That Dylan Johnson has been doing some limited testing to find the fastest Gravel tyres, which is larger than most folks would think.
though does as he notes depend on you and your riding, my Gravel riding is often mixed use, and I like it?s adaptability, which would be compromised with much larger tyres ie be more draggy on the tarmac.
Though if you?re just riding on the trails then a 2.1/50mm tyre is almost certainly a better choice, I personally like being able to ride tarmac/mud/roots etc which the all road/Gravel bike I have does fine, it gives a bit to mates with newer bikes with wider clearances but it?s certainly not enough to tempt me to a new bike!
And if it?s really narly can just use the MTB which just flattens stuff!
<https://youtu.be/iq9ydwkRt0Q?si=eX_6lRdPWtLwjh4k>
On Sat Feb 8 22:29:16 2025 Roger Merriman wrote:
That Dylan Johnson has been doing some limited testing to find the fastest >> Gravel tyres, which is larger than most folks would think.
though does as he notes depend on you and your riding, my Gravel riding is >> often mixed use, and I like it?s adaptability, which would be compromised
with much larger tyres ie be more draggy on the tarmac.
Though if you?re just riding on the trails then a 2.1/50mm tyre is almost
certainly a better choice, I personally like being able to ride
tarmac/mud/roots etc which the all road/Gravel bike I have does fine, it
gives a bit to mates with newer bikes with wider clearances but it?s
certainly not enough to tempt me to a new bike!
And if it?s really narly can just use the MTB which just flattens stuff!
<https://youtu.be/iq9ydwkRt0Q?si=eX_6lRdPWtLwjh4k>
On my gravel bike I had 38 mm tires. Going fatter would have gained
nothing unless the terrain changed from gravel to wild MTB.
On Sat Feb 8 22:29:16 2025 Roger Merriman wrote:
That Dylan Johnson has been doing some limited testing to find the fastest >> Gravel tyres, which is larger than most folks would think.
though does as he notes depend on you and your riding, my Gravel riding is >> often mixed use, and I like it?s adaptability, which would be compromised
with much larger tyres ie be more draggy on the tarmac.
Though if you?re just riding on the trails then a 2.1/50mm tyre is almost
certainly a better choice, I personally like being able to ride
tarmac/mud/roots etc which the all road/Gravel bike I have does fine, it
gives a bit to mates with newer bikes with wider clearances but it?s
certainly not enough to tempt me to a new bike!
And if it?s really narly can just use the MTB which just flattens stuff!
<https://youtu.be/iq9ydwkRt0Q?si=eX_6lRdPWtLwjh4k>
On my gravel bike I had 38 mm tires. Going fatter would have gained nothing unless the terrain changed from gravel to wild MTB.
On 2/9/2025 3:54 PM, cyclintom wrote:
On Sat Feb 8 22:29:16 2025 Roger Merriman wrote:
That Dylan Johnson has been doing some limited testing to find the fastest >>> Gravel tyres, which is larger than most folks would think.
though does as he notes depend on you and your riding, my Gravel riding is >>> often mixed use, and I like it?s adaptability, which would be compromised >>> with much larger tyres ie be more draggy on the tarmac.
Though if you?re just riding on the trails then a 2.1/50mm tyre is almost >>> certainly a better choice, I personally like being able to ride
tarmac/mud/roots etc which the all road/Gravel bike I have does fine, it >>> gives a bit to mates with newer bikes with wider clearances but it?s
certainly not enough to tempt me to a new bike!
And if it?s really narly can just use the MTB which just flattens stuff! >>>
<https://youtu.be/iq9ydwkRt0Q?si=eX_6lRdPWtLwjh4k>
On my gravel bike I had 38 mm tires. Going fatter would have gained nothing unless the terrain changed from gravel to wild MTB.
As noted, we all have our political preferences and our own
analyses of agreed facts. Such is life.
That said, Mr Shadow is spending the day, again, amid cute
Brasilian girls and you're not.
On Sun, 9 Feb 2025 16:32:11 -0600, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 2/9/2025 3:54 PM, cyclintom wrote:
On Sat Feb 8 22:29:16 2025 Roger Merriman wrote:
That Dylan Johnson has been doing some limited testing to find the fastest >>>> Gravel tyres, which is larger than most folks would think.
though does as he notes depend on you and your riding, my Gravel riding is >>>> often mixed use, and I like it?s adaptability, which would be compromised >>>> with much larger tyres ie be more draggy on the tarmac.
