We have set it down as a law to ourselves to examine
things to the bottom, and not to receive upon credit,
or reject upon probability, until these have passed a
due examination. - Bacon's Natural History.
_The Tempest_ is popularly interpreted as an allegory for Freemason >initiation [1][2]. And some Shakespearean scholars simultaneously see >_Forbidden Planet_ as an adaptation of _The Tempest_ [3][4].
Given all of the above, it's fun to forage for Freemason forms in
_Forbidden Planet_."
The link below shows some symbols spotted in the movie along with
associated commentary. Views expressed are for informational purposes
only; they do not constitute an endorsement or an approval of
Freemasonry, Shakespeare, or Bacon.
<https://crcomp.net/arts/forbidden/index.php>
Do you see other, overlooked, occult Freemason symbols in
_Forbidden Planet_? Append any additional speculative symbology you spot
to this thread.
Don wrote:
We have set it down as a law to ourselves to examine
things to the bottom, and not to receive upon credit,
or reject upon probability, until these have passed a
due examination. - Bacon's Natural History.
_The Tempest_ is popularly interpreted as an allegory for Freemason
initiation [1][2]. And some Shakespearean scholars simultaneously see
_Forbidden Planet_ as an adaptation of _The Tempest_ [3][4].
Given all of the above, it's fun to forage for Freemason forms in
_Forbidden Planet_."
The link below shows some symbols spotted in the movie along with
associated commentary. Views expressed are for informational purposes
only; they do not constitute an endorsement or an approval of
Freemasonry, Shakespeare, or Bacon.
<https://crcomp.net/arts/forbidden/index.php>
Do you see other, overlooked, occult Freemason symbols in
_Forbidden Planet_? Append any additional speculative symbology you spot
to this thread.
Whoo boy. You're playing in *my* house now.
I'm a Freemason, and have been one for over 35 years.
I know a thing or two.
I'm going to accept, as everyone does, that Forbidden Planet is
a homage to The Tempest.
The 'popular interpretation' is better characterized as 'a couple
of people wrote speculative essays'.
Freemasonry is remarkably free of canon, and there
is complete freedom for any Mason to write any speculation about it he
wants, without fear of sanction, unless he reveals a very small number
of passwords, etc - all the 'real secrets' would fit on the 3x5 filecard
with room to spare.
I have, for example, a book claiming that Stonehenge was constructed as
a Masonic temple. This is nonsense, but the author didn't get in
trouble.
There's a very long cottage industry of claiming that this or that
work of art contains Masonic dogwhistles. Usually they're not supported.
In the case of Forbidden Planet, the things the linked essay claims
as 'Masonic forms' don't appear in the play - they were added for
the movie. Certainly, Shakespeare didn't put them there.
As to whether they were actually intended to invoke Freemasonry, I
can't rule it out. But its highly speculative, and I strongly
doubt it. Some are too strained (the Krell doorways), some have errors
(the staircase), some have far more mundane explanations (Cookies
apron, the celestial globe), and some are just too common to require
a Masonic explanation (the star blowing up).
[Prediction, based on years of trying to debunk nonsense about
Freemasonry. Don will say some combination of:
* You're low level, and don't know the real secrets.
* You're high level, and are hiding the real secrets.
* My internet sources are better than your lived experience.
On 6/1/2024 11:06 AM, Paul S Person wrote:
On Sat, 1 Jun 2024 12:02:44 -0000 (UTC), Don <g@crcomp.net> wrote:
We have set it down as a law to ourselves to examine
things to the bottom, and not to receive upon credit,
or reject upon probability, until these have passed a
due examination. - Bacon's Natural History.
_The Tempest_ is popularly interpreted as an allegory for Freemason
initiation [1][2]. And some Shakespearean scholars simultaneously see
_Forbidden Planet_ as an adaptation of _The Tempest_ [3][4].
Given all of the above, it's fun to forage for Freemason forms in
_Forbidden Planet_."
In the 50s, our teacher actually /encouraged/ us to see it because it
was based on Shakespeare.
So this is nothing new, as ideas go.
The link below shows some symbols spotted in the movie along with
associated commentary. Views expressed are for informational purposes
only; they do not constitute an endorsement or an approval of
Freemasonry, Shakespeare, or Bacon.
<https://crcomp.net/arts/forbidden/index.php>
As Grave's /The White Goddess/ also illustrates, when you have a bee
in your bonnet, you will find what you are looking for anywhere,
whether it is there or not.
That's for sure. I've seen, for example, an essay with a very long and >convoluted explanation as to why 'Eyes Wide Shut' is an homage to
Scottish Rite Freemasonry.
/From Hell/, the graphic novel, was tedious (the second appendix is
the only part I really enjoyed) in part because of its long and boring
explanation of how London was laid out in Masonic symbols.
Still, it /did/ explain why /From Hell/, the movie, paused to give us
a clear view of a horse's harness: it has what the graphic novel
identifies as a Masonic symbol on it.
Do you see other, overlooked, occult Freemason symbols in
_Forbidden Planet_? Append any additional speculative symbology you spot >>> to this thread.
I wouldn't know one if I saw one. I might recognize a few that are
said to be Masonic in various films, but there is no reason to believe
that those films are correct.
