There's this very cool card I was reading up on called the VidHD, and it seems to work by snooping on the bus. I thought the Address bus was uni-directional! Does anyone have any info on what exactly it's doing? I thought to read anything off the bus you
needed to perform DMA, and I had no idea you could read the address off the bus, I thought you could only drive it. If someone could point me to the technical aspects of how it's doing what it's doing I'd appreciate it.

Many thanks in advance!

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

Snooping on the bus is neither reading nor writing on the bus. It is
just watching the bus to see what is there.
So while snooping, if a video card 'sees' a write to a memory location
that holds video data, it 'looks' at the data and writes a copy of that
data to a buffer on the card. The buffer is then used (along with other information) to create a video output.

The card itself is not doing a read/write because it is not manipulating
the slot bus signals in any way. There is no effect on the operation of
the Apple II.

I don't know if the VidHD is open source, but you can download source
code for my Carte Blanche II 800x600 video card for the IIgs here:

http://noboot.com/charlie/c2001-2015-07-20.zip

Unzip it and open cb2.v with notepad or any text editor.
It is in verilog but is pretty heavily commented.

Scroll down about 216 lines to where it says 'write clock - from old
wrclk module'. The next 25 lines shows the wires and registers I used
and the 'always' block of code that does the actual snooping.

This method is derived from Alex Freed's code here:

https://sourceforge.net/projects/jatcb/?source=navbar

Incidentally, the peripheral slot bus address and data pins are bidirectional.

Charlie

Hey Charlie! Just to be clear, are you saying that so long as I have my peripheral card lines set as INPUT and tied to the R/W and Address and Data buses all I need to do is just read the signals at the appropriate time and voila!? I'll check your code
out!

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On 8/13/2022 11:35 AM, Anthony Ortiz wrote:

There's this very cool card I was reading up on called the VidHD, and it seems to work by snooping on the bus. I thought the Address bus was uni-directional! Does anyone have any info on what exactly it's doing? I thought to read anything off the bus

you needed to perform DMA, and I had no idea you could read the address off the bus, I thought you could only drive it. If someone could point me to the technical aspects of how it's doing what it's doing I'd appreciate it.

Many thanks in advance!

Snooping on the bus is neither reading nor writing on the bus. It is
just watching the bus to see what is there.
So while snooping, if a video card 'sees' a write to a memory location
that holds video data, it 'looks' at the data and writes a copy of that
data to a buffer on the card. The buffer is then used (along with other information) to create a video output.

The card itself is not doing a read/write because it is not manipulating
the slot bus signals in any way. There is no effect on the operation of
the Apple II.

I don't know if the VidHD is open source, but you can download source
code for my Carte Blanche II 800x600 video card for the IIgs here:

http://noboot.com/charlie/c2001-2015-07-20.zip

Unzip it and open cb2.v with notepad or any text editor.
It is in verilog but is pretty heavily commented.

Scroll down about 216 lines to where it says 'write clock - from old
wrclk module'. The next 25 lines shows the wires and registers I used
and the 'always' block of code that does the actual snooping.

This method is derived from Alex Freed's code here:

https://sourceforge.net/projects/jatcb/?source=navbar

Incidentally, the peripheral slot bus address and data pins are
bidirectional.

Charlie

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On 8/13/2022 2:01 PM, Anthony Ortiz wrote:

Snooping on the bus is neither reading nor writing on the bus. It is
just watching the bus to see what is there.
So while snooping, if a video card 'sees' a write to a memory location
that holds video data, it 'looks' at the data and writes a copy of that
data to a buffer on the card. The buffer is then used (along with other
information) to create a video output.

The card itself is not doing a read/write because it is not manipulating
the slot bus signals in any way. There is no effect on the operation of
the Apple II.

I don't know if the VidHD is open source, but you can download source
code for my Carte Blanche II 800x600 video card for the IIgs here:

http://noboot.com/charlie/c2001-2015-07-20.zip

Unzip it and open cb2.v with notepad or any text editor.
It is in verilog but is pretty heavily commented.

Scroll down about 216 lines to where it says 'write clock - from old
wrclk module'. The next 25 lines shows the wires and registers I used
and the 'always' block of code that does the actual snooping.

This method is derived from Alex Freed's code here:

https://sourceforge.net/projects/jatcb/?source=navbar

Incidentally, the peripheral slot bus address and data pins are
bidirectional.

Charlie

Hey Charlie! Just to be clear, are you saying that so long as I have my peripheral card lines set as INPUT and tied to the R/W and Address and Data buses all I need to do is just read the signals at the appropriate time and voila!? I'll check your code

out!


Yes, but technically we use 'snooping' or 'watching' or some term other
than 'reading' the signals so as to not confuse it with actually
manipulating the R/W (Read/Write) signal.

Charlie

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

Hey Charlie! Just to be clear, are you saying that so long as I have my peripheral card lines set as INPUT and tied to the R/W and Address and Data buses all I need to do is just read the signals at the appropriate time and voila!? I'll check your

code out!

Yes, but technically we use 'snooping' or 'watching' or some term other
than 'reading' the signals so as to not confuse it with actually manipulating the R/W (Read/Write) signal.

