• Bad News for Universal Basic Income.

    From D@21:1/5 to All on Mon Aug 26 12:58:08 2024
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    Bad News for Universal Basic Income

    Researchers found that giving people $1,000 every month for three years resulted in decreased productivity and earnings, and more leisure time.

    (https://reason.com/2024/07/25/bad-news-for-universal-basic-income)

    The largest study into the real-world consequences of giving people an
    extra $1,000 per month, with no strings attached, has found that those individuals generally worked less, earned less, and engaged in more
    leisure time activities.

    It's a result that seems to undercut some of the arguments for universal
    basic income (UBI), which advocates say would help lower- and middle-class Americans become more productive. The idea is that a UBI would reduce the financial uncertainty that might keep some people from pursuing new
    careers or entrepreneurial opportunities. Andrew Yang, the businessman and one-time Democratic presidential candidate who popularized the idea during
    his 2020 primary campaign, believes that a $1,000 monthly UBI would
    "enable all Americans to pay their bills, educate themselves, start
    businesses, be more creative, stay healthy, relocate for work, spend time
    with their children, take care of loved ones, and have a real stake in the future."

    In theory, that sounds great. In reality, that's not what most people do, according to a working paper published this month.

    The five researchers who published the paper tracked 1,000 people in
    Illinois and Texas over three years who were given $1,000 monthly gifts
    from a nonprofit that funded the study. The average household income for
    the study's participants was about $29,000 in 2019, so the monthly
    payments amounted to about a 40 percent increase in their income.

    Relative to a control group of 2,000 people who received just $50 per
    month, the participants in the UBI group were less productive and no more likely to pursue better jobs or start businesses, the researchers found.
    They also reported "no significant effects on investments in human
    capital" due to the monthly payments.

    Participants receiving the $1,000 monthly payments saw their income fall
    by about $1,500 per year (excluding the UBI payments), due to a two
    percentage point decrease in labor market participation and the fact that participants worked about 1.3 hours less per week than the members of the control group.

    "You can think of total household income, excluding the transfers, as
    falling by more than 20 cents for every $1 received," wrote Eva Vivalt, a University of Toronto economist who co-authored the study, in a post on X. "This is a pretty substantial effect."

    But if those people are working less, the important question to ask is how
    they spent the extra time—time that was, effectively, purchased by the transfer payments.

    Participants in the study generally did not use the extra time to seek new
    or better jobs—even though younger participants were slightly more likely
    to pursue additional education. There was no clear indication that the participants in the study were more likely to take the risk of starting a
    new business, although Vivalt points out that there was a significant
    uptick in "precursors" to entrepreneurialism. Instead, the largest
    increases were in categories that the researchers termed social and solo leisure activities.

    Some advocates for UBI might argue that the study shows participants were better off, despite the decline in working hours and earnings. Indeed,
    maybe that's the whole point?

    "While decreased labor market participation is generally characterized negatively, policymakers should take into account the fact that recipients
    have demonstrated—by their own choices—that time away from work is something they prize highly," the researchers note in the paper's
    conclusion.

    If you give someone $1,000 a month so they have more flexibility to live
    as they choose, there's nothing wrong with the fact that most people will choose leisure over harder work.

    "So, free time is good [and] guaranteed income recipients use some of the
    money to free up time," argued Damon Jones, a professor at the University
    of Chicago's school of public policy, on X. "The results are bad if you
    want low-income people to be doing other things with their time, for
    example working."

    Of course, if the money being used to fund a UBI program was simply
    falling from the sky, policy makers would have no reason to care about
    things like labor market effects and potential declines in productivity.
    If a program like this is costless, then the only goal is to see as many individuals self-actualize as much as possible. One person wants to learn
    new skills or start a business? Great! Others want to play video games all
    day? Awesome.

    In reality, however, a UBI program is not costless and policy makers
    deciding whether to implement one must decide if the benefits will be
    worth the high price tag—Yang's proposal for a national UBI, for example,
    is estimated to cost $2.8 trillion annually.

    That's why a study like this one matters, and why it's so potentially
    damaging to the case for a UBI. A welfare program—which is ultimately what this is—that encourages people to work less and earn less is not a
    successful public policy. Taxpayers should not be expected to fund an
    increase in individuals' leisure time, regardless of the mechanism used to achieve it.

