On Fri, 2 May 2025 22:18:57 -0000 (UTC), TonyYou are proud of the poor results. Most thinking caring people are not - and truth will out.
<lizandtony@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
https://centrist.nz/media-played-doctor-during-covid-now-the-bill-is-due/?utm_source=Klaviyo&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=2-5-2025&_kx=r-9yRwOooklJ4fu8JfYI0L2yjNQJoEDhB4PntHsLeWo.VYfxNg
One day history will hold the last government to account.
As one of the comments said, New Zealand results from this site: >https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/COVID-19_pandemic_death_rates_by_country
showed that on that measure, New Zealand was 122nd in a list of
countries from worst to best.
That site itself says that a better measure is excess deaths, and led
to this url:
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC8132017/
Look for New Zealand on that list . . .
I posted data based on excess deaths many times in the later period of
Covid being still a major issue - it showed that the initial drop in
deaths for New Zealand did not last - rates increased as we moved out
of lockdowns, but the current government is still subsidising vaccines
for many New Zealanders, and Covid cases are still one of the reasons
why hospitals are stretched - as I understand it a few months ago we
were still getting a few deaths each week, and a dozen or so in
intensive care at any one time - I have not followed that for a while
though.
Health expert estimates were that NZ saved around 22,000 deaths in
comparison with USA experience in that critical Covid period.
Have you any reason to doubt that the current enquiry will not hold
the previous government to account? Yes mistakes were made, but we can
be proud of the results . . .
https://centrist.nz/media-played-doctor-during-covid-now-the-bill-is-due/?utm_source=Klaviyo&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=2-5-2025&_kx=r-9yRwOooklJ4fu8JfYI0L2yjNQJoEDhB4PntHsLeWo.VYfxNg
One day history will hold the last government to account.
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:
On Fri, 2 May 2025 22:18:57 -0000 (UTC), TonyYou are proud of the poor results. Most thinking caring people are not - and >truth will out.
<lizandtony@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
One day history will hold the last government to account.https://centrist.nz/media-played-doctor-during-covid-now-the-bill-is-due/?utm_source=Klaviyo&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=2-5-2025&_kx=r-9yRwOooklJ4fu8JfYI0L2yjNQJoEDhB4PntHsLeWo.VYfxNg
As one of the comments said, New Zealand results from this site: >>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/COVID-19_pandemic_death_rates_by_country >>showed that on that measure, New Zealand was 122nd in a list of
countries from worst to best.
That site itself says that a better measure is excess deaths, and led
to this url:
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC8132017/
Look for New Zealand on that list . . .
I posted data based on excess deaths many times in the later period of >>Covid being still a major issue - it showed that the initial drop in
deaths for New Zealand did not last - rates increased as we moved out
of lockdowns, but the current government is still subsidising vaccines
for many New Zealanders, and Covid cases are still one of the reasons
why hospitals are stretched - as I understand it a few months ago we
were still getting a few deaths each week, and a dozen or so in
intensive care at any one time - I have not followed that for a while >>though.
Health expert estimates were that NZ saved around 22,000 deaths in >>comparison with USA experience in that critical Covid period.
Have you any reason to doubt that the current enquiry will not hold
the previous government to account? Yes mistakes were made, but we can
be proud of the results . . .
Your links are one side of the story - as usual, no balance in sight.
On Fri, 2 May 2025 22:18:57 -0000 (UTC), Tony
<lizandtony@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
https://centrist.nz/media-played-doctor-during-covid-now-the-bill-is-due/?utm_source=Klaviyo&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=2-5-2025&_kx=r-9yRwOooklJ4fu8JfYI0L2yjNQJoEDhB4PntHsLeWo.VYfxNg
One day history will hold the last government to account.
As one of the comments said, New Zealand results from this site: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/COVID-19_pandemic_death_rates_by_country
showed that on that measure, New Zealand was 122nd in a list of
countries from worst to best.
That site itself says that a better measure is excess deaths, and led
to this url:
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC8132017/
Look for New Zealand on that list . . .
I posted data based on excess deaths many times in the later period of
Covid being still a major issue - it showed that the initial drop in
deaths for New Zealand did not last - rates increased as we moved out
of lockdowns, but the current government is still subsidising vaccines
for many New Zealanders, and Covid cases are still one of the reasons
why hospitals are stretched - as I understand it a few months ago we
were still getting a few deaths each week, and a dozen or so in
intensive care at any one time - I have not followed that for a while
though.