Charlie

Gotcha! I tried accessing your site, even the home page, and Bitdefender is preventing me with malicious page warnings :(

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

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--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On 8/13/2022 11:19 PM, Anthony Ortiz wrote:

Hey Charlie! Just to be clear, are you saying that so long as I have my peripheral card lines set as INPUT and tied to the R/W and Address and Data buses all I need to do is just read the signals at the appropriate time and voila!? I'll check your

code out!

Yes, but technically we use 'snooping' or 'watching' or some term other
than 'reading' the signals so as to not confuse it with actually
manipulating the R/W (Read/Write) signal.

Charlie

Gotcha! I tried accessing your site, even the home page, and Bitdefender is preventing me with malicious page warnings :(

All I can say about the site is that I have no trouble accessing it with Windows (with the Windows security on). I've used both Firefox and MS
Edge with no problem. To my knowledge there is nothing bad on the site.

Is anyone else having trouble?

http://noboot.com/charlie/Charlie's%20Stuff.htm

I also checked with virus total.

https://www.virustotal.com/gui/home/url

It said BitDefender and G-Data flagged it as malware.
The other 93 malware programs found it clean or unrated.

I sent a false positive report to BitDefender. I don't know if that
will help. They said they would check the site and fix BitDefender in
the next 72 hours.

I also did a virus scan from this site:

https://scanner.pcrisk.com/

Here's the report:
-------------------------------------
Overview

Normalized URL: http://noboot.com:80
Submission date: Sun Aug 14 16:39:59 2022
Server IP address: 68.81.25.96
Country: United States
Web Server: Microsoft-IIS/7.5
Malicious files: 0
Suspicious files: 0
Potentially Suspicious files: 0
Clean files: 54
External links detected: 91
Iframes scanned: 2
Blacklisted: No
-------------------------------------

Charlie

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

Charlie <charlieDOTd@verEYEzon.net> writes:

On 8/13/2022 11:19 PM, Anthony Ortiz wrote:

Hey Charlie! Just to be clear, are you saying that so long as I have my peripheral
card lines set as INPUT and tied to the R/W and Address and Data buses all I need to
do is just read the signals at the appropriate time and voila!? I'll check your code
out!

Yes, but technically we use 'snooping' or 'watching' or some term other
than 'reading' the signals so as to not confuse it with actually
manipulating the R/W (Read/Write) signal.

Charlie

Gotcha! I tried accessing your site, even the home page, and Bitdefender is preventing
me with malicious page warnings :(

All I can say about the site is that I have no trouble accessing it with Windows (with the
Windows security on). I've used both Firefox and MS Edge with no problem. To my
knowledge there is nothing bad on the site.

Is anyone else having trouble?

http://noboot.com/charlie/Charlie's%20Stuff.htm

[...]

Works fine for me. Firefox 103.0 on Linux.

--
--
Jerry jerry+a2 at jpen.ca

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On 8/15/2022 1:32 AM, Jerry Penner wrote:

Charlie <charlieDOTd@verEYEzon.net> writes:

On 8/13/2022 11:19 PM, Anthony Ortiz wrote:

Hey Charlie! Just to be clear, are you saying that so long as I have my peripheral
card lines set as INPUT and tied to the R/W and Address and Data buses all I need to
do is just read the signals at the appropriate time and voila!? I'll check your code
out!

Yes, but technically we use 'snooping' or 'watching' or some term other >>>> than 'reading' the signals so as to not confuse it with actually
manipulating the R/W (Read/Write) signal.

Charlie

Gotcha! I tried accessing your site, even the home page, and Bitdefender is preventing
me with malicious page warnings :(

All I can say about the site is that I have no trouble accessing it with Windows (with the
Windows security on). I've used both Firefox and MS Edge with no problem. To my
knowledge there is nothing bad on the site.

Is anyone else having trouble?

http://noboot.com/charlie/Charlie's%20Stuff.htm

[...]

Works fine for me. Firefox 103.0 on Linux.

Thank you for checking.

Charlie

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

All I can say about the site is that I have no trouble accessing it with Windows (with the
Windows security on). I've used both Firefox and MS Edge with no problem. To my
knowledge there is nothing bad on the site.

Is anyone else having trouble?

http://noboot.com/charlie/Charlie's%20Stuff.htm

[...]

Works fine for me. Firefox 103.0 on Linux.

Thank you for checking.

Charlie

Looks good to me now, no more bitdefender blockage :)

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On 8/14/22 11:44, Charlie wrote:

All I can say about the site is that I have no trouble accessing it with Windows (with the Windows security on).  I've used both Firefox and MS Edge with no problem.  To my knowledge there is nothing bad on the site.

Is anyone else having trouble?

http://noboot.com/charlie/Charlie's%20Stuff.htm

No problem accessing the site and no warnings from the browser.

Using Firefox 100.0.2 64-bit on Linux.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On 8/16/2022 6:04 PM, Anthony Ortiz wrote:

All I can say about the site is that I have no trouble accessing it with Windows (with the
Windows security on). I've used both Firefox and MS Edge with no problem. To my
knowledge there is nothing bad on the site.

Is anyone else having trouble?

http://noboot.com/charlie/Charlie's%20Stuff.htm

[...]

Works fine for me. Firefox 103.0 on Linux.

Thank you for checking.

Charlie

Looks good to me now, no more bitdefender blockage :)

Good to hear it.

Charlie

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

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--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)