Though if you?re just riding on the trails then a 2.1/50mm tyre is almost >>>> certainly a better choice, I personally like being able to ride
tarmac/mud/roots etc which the all road/Gravel bike I have does fine, it >>>> gives a bit to mates with newer bikes with wider clearances but it?s
certainly not enough to tempt me to a new bike!
And if it?s really narly can just use the MTB which just flattens stuff! >>>>
<https://youtu.be/iq9ydwkRt0Q?si=eX_6lRdPWtLwjh4k>
On my gravel bike I had 38 mm tires. Going fatter would have gained
nothing unless the terrain changed from gravel to wild MTB.
As noted, we all have our political preferences and our own
analyses of agreed facts. Such is life.
That said, Mr Shadow is spending the day, again, amid cute
Brasilian girls and you're not.
Well, I see some when I go for my daily 10km ride. They jog
round the lake before the sun gets too hot.Though you probably
wouldn't consider 10km a "ride".
But for the rest of the day there's only my wife. She hasn't
been "cute" for over 40 years.
PS I use 29x2.1(CST Critter) front and 29x2.2 Pirelli back.
The CST , which are chunky, last around 4.000Km ? Not sure, because
odometer was broken for a while. Not sure how long the Pirelli will
last. They seem to be harder than the CST.
No way either will last the 8000 MILES I think someone
mentioned here...
[]'s
Shadow <Sh@dow.br> wrote:
On Sun, 9 Feb 2025 16:32:11 -0600, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 2/9/2025 3:54 PM, cyclintom wrote:
On Sat Feb 8 22:29:16 2025 Roger Merriman wrote:
That Dylan Johnson has been doing some limited testing to find the fastest
Gravel tyres, which is larger than most folks would think.
though does as he notes depend on you and your riding, my Gravel riding is
often mixed use, and I like it?s adaptability, which would be compromised >>>>> with much larger tyres ie be more draggy on the tarmac.
Though if you?re just riding on the trails then a 2.1/50mm tyre is almost >>>>> certainly a better choice, I personally like being able to ride
tarmac/mud/roots etc which the all road/Gravel bike I have does fine, it >>>>> gives a bit to mates with newer bikes with wider clearances but it?s >>>>> certainly not enough to tempt me to a new bike!
And if it?s really narly can just use the MTB which just flattens stuff! >>>>>
<https://youtu.be/iq9ydwkRt0Q?si=eX_6lRdPWtLwjh4k>
On my gravel bike I had 38 mm tires. Going fatter would have gained
nothing unless the terrain changed from gravel to wild MTB.
As noted, we all have our political preferences and our own
analyses of agreed facts. Such is life.
That said, Mr Shadow is spending the day, again, amid cute
Brasilian girls and you're not.
Well, I see some when I go for my daily 10km ride. They jog
round the lake before the sun gets too hot.Though you probably
wouldn't consider 10km a "ride".
But for the rest of the day there's only my wife. She hasn't
been "cute" for over 40 years.
PS I use 29x2.1(CST Critter) front and 29x2.2 Pirelli back.
The CST , which are chunky, last around 4.000Km ? Not sure, because
odometer was broken for a while. Not sure how long the Pirelli will
last. They seem to be harder than the CST.
No way either will last the 8000 MILES I think someone
mentioned here...
[]'s
I get 5/8k on the main commute bike, out of the Big Apples, though have had >two rear tyres retired early due to sidewall damage, they have always
reached a point of death by a thousand cuts than wear out.
MTB bit over 1k for tyres before they are toast, soft compounds so that’s >about what one would expect really.
Gravel bike 3k front 2k rear give or take, gravel tyres tend to the fast
and fragile end of things so do occasionally get dramatic failures or at >least tyres that might get me home but no further!
The roadie commuter I’d expect 2k ish but it does low miles so let’s see.
Roger Merriman
As noted, we all have our political preferences and our own
analyses of agreed facts. Such is life.
That said, Mr Shadow is spending the day, again, amid cute
Brasilian girls and you're not.
On Sun Feb 9 16:32:11 2025 AMuzi wrote:
As noted, we all have our political preferences and our own
analyses of agreed facts. Such is life.