Health expert estimates were that NZ saved around 22,000 deaths in
comparison with USA experience in that critical Covid period.
Have you any reason to doubt that the current enquiry will not hold
the previous government to account? Yes mistakes were made, but we can
be proud of the results . . .
On 2025-05-02, Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:So what are the other measures you believe should be considered,
On Fri, 2 May 2025 22:18:57 -0000 (UTC), Tony
<lizandtony@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
One day history will hold the last government to account.https://centrist.nz/media-played-doctor-during-covid-now-the-bill-is-due/?utm_source=Klaviyo&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=2-5-2025&_kx=r-9yRwOooklJ4fu8JfYI0L2yjNQJoEDhB4PntHsLeWo.VYfxNg
As one of the comments said, New Zealand results from this site:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/COVID-19_pandemic_death_rates_by_country
showed that on that measure, New Zealand was 122nd in a list of
countries from worst to best.
The number of deaths is one but one measure of how well the Government did
in its response to the pandemic.
I am of the view that any static to do with the Covid pandenic is factual,That is true of all the international comparisons - what "condition"
or at least has "condition" attached to it.
That site itself says that a better measure is excess deaths, and led
to this url:
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC8132017/
Look for New Zealand on that list . . .
I posted data based on excess deaths many times in the later period of
Covid being still a major issue - it showed that the initial drop in
deaths for New Zealand did not last - rates increased as we moved out
of lockdowns, but the current government is still subsidising vaccines
for many New Zealanders, and Covid cases are still one of the reasons
why hospitals are stretched - as I understand it a few months ago we
were still getting a few deaths each week, and a dozen or so in
intensive care at any one time - I have not followed that for a while
though.
Health expert estimates were that NZ saved around 22,000 deaths in
comparison with USA experience in that critical Covid period.
Have you any reason to doubt that the current enquiry will not hold
the previous government to account? Yes mistakes were made, but we can
be proud of the results . . .
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:
On Sat, 3 May 2025 00:04:44 -0000 (UTC), TonyWhy do you ask such idiotic and off topic questions?
<lizandtony@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:
On Fri, 2 May 2025 22:18:57 -0000 (UTC), TonyYou are proud of the poor results. Most thinking caring people are not - and >>>truth will out.
<lizandtony@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
One day history will hold the last government to account.https://centrist.nz/media-played-doctor-during-covid-now-the-bill-is-due/?utm_source=Klaviyo&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=2-5-2025&_kx=r-9yRwOooklJ4fu8JfYI0L2yjNQJoEDhB4PntHsLeWo.VYfxNg
As one of the comments said, New Zealand results from this site: >>>>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/COVID-19_pandemic_death_rates_by_country >>>>showed that on that measure, New Zealand was 122nd in a list of >>>>countries from worst to best.
That site itself says that a better measure is excess deaths, and led >>>>to this url:
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC8132017/
Look for New Zealand on that list . . .
I posted data based on excess deaths many times in the later period of >>>>Covid being still a major issue - it showed that the initial drop in >>>>deaths for New Zealand did not last - rates increased as we moved out >>>>of lockdowns, but the current government is still subsidising vaccines >>>>for many New Zealanders, and Covid cases are still one of the reasons >>>>why hospitals are stretched - as I understand it a few months ago we >>>>were still getting a few deaths each week, and a dozen or so in >>>>intensive care at any one time - I have not followed that for a while >>>>though.
Health expert estimates were that NZ saved around 22,000 deaths in >>>>comparison with USA experience in that critical Covid period.
Have you any reason to doubt that the current enquiry will not hold
the previous government to account? Yes mistakes were made, but we can >>>>be proud of the results . . .
Your links are one side of the story - as usual, no balance in sight.
This link gives comparative data - you tell us what lack of balance
there is in those numbers . . . >>https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC8132017/table/tbl1/
Note that New Zealand appears at the bottom of that list - is that
what you hoped for?
Another irrelevant question.
Look also at: >>https://www.tewhatuora.govt.nz/for-health-professionals/data-and-statistics/covid-19-data/covid-19-current-cases#current-situation
So there were 364 confirmed Covid cases in New Zealand in the last
week, and 9 deaths where Covid was either underlying or contributory.
Have we beaten Covid, Tony?
