Do Greens chant that we are at an energy transition to renewables?
Are they lying or just ignorant, pick your preference, then head to:
https://www.powerlineblog.com/archives/2024/05/down-with-coal.php
and see the "Electricity production by source" chart (page down
twice). There you will see that, world-wide, coal-powered electricity generation is at an all-time high, and is increasing every year. Same
for Gas.
In the USA, coal is declining, but is entirely outstripped by the
booming China and India usage -- keep your eye on the vertical axes,
China's is twice that of the USA. India is on the same curve as China
but about 20 years behind.
The Truth is impossible for most Greens to conceive. Don't be like
the Greens.
On 2024-05-24, Willy Nilly <wn@nosuch.com> wrote:
Do Greens chant that we are at an energy transition to renewables?
Are they lying or just ignorant, pick your preference, then head to:
https://www.powerlineblog.com/archives/2024/05/down-with-coal.php
and see the "Electricity production by source" chart (page down
twice). There you will see that, world-wide, coal-powered electricity generation is at an all-time high, and is increasing every year. Same
for Gas.
In the USA, coal is declining, but is entirely outstripped by the
booming China and India usage -- keep your eye on the vertical axes, China's is twice that of the USA. India is on the same curve as China
but about 20 years behind.
The population of India and China are each about 4 times the poulation of the USA so it is to be expected that both China and India will be powering through more coal than the USA.
However that is irrelevent when it comes to world production of CO2.
The "under developed" countries are where the Western world was at the start of the Industrial Revolution and the Western world became wealthly on coal and oil. India and China etc are now doing the same and as any parent
desirse the best for their children they care not about CO2 but about making like better.
India, has started on the path to being world world force.
The Truth is impossible for most Greens to conceive. Don't be like
the Greens.
It doesn't look like they (China) plan to rely on Coal for
any longer than strictly necessary.
On Mon, 27 May 2024, David Goodwin <david+usenet@zx.net.nz> wrote:
It doesn't look like they (China) plan to rely on Coal for
any longer than strictly necessary.
So much for all your education and long-winded sentences, you
personify "none are so blind as those who will not see".
On Mon, 27 May 2024 03:28:47 GMT, wn@nosuch.com (Willy Nilly) wrote:Why don't you shove your sarcasm and tiny minded sniping and debate like a real person.
On Mon, 27 May 2024, David Goodwin <david+usenet@zx.net.nz> wrote:Are these articles that you do not think anyone has seen, Willy?
It doesn't look like they (China) plan to rely on Coal for
any longer than strictly necessary.
So much for all your education and long-winded sentences, you
personify "none are so blind as those who will not see".
https://www.enerdata.net/publications/daily-energy-news/chinas-solar-power-capacity-soared-55-2023-and-wind-capacity-21.htmlNone of which address the issue.
https://e360.yale.edu/features/china-renewable-energy >https://www.reuters.com/business/energy/chinas-installed-solar-power-capacity-rises-552-2023-2024-01-26/
https://www.reuters.com/world/china/china-solar-power-capacity-could-post-record-growth-2023-2023-02-16/
https://www.solarfeeds.com/mag/solar-power-statistics-in-china-2021/ >https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zxkv074ZDr0&ab_channel=APArchive
On Mon, 27 May 2024, David Goodwin <david+usenet@zx.net.nz> wrote:
It doesn't look like they (China) plan to rely on Coal for
any longer than strictly necessary.
So much for all your education and long-winded sentences, you
personify "none are so blind as those who will not see".
In article <6653fce7.1450100718@news.mixmin.net>, wn@nosuch.com says...
On Mon, 27 May 2024, David Goodwin <david+usenet@zx.net.nz> wrote:
It doesn't look like they (China) plan to rely on Coal for
any longer than strictly necessary.
So much for all your education and long-winded sentences, you
personify "none are so blind as those who will not see".
I'm not sure I understand your meaning or how its relevant to the quoted >text.
(absurd options given)
On Mon, 27 May 2024, David Goodwin <david+usenet@zx.net.nz> wrote:
In article <6653fce7.1450100718@news.mixmin.net>, wn@nosuch.com says...
On Mon, 27 May 2024, David Goodwin <david+usenet@zx.net.nz> wrote:
It doesn't look like they (China) plan to rely on Coal for
any longer than strictly necessary.
So much for all your education and long-winded sentences, you
personify "none are so blind as those who will not see".
I'm not sure I understand your meaning or how its relevant to the quoted >text.
(absurd options given)
Because China's growth in coal use is far more than its growth in wind
& solar use
therefore your statement "It doesn't look like they plan
to rely on Coal for any longer than strictly necessary" is absurd on
its face. No such conclusion can possibly be drawn.
You hear the
little voices in your head only. The applicable generalism is: "For
leftists to cling to their absurd set of beliefs, they have to pretend
not to know a lot of things". As you are doing here.
In article <6654ecee.1511548187@news.mixmin.net>, wn@nosuch.com says...
Because China's growth in coal use is far more than its growth in wind
& solar use
Do you have any references for that statement?
The Centre for Economic Policy Research has some ideas on why China
might be over-building coal capacity: >https://cepr.org/voxeu/columns/china-overinvested-coal-power-heres-why
I think it has now been sufficiently shown that Chinas growth in
renewable generation and solar in particular does exceed their growth in
coal which would suggest that China does indeed intend to do what they
said they will do.
You hear the
little voices in your head only. The applicable generalism is: "For
leftists to cling to their absurd set of beliefs, they have to pretend
not to know a lot of things". As you are doing here.
The same could be said about those on the right. Far too many people
allow ideology to get in the way of reality.