That said, Mr Shadow is spending the day, again, amid cute
Brasilian girls and you're not.
It is my belief that shadow is really illegaly in the US. The present Brazilian government does not like communists. His posting times seem to match yours.
On Sun Feb 9 16:32:11 2025 AMuzi wrote:
As noted, we all have our political preferences and our own
analyses of agreed facts. Such is life.
That said, Mr Shadow is spending the day, again, amid cute
Brasilian girls and you're not.
It is my belief that shadow is really illegaly in the US.
The present Brazilian government does not like communists. His posting times seem to match yours.
On 10 Feb 2025 17:42:04 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
Shadow <Sh@dow.br> wrote:
On Sun, 9 Feb 2025 16:32:11 -0600, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 2/9/2025 3:54 PM, cyclintom wrote:
On Sat Feb 8 22:29:16 2025 Roger Merriman wrote:
That Dylan Johnson has been doing some limited testing to find the fastest
Gravel tyres, which is larger than most folks would think.
though does as he notes depend on you and your riding, my Gravel riding is
often mixed use, and I like it?s adaptability, which would be compromised
with much larger tyres ie be more draggy on the tarmac.
Though if you?re just riding on the trails then a 2.1/50mm tyre is almost
certainly a better choice, I personally like being able to ride
tarmac/mud/roots etc which the all road/Gravel bike I have does fine, it >>>>>> gives a bit to mates with newer bikes with wider clearances but it?s >>>>>> certainly not enough to tempt me to a new bike!
And if it?s really narly can just use the MTB which just flattens stuff! >>>>>>
<https://youtu.be/iq9ydwkRt0Q?si=eX_6lRdPWtLwjh4k>
On my gravel bike I had 38 mm tires. Going fatter would have gained
nothing unless the terrain changed from gravel to wild MTB.
As noted, we all have our political preferences and our own
analyses of agreed facts. Such is life.
That said, Mr Shadow is spending the day, again, amid cute
Brasilian girls and you're not.
Well, I see some when I go for my daily 10km ride. They jog
round the lake before the sun gets too hot.Though you probably
wouldn't consider 10km a "ride".
But for the rest of the day there's only my wife. She hasn't
been "cute" for over 40 years.
PS I use 29x2.1(CST Critter) front and 29x2.2 Pirelli back.
The CST , which are chunky, last around 4.000Km ? Not sure, because
odometer was broken for a while. Not sure how long the Pirelli will
last. They seem to be harder than the CST.
No way either will last the 8000 MILES I think someone
mentioned here...
[]'s
I get 5/8k on the main commute bike, out of the Big Apples, though have had >> two rear tyres retired early due to sidewall damage, they have always
reached a point of death by a thousand cuts than wear out.
MTB bit over 1k for tyres before they are toast, soft compounds so thatÂ’s >> about what one would expect really.
Gravel bike 3k front 2k rear give or take, gravel tyres tend to the fast
and fragile end of things so do occasionally get dramatic failures or at
least tyres that might get me home but no further!
The roadie commuter IÂ’d expect 2k ish but it does low miles so letÂ’s see. >>
Roger Merriman
My CST are described as MTB, so I suppose I get pretty good
mileage.
My Pirelli are "Mixed terrain" which describes quite well all
roads in rural Brazil, where I live.
[]'s
On 2/10/2025 1:07 PM, cyclintom wrote:
On Sun Feb 9 16:32:11 2025 AMuzi wrote:
As noted, we all have our political preferences and our own
analyses of agreed facts. Such is life.
That said, Mr Shadow is spending the day, again, amid cute
Brasilian girls and you're not.
It is my belief that shadow is really illegaly in the US. The present
Brazilian government does not like communists. His posting times seem to match yours.
There is no reason to believe any of that. So I don't.
Shadow <Sh@dow.br> wrote:
On 10 Feb 2025 17:42:04 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
Shadow <Sh@dow.br> wrote:
On Sun, 9 Feb 2025 16:32:11 -0600, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 2/9/2025 3:54 PM, cyclintom wrote:
On Sat Feb 8 22:29:16 2025 Roger Merriman wrote:
That Dylan Johnson has been doing some limited testing to find the fastest
Gravel tyres, which is larger than most folks would think.
though does as he notes depend on you and your riding, my Gravel riding is
often mixed use, and I like it?s adaptability, which would be compromised
with much larger tyres ie be more draggy on the tarmac.