Abuse removed.
Neutral measures such as those done by international organisations are
not looking to make anyone look good or bad. If you have evidence of
our response to Covid not being as good as they show it was, then by
all means show some evidence
. . . All thatYou have not addressed what I posted at all, until you do you are being >deliberately obtuse.
So show your evidence or admit
that you are wrong . . .
There is increasing evidence that the pandemic was badly handled, that the >vaccines were experimental and not true vaccines. So as I wrote Truth Will Out.
Time is on our side, not yours.
On Sat, 3 May 2025 00:04:44 -0000 (UTC), TonyWhy do you ask such idiotic and off topic questions?
<lizandtony@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:
On Fri, 2 May 2025 22:18:57 -0000 (UTC), TonyYou are proud of the poor results. Most thinking caring people are not - and >>truth will out.
<lizandtony@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
One day history will hold the last government to account.https://centrist.nz/media-played-doctor-during-covid-now-the-bill-is-due/?utm_source=Klaviyo&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=2-5-2025&_kx=r-9yRwOooklJ4fu8JfYI0L2yjNQJoEDhB4PntHsLeWo.VYfxNg
As one of the comments said, New Zealand results from this site: >>>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/COVID-19_pandemic_death_rates_by_country >>>showed that on that measure, New Zealand was 122nd in a list of
countries from worst to best.
That site itself says that a better measure is excess deaths, and led
to this url:
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC8132017/
Look for New Zealand on that list . . .
I posted data based on excess deaths many times in the later period of >>>Covid being still a major issue - it showed that the initial drop in >>>deaths for New Zealand did not last - rates increased as we moved out
of lockdowns, but the current government is still subsidising vaccines >>>for many New Zealanders, and Covid cases are still one of the reasons
why hospitals are stretched - as I understand it a few months ago we
were still getting a few deaths each week, and a dozen or so in
intensive care at any one time - I have not followed that for a while >>>though.
Health expert estimates were that NZ saved around 22,000 deaths in >>>comparison with USA experience in that critical Covid period.
Have you any reason to doubt that the current enquiry will not hold
the previous government to account? Yes mistakes were made, but we can
be proud of the results . . .
Your links are one side of the story - as usual, no balance in sight.
This link gives comparative data - you tell us what lack of balance
there is in those numbers . . . >https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC8132017/table/tbl1/
Note that New Zealand appears at the bottom of that list - is that
what you hoped for?
Look also at: >https://www.tewhatuora.govt.nz/for-health-professionals/data-and-statistics/covid-19-data/covid-19-current-cases#current-situationAnother irrelevant question.
So there were 364 confirmed Covid cases in New Zealand in the last
week, and 9 deaths where Covid was either underlying or contributory.
Have we beaten Covid, Tony?
Neutral measures such as those done by international organisations areAbuse removed.
not looking to make anyone look good or bad. If you have evidence of
our response to Covid not being as good as they show it was, then by
all means show some evidence
. . . All thatYou have not addressed what I posted at all, until you do you are being deliberately obtuse.
So show your evidence or admit
that you are wrong . . .
On Sat, 3 May 2025 03:42:06 -0000 (UTC), Tony
<lizandtony@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:
On Sat, 3 May 2025 00:04:44 -0000 (UTC), TonyWhy do you ask such idiotic and off topic questions?
<lizandtony@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:
On Fri, 2 May 2025 22:18:57 -0000 (UTC), Tony >>>>><lizandtony@orcon.net.nz> wrote:You are proud of the poor results. Most thinking caring people are not - >>>>and
One day history will hold the last government to account.https://centrist.nz/media-played-doctor-during-covid-now-the-bill-is-due/?utm_source=Klaviyo&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=2-5-2025&_kx=r-9yRwOooklJ4fu8JfYI0L2yjNQJoEDhB4PntHsLeWo.VYfxNg
As one of the comments said, New Zealand results from this site: >>>>>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/COVID-19_pandemic_death_rates_by_country >>>>>showed that on that measure, New Zealand was 122nd in a list of >>>>>countries from worst to best.
That site itself says that a better measure is excess deaths, and led >>>>>to this url:
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC8132017/
Look for New Zealand on that list . . .