On Tue, 28 May 2024, David Goodwin <david+usenet@zx.net.nz> wrote:
In article <6654ecee.1511548187@news.mixmin.net>, wn@nosuch.com says...
Because China's growth in coal use is far more than its growth in wind
& solar use
Do you have any references for that statement?
The original reference in the OP and the chart therein, duh.
Your references are silly-as, the first one is from a year ago, says
"China's government approved a record-breaking 86 GW of new coal-fired
power capacity in 2022" and then gives a ludicrous chart (what you
call a "nice chart") showing year-to-year increases in China's coal
usage up to Y2022.5, then suddenly decreasing "in the future" --
complete horseshit of the kind you get from salesmen hawking junk.
You are an easy mark to bullshit, David.
The Centre for Economic Policy Research has some ideas on why China
might be over-building coal capacity: >https://cepr.org/voxeu/columns/china-overinvested-coal-power-heres-why
Ha ha, "some ideas", right, of the sort where all that coal capacity
is needed to fill in for the times when wind doesn't blow and the sun
doesn't shine. Well my chart shows *actual usage* of coal-produced
power and it increases relentlessly.
I think it has now been sufficiently shown that Chinas growth in
renewable generation and solar in particular does exceed their growth in >coal which would suggest that China does indeed intend to do what they
said they will do.
Sufficient for your echo chamber which you inhabit. hoping that approved-peoples' notions are as valuable as physical reality on the
ground. Whereas I use actual production figures to guide my thinking.
You hear the
little voices in your head only. The applicable generalism is: "For
leftists to cling to their absurd set of beliefs, they have to pretend
not to know a lot of things". As you are doing here.
The same could be said about those on the right. Far too many people
allow ideology to get in the way of reality.
Mirror. Use. Look.
In article <66550765.1518322984@news.mixmin.net>, wn@nosuch.com says...
On Tue, 28 May 2024, David Goodwin <david+usenet@zx.net.nz> wrote:
In article <6654ecee.1511548187@news.mixmin.net>, wn@nosuch.com says...
Because China's growth in coal use is far more than its growth in wind
& solar use
Do you have any references for that statement?
The original reference in the OP and the chart therein, duh.
The link in the OP does not say that china deployed more than 301GW of
new coal generation last year.
You would rather believe an American right-wing blog over a
multinational provider of commodities & energy analytics because the >right-wing blog agrees with your views while S&P Global doesn't.
There is a graph that shows in 2023 total generation from wind and solar >increased by 23.5%, while generation from coal only increased by 6.4%
when compared to the previous year.
In total they generated an additional 343.7TWh of energy via coal in
2023. If all of their existing coal powerplants were running at 100% for
the entire year, they'd have to add around 40GW of new coal generation
to produce that extra energy.
Given installed coal generation capacity increased by 110GW (they
retired 4GW of old power generation in 2023), that new capacity would be >running less than half the time to provide that 343.7TWh of coal power.
I don't think you read the chart correctly. The red line shows average
coal plant utilisation declining from a high of around 75% in the early
2000s to a little over 50% in 2023. This indicates they are building
more coal generation than they actually need to to meet demand.
The filled area in the chart shows the carbon emissions rising which
does indicate that they are burning more coal every year, but the
utilisation rate shows they are not burning as much as their
construction of new plants might imply.
But it does not increase as much as it should given the number of plants >they're building.
Actual production figures guide my thinking too. Unfortunately you seem
to be misinterpreting those figures.
As a proportion of Chinas energy supply, solar and wind is growing at a >faster rate than coal. Its right there in the graph you posted.
In article <6654ecee.1511548187@news.mixmin.net>, wn@nosuch.com says...Yes that might be fair. My response however is that so many people who are left leaning assume that moderates (centre leaning) are right wing. An absolute nonsense.
On Mon, 27 May 2024, David Goodwin <david+usenet@zx.net.nz> wrote:
In article <6653fce7.1450100718@news.mixmin.net>, wn@nosuch.com says...
On Mon, 27 May 2024, David Goodwin <david+usenet@zx.net.nz> wrote:
It doesn't look like they (China) plan to rely on Coal for
any longer than strictly necessary.
So much for all your education and long-winded sentences, you
personify "none are so blind as those who will not see".
I'm not sure I understand your meaning or how its relevant to the quoted
text.
(absurd options given)
Because China's growth in coal use is far more than its growth in wind
& solar use
Do you have any references for that statement? I can't find anything
that indicates they deployed more than 301GW of new coal generation last >year. As far as I can tell they only approved 114GW of new coal
generation.
Additionally, Standard & Poor's says China is running the coal power
plants they do have less frequently than they did in the past. They even >provide a nice chart to visualise the change over time as well as
expected trends for the next few years: >https://www.spglobal.com/commodityinsights/en/ci/research- >analysis/chinas-record-coal-capacity-approvals-in-2022-carbon-
targets.html
So while China is building additional coal generation, that doesn't >necessarily mean they've increased the total GWh of coal generated >electricity by as much as the added capacity might imply.
The Centre for Economic Policy Research has some ideas on why China
might be over-building coal capacity: >https://cepr.org/voxeu/columns/china-overinvested-coal-power-heres-why
therefore your statement "It doesn't look like they plan
to rely on Coal for any longer than strictly necessary" is absurd on
its face. No such conclusion can possibly be drawn.
I think it has now been sufficiently shown that Chinas growth in
renewable generation and solar in particular does exceed their growth in
coal which would suggest that China does indeed intend to do what they
said they will do.
You hear the
little voices in your head only. The applicable generalism is: "For
leftists to cling to their absurd set of beliefs, they have to pretend
not to know a lot of things". As you are doing here.
The same could be said about those on the right. Far too many people
allow ideology to get in the way of reality.
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