the end of that file was excruciating... one 64K chunk at a time IIRC.
*WAS text
*WAS
*WAS
*WAS
. . .
On Tue, 20 May 2025 07:54:59 -0000 (UTC), Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
Microsoft also wanted to avoid the “how do I exit vim?” meme, so it >> built its own text editor instead of relying on other available
options.
I'll admit I wondered how to exit vim, or the original vi to be specific,
but that was 45 years or so ago.
Microsoft might be upset that one of the first VS Code extensions I
install is Vim.
Kind of amusing to see the lengths that Microsoft keeps going to, to
try to bolster its sagging geek cred. Now it is introducing a new command-line-based text editor for 64-bit Windows!
<https://www.theverge.com/news/669318/microsoft-edit-on-windows-command-line-text-editor>
Of all the excuses for reinventing the wheel, I’m not sure whether
this one is particularly creative, particularly lame, or both:
Microsoft also wanted to avoid the “how do I exit vim?” meme, so
it built its own text editor instead of relying on other available
options.
Really?? You wanted to spare your users the horrors of coping with
vim?!? They’re already suffering under Windows, for goshsakes!
I avoided EMACS after that until a few years latter when I was using the grown up adult version integrated into the Symbolics Lisp Machine's development environment. Life had changed for the good.
Goshsakes, what's wrong with notepad++?
On 5/20/2025 1:25 PM, rbowman wrote:
On Tue, 20 May 2025 07:54:59 -0000 (UTC), Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:In the early 1980s (approximately when you were trapped in the vim maze)
Microsoft also wanted to avoid the “how do I exit vim?” meme, so it
built its own text editor instead of relying on other available
options.
I'll admit I wondered how to exit vim, or the original vi to be specific,
but that was 45 years or so ago.
an excited colleague told me I just had to try out some new version of
EMACS running on our PDP10 farm at ISI - I had been using some other
editor. I was having some fun figuring out a few simple commands; then I tried to exit: ctr x, ctr q, etc. After 15 minutes I screamed for help.
I avoided EMACS after that until a few years latter when I was using the grown up adult version integrated into the Symbolics Lisp Machine's development environment. Life had changed for the good.
On 5/20/2025 1:25 PM, rbowman wrote:
On Tue, 20 May 2025 07:54:59 -0000 (UTC), Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:In the early 1980s (approximately when you were trapped in the vim maze)
Microsoft also wanted to avoid the “how do I exit vim?” meme, so >>> it built its own text editor instead of relying on other
available options.
I'll admit I wondered how to exit vim, or the original vi to be
specific,
but that was 45 years or so ago.
an excited colleague told me I just had to try out some new version of
EMACS running on our PDP10 farm at ISI - I had been using some other
editor. I was having some fun figuring out a few simple commands; then I tried to exit: ctr x, ctr q, etc. After 15 minutes I screamed for help.
I avoided EMACS after that until a few years latter when I was using the grown up adult version integrated into the Symbolics Lisp Machine's development environment. Life had changed for the good.
On 5/20/2025 1:25 PM, rbowman wrote:out a few simple commands; then I tried to exit: ctr x, ctr q, etc. After 15 minutes I screamed for help. I avoided EMACS after that until a few years latter when I was using the grown up adult version integrated into the Symbolics Lisp Machine's
On Tue, 20 May 2025 07:54:59 -0000 (UTC), Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:In the early 1980s (approximately when you were trapped in the vim maze) an excited colleague told me I just had to try out some new version of EMACS running on our PDP10 farm at ISI - I had been using some other editor. I was having some fun figuring
Microsoft also wanted to avoid the “how do I exit vim?” meme, so it
built its own text editor instead of relying on other available >>> options.
I'll admit I wondered how to exit vim, or the original vi to be specific,
but that was 45 years or so ago.
On 2025-05-20, Jeff Barnett <jbb@notatt.com> wrote:
On 5/20/2025 1:25 PM, rbowman wrote:
On Tue, 20 May 2025 07:54:59 -0000 (UTC), Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:In the early 1980s (approximately when you were trapped in the vim
Microsoft also wanted to avoid the “how do I exit vim?” meme, so >>>> it built its own text editor instead of relying on other
available options.