I posted data based on excess deaths many times in the later period of >>>>>Covid being still a major issue - it showed that the initial drop in >>>>>deaths for New Zealand did not last - rates increased as we moved out >>>>>of lockdowns, but the current government is still subsidising vaccines >>>>>for many New Zealanders, and Covid cases are still one of the reasons >>>>>why hospitals are stretched - as I understand it a few months ago we >>>>>were still getting a few deaths each week, and a dozen or so in >>>>>intensive care at any one time - I have not followed that for a while >>>>>though.
Health expert estimates were that NZ saved around 22,000 deaths in >>>>>comparison with USA experience in that critical Covid period.
Have you any reason to doubt that the current enquiry will not hold >>>>>the previous government to account? Yes mistakes were made, but we can >>>>>be proud of the results . . .
truth will out.
Your links are one side of the story - as usual, no balance in sight.
This link gives comparative data - you tell us what lack of balance
there is in those numbers . . . >>>https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC8132017/table/tbl1/
Note that New Zealand appears at the bottom of that list - is that
what you hoped for?
Another irrelevant question.
Look also at: >>>https://www.tewhatuora.govt.nz/for-health-professionals/data-and-statistics/covid-19-data/covid-19-current-cases#current-situation
So there were 364 confirmed Covid cases in New Zealand in the last
week, and 9 deaths where Covid was either underlying or contributory. >>>Have we beaten Covid, Tony?
Abuse removed.
Neutral measures such as those done by international organisations are >>>not looking to make anyone look good or bad. If you have evidence of
our response to Covid not being as good as they show it was, then by
all means show some evidence
. . . All thatYou have not addressed what I posted at all, until you do you are being >>deliberately obtuse.
So show your evidence or admit
that you are wrong . . .
There is increasing evidence that the pandemic was badly handled, that the >>vaccines were experimental and not true vaccines. So as I wrote Truth Will >>Out.
Time is on our side, not yours.
"There is increasing evidence that the pandemic was badly handled,
that the vaccines were experimental and not true vaccines. "
On 2025-05-03 02:48:15 +0000, Rich80105 said:
On Sat, 3 May 2025 00:04:44 -0000 (UTC), Tony
<lizandtony@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:
On Fri, 2 May 2025 22:18:57 -0000 (UTC), TonyYou are proud of the poor results. Most thinking caring people are not - and
<lizandtony@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
https://centrist.nz/media-played-doctor-during-covid-now-the-bill-is-due/?utm_source=Klaviyo&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=2-5-2025&_kx=r-9yRwOooklJ4fu8JfYI0L2yjNQJoEDhB4PntHsLeWo.VYfxNg
One day history will hold the last government to account.
As one of the comments said, New Zealand results from this site:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/COVID-19_pandemic_death_rates_by_country >>>> showed that on that measure, New Zealand was 122nd in a list of
countries from worst to best.
That site itself says that a better measure is excess deaths, and led
to this url:
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC8132017/
Look for New Zealand on that list . . .
I posted data based on excess deaths many times in the later period of >>>> Covid being still a major issue - it showed that the initial drop in
deaths for New Zealand did not last - rates increased as we moved out
of lockdowns, but the current government is still subsidising vaccines >>>> for many New Zealanders, and Covid cases are still one of the reasons
why hospitals are stretched - as I understand it a few months ago we
were still getting a few deaths each week, and a dozen or so in
intensive care at any one time - I have not followed that for a while
though.
Health expert estimates were that NZ saved around 22,000 deaths in
comparison with USA experience in that critical Covid period.
Have you any reason to doubt that the current enquiry will not hold
the previous government to account? Yes mistakes were made, but we can >>>> be proud of the results . . .
truth will out.
Your links are one side of the story - as usual, no balance in sight.
This link gives comparative data - you tell us what lack of balance
there is in those numbers . . .
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC8132017/table/tbl1/
Note that New Zealand appears at the bottom of that list - is that
what you hoped for?
Look also at:
https://www.tewhatuora.govt.nz/for-health-professionals/data-and-statistics/covid-19-data/covid-19-current-cases#current-situation
So there were 364 confirmed Covid cases in New Zealand in the last
week,
Certainly a lot more than that in the community. Since it is no longer >necessary to report having Covid, nobody will have the real numbers.
and 9 deaths where Covid was either underlying or contributory.
Have we beaten Covid, Tony?