    In theory, substituting a UBI in place of the myriad, overlapping, and
    often inefficient welfare systems operated by the federal and state
    governments is an intriguing idea. In practice, this new study suggests
    those tradeoffs might not be as desirable.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Danart@21:1/5 to All on Thu Aug 29 09:15:13 2024
    D wrote:
    Bad News for Universal Basic Income

    Researchers found that giving people $1,000 every month for three
    years
    resulted in decreased productivity and earnings, and more leisure
    time.

    (https://reason.com/2024/07/25/bad-news-for-universal-basic-income)

    The largest study into the real-world consequences of giving people
    an
    extra $1,000 per month, with no strings attached, has found that
    those
    individuals generally worked less, earned less, and engaged in more

    leisure time activities.

    It's a result that seems to undercut some of the arguments for
    universal
    basic income (UBI), which advocates say would help lower- and
    middle-class
    Americans become more productive. The idea is that a UBI would
    reduce the
    financial uncertainty that might keep some people from pursuing new

    careers or entrepreneurial opportunities. Andrew Yang, the
    businessman and
    one-time Democratic presidential candidate who popularized the idea
    during
    his 2020 primary campaign, believes that a $1,000 monthly UBI would

    "enable all Americans to pay their bills, educate themselves,
    start
    businesses, be more creative, stay healthy, relocate for work,
    spend time
    with their children, take care of loved ones, and have a real stake
    in the
    future."

    In theory, that sounds great. In reality, that's not what most
    people do,
    according to a working paper published this month.

    The five researchers who published the paper tracked 1,000 people
    in
    Illinois and Texas over three years who were given $1,000 monthly
    gifts
    from a nonprofit that funded the study. The average household
    income for
    the study's participants was about $29,000 in 2019, so the monthly
    payments amounted to about a 40 percent increase in their income.

    Relative to a control group of 2,000 people who received just $50
    per
    month, the participants in the UBI group were less productive and
    no more
    likely to pursue better jobs or start businesses, the researchers
    found.
    They also reported "no significant effects on investments in
    human
    capital" due to the monthly payments.

    Participants receiving the $1,000 monthly payments saw their income
    fall
    by about $1,500 per year (excluding the UBI payments), due to a two

    percentage point decrease in labor market participation and the
    fact that
    participants worked about 1.3 hours less per week than the members
    of the
    control group.

    "You can think of total household income, excluding the
    transfers, as
    falling by more than 20 cents for every $1 received," wrote
    Eva Vivalt, a
    University of Toronto economist who co-authored the study, in a
    post on X.
    "This is a pretty substantial effect."

    But if those people are working less, the important question to ask
    is how
    they spent the extra time—time that was, effectively, purchased
    by the
    transfer payments.

    Participants in the study generally did not use the extra time to
    seek new
    or better jobs—even though younger participants were slightly
    more likely
    to pursue additional education. There was no clear indication that
    the
    participants in the study were more likely to take the risk of
    starting a
    new business, although Vivalt points out that there was a
    significant
    uptick in "precursors" to entrepreneurialism. Instead,
    the largest
    increases were in categories that the researchers termed social and
    solo
    leisure activities.

    Some advocates for UBI might argue that the study shows
    participants were
    better off, despite the decline in working hours and earnings.
    Indeed,
    maybe that's the whole point?

    "While decreased labor market participation is generally
    characterized
    negatively, policymakers should take into account the fact that
    recipients
    have demonstrated—by their own choices—that time away from work
    is
    something they prize highly," the researchers note in the
    paper's
    conclusion.

    If you give someone $1,000 a month so they have more flexibility to
    live
    as they choose, there's nothing wrong with the fact that most
    people will
    choose leisure over harder work.

    "So, free time is good [and] guaranteed income recipients use
    some of the
    money to free up time," argued Damon Jones, a professor at the
    University
    of Chicago's school of public policy, on X. "The results are
    bad if you
    want low-income people to be doing other things with their time,
    for
    example working."

    Of course, if the money being used to fund a UBI program was simply

    falling from the sky, policy makers would have no reason to care
    about
    things like labor market effects and potential declines in
    productivity.
    If a program like this is costless, then the only goal is to see as
    many
    individuals self-actualize as much as possible. One person wants to
    learn
    new skills or start a business? Great! Others want to play video
    games all
    day? Awesome.