I'll admit I wondered how to exit vim, or the original vi to be
specific,
but that was 45 years or so ago.
maze)
an excited colleague told me I just had to try out some new version of
EMACS running on our PDP10 farm at ISI - I had been using some other
editor. I was having some fun figuring out a few simple commands; then
I tried to exit: ctr x, ctr q, etc. After 15 minutes I screamed for
help. I avoided EMACS after that until a few years latter when I was
using the grown up adult version integrated into the Symbolics Lisp
Machine's development environment. Life had changed for the good.
I'd install "joe" since I'm a WordStar fan.
From the joe manpage....
syntax
joe [global-options] [ [local-options] filename ]...
jstar [global-options] [ [local-options] filename ]...
jmacs [global-options] [ [local-options] filename ]...
rjoe [global-options] [ [local-options] filename ]...
jpico [global-options] [ [local-options] filename ]...
Description
JOE is a powerful console screen editor. It has a "mode-less"
user in‐ terface which is similar to many user-friendly PC
editors. Users of Mi‐ cro-Pro´s WordStar or Borland´s "Turbo"
languages will feel at home. JOE is a full featured UNIX
screen-editor though, and has many features for editing programs
and text.
JOE also emulates several other editors. JSTAR is a close
imitation of WordStar with many "JOE" extensions. JPICO is a
close imitation of the Pine mailing system´s PICO editor, but
with many extensions and improve‐
ments. JMACS is a GNU-EMACS imitation. RJOE is a restricted
version of JOE, which allows you to edit only the files
specified on the command line.
Although JOE is actually five different editors, it still
requires only one executable, but one with five different
names. The name of the edi‐ tor with an "rc" appended gives the
name of JOE´s initialization file, which determines the
personality of the editor.
---------------------------------------------------------------
It does not seem to have vi(m) in there....oh well.
pH in Aptos
I never use vi, I hate it. I know the basics, that's it.
On Tue, 20 May 2025 08:21:51 -0400, Alan K. wrote:
Goshsakes, what's wrong with notepad++?
Lots of people (Windows people, at least) do seem to have nice things to
say about it.
Maybe Microsoft tried to buy them out, and they refused.
On Tue, 5/20/2025 3:54 AM, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
Kind of amusing to see the lengths that Microsoft keeps going to, to
try to bolster its sagging geek cred. Now it is introducing a new
command-line-based text editor for 64-bit Windows!
<https://www.theverge.com/news/669318/microsoft-edit-on-windows-command-line-text-editor>
Of all the excuses for reinventing the wheel, I’m not sure whether
this one is particularly creative, particularly lame, or both:
Microsoft also wanted to avoid the “how do I exit vim?” meme, so
it built its own text editor instead of relying on other available
options.
Really?? You wanted to spare your users the horrors of coping with
vim?!? They’re already suffering under Windows, for goshsakes!
This is so cool. <Slips on geek shades>
https://devblogs.microsoft.com/commandline/edit-is-now-open-source/
Somehow VIM just isn't the same.
The keyboards that came that came with the Lisp machines had cap,
ctrl, meta, hyper, and maybe one other such key ...
The mouse "knew" the types you were pointing at and the menus adjust
to sensible options for the type of data of the object represented
by what the mouse was on.
On Tue, 5/20/2025 5:18 PM, Paul wrote:
On Tue, 5/20/2025 3:54 AM, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
Kind of amusing to see the lengths that Microsoft keeps going to, to
try to bolster its sagging geek cred. Now it is introducing a new
command-line-based text editor for 64-bit Windows!
<https://www.theverge.com/news/669318/microsoft-edit-on-windows-command-line-text-editor>
Now, the problem with this, is it failed the very next test case.
Name: out16GB.txt
Size: 16,671,280,658 bytes (15 GiB)
SHA256: D7C6EE1708BD905F3CF10A287D00649098FFEBBA6ACCD48AAE202FC8E24BDB41
./edit ./out16GB.txt
The program reads about 4GB of the file. It ignores the rest of the file
and I don't see a control for moving past that 4GB point.
On Tue, 20 May 2025 22:51:59 +0200, Carlos E. R. wrote:
I never use vi, I hate it. I know the basics, that's it.
On Linux machines vi is usually an alias for vim. Real vi does leave something to be desired.
