when it comes to invoking special counsel statute.
On 8/22/23 10:33 AM, ScottW wrote:
when it comes to invoking special counsel statute.How could he? It's a "will" kinda deal.
https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/28/600.1
§ 600.1 Grounds for appointing a Special Counsel.
The Attorney General, or in cases in which the Attorney General is
recused, the Acting Attorney General, will appoint a Special Counsel
when he or she determines that criminal investigation of a person or
matter is warranted and—
(a) That investigation or prosecution of that person or matter by a
United States Attorney's Office or litigating Division of the Department
of Justice would present a conflict of interest for the Department or
other extraordinary circumstances; and
(b) That under the circumstances, it would be in the public interest to appoint an outside Special Counsel to assume responsibility for the matter.
More context:
https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-28/chapter-VI/part-600
§ 600.3 Qualifications of the Special Counsel.
(a) An individual named as Special Counsel shall be a lawyer with a reputation for integrity and impartial decisionmaking...
(b) The Attorney General shall consult with the Assistant Attorney
General for Administration to ensure an appropriate method of appointment...
"Shall" is more a Weiss thing.
§ 600.6 Powers and authority.
Subject to the limitations in the following paragraphs, the Special
Counsel shall exercise, within the scope of his or her jurisdiction, the full power and independent authority to exercise all investigative and prosecutorial functions of any United States Attorney. Except as
provided in this part, the Special Counsel shall determine whether and
to what extent to inform or consult with the Attorney General or others within the Department about the conduct of his or her duties and responsibilities.
On Tuesday, August 22, 2023 at 12:00:57 PM UTC-4, mINE109 wrote:
On 8/22/23 10:33 AM, ScottW wrote:
when it comes to invoking special counsel statute.How could he? It's a "will" kinda deal.
https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/28/600.1
§ 600.1 Grounds for appointing a Special Counsel.
The Attorney General, or in cases in which the Attorney General is
recused, the Acting Attorney General, will appoint a Special Counsel
when he or she determines that criminal investigation of a person or
matter is warranted...
here is the answer, straight from Austin, Texas.
I shall set everybody straight.
This link will set everybody straight
Shall vs Will in legalese.
https://law.utexas.edu/faculty/wschiess/legalwriting/2005/05/shall-vs-will.html
essentially it is the same
a person shall do something
an event will be something.
On 8/22/23 6:52 PM, Art Sackman wrote:
On Tuesday, August 22, 2023 at 12:00:57 PM UTC-4, mINE109 wrote:
On 8/22/23 10:33 AM, ScottW wrote:here is the answer, straight from Austin, Texas.
when it comes to invoking special counsel statute.How could he? It's a "will" kinda deal.
https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/28/600.1
§ 600.1 Grounds for appointing a Special Counsel.
The Attorney General, or in cases in which the Attorney General is
recused, the Acting Attorney General, will appoint a Special Counsel
when he or she determines that criminal investigation of a person or
matter is warranted...
I shall set everybody straight.
This link will set everybody straight
Shall vs Will in legalese.
https://law.utexas.edu/faculty/wschiess/legalwriting/2005/05/shall-vs-will.html
essentially it is the sameThanks for the link. "Shall" imposes a duty; "will" is a contractual obligation. Close, but not same. More to the point, if someone indicates
a person shall do something
an event will be something.
by quotation mark that the word is cited literally, "will" is not "shall."
https://feltg.com/shall-will-may-or-must/
"Just about every jurisdiction in this great country has held that the
word shall, while the most often used of the above, is also the most confusing because it can mean may, will, or must. Our very own U.S.
Supreme Court has interpreted the word to mean may. In fact, it’s so confusing that the Federal Rules of Civil Procedure no longer use the
word at all."
Bryan Garner: “In most legal instruments, shall violates the presumption of consistency...which is why shall is among the most heavily litigated words in the English language.”
On Tuesday, August 22, 2023 at 6:08:22 PM UTC-7, mINE109 wrote:
On 8/22/23 6:52 PM, Art Sackman wrote:
On Tuesday, August 22, 2023 at 12:00:57 PM UTC-4, mINE109 wrote:
On 8/22/23 10:33 AM, ScottW wrote:
when it comes to invoking special counsel statute.How could he? It's a "will" kinda deal.
https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/28/600.1
§ 600.1 Grounds for appointing a Special Counsel.
The Attorney General, or in cases in which the Attorney General is
recused, the Acting Attorney General, will appoint a Special Counsel
when he or she determines that criminal investigation of a person or
matter is warranted...
STOP the MORON BS.
That investigation or prosecution of that person or matter by a
United States Attorney's Office or litigating Division of the Department
of Justice would present a conflict of interest for the Department or
other extraordinary circumstances; and
The above is the presumed condition for the appointment of a special counsel.
