https://www.laptopmag.com/phones/iphone/apples-iphone-15-pro-max-is-a-disaster-screen-burn-in-latest-of-reported-issues
While an initial patch seemed to solve its thermal problems it came at the expense of performance as A17 benchmarks dipped following the update.

To make matters worse users are now reporting screen burn issues hampering
the smartphone.

First, the iPhone 15 was just overheating.
Then Apple markedly reduced A17 performance but it's still overheating.
Now it's also suffering from premature OLED burn-in.

What's next?

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On 2023-10-15 19:39, Peter wrote:

https://www.laptopmag.com/phones/iphone/apples-iphone-15-pro-max-is-a-disaster-screen-burn-in-latest-of-reported-issues
While an initial patch seemed to solve its thermal problems it came at the expense of performance as A17 benchmarks dipped following the update.

To make matters worse users are now reporting screen burn issues hampering the smartphone.

First, the iPhone 15 was just overheating.
Then Apple markedly reduced A17 performance but it's still overheating.
Now it's also suffering from premature OLED burn-in.

What's next?

You visit your doctor for hysteria treatment?

The first problem was solved in s/w. No performance hit at all. And a
few still report issues.

Then some OLED's are seeing quality issues.

Bring on the hysteria.

--
“Markets can remain irrational longer than your can remain solvent.”
- John Maynard Keynes.

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Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> wrote:

You visit your doctor for hysteria treatment?

Maybe you need to visit the eye doctor since you didn't read this report. https://www.laptopmag.com/news/iphone-15-pro-overheating-ios-17-0-3-benchmark-results

The first problem was solved in s/w. No performance hit at all.

Two out of three very well respected testing outfits found markedly reduced performance between iOS 17.0.2 and 17.0.3 with nothing else having changed. https://9to5mac.com/2023/10/04/ios-17-0-3-iphone-15-pro-overheating/

And a few still report issues.

Reports are that the fix didn't fix the overheating even as you say it did. https://www.zdnet.com/article/new-iphone-15-pro-overheating-reports-still-too-hot-after-ios-17-0-3-and-fresh-issues-arise-after-the-update/

Then some OLED's are seeing quality issues.

Tom�s Guide points out that if screen burn-in occurs on the iPhone 15 Pro
or iPhone 15 Pro Max, which has been released for less than a month, there
may be other factors, such as a defective display https://iphonewired.com/news/709658/

Bring on the hysteria.

It's clear that you haven't read the news about the iPhone 15 in weeks.

Since the first overheating fix required markedly reduced A17 performance,
what do you think the second overheating fix is going to do to performance?

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On 2023-10-15, Peter <confused@nospam.net> wrote:

https://www.laptopmag.com/phones/iphone/apples-iphone-15-pro-max-is-a-disaster-screen-burn-in-latest-of-reported-issues
While an initial patch seemed to solve its thermal problems it came at
the expense of performance as A17 benchmarks dipped following the
update.

Poor, little Arlen. He's just *desperate* to flood this news group with
posts supporting his bullshit claim that the iPhone 15 hardware is
supposedly "defective" - *so* desperate that he's actively seeking out
articles and posts that confirm his anti-Apple bias while ignoring the
plethora of others articles and posts showing the reality. And even his
linked article says this:

---
First of all, these numbers are still dramatically faster than its
closest competitors — the Snapdragon 8 Gen 2-armed Samsung Galaxy S23
Ultra and the OnePlus 11. Second, looking at the tests from other
publications, the results seem to be all over the shop. You see, these
results can vary based on conditions of where the test is done.
9to5Mac’s preliminary results show a far smaller drop, while
AppleInsider has seen no drop at all.
---

And notice how the article's author gets even this part wrong:

---
based on conditions of where the test is done
---

Actually, as anyone who knows anything about software and hardware
design knows, benchmark results aren't strictly based on *where* the
test is done as much as they are based on the *state* of the device at
the time of testing, which will naturally be affected by environment
(ambient temperature), but to a much greater extent which processes are
running on the device at the time, which will naturally vary for each
device (and eve

Peter <confused@nospam.net> wrote:

Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> wrote:

You visit your doctor for hysteria treatment?

Maybe you need to visit the eye doctor since you didn't read this report. https://www.laptopmag.com/news/iphone-15-pro-overheating-ios-17-0-3-benchmark-results

The first problem was solved in s/w. No performance hit at all.

