• Re: There are zero chances in Hell that I will quit this --- Survival o

    From joes@21:1/5 to All on Sat Aug 2 18:19:53 2025
    Am Sat, 02 Aug 2025 10:03:10 -0500 schrieb olcott:
    On 8/2/2025 4:38 AM, Fred. Zwarts wrote:
    Op 02.aug.2025 om 04:09 schreef olcott:
    On 8/1/2025 8:01 PM, Mr Flibble wrote:

    Olcott, give it a fucking rest: what you are banging on about has
    nothing to do with the Halting Problem.
    Damon, stop feeding Olcott: you are just talking over each other at
    this point.
    I'll have to agree with you on this one.

    Every attempt to refute me has been counter-factual.
    The survival of life an Earth depends on a correct understanding of
    truth.
    You are literally deluded.

    As usual incorrect claims without evidence.
    I am not going to repeat all of the lines of my proof every single time.
    Thank you.

    A finite recursion is not a non-halting behaviour.

    Finite recursion by itself is not non-halting behavior.
    Finite recursion that correctly detects a pattern that would infinitely repeat *IS NON-HALTING BEHAVIOR*
    ...if you change what the "HHH" that DDD calls refers to.

    You are trying to get away with the idea that if you close your eyes
    for the halting behaviour, it does not exists.
    Not at all. I repeatedly challenge you to show how DDD emulated by HHH
    halts and you change the subject.
    Change it to what?

    The simulating HHH aborts before it reaches the final halt state of the
    simulated HHH that has the same code to abort, so it does not see it
    and pretends that it does not exist.

    Each HHH aborts as soon as it has seen one recursive simulation.
    Each? The simulating and the simulated HHH?

    We could change this to each HHH aborts after it sees N recursive simulations. In every case the outer HHH meets its criteria first.
    If this HHH waited for the next, they would all wait for the next and no abort would ever occur.
    Sure, but those are different programs. DDD calls a simulator that aborts
    after two levels, no matter what you simulate it with.

    I don't change the meaning of words. I [...]
    correct the definitions of the meaning
    of words when these definitions directly contradict other definitions.
    --
    Am Sat, 20 Jul 2024 12:35:31 +0000 schrieb WM in sci.math:
    It is not guaranteed that n+1 exists for every n.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Richard Damon@21:1/5 to olcott on Sun Aug 3 07:31:30 2025
    On 8/2/25 2:46 PM, olcott wrote:
    On 8/2/2025 1:19 PM, joes wrote:
    Am Sat, 02 Aug 2025 10:03:10 -0500 schrieb olcott:
    On 8/2/2025 4:38 AM, Fred. Zwarts wrote:
    Op 02.aug.2025 om 04:09 schreef olcott:
    On 8/1/2025 8:01 PM, Mr Flibble wrote:

    Olcott, give it a fucking rest: what you are banging on about has
    nothing to do with the Halting Problem.
    Damon, stop feeding Olcott: you are just talking over each other at >>>>>> this point.
    I'll have to agree with you on this one.

    Every attempt to refute me has been counter-factual.
    The survival of life an Earth depends on a correct understanding of
    truth.
    You are literally deluded.

    As usual incorrect claims without evidence.
    I am not going to repeat all of the lines of my proof every single time.
    Thank you.

    A finite recursion is not a non-halting behaviour.

    Finite recursion by itself is not non-halting behavior.
    Finite recursion that correctly detects a pattern that would infinitely
    repeat *IS NON-HALTING BEHAVIOR*
    ...if you change what the "HHH" that DDD calls refers to.

    You are trying to get away with the idea that if you close your eyes
    for the halting behaviour, it does not exists.
    Not at all. I repeatedly challenge you to show how DDD emulated by HHH
    halts and you change the subject.

    Change it to what?


    I say DDD correctly emulated by HHH does not halt
    and Richard says no I am wrong the directly executed
    DDD() does halt. He has done this hundreds of times.

    But the problem is, if that WERE true, then HHH doesn't answer, as so
    wasn't a correct halt decider either.

    And it is a DIFFERENT DDD that the HHH that aborts sees, because DDD
    needs to be a PROGRAM, and thus include the code of the HHH that you are claiming to get the right answer, or you are just lying that you are
    following the pattern.

    Once we do that, then you statement is a lie, as now "the" HHH doesn't
    do that to "the" DDD.

    All you are doing is showing that you think you are allowed to LIE when
    you do logic, and thus that you LIE about your ultimate goal.


    The simulating HHH aborts before it reaches the final halt state of the >>>> simulated HHH that has the same code to abort, so it does not see it
    and pretends that it does not exist.

    Each HHH aborts as soon as it has seen one recursive simulation.

    Each? The simulating and the simulated HHH?


    _DDD()
    [0000219e] 55             push ebp
    [0000219f] 8bec           mov ebp,esp
    [000021a1] 689e210000     push 0000219e
    [000021a6] e843f4ffff     call 000015ee
    [000021ab] 83c404         add esp,+04
    [000021ae] 5d             pop ebp
    [000021af] c3             ret
    Size in bytes:(0018) [000021af]

    Not a valid input until the code of HHH is added to it, which makes each
    HHH get a different DDD.


    Within the infinite set of HHH/DDD pairs such that
    each HHH emulates one element of the sequence of natural
    numbers instructions of DDD no DDD element each reaches
    past its own machine address [000021a6].

    Which doesn't matter, as the test is does the program the input
    represent reach a final state, which it does (as long as the selected
    HHH returns an answer).

    All you are doing is showing that you think LYING is valid, as you try
    to use a strawman of the partial simulation of DDD to be its behavior,
    and to say that all the DDD are "the same" when they are different.


    We could change this to each HHH aborts after it sees N recursive
    simulations. In every case the outer HHH meets its criteria first.
    If this HHH waited for the next, they would all wait for the next and no >>> abort would ever occur.

    Sure, but those are different programs. DDD calls a simulator that aborts
    after two levels, no matter what you simulate it with.


    When we examine the infinite set of HHH/DDD pairs
    and HHH is a simulating termination analyzer it
    would be correct for HHH to abort its simulation
    as soon as it sees that DDD calls itself HHH(DDD).

    Nope. That is just your lie.

    If HHH does that, then the "behavior" of the input, which is DEFINED to
    be the behavior of the program it represents, will halt, as that DDD
    calls a HHH(DDD) that returns 0 to it.

    Again, all you are doing is proving you think LYING is valid logic as
    you think you get to change the meaning of words, which is just one form
    of lying.


    I have HHH emulate DDD all over again because
    people here can hardly pay any attention at all
    so I have to make a point totally obvious before
    they have any chance of understanding.


    No, you do it as you have run out of ideas of how to lie about what you
    are doing, so trying to make an obvious lie to hide your real lie,

    Sorry, all you have done is prove that you are just a stupid liar that
    doesn't know the meaning of the words he uses, but just makes up what he
    wants, and tries to call it the truth, when it is just a lie.

    I don't change the meaning of words. I [...]
    correct the definitions of the meaning
    of words when these definitions directly contradict other definitions.


    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)