Neutral measures such as those done by international organisations are
not looking to make anyone look good or bad. If you have evidence of
our response to Covid not being as good as they show it was, then by
all means show some evidence - as usual you are casually dismissing
expert analysis and advice in favour of political rants . . . All that
does is discredit you as having any intellectual competence, and being
a leech on civilized discussion, Tony. So show your evidence or admit
that you are wrong . . .
On Sat, 3 May 2025 00:04:44 -0000 (UTC), Tony
<lizandtony@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:
On Fri, 2 May 2025 22:18:57 -0000 (UTC), TonyYou are proud of the poor results. Most thinking caring people are not - and >> truth will out.
<lizandtony@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
https://centrist.nz/media-played-doctor-during-covid-now-the-bill-is-due/?utm_source=Klaviyo&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=2-5-2025&_kx=r-9yRwOooklJ4fu8JfYI0L2yjNQJoEDhB4PntHsLeWo.VYfxNg
One day history will hold the last government to account.
As one of the comments said, New Zealand results from this site:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/COVID-19_pandemic_death_rates_by_country
showed that on that measure, New Zealand was 122nd in a list of
countries from worst to best.
That site itself says that a better measure is excess deaths, and led
to this url:
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC8132017/
Look for New Zealand on that list . . .
I posted data based on excess deaths many times in the later period of
Covid being still a major issue - it showed that the initial drop in
deaths for New Zealand did not last - rates increased as we moved out
of lockdowns, but the current government is still subsidising vaccines
for many New Zealanders, and Covid cases are still one of the reasons
why hospitals are stretched - as I understand it a few months ago we
were still getting a few deaths each week, and a dozen or so in
intensive care at any one time - I have not followed that for a while
though.
Health expert estimates were that NZ saved around 22,000 deaths in
comparison with USA experience in that critical Covid period.
Have you any reason to doubt that the current enquiry will not hold
the previous government to account? Yes mistakes were made, but we can
be proud of the results . . .
Your links are one side of the story - as usual, no balance in sight.
This link gives comparative data - you tell us what lack of balance
there is in those numbers . . . https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC8132017/table/tbl1/
Note that New Zealand appears at the bottom of that list - is that
what you hoped for?
Look also at: https://www.tewhatuora.govt.nz/for-health-professionals/data-and-statistics/covid-19-data/covid-19-current-cases#current-situation
So there were 364 confirmed Covid cases in New Zealand in the last
week,
and 9 deaths where Covid was either underlying or contributory.
Have we beaten Covid, Tony?
Neutral measures such as those done by international organisations are
not looking to make anyone look good or bad. If you have evidence of
our response to Covid not being as good as they show it was, then by
all means show some evidence - as usual you are casually dismissing
expert analysis and advice in favour of political rants . . . All that
does is discredit you as having any intellectual competence, and being
a leech on civilized discussion, Tony. So show your evidence or admit
that you are wrong . . .
On Sat, 3 May 2025 18:22:43 +1200, It's A Me <its-a-me@mario.com>You don't know so why do you guess?
wrote:
On 2025-05-03 02:48:15 +0000, Rich80105 said:
On Sat, 3 May 2025 00:04:44 -0000 (UTC), Tony
<lizandtony@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:
On Fri, 2 May 2025 22:18:57 -0000 (UTC), TonyYou are proud of the poor results. Most thinking caring people are not - >>>>and
<lizandtony@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
https://centrist.nz/media-played-doctor-during-covid-now-the-bill-is-due/?utm_source=Klaviyo&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=2-5-2025&_kx=r-9yRwOooklJ4fu8JfYI0L2yjNQJoEDhB4PntHsLeWo.VYfxNg
One day history will hold the last government to account.
As one of the comments said, New Zealand results from this site:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/COVID-19_pandemic_death_rates_by_country >>>>> showed that on that measure, New Zealand was 122nd in a list of
countries from worst to best.
That site itself says that a better measure is excess deaths, and led >>>>> to this url:
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC8132017/
Look for New Zealand on that list . . .
I posted data based on excess deaths many times in the later period of >>>>> Covid being still a major issue - it showed that the initial drop in >>>>> deaths for New Zealand did not last - rates increased as we moved out >>>>> of lockdowns, but the current government is still subsidising vaccines >>>>> for many New Zealanders, and Covid cases are still one of the reasons >>>>> why hospitals are stretched - as I understand it a few months ago we >>>>> were still getting a few deaths each week, and a dozen or so in
intensive care at any one time - I have not followed that for a while >>>>> though.