Two out of three very well respected testing outfits found markedly reduced performance between iOS 17.0.2 and 17.0.3 with nothing else having changed. https://9to5mac.com/2023/10/04/ios-17-0-3-iphone-15-pro-overheating/

Er, try reading the 9to5 one again. They ran two tests after updating to
17.0.3 the first was very slightly down, but the second was very much up against a single result with 17.0.2.

The thing that annoys me about these reports is that they are completely unreliable. Why can't they run the tests 5x under each condition? That will then give you the ability to apply simple statistical methodology to
identify real differences. n=1 tells you nothing at all.

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Chris <ithinkiam@gmail.com> wrote:

The thing that annoys me about these reports is that they are completely unreliable. Why can't they run the tests 5x under each condition?

I think we have to wait for more reliable benchmark comparisons to be done, (but only after all the overheating issues have been "fixed" in software).

Apple only fixed some so we have to wait for all to be fixed since you
can't fix overheating without reducing the performance in some manner.

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Am 16.10.23 um 01:39 schrieb Peter:

https://www.laptopmag.com/phones/iphone/apples-iphone-15-pro-max-is-a-disaster-screen-burn-in-latest-of-reported-issues
While an initial patch seemed to solve its thermal problems it came at the expense of performance as A17 benchmarks dipped following the update.

To make matters worse users are now reporting screen burn issues hampering the smartphone.

First, the iPhone 15 was just overheating.
Then Apple markedly reduced A17 performance but it's still overheating.
Now it's also suffering from premature OLED burn-in.

What's next?

Arlen, you are the idiot of the English speaking Usenet!
You really believe that someone takes your effusions serious?

--
Gutta cavat lapidem (Ovid)

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On 2023-10-15 19:51, Peter wrote:

Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> wrote:

You visit your doctor for hysteria treatment?

Maybe you need to visit the eye doctor since you didn't read this report. https://www.laptopmag.com/news/iphone-15-pro-overheating-ios-17-0-3-benchmark-results

The first problem was solved in s/w. No performance hit at all.

Two out of three very well respected testing outfits found markedly reduced performance between iOS 17.0.2 and 17.0.3 with nothing else having changed. https://9to5mac.com/2023/10/04/ios-17-0-3-iphone-15-pro-overheating/

And a few still report issues.

Reports are that the fix didn't fix the overheating even as you say it did. https://www.zdnet.com/article/new-iphone-15-pro-overheating-reports-still-too-hot-after-ios-17-0-3-and-fresh-issues-arise-after-the-update/

Then some OLED's are seeing quality issues.

Tom¢s Guide points out that if screen burn-in occurs on the iPhone 15 Pro
or iPhone 15 Pro Max, which has been released for less than a month, there may be other factors, such as a defective display https://iphonewired.com/news/709658/

Bring on the hysteria.

It's clear that you haven't read the news about the iPhone 15 in weeks.

Since the first overheating fix required markedly reduced A17 performance, what do you think the second overheating fix is going to do to performance?

And yet other tests show no significant difference at all... so jury's out.

As to OLED that would more likely be unit problems rather than a general problem. eg: Apple have been working on this for a long time and would
have thousands of hours on early sample displays - they would not go to production with such.


--
“Markets can remain irrational longer than your can remain solvent.”
- John Maynard Keynes.

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On 2023-10-16 05:15, Peter wrote:

Apple only fixed some so we have to wait for all to be fixed since you
can't fix overheating without reducing the performance in some manner.

False. Bugs can often just cause CPU 'spin' (which consumes power)
while waiting for a signal or condition to occur. This is indeed a
common error in multithreaded environments and iOS is most definitely such.

--
“Markets can remain irrational longer than your can remain solvent.”
- John Maynard Keynes.

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Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> wrote:

On 2023-10-16 05:15, Peter wrote:

Apple only fixed some so we have to wait for all to be fixed since you
can't fix overheating without reducing the performance in some manner.

False. Bugs can often just cause CPU 'spin' (which consumes power)
while waiting for a signal or condition to occur. This is indeed a
common error in multithreaded environments and iOS is most definitely such.

I have to admire your optimistic wishful thinking that every cause of
iPhone 15 overheating is due only to that one extremely rare situation.