This dictates that a person outside the DoJ be appointed. PERIOD.
On 8/22/23 10:01 PM, ScottW wrote:
On Tuesday, August 22, 2023 at 6:08:22 PM UTC-7, mINE109 wrote:
On 8/22/23 6:52 PM, Art Sackman wrote:STOP the MORON BS.
On Tuesday, August 22, 2023 at 12:00:57 PM UTC-4, mINE109 wrote:
On 8/22/23 10:33 AM, ScottW wrote:
when it comes to invoking special counsel statute.How could he? It's a "will" kinda deal.
https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/28/600.1
§ 600.1 Grounds for appointing a Special Counsel.
The Attorney General, or in cases in which the Attorney General is
recused, the Acting Attorney General, will appoint a Special Counsel >>>> when he or she determines that criminal investigation of a person or >>>> matter is warranted...
That investigation or prosecution of that person or matter by a
United States Attorney's Office or litigating Division of the Department of Justice would present a conflict of interest for the Department or other extraordinary circumstances; and
The above is the presumed condition for the appointment of a special counsel.
This dictates that a person outside the DoJ be appointed. PERIOD.If the special counsel were named pursuant to section 600.3, yes, but:
https://www.justice.gov/d9/2023-08/order.appointment_of_david_c._weiss_as_special_counsel.pdf
When Durham, also a US attorney, was named special counsel, Barr cited
28 U.S.C. §§ 509, 510, and 515, then added "28 C.F.R. §§ 600.4 to 600.10,” effectively naming him but omitting the "outside the
government" requirement.
https://www.justice.gov/d9/fieldable-panel-panes/basic-panes/attachments/2021/02/26/durham.order_.pdf
You'll see Garland did the same, with addition of 533 which I believe
covers funding.
So, "presumed" is the problem. However, I agree Weiss should step down
from the investigation.
However, I agree Weiss should step down from the investigation.and the moron who appointed him should be fired.
On Wednesday, August 23, 2023 at 5:42:38 AM UTC-7, mINE109 wrote:
On 8/22/23 10:01 PM, ScottW wrote:
On Tuesday, August 22, 2023 at 6:08:22 PM UTC-7, mINE109 wrote:
On 8/22/23 6:52 PM, Art Sackman wrote:
On Tuesday, August 22, 2023 at 12:00:57 PM UTC-4, mINE109 wrote:
On 8/22/23 10:33 AM, ScottW wrote:
when it comes to invoking special counsel statute.How could he? It's a "will" kinda deal.
https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/28/600.1
§ 600.1 Grounds for appointing a Special Counsel.
The Attorney General, or in cases in which the Attorney General is >>>>>> recused, the Acting Attorney General, will appoint a Special Counsel >>>>>> when he or she determines that criminal investigation of a person or >>>>>> matter is warranted...
This dictates that a person outside the DoJ be appointed. PERIOD.If the special counsel were named pursuant to section 600.3, yes, but:
https://www.justice.gov/d9/2023-08/order.appointment_of_david_c._weiss_as_special_counsel.pdf
When Durham, also a US attorney, was named special counsel, Barr cited
28 U.S.C. §§ 509, 510, and 515, then added "28 C.F.R. §§ 600.4 to
600.10,” effectively naming him but omitting the "outside the
government" requirement.
https://www.justice.gov/d9/fieldable-panel-panes/basic-panes/attachments/2021/02/26/durham.order_.pdf
You'll see Garland did the same, with addition of 533 which I believe
covers funding.
So, "presumed" is the problem. However, I agree Weiss should step down
from the investigation.
and the moron who appointed him should be fired.
On 8/23/23 12:34 PM, ScottW wrote:
On Wednesday, August 23, 2023 at 5:42:38 AM UTC-7, mINE109 wrote:<600.3>
On 8/22/23 10:01 PM, ScottW wrote:
On Tuesday, August 22, 2023 at 6:08:22 PM UTC-7, mINE109 wrote:
On 8/22/23 6:52 PM, Art Sackman wrote:
On Tuesday, August 22, 2023 at 12:00:57 PM UTC-4, mINE109 wrote: >>>>>> On 8/22/23 10:33 AM, ScottW wrote:
when it comes to invoking special counsel statute.How could he? It's a "will" kinda deal.
https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/28/600.1
§ 600.1 Grounds for appointing a Special Counsel.
The Attorney General, or in cases in which the Attorney General is >>>>>> recused, the Acting Attorney General, will appoint a Special Counsel >>>>>> when he or she determines that criminal investigation of a person or >>>>>> matter is warranted...