Health expert estimates were that NZ saved around 22,000 deaths in
comparison with USA experience in that critical Covid period.
Have you any reason to doubt that the current enquiry will not hold
the previous government to account? Yes mistakes were made, but we can >>>>> be proud of the results . . .
truth will out.
Your links are one side of the story - as usual, no balance in sight.
This link gives comparative data - you tell us what lack of balance
there is in those numbers . . .
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC8132017/table/tbl1/
Note that New Zealand appears at the bottom of that list - is that
what you hoped for?
Look also at:
https://www.tewhatuora.govt.nz/for-health-professionals/data-and-statistics/covid-19-data/covid-19-current-cases#current-situation
So there were 364 confirmed Covid cases in New Zealand in the last
week,
Certainly a lot more than that in the community. Since it is no longer >>necessary to report having Covid, nobody will have the real numbers.
I agree - 9 deaths are likely to more accurate, and if repeated each
week that would be 468 for a year - higher than road deaths (341 in
2023, 289 in 2024, but going up a bit this year). It appears that the
number of deaths may be climbing slightly.
and 9 deaths where Covid was either underlying or contributory.
Have we beaten Covid, Tony?
Neutral measures such as those done by international organisations are
not looking to make anyone look good or bad. If you have evidence of
our response to Covid not being as good as they show it was, then by
all means show some evidence - as usual you are casually dismissing
expert analysis and advice in favour of political rants . . . All that
does is discredit you as having any intellectual competence, and being
a leech on civilized discussion, Tony. So show your evidence or admit
that you are wrong . . .
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:Because the current government is making it difficult to find the
On Sat, 3 May 2025 18:22:43 +1200, It's A Me <its-a-me@mario.com>You don't know so why do you guess?
wrote:
On 2025-05-03 02:48:15 +0000, Rich80105 said:
On Sat, 3 May 2025 00:04:44 -0000 (UTC), Tony
<lizandtony@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:This link gives comparative data - you tell us what lack of balance
On Fri, 2 May 2025 22:18:57 -0000 (UTC), TonyYou are proud of the poor results. Most thinking caring people are not - >>>>>and
<lizandtony@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
https://centrist.nz/media-played-doctor-during-covid-now-the-bill-is-due/?utm_source=Klaviyo&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=2-5-2025&_kx=r-9yRwOooklJ4fu8JfYI0L2yjNQJoEDhB4PntHsLeWo.VYfxNg
One day history will hold the last government to account.
As one of the comments said, New Zealand results from this site:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/COVID-19_pandemic_death_rates_by_country >>>>>> showed that on that measure, New Zealand was 122nd in a list of
countries from worst to best.
That site itself says that a better measure is excess deaths, and led >>>>>> to this url:
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC8132017/
Look for New Zealand on that list . . .
I posted data based on excess deaths many times in the later period of >>>>>> Covid being still a major issue - it showed that the initial drop in >>>>>> deaths for New Zealand did not last - rates increased as we moved out >>>>>> of lockdowns, but the current government is still subsidising vaccines >>>>>> for many New Zealanders, and Covid cases are still one of the reasons >>>>>> why hospitals are stretched - as I understand it a few months ago we >>>>>> were still getting a few deaths each week, and a dozen or so in
intensive care at any one time - I have not followed that for a while >>>>>> though.
Health expert estimates were that NZ saved around 22,000 deaths in >>>>>> comparison with USA experience in that critical Covid period.
Have you any reason to doubt that the current enquiry will not hold >>>>>> the previous government to account? Yes mistakes were made, but we can >>>>>> be proud of the results . . .
truth will out.
Your links are one side of the story - as usual, no balance in sight. >>>>
there is in those numbers . . .
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC8132017/table/tbl1/
Note that New Zealand appears at the bottom of that list - is that
what you hoped for?
Look also at:
https://www.tewhatuora.govt.nz/for-health-professionals/data-and-statistics/covid-19-data/covid-19-current-cases#current-situation
So there were 364 confirmed Covid cases in New Zealand in the last
week,
Certainly a lot more than that in the community. Since it is no longer >>>necessary to report having Covid, nobody will have the real numbers.