How you managed to debug all the overheating cases without needing even a single test on a single iPhone 15 means you have tremendous debug skills.

How do you manage to identify that single one-in-a-million situation that
each & every overheating problem reported is due to (even as Apple hasn't)?

You alone could replace all of Apple's test engineers since you figured out
the problem that Apple still hasn't figured out yet (based on the reports).

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On 2023-10-16 09:32, Peter wrote:

yet (based on the reports).

Based on a few tests posted online that were poorly (if at all)
controlled...

--
“Markets can remain irrational longer than your can remain solvent.”
- John Maynard Keynes.

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On 10/16/2023 6:32 AM, Peter wrote:

<snip>

I have to admire your optimistic wishful thinking that every cause of
iPhone 15 overheating is due only to that one extremely rare situation.

How you managed to debug all the overheating cases without needing even a single test on a single iPhone 15 means you have tremendous debug skills.

How do you manage to identify that single one-in-a-million situation that each & every overheating problem reported is due to (even as Apple hasn't)?

You alone could replace all of Apple's test engineers since you figured out the problem that Apple still hasn't figured out yet (based on the reports).

It's not possible to go through millions of apps, find the ones that are written in a way that use excessive system resources and cause
overheating, and have the developer modify the app to reduce the
resources that the app uses.

Because the very high performance of the Bionic CPU/GPU, developers
don't make any effort to optimize their applications to use fewer
resources, it just has not been necessary. Since iOS does not support
true multi-tasking, only "fast app-switching," one app using all the
resources of the processor is not a problem, other than in terms of
power consumption and thermals.

As to throttling, it already is occurring: "...a TechTablets reviewer
has confirmed that the iPhone 15 Pro Max struggles with A17 Pro
throttling. After 20 minutes of GPU load, performance had dropped by
nearly 34%. In just two minutes, nearly 25% of the performance was
lost." <https://www.sportskeeda.com/gaming-tech/blame-apple-implementing-proper-cooling-system-iphone-15-pro-s-heating-issues-leave-fans-disappointed>.

As to the ultimate solution to this issue, it remains to be seen.
Obviously simply changing the temperature at which the processor reduces
speed is one solution. They could have chosen a lower set point at the
outset and no one would have noticed or cared but they may have been
trying to achieve high scores on benchmarks. They could add a slider to Settings that allows the user to choose the balance of performance and temperature that they are comfortable with.

In the next generation of iPhone Pro/Pro Max they can improve the
thermal solution, following the example of other flagship devices, by
adding vapor chamber cooling, "According to Sondesix, a vapor chamber
cooling system is necessary for modern flagship phones, especially if
the material being used is unable to dissipate heat." <https://www.sportskeeda.com/gaming-tech/blame-apple-implementing-proper-cooling-system-iphone-15-pro-s-heating-issues-leave-fans-disappointed>.

OLED burn in has been an issue on many devices since OLED was
introduced, it's not limited to the iPhone. Apple acknowledges the OLED
burn in can be an issue in "extreme cases," see <https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT208191>. The best advice is to limit
the use of high brightness to times when it is absolutely necessary.

--
“If you are not an expert on a subject, then your opinions about it
really do matter less than the opinions of experts. It's not
indoctrination nor elitism. It's just that you don't know as much as
they do about the subject.”—Tin Foil Awards

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On 2023-10-16, Chris <ithinkiam@gmail.com> wrote:

Peter <confused@nospam.net> wrote:

Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> wrote:

You visit your doctor for hysteria treatment?

Maybe you need to visit the eye doctor since you didn't read this
report.
https://www.laptopmag.com/news/iphone-15-pro-overheating-ios-17-0-3-benchmark-results

The first problem was solved in s/w. No performance hit at all.

Two out of three very well respected testing outfits found markedly
reduced performance between iOS 17.0.2 and 17.0.3 with nothing else
having changed.
https://9to5mac.com/2023/10/04/ios-17-0-3-iphone-15-pro-overheating/

Er, try reading the 9to5 one again. They ran two tests after updating
to 17.0.3 the first was very slightly down, but the second was very
much up against a single result with 17.0.2.

The thing that annoys me about these reports is that they are
completely unreliable. Why can't they run the tests 5x under each
condition? That will then give you the ability to apply simple
statistical methodology to identify real differences. n=1 tells you
nothing at all.