Once you get used to it, vim is light years ahead of any editor MS came up with. Borland bought Brief and killed it but it too was a lot better than
MS efforts. Hell, Wordstar was better and it wasn't even a programming editor.
On 5/20/2025 1:25 PM, rbowman wrote:
On Tue, 20 May 2025 07:54:59 -0000 (UTC), Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
Microsoft also wanted to avoid the “how do I exit vim?” meme, so it
built its own text editor instead of relying on other available
options.
I'll admit I wondered how to exit vim, or the original vi to be specific,
but that was 45 years or so ago.
In the early 1980s (approximately when you were trapped in the vim maze)
an excited colleague told me I just had to try out some new version of
EMACS running on our PDP10 farm at ISI - I had been using some other
editor. I was having some fun figuring out a few simple commands; then I tried to exit: ctr x, ctr q, etc. After 15 minutes I screamed for help.
I avoided EMACS after that until a few years latter when I was using the grown up adult version integrated into the Symbolics Lisp Machine's development environment. Life had changed for the good.
On Tue, 20 May 2025 22:48:16 -0400, Paul wrote:
Somehow VIM just isn't the same.
'Vim' was the name of a brand of household cleaner, back in the Old
Country ...
Kind of amusing to see the lengths that Microsoft keeps going to, to
try to bolster its sagging geek cred.
On 2025-05-21 04:55, rbowman wrote:
On Tue, 20 May 2025 22:51:59 +0200, Carlos E. R. wrote:
I never use vi, I hate it. I know the basics, that's it.
On Linux machines vi is usually an alias for vim. Real vi does leave
something to be desired.
Once you get used to it, vim is light years ahead of any editor MS came
up with. Borland bought Brief and killed it but it too was a lot better
than MS efforts. Hell, Wordstar was better and it wasn't even a
programming editor.
Long ago, Borland editors used the WordStar keyboard set. I loved it. I
don't know if the current Borland IDEs still use it.
Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> wrote:
Kind of amusing to see the lengths that Microsoft keeps going to, to
try to bolster its sagging geek cred. Now it is introducing a new
command-line-based text editor for 64-bit Windows!
<https://www.theverge.com/news/669318/microsoft-edit-on-windows- command-line-text-editor>
Of all the excuses for reinventing the wheel, I’m not sure whether this
one is particularly creative, particularly lame, or both:
Microsoft also wanted to avoid the “how do I exit vim?” meme, so it >> built its own text editor instead of relying on other available
options.
Really?? You wanted to spare your users the horrors of coping with
vim?!? They’re already suffering under Windows, for goshsakes!
There's always Nano for those who can't cope with Vim/Emacs.
On Tue, 20 May 2025 22:48:16 -0400, Paul wrote:
Somehow VIM just isn't the same.
“Vim” was the name of a brand of household cleaner, back in the Old Country ...
The keyboards that came that came with the Lisp machines had cap, ctrl,
meta, hyper, and maybe one other such key; the mouse had three buttons
and you could chord with both hands. The mouse "knew" the types you were pointing at and the menus adjust to sensible options for the type of
data of the object represented by what the mouse was on. After
overcoming disbelief that all this was working reasonably quickly and properly, it was a real joy. And, by the way, the keys I mentioned above
were so arranged that it was not hard to reach virtually any chord.
rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:
On Wed, 21 May 2025 11:47:16 +0200, Carlos E. R. wrote:
Long ago, Borland editors used the WordStar keyboard set. I loved it.
I don't know if the current Borland IDEs still use it.
I liked the Borland C++ IDE and OWL better than MFC but the gorilla won. >>iirc you could select the Brief bindings on the editor but it wasn't the >>full Brief editor. I'd used Wordstar on CP/M so I stayed with those.
The Borland C++ 5.x I had back in the day was great software, I never
got into GUI-app development with it, but it was great to have, to be
able to do college homework and experiment with coding. In fact, in
those days it was non-trivial to copy an optical disk, so there wasn't
any kind of copy protection on it, not even a check for the prior
version in the upgrade edition either (I'd initially bought 4.x but
bought the 5.x upgrade after upgrading Windows itself from 3.x to 95),
so when Borland mailed me a new CD-ROM of 5.x for a minor update, I gave
the original disk to a friend from college, he could use the IDE/
compiler and online documentation without spending a dime. Such a
different era.
