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  • systemd version 256.7-2 on Debian testing disabled UTMP support

    From Jens Schmidt@21:1/5 to All on Wed Nov 6 21:50:01 2024
    [I hope this is the right way to address this question - apologies
    if not or if I have overlooked an existing discussion ...]

    systemd version 256.7-2 on Debian disabled UTMP support (from the
    Debian changelog):

    ,----
    | [ Luca Boccassi ]
    | * systemd-boot: depend on systemd for kernel-install (Closes: #1085012)
    | * Disable utmp support, not y2038 safe. utmp support in tmux has been
    | disabled, so autopkgtest should no longer break
    | * Backport fixes for upstream autopkgtest suite
    `----

    As a result, no `utmp' file is created on systems having that version
    of systemd installed. However, utmp(5) states that

    ,----
    | Unlike various other systems, where utmp logging can be disabled by re‐
    | moving the file, utmp must always exist on Linux. [...]
    `----

    And at least on my system I get the following errors logged in my
    journal:

    ,----
    | [ 24.434215] host01 lightdm[2087]: Failed to write utmpx: No such file or directory
    | [...]
    | [ 30.866566] host01 systemd[2094]: Started app-xterm1fxd.service - /home/farblos/bin/lwsdi shutdown "FVWM Child" "Wait for explicit exit" block xterm -name xterm1fxd -title "XTerm 1".
    | [ 31.026661] host01 utempter[2538]: [ppid=2536] pututline: No such file or directory
    `----

    Since:

    - I'd like to get rid of these warnings/errors,
    - I'd like to have an `utmp' file that does *not* last across reboots
    and
    - I don't care (yet) about the Y2038 problem,

    I came up with file `/etc/tmpfiles.d/90-local-utmp.conf' containing
    what `/usr/lib/tmpfiles.d/systemd.conf' previously provided, namely:

    ,----
    | f+! /run/utmp 0664 root utmp -
    `----

    Would that be the "correct" or "Debian-ish" way to provide an `utmp'
    file that fulfills my above requirements?

    And: Should users file Debian bugs against applications still relying
    on `utmp'? Or will there be some replacement for what systemd has
    provided?

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Charles Curley@21:1/5 to Jens Schmidt on Thu Nov 7 00:10:01 2024
    On Wed, 6 Nov 2024 21:18:33 +0100
    Jens Schmidt <farblos@vodafonemail.de> wrote:

    [I hope this is the right way to address this question - apologies
    if not or if I have overlooked an existing discussion ...]

    systemd version 256.7-2 on Debian disabled UTMP support (from the
    Debian changelog):

    I am guessing from the version number that this is on trixie/sid. On
    November 4th, systemd 256.7-3 came through. Have you tested whether
    that fixed the issue?

    --
    Does anybody read signatures any more?

    https://charlescurley.com
    https://charlescurley.com/blog/

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Jens Schmidt@21:1/5 to All on Thu Nov 7 21:20:01 2024
    I am guessing from the version number that this is on trixie/sid. On

    Correct, thanks for guessing.

    November 4th, systemd 256.7-3 came through. Have you tested whether
    that fixed the issue?

    Nothing has changed with that version (note the "-UTMP"):

    ,----
    | [~]$ systemctl --version
    | systemd 256 (256.7-3)
    | +PAM +AUDIT +SELINUX +APPARMOR +IMA +SMACK +SECCOMP +GCRYPT -GNUTLS +OPENSSL +ACL +BLKID +CURL +ELFUTILS +FIDO2 +IDN2 -IDN +IPTC +KMOD +LIBCRYPTSETUP +LIBCRYPTSETUP_PLUGINS +LIBFDISK +PCRE2 +PWQUALITY +P11KIT +QRENCODE +TPM2 +BZIP2 +LZ4 +XZ +ZLIB +ZSTD
    +BPF_FRAMEWORK -XKBCOMMON -UTMP +SYSVINIT +LIBARCHIVE
    |
    | [~]$ grep utmp /usr/lib/tmpfiles.d/systemd.conf || echo no hits
    | no hits
    `----

    and given the fact that the change has been explicitly mentioned
    in systemd's Debian changelog I doubt that anything will change
    here.

    IOW, I do not consider this a systemd bug, but I'm curious about
    how Debian plans to handle the bigger utmp picture here.

    Please CC me in replies, as I'm not subscribed to the list.

    Thanks!

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Farblos@21:1/5 to Jens Schmidt on Fri Nov 15 22:40:01 2024
    Hi Luca, everybody,

    any comment from your side on below mail or a general pointer on
    "the future of Debian and utmp"?

    Thanks

    Jens

    On 2024-11-06 21:18, Jens Schmidt wrote:
    [I hope this is the right way to address this question - apologies
    if not or if I have overlooked an existing discussion ...]

    systemd version 256.7-2 on Debian disabled UTMP support (from the
    Debian changelog):

    ,----
    | [ Luca Boccassi ]
    | * systemd-boot: depend on systemd for kernel-install (Closes: #1085012)
    | * Disable utmp support, not y2038 safe. utmp support in tmux has been
    | disabled, so autopkgtest should no longer break
    | * Backport fixes for upstream autopkgtest suite
    `----

    As a result, no `utmp' file is created on systems having that version
    of systemd installed. However, utmp(5) states that

    ,----
    | Unlike various other systems, where utmp logging can be disabled by re‐ | moving the file, utmp must always exist on Linux. [...]
    `----

    And at least on my system I get the following errors logged in my
    journal:

    ,----
    | [ 24.434215] host01 lightdm[2087]: Failed to write utmpx: No such file or directory
    | [...]
    | [ 30.866566] host01 systemd[2094]: Started app-xterm1fxd.service - /home/farblos/bin/lwsdi shutdown "FVWM Child" "Wait for explicit exit" block xterm -name xterm1fxd -title "XTerm 1".
    | [ 31.026661] host01 utempter[2538]: [ppid=2536] pututline: No such file or directory
    `----

    Since:

    - I'd like to get rid of these warnings/errors,
    - I'd like to have an `utmp' file that does *not* last across reboots
    and
    - I don't care (yet) about the Y2038 problem,

    I came up with file `/etc/tmpfiles.d/90-local-utmp.conf' containing
    what `/usr/lib/tmpfiles.d/systemd.conf' previously provided, namely:

    ,----
    | f+! /run/utmp 0664 root utmp -
    `----

    Would that be the "correct" or "Debian-ish" way to provide an `utmp'
    file that fulfills my above requirements?

    And: Should users file Debian bugs against applications still relying
    on `utmp'? Or will there be some replacement for what systemd has
    provided?

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Farblos@21:1/5 to Farblos on Sun Nov 17 12:10:02 2024
    On 2024-11-15 22:19, Farblos wrote:

    any comment from your side on below mail or a general pointer on
    "the future of Debian and utmp"?

    Ok, my bad.

    I have been focusing on/searching in debian-user, but debian-devel
    would have been the more appropriate place. If anybody else comes
    across this here, some relevant pointers are:

    - https://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2024/04/msg00406.html

    - https://wiki.debian.org/pam_lastlog2%20and%20wtmpdb

    - https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=1068017

    From that I understand that one should open bugs tagged as
    "utmp-disable" for any packages moaning about an absent utmp
    file. Will do that for packages xterm and lightdm ...

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)