    In reality, however, a UBI program is not costless and policy
    makers
    deciding whether to implement one must decide if the benefits will
    be
    worth the high price tag—Yang's proposal for a national UBI, for
    example,
    is estimated to cost $2.8 trillion annually.

    That's why a study like this one matters, and why it's so
    potentially
    damaging to the case for a UBI. A welfare program—which is
    ultimately what
    this is—that encourages people to work less and earn less is not
    a
    successful public policy. Taxpayers should not be expected to fund
    an
    increase in individuals' leisure time, regardless of the mechanism
    used to
    achieve it.

    In theory, substituting a UBI in place of the myriad, overlapping,
    and
    often inefficient welfare systems operated by the federal and state

    governments is an intriguing idea. In practice, this new study
    suggests
    those tradeoffs might not be as desirable.

    Are you talking
    about free money or your talking about raising the wages based on the


    Inflation happens when
    1. Wars ( like Iraq/Afganistan ) or anything that forces US spending
    as with weapons to Ukraine, or usage of troops. More peace means less
    spending.
    2. Racism happens, age discrimination, ( race, religion, culture ) discrimination, and your left with educated people with no ability to
    actually function at all. Forcing a bird to live on land. That bird
    might survive but with reminder of the hate that you give it.
    3. That being said when you have people ( like in my area J-e-w-s, and
    LGBT ) in the education system taking jobs, and then you as a parent
    wants to keep your kid away from these people via home-schooling, only
    to have to deal with ( as my uncle said "Black phat woman"
    and scrawny White men" ) who makes you a criminal for doing what
    "The Graduate Part 2" did, which was to home school there
    children.

    Your in a screwed up system where nobody can be happy. It is like in
    "1984". The adults know they are being held-hostage, they
    knew they are being abused by the system, they know they are children
    of the would-be whores, and sell-outs, but in reality the children (
    Like the boyscouts ) believe the system is just, the system is ideal,
    and the system is perfectly fine. When in reality it is a war to
    remove pieces from the "war at home".

    ...........

    About communism..............yes communism which is literally akin to
    J-U-E-s controlling USSR, as with both "Bobby Fischer" and
    "Martin Luther" put it "Special". We might create
    a weaker person, a person who is unable to think outside the system in
    place.

    ...........

    I mean yes you might be correct. We should not give people money.

    but

    If there is no wars, no guns, and thus leaving an open-gap.

    If these people invest the money wisely. If these people make income
    off that income, in time ( whatever currency ) would increase.

    ...........


    It is like the "Great Mall of China". Nobody purchasing
    anything, businesses are told to stay even if lack of customers. The
    communism factory worker mindset created this abandoned and empty mall
    full of goods nobody locally will buy. But the buyers could come from
    abroad, which is why we have marketing on various social media
    platforms.


    This is a response to the post seen at: http://www.jlaforums.com/viewtopic.php?p=672715977#672715977

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  • From JAB@21:1/5 to nospam@example.net on Thu Aug 29 12:22:23 2024
    On Mon, 26 Aug 2024 12:58:08 +0200, D <nospam@example.net> wrote:

    Bad News for Universal Basic Incom

    Eric is hell bent on pleasing the conservatives....he has omitted
    other details in that study.


    Eric Boehm is a reporter for Reason. He lives in Culpeper, Virginia.

    His work has appeared in The Wall Street Journal, National Review
    Online, The Freeman Magazine, The Philadelphia Inquirer, The American Spectator, The Washington Examiner, The Daily Signal, FoxNews.com, and elsewhere.

    He was a national regulatory reporter for Watchdog.org and bureau
    chief of the (now-defunct) Pennsylvania Independent in Harrisburg, Pennsylvania. He has also lived in St. Paul, Minnesota; Rochester, New
    York; and Brussels, Belgium. He received a bachelor' degree from
    Fairfield University in 2009. When he steps away from the computer, he
    enjoys drinking craft beer and good gin, cheering for an eclectic mix
    of favorite sports teams (mostly based in Philadelphia), updating his
    list of TV shows he intended to watch but never did, reading and
    traveling to new places. He was once featured in a Buzzfeed listicle
    about the 2008 Democratic National Convention. (Reason)

    https://www.allsides.com/news-source/eric-boehm-media-bias

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