I agree - 9 deaths are likely to more accurate, and if repeated each
week that would be 468 for a year - higher than road deaths (341 in
2023, 289 in 2024, but going up a bit this year). It appears that the >>number of deaths may be climbing slightly.
and 9 deaths where Covid was either underlying or contributory.
Have we beaten Covid, Tony?
Neutral measures such as those done by international organisations are >>>> not looking to make anyone look good or bad. If you have evidence of
our response to Covid not being as good as they show it was, then by
all means show some evidence - as usual you are casually dismissing
expert analysis and advice in favour of political rants . . . All that >>>> does is discredit you as having any intellectual competence, and being >>>> a leech on civilized discussion, Tony. So show your evidence or admit
that you are wrong . . .
On Sat, 3 May 2025 20:58:48 -0000 (UTC), TonyYou really are incredibly stupid if you think anybody believes that politcial nonsense.
<lizandtony@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:Because the current government is making it difficult to find the
On Sat, 3 May 2025 18:22:43 +1200, It's A Me <its-a-me@mario.com>You don't know so why do you guess?
wrote:
On 2025-05-03 02:48:15 +0000, Rich80105 said:
On Sat, 3 May 2025 00:04:44 -0000 (UTC), Tony
<lizandtony@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:This link gives comparative data - you tell us what lack of balance
On Fri, 2 May 2025 22:18:57 -0000 (UTC), TonyYou are proud of the poor results. Most thinking caring people are not - >>>>>>and
<lizandtony@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
https://centrist.nz/media-played-doctor-during-covid-now-the-bill-is-due/?utm_source=Klaviyo&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=2-5-2025&_kx=r-9yRwOooklJ4fu8JfYI0L2yjNQJoEDhB4PntHsLeWo.VYfxNg
One day history will hold the last government to account.
As one of the comments said, New Zealand results from this site: >>>>>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/COVID-19_pandemic_death_rates_by_country >>>>>>> showed that on that measure, New Zealand was 122nd in a list of
countries from worst to best.
That site itself says that a better measure is excess deaths, and led >>>>>>> to this url:
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC8132017/
Look for New Zealand on that list . . .
I posted data based on excess deaths many times in the later period of >>>>>>> Covid being still a major issue - it showed that the initial drop in >>>>>>> deaths for New Zealand did not last - rates increased as we moved out >>>>>>> of lockdowns, but the current government is still subsidising vaccines >>>>>>> for many New Zealanders, and Covid cases are still one of the reasons >>>>>>> why hospitals are stretched - as I understand it a few months ago we >>>>>>> were still getting a few deaths each week, and a dozen or so in
intensive care at any one time - I have not followed that for a while >>>>>>> though.
Health expert estimates were that NZ saved around 22,000 deaths in >>>>>>> comparison with USA experience in that critical Covid period.
Have you any reason to doubt that the current enquiry will not hold >>>>>>> the previous government to account? Yes mistakes were made, but we can >>>>>>> be proud of the results . . .
truth will out.
Your links are one side of the story - as usual, no balance in sight. >>>>>
there is in those numbers . . .
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC8132017/table/tbl1/
Note that New Zealand appears at the bottom of that list - is that
what you hoped for?
Look also at:
https://www.tewhatuora.govt.nz/for-health-professionals/data-and-statistics/covid-19-data/covid-19-current-cases#current-situation
So there were 364 confirmed Covid cases in New Zealand in the last
week,
Certainly a lot more than that in the community. Since it is no longer >>>>necessary to report having Covid, nobody will have the real numbers.
I agree - 9 deaths are likely to more accurate, and if repeated each
week that would be 468 for a year - higher than road deaths (341 in
2023, 289 in 2024, but going up a bit this year). It appears that the >>>number of deaths may be climbing slightly.
numbers out - they want to pretend that the threat of death by Covid
has gone; it would not give any benefit to political donors so is low >priority - but give it a go yourself if you think I am wrong . . .
and 9 deaths where Covid was either underlying or contributory.
Have we beaten Covid, Tony?
Neutral measures such as those done by international organisations are >>>>> not looking to make anyone look good or bad. If you have evidence of >>>>> our response to Covid not being as good as they show it was, then by >>>>> all means show some evidence - as usual you are casually dismissing
expert analysis and advice in favour of political rants . . . All that >>>>> does is discredit you as having any intellectual competence, and being >>>>> a leech on civilized discussion, Tony. So show your evidence or admit >>>>> that you are wrong . . .
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