This dictates that a person outside the DoJ be appointed. PERIOD.If the special counsel were named pursuant to section 600.3, yes, but:
https://www.justice.gov/d9/2023-08/order.appointment_of_david_c._weiss_as_special_counsel.pdf
When Durham, also a US attorney, was named special counsel, Barr cited
28 U.S.C. §§ 509, 510, and 515, then added "28 C.F.R. §§ 600.4 to
600.10,” effectively naming him but omitting the "outside the
government" requirement.
https://www.justice.gov/d9/fieldable-panel-panes/basic-panes/attachments/2021/02/26/durham.order_.pdf
You'll see Garland did the same, with addition of 533 which I believe
covers funding.
So, "presumed" is the problem. However, I agree Weiss should step down
from the investigation.
and the moron who appointed him should be fired.And the thirty-odd Republican Senators who demanded his appointment?
Turns out Garland and Barr could both read the statute.
On Wednesday, August 23, 2023 at 12:18:42 PM UTC-7, mINE109 wrote:
On 8/23/23 12:34 PM, ScottW wrote:
On Wednesday, August 23, 2023 at 5:42:38 AM UTC-7, mINE109 wrote:<600.3>
On 8/22/23 10:01 PM, ScottW wrote:
On Tuesday, August 22, 2023 at 6:08:22 PM UTC-7, mINE109 wrote:
On 8/22/23 6:52 PM, Art Sackman wrote:
On Tuesday, August 22, 2023 at 12:00:57 PM UTC-4, mINE109 wrote: >>>>>>>> On 8/22/23 10:33 AM, ScottW wrote:
when it comes to invoking special counsel statute.How could he? It's a "will" kinda deal.
https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/28/600.1
§ 600.1 Grounds for appointing a Special Counsel.
The Attorney General, or in cases in which the Attorney General is >>>>>>>> recused, the Acting Attorney General, will appoint a Special Counsel >>>>>>>> when he or she determines that criminal investigation of a person or >>>>>>>> matter is warranted...
And the thirty-odd Republican Senators who demanded his appointment?This dictates that a person outside the DoJ be appointed. PERIOD.If the special counsel were named pursuant to section 600.3, yes, but: >>>>
https://www.justice.gov/d9/2023-08/order.appointment_of_david_c._weiss_as_special_counsel.pdf
When Durham, also a US attorney, was named special counsel, Barr cited >>>> 28 U.S.C. §§ 509, 510, and 515, then added "28 C.F.R. §§ 600.4 to
600.10,” effectively naming him but omitting the "outside the
government" requirement.
https://www.justice.gov/d9/fieldable-panel-panes/basic-panes/attachments/2021/02/26/durham.order_.pdf
You'll see Garland did the same, with addition of 533 which I believe
covers funding.
So, "presumed" is the problem. However, I agree Weiss should step down >>>> from the investigation.
and the moron who appointed him should be fired.
His? Show me the demand to appoint the loser Weiss. How many years ago was that....if ever?
Turns out Garland and Barr could both read the statute.
and cherrypick the sections.....Kind of odd.
Do you get to cherrypick the sections of statute you will abide by?
On 8/22/23 10:33 AM, ScottW wrote:
when it comes to invoking special counsel statute.How could he? It's a "will" kinda deal.
https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/28/600.1
§ 600.1 Grounds for appointing a Special Counsel.
The Attorney General, or in cases in which the Attorney General is
recused, the Acting Attorney General, will appoint a Special Counsel
when he or she determines that criminal investigation of a person or
matter is warranted and—
(a) That investigation or prosecution of that person or matter by a
United States Attorney's Office or litigating Division of the Department
of Justice would present a conflict of interest for the Department or
other extraordinary circumstances; and
(b) That under the circumstances, it would be in the public interest to appoint an outside Special Counsel to assume responsibility for the matter.
More context:
https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-28/chapter-VI/part-600
§ 600.3 Qualifications of the Special Counsel.
(a) An individual named as Special Counsel shall be a lawyer with a reputation for integrity and impartial decisionmaking...
(b) The Attorney General shall consult with the Assistant Attorney
General for Administration to ensure an appropriate method of appointment...
"Shall" is more a Weiss thing.
§ 600.6 Powers and authority.
Subject to the limitations in the following paragraphs, the Special
Counsel shall exercise, within the scope of his or her jurisdiction, the full power and independent authority to exercise all investigative and prosecutorial functions of any United States Attorney. Except as
provided in this part, the Special Counsel shall determine whether and
to what extent to inform or consult with the Attorney General or others within the Department about the conduct of his or her duties and responsibilities.
| Sysop: | Keyop |
|---|---|
| Location: | Huddersfield, West Yorkshire, UK |
| Users: | 546 |
| Nodes: | 16 (0 / 16) |
| Uptime: | 169:53:40 |
| Calls: | 10,385 |
| Calls today: | 2 |
| Files: | 14,057 |
| Messages: | 6,416,555 |