Even then, they aren't controlling what the device happens to be doing
at the time. There are lots of Unix processes under the hood that may or
may not be processing content at any point in time. So at best,
benchmark results should be taken with a grain of salt.

--
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR

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Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote

Even then, they aren't controlling what the device happens to be doing
at the time. There are lots of Unix processes under the hood that may or
may not be processing content at any point in time. So at best,
benchmark results should be taken with a grain of salt.

You can always chastise me if I say something unreasonable, as I'll berate
you if you do - but it's to Apple's credit - I think - that - to my
knowledge, Apple themselves doesn't seem to advertise benchmark scores.

We're all old men who are quite aware of how benchmarks can be skewed.

My only cynical comment is that when the Apple processor comes out above
others in those bogus benchmarks, posters here do very much crow about it.

Not me. But others. Like Steve and Alan Browne, offhand. But not me.
I agree with Jolly Roger that benchmarks are limited in their usefulness.

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Peter <confused@nospam.net> wrote:

Chris <ithinkiam@gmail.com> wrote:

The thing that annoys me about these reports is that they are completely
unreliable. Why can't they run the tests 5x under each condition?

I think we have to wait for more reliable benchmark comparisons to be done, (but only after all the overheating issues have been "fixed" in software).

No we don't. Different benchmarks will add more information, but only if
the tests are run multiple times. Running several benchmarks only once
tells you very little.

Apple only fixed some so we have to wait for all to be fixed since you
can't fix overheating without reducing the performance in some manner.

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On 2023-10-16 16:23, Chris wrote:

Peter <confused@nospam.net> wrote:

Chris <ithinkiam@gmail.com> wrote:

The thing that annoys me about these reports is that they are completely >>> unreliable. Why can't they run the tests 5x under each condition?

I think we have to wait for more reliable benchmark comparisons to be done, >> (but only after all the overheating issues have been "fixed" in software).

No we don't. Different benchmarks will add more information, but only if
the tests are run multiple times. Running several benchmarks only once
tells you very little.

Also need to stabilize the temperature between tests to be sure initial conditions are the same.

Bad enough doing experiments with 3 or variables.

An iPhone is like a thousand variables. Or 10,000....

--
“Markets can remain irrational longer than your can remain solvent.”
- John Maynard Keynes.

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Peter <confused@nospam.net> wrote:

https://www.laptopmag.com/phones/iphone/apples-iphone-15-pro-max-is-a-disaster-screen-burn-in-latest-of-reported-issues
While an initial patch seemed to solve its thermal problems it came at the expense of performance as A17 benchmarks dipped following the update.

To make matters worse users are now reporting screen burn issues hampering the smartphone.

First, the iPhone 15 was just overheating.
Then Apple markedly reduced A17 performance but it's still overheating.
Now it's also suffering from premature OLED burn-in.

What's next?

Didn't previous iPhones have issues when they first came out too?
--
"'If you can?' said Jesus. 'Everything is possible for him who believes.'" --Mark 9:23. Global Cat & Nat. Boss' Days, but Who's the Boss? Tony Micelli? Cats? :) Tech issues again. :(
Note: A fixed width font (Courier, Monospace, etc.) is required to see this signature correctly.
/\___/\ Ant(Dude) @ http://aqfl.net & http://antfarm.home.dhs.org.
/ /\ /\ \ Please nuke ANT if replying by e-mail.
| |o o| |
\ _ /
( )

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Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> wrote:

On 2023-10-16 16:23, Chris wrote:

Peter <confused@nospam.net> wrote:

Chris <ithinkiam@gmail.com> wrote:

The thing that annoys me about these reports is that they are completely >>>> unreliable. Why can't they run the tests 5x under each condition?

I think we have to wait for more reliable benchmark comparisons to be done, >>> (but only after all the overheating issues have been "fixed" in software). >>

No we don't. Different benchmarks will add more information, but only if
the tests are run multiple times. Running several benchmarks only once
tells you very little.

Also need to stabilize the temperature between tests to be sure initial conditions are the same.

Bad enough doing experiments with 3 or variables.

An iPhone is like a thousand variables. Or 10,000....

Correct. Important to measure the inter vs intra device variability.

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