1. Forum
  2. Usenet
  3. NEWS.ADMIN.MISC

  • How does your server handle rmgroup control messages?

    From Tristan Miller@21:1/5 to All on Fri Mar 28 22:08:45 2025
    Dear all,

    The Big-8 Management Board has posted an RFD to remove 99 disused
    moderated groups [1]. One of the points raised in the discussion is
    whether removing these groups might irretrievably destroy their
    contents, which could hinder people doing (historical) research. The
    Board is therefore seeking information from server administrators
    concerning their article retention and archiving policies for deleted
    groups. We're particularly interested in hearing from admins of public
    servers (that is, those that allow read access from the general public,
    whether for free or for a fee) but would also be happy to hear about
    servers operated for personal use or for use within an organization.
    What we'd like to know is as follows:

    1. Is your server set up to process control messages to remove groups,
    or does it automatically ignore them? If it does process them, is this
    process automatic or does it require manual intervention?

    2. If your server does process control messages, what action does your
    server normally take for an rmgroup? For example, does it remove the
    group entirely so that users can no longer see and access it, or does it
    simply mark the group as read-only so that users can still subscribe and
    read but not post to it?

    3. How long does your server retain articles in deleted groups, and is
    this retention limit any different from that of active groups?

    4. Do you make archives of posts in deleted groups that are accessible
    other than via NNTP (e.g., via a website)? If so, do these archives
    faithfully preserve the article headers and bodies? Do you make these
    archives available to your users, enquirers, and/or the general public?

    Regards,
    Tristan

    [1] <news:vqq7tf$ehn$1@reader1.panix.com>

    --
    Usenet Big-8 Management Board
    https://www.big-8.org/
    board@big-8.org

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From =?UTF-8?Q?Julien_=C3=89LIE?=@21:1/5 to All on Sun Mar 30 13:59:25 2025
    Hi Tristan,

    The Big-8 Management Board has posted an RFD to remove 99 disused
    moderated groups [1].  One of the points raised in the discussion is
    whether removing these groups might irretrievably destroy their
    contents, which could hinder people doing (historical) research.  The
    Board is therefore seeking information from server administrators
    concerning their article retention and archiving policies for deleted
    groups.

    This is always the same debate as soon as we speak about removing
    newsgroups from a canonic list of newsgroups (checkgroups).

    There had been a mass removal in 2011 (and also earlier) in the
    Big-Eight. Does it appear to currently be a problem?

    If a news server is intended to be a Usenet archival server, then
    naturally it does not honour any removal of newsgroups and does not
    expire any article. So they won't be affected by the removals.

    Otherwise, well, it can have whatever policy as it does not aim at being
    used for historical research.

    My two cents,

    --
    Julien ÉLIE

    « Il ne faut jamais pleurer d'avoir perdu la lune car les larmes
    empêchent de voir les étoiles. »

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Thomas Hochstein@21:1/5 to Tristan Miller on Sun Mar 30 15:14:58 2025
    Tristan Miller wrote:

    One of the points raised in the discussion is
    whether removing these groups might irretrievably destroy their
    contents, which could hinder people doing (historical) research.

    If those groups have been disused for years, their content will have
    expired long ago. Servers with very long retention times for archive
    purposes won't remove groups.

    1. Is your server set up to process control messages to remove groups,
    or does it automatically ignore them? If it does process them, is this process automatic or does it require manual intervention?

    Depends on the hierarchy. rmgroups for managed hierarchies with signed
    control messages will beprocesd automatically.

    2. If your server does process control messages, what action does your
    server normally take for an rmgroup?

    It will remove the group entirely.

    3. How long does your server retain articles in deleted groups, and is
    this retention limit any different from that of active groups?

    Articles in deleted groups are gone.

    -thh

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Ivo Gandolfo@21:1/5 to Tristan Miller on Sat Mar 29 10:12:05 2025
    On 29/03/2025 04:08, Tristan Miller wrote:

    1. Is your server set up to process control messages to remove groups,
    or does it automatically ignore them?  If it does process them, is this process automatic or does it require manual intervention?


    Actually I setup all my server's to send me an email for everything,
    except for newgroup (autoprocessed). All is done manually by me. The
    removed group I change the status to "n" (closed for posting) in my INN.
    All is done manually.

    2. If your server does process control messages, what action does your
    server normally take for an rmgroup?  For example, does it remove the
    group entirely so that users can no longer see and access it, or does it simply mark the group as read-only so that users can still subscribe and
    read but not post to it?

    See above.

    3. How long does your server retain articles in deleted groups, and is
    this retention limit any different from that of active groups?

    My history on public server the retention it's 5y (+/-). On private
    server (registered only, with bin) the text group come back to 2000's.

    4. Do you make archives of posts in deleted groups that are accessible
    other than via NNTP (e.g., via a website)?  If so, do these archives faithfully preserve the article headers and bodies?  Do you make these archives available to your users, enquirers, and/or the general public?

    For future I planning to do a web interface, at this moment only nntp avalaible.


    Sincerely


    --
    Ivo Gandolfo

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)