This is true.
'From Hell' the movie is based on Alan Moore's graphic novel of the
same name.
Moore's 'From Hell', in turn, is based on 'Jack the Ripper: The
Final Solution', a 1976 "non-fiction" book by Stephen Knight, an
anti-Masonic author. It has been thoroughly discredited, but was
quite a scandal at the time, with its accusations vs the
Royal Family.
Interestingly, the film 'Murder by Decree' is also based on
Knight's book, and tells the same story, but without the woo-woo.
Don wrote:
Please post greater detail about your "winding staircase" grievance.
On a happier note, it was fun to discover the Forty-seventh Problem of
Euclid staring at me right in the face from the chalkboard! It tickles
me to pull Euclid into my Masonic mosaic in the form of a new Figure.
Perhaps a wise guy can pull a pattern, a potential pièce de résistance,
out of this paper?
<https://crcomp.net/arts/forbidden/paper.png>
The staircase need another flight, of 7 steps.
Again, the main problem with trying to to use the movie to
connect Shakespeare to the Masons that none of these
claimed 'tells' in the film appear in the play.
Petertrei wrote:
<snip>
Cookie's apron is cringe-worthy. But sometimes you must pander to
readers. In this case to readers who, at best, recognize only one
symbol: the apron.
Don wrote:
Petertrei wrote:
Don wrote:
<snip>
Please post greater detail about your "winding staircase" grievance.
On a happier note, it was fun to discover the Forty-seventh Problem of >>>> Euclid staring at me right in the face from the chalkboard! It tickles >>>> me to pull Euclid into my Masonic mosaic in the form of a new Figure.
Perhaps a wise guy can pull a pattern, a potential pièce de résistance, >>>> out of this paper?
<https://crcomp.net/arts/forbidden/paper.png>
The staircase need another flight, of 7 steps.
Again, the main problem with trying to to use the movie to
connect Shakespeare to the Masons that none of these
claimed 'tells' in the film appear in the play.
Perhaps Hollywood left out the last seven steps as an ... innovation?
Seven steps sacrificed for the sake of framing, or something?
"My piece of evidence has been shown to be deficient, but I'm
going to insist it is valid anyway."
Regardless, there's a misunderstanding. My current focus is to find
Freemason forms in _Forbidden Planet_ - for the fun of it. Intention
is irrelevant to this thread - it doesn't seek to prove a connection
between Freemasonry and Shakespeare. Other people's arguments about a
connection purely provide pretext. Otherwise readers would wonder
why Freemason forms are sought in _Forbidden Planet_.
OK, fine. So, who do you think inserted these alleged 'Masonic' tells?
Strickly speaking, the staircase and Euclid are both legend:
EUCLID. The masonic legend which refers to Euclid is altogether
historically untrue. It is really a philosophical myth intended
to convey a masonic truth.
WINDING STAIRS, LEGEND OF. A legend in the Fellow Craft's degree
having no historical truth, but being simply a philosophical
myth or legendary symbol intended to communicate a masonic
dogma.
The Symbolism of Freemasonry
<https://www.gutenberg.org/files/11937/11937-h/11937-h.htm#index>
Absolutely. Freemasonry as we recognize it today grew organically out
of the tail end of the medieval Mason's Guilds during the 1500s and
1600s. We know its all made up. You occasionally find Masons who think
that the order really originated at the building of King Solomon's
Temple, but they're looked at a bit like Young Earth Creationists.
Cookie's apron is cringe-worthy. But sometimes you must pander to
readers. In this case to readers who, at best, recognize only one
symbol: the apron.
No one 'reads' "forbidden Plant". Its a movie. But your point remains. Sometimes a cook's apron is just a cook's apron.
The Blazing Star provides a tentative origin for the space object
explosion climax cliche.
In the movie, its a planet that explodes, not a star. Yes, its a
bit of a trope now. 2010 is another good example.
There's a very long history of people claiming to find Masonic
allusions in things. Nearly all of it is pure apophenia.
Examples:
* I have a book that tries to prove that Stonehenge
is an ancient Masonic temple
* A lot of conspiracy theorists claim the two World Trade Center
towers were an allusion to a pair of pillars in Freemasonry,
and that 9/11 was somehow a Masonic ritual.
* Here's an attempt, at great length, and with
an amazing level of effort, to 'prove' that the film
'Eyes Wide Shut' is an allegory of what the author thinks
is in the Scottish Rite.
https://33degreesofeyeswideshut.wordpress.com/
On 6/3/2024 12:38 AM, Don wrote:
Regardless, there's a misunderstanding. My current focus is to find
Freemason forms in _Forbidden Planet_ - for the fun of it. Intention
is irrelevant to this thread - it doesn't seek to prove a connection
between Freemasonry and Shakespeare. Other people's arguments about a
connection purely provide pretext. Otherwise readers would wonder
why Freemason forms are sought in _Forbidden Planet_.
OK, fine. So, who do you think inserted these alleged 'Masonic' tells?
No one 'reads' "forbidden Plant". Its a movie. But your point remains. >Sometimes a cook's apron is just a cook's apron.
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