Farley Flud <ff@linux.rocks> wrote:
On Tue, 20 May 2025 07:54:59 -0000 (UTC), Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
Kind of amusing to see the lengths that Microsoft keeps going to, to
try to bolster its sagging geek cred.
Who the fuck would ever want to use a command-line editor,
on Microslop or otherwise?
On GNU/Linux, the best GUI editors are:
https://geany.org/
https://github.com/paulsheer/cooledit
Use either, or both, of the above and kindly STFU.
I don't wanna hear no fucking nostalgia for 1970's
stuff. Grow up, fer chrissake.
Now *that* is rich, your lame ass is going to talk about outmoded
software, you're using Gentoo/LFS as a platform for your most
important computing, rather than as an experimental system to manually install components of the larger OS, decrying others who have the mere
common sense to use a distro, claiming that there's a meaningful
performance advantage in compiling everything to an exact
specification of one's hardware, it's insanity, you have some kind of
brain damage. Talk about "grow up", you need to *wake* up, to basic
reality.
On Tue, 20 May 2025 07:54:59 -0000 (UTC), Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
Kind of amusing to see the lengths that Microsoft keeps going to, to
try to bolster its sagging geek cred.
Who the fuck would ever want to use a command-line editor,
on Microslop or otherwise?
On GNU/Linux, the best GUI editors are:
https://geany.org/
https://github.com/paulsheer/cooledit
Use either, or both, of the above and kindly STFU.
I don't wanna hear no fucking nostalgia for 1970's
stuff. Grow up, fer chrissake.
Farley Flud wrote this post while blinking in Morse code:
On Tue, 20 May 2025 07:54:59 -0000 (UTC), Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
Kind of amusing to see the lengths that Microsoft keeps going to, to
try to bolster its sagging geek cred.
Who the fuck would ever want to use a command-line editor,
on Microslop or otherwise?
On GNU/Linux, the best GUI editors are:
https://geany.org/
https://github.com/paulsheer/cooledit
Meh.
Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> wrote:
On Tue, 20 May 2025 22:48:16 -0400, Paul wrote:
Somehow VIM just isn't the same.
'Vim' was the name of a brand of household cleaner, back in the Old
Country ...
Still is. I don't think it's used/sold all that much, but this is on
the ah.nl website ('ah' is the main supermarket in NL):
I wasn't aware of Geany
It appears to be usable but I'll stick with Vim/Code.
On Wed, 21 May 2025 03:26:00 -0000 (UTC), Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
On Tue, 20 May 2025 22:48:16 -0400, Paul wrote:
Somehow VIM just isn't the same.
“Vim” was the name of a brand of household cleaner, back in the Old
Country ...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YsuJT9QX210
The detergent tablets sounded like a good idea but in practice they sucked and seldom dissolved completely. It only took about 40 years to come up
with pods. They work a lot better but it took a really determined kid to
eat a tablet.
On Tue, 20 May 2025 07:54:59 -0000 (UTC), Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
Kind of amusing to see the lengths that Microsoft keeps going to, to
try to bolster its sagging geek cred.
Who the fuck would ever want to use a command-line editor,
on Microslop or otherwise?
On GNU/Linux, the best GUI editors are:
https://geany.org/
https://github.com/paulsheer/cooledit
Use either, or both, of the above and kindly STFU.
I don't wanna hear no fucking nostalgia for 1970's
stuff. Grow up, fer chrissake.
Cooledit hasn't been maintained in almost exactly 2 years.
On Thu, 22 May 2025 20:50:05 -0000 (UTC), candycanearter07 wrote:
Cooledit hasn't been maintained in almost exactly 2 years.
Since when does software have to be "maintained."
If it works now, it will work forever.
Idiot.
You know what, fair enough for a text editor. And looking at the repository again, it seems like the /devel/ branch is still being updated.
On the other hand, it does seems be a compile-only program, the UI appears
to be 20 years out of date, it's being developed by only two people, and
nVim does pretty much everything I want.
More idiocy.
Idiot.
winverMicrosoft Windows
On Sat, 24 May 2025 21:00:04 -0000 (UTC), candycanearter07 wrote:
You know what, fair enough for a text editor. And looking at the repository >> again, it seems like the /devel/ branch is still being updated.
On the other hand, it does seems be a compile-only program, the UI appears >> to be 20 years out of date, it's being developed by only two people, and
nVim does pretty much everything I want.
More idiocy.
Cooledit is based on the same code that is present in another wonder
on the GNU/Linux world, that of the Midnight Commander file manager,
or more properly, the file editor thereof.
On Sat, 24 May 2025 21:00:04 -0000 (UTC), candycanearter07 wrote:
You know what, fair enough for a text editor. And looking at the repository >> again, it seems like the /devel/ branch is still being updated.
On the other hand, it does seems be a compile-only program, the UI appears >> to be 20 years out of date, it's being developed by only two people, and
nVim does pretty much everything I want.
More idiocy.
Cooledit is based on the same code that is present in another wonder
on the GNU/Linux world, that of the Midnight Commander file manager,
or more properly, the file editor thereof.
The code is tried and true and therefor needs little updating (as
if updating is essential for any software).
Furthermore, Cooledit is designed to work only with basic X11
libraries and eschews "modern" graphical toolkits. Thus, your
comment that the UI is "20 years out of date" is pure lunacy.
Cooledit has been improved by Paul Sheer to include full Unicode
support as well as other features, and Cooledit if fully programmable
via user scripts or Python.
Before you begin to criticize you should educate yourself
on the state of GNU/Linux software.
Cooledit is another fantastic editor that is not appreciated
due to the lethargic attitude of the average GNU/Linux user.
Farley Flud <ff@linux.rocks> wrote at 21:04 this Sunday (GMT):
On Sat, 24 May 2025 21:00:04 -0000 (UTC), candycanearter07 wrote:
You know what, fair enough for a text editor. And looking at the repository >>> again, it seems like the /devel/ branch is still being updated.
On the other hand, it does seems be a compile-only program, the UI appears >>> to be 20 years out of date, it's being developed by only two people, and >>> nVim does pretty much everything I want.
More idiocy.
Cooledit is based on the same code that is present in another wonder
on the GNU/Linux world, that of the Midnight Commander file manager,
or more properly, the file editor thereof.
And mc is a very nice TUI file manager. I personally dislike the built
in text editor of it, as well.
I prefer "jstar", but it breaks inside "tmux", some commands collide.
On Tue, 27 May 2025 13:08:17 +0200, Carlos E. R. wrote:
I prefer "jstar", but it breaks inside "tmux", some commands collide.
Isn’t tmux like screen, in that all the commands are keyed off a single prefix key?
In screen, I set that prefix key to CTRL/Z. This is normally the key recognized by the terminal driver for job control. But it’s not needed, when you have a multiplexer app like screen doing the job control.
On 2025-05-28 01:55, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
On Tue, 27 May 2025 13:08:17 +0200, Carlos E. R. wrote:
I prefer "jstar", but it breaks inside "tmux", some commands collide.
Isn’t tmux like screen, in that all the commands are keyed off a single
prefix key?
In screen, I set that prefix key to CTRL/Z. This is normally the key
recognized by the terminal driver for job control. But it’s not needed,
when you have a multiplexer app like screen doing the job control.
Most start with ^B. I'm not familiar with screen, though. I have trouble
it ^K^B..^K^K to mark a block of text. I don't remember what happens,
maybe the ^B in ^K^B is intercepted.
On Wed, 28 May 2025 12:38:21 +0200, Carlos E. R. wrote:
On 2025-05-28 01:55, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
On Tue, 27 May 2025 13:08:17 +0200, Carlos E. R. wrote:
I prefer "jstar", but it breaks inside "tmux", some commands collide.
Isn’t tmux like screen, in that all the commands are keyed off a single >>> prefix key?
In screen, I set that prefix key to CTRL/Z. This is normally the key
recognized by the terminal driver for job control. But it’s not needed, >>> when you have a multiplexer app like screen doing the job control.
Most start with ^B. I'm not familiar with screen, though. I have trouble
it ^K^B..^K^K to mark a block of text. I don't remember what happens,
maybe the ^B in ^K^B is intercepted.
I’d say you need to redefine your escape prefix. I regularly use Emacs through a screen session, without keystroke conflicts.
Of course, I have also removed the default definition of CTRL/Z in Emacs (suspend-frame), because I have no need for that function, so that
wouldn’t cause a clash anyway.
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