Though if you?re just riding on the trails then a 2.1/50mm tyre is almost
certainly a better choice, I personally like being able to ride
tarmac/mud/roots etc which the all road/Gravel bike I have does fine, it
gives a bit to mates with newer bikes with wider clearances but it?s >>>>>>> certainly not enough to tempt me to a new bike!
And if it?s really narly can just use the MTB which just flattens stuff!
<https://youtu.be/iq9ydwkRt0Q?si=eX_6lRdPWtLwjh4k>
On my gravel bike I had 38 mm tires. Going fatter would have gained >>>>>> nothing unless the terrain changed from gravel to wild MTB.
As noted, we all have our political preferences and our own
analyses of agreed facts. Such is life.
That said, Mr Shadow is spending the day, again, amid cute
Brasilian girls and you're not.
Well, I see some when I go for my daily 10km ride. They jog
round the lake before the sun gets too hot.Though you probably
wouldn't consider 10km a "ride".
But for the rest of the day there's only my wife. She hasn't
been "cute" for over 40 years.
PS I use 29x2.1(CST Critter) front and 29x2.2 Pirelli back.
The CST , which are chunky, last around 4.000Km ? Not sure, because
odometer was broken for a while. Not sure how long the Pirelli will
last. They seem to be harder than the CST.
No way either will last the 8000 MILES I think someone
mentioned here...
[]'s
I get 5/8k on the main commute bike, out of the Big Apples, though have had >>> two rear tyres retired early due to sidewall damage, they have always
reached a point of death by a thousand cuts than wear out.
MTB bit over 1k for tyres before they are toast, soft compounds so thatÂ’s >>> about what one would expect really.
Gravel bike 3k front 2k rear give or take, gravel tyres tend to the fast >>> and fragile end of things so do occasionally get dramatic failures or at >>> least tyres that might get me home but no further!
The roadie commuter IÂ’d expect 2k ish but it does low miles so letÂ’s see. >>>
Roger Merriman
My CST are described as MTB, so I suppose I get pretty good
mileage.
I’d not heard of CST but having a dig appears to be a budget brand compared to more premium Maxxis both of which are owned by the same company.
But would explain the longevity as generally speaking more budget friendly MTB tyres do last much better. Used some on the old MTB/Commute bike and seemed to last a few thousand miles, not as long as the BigApples but certainly a lot better than posh MTB tyres.
As ever with life are compromises I had some mid range Continental tyres
few years back that I ditched after a very hairy descent of one of the old industrial inclines near my folks place in Wales which was wet steep and plenty of rock slabs which the Conti’s where very skittish over.
Magic Marys and Hans in a soft compound handle the incline without fuss, it’s still steep and a wet slippery environment but much more controlled.
My Pirelli are "Mixed terrain" which describes quite well all
roads in rural Brazil, where I live.
[]'s
I suspect so yes!
Roger Merriman
AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 2/10/2025 1:07 PM, cyclintom wrote:Brazil appears to be somewhere in the middle between myself (UK) and
On Sun Feb 9 16:32:11 2025 AMuzi wrote:
As noted, we all have our political preferences and our own
analyses of agreed facts. Such is life.
That said, Mr Shadow is spending the day, again, amid cute
Brasilian girls and you're not.
It is my belief that shadow is really illegaly in the US. The present
Brazilian government does not like communists. His posting times seem to match yours.
There is no reason to believe any of that. So I don't.
eastern America in terms of time zones, so only a few hours difference and who knows when he posts? Some folks seem to have vague routines others not
so much, I can read/post early I read maybe posted before work today, at
7am though sometimes I’d be at work by then so potentially might have done so at 5am with a morning cup of tea! Equally might be winding down later on like it is now at 10:15pm.
But I use an app on iPad so can just grab and use, rather than using a computer.
Roger Merriman
CST = Cheng Shin Tire
https://www.csttires.com/int/about-cst/contact-page/
On Mon, 10 Feb 2025 17:42:51 -0600, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
CST = Cheng Shin Tire
https://www.csttires.com/int/about-cst/contact-page/
<https://www.summitbicycles.com/product/cst-critter-tire-247107-1.htm>
<https://www.walmart.com/ip/Cst-Critter-Tire-29X2-10-Black-Steel-Bead/134022585>
Cheap. Well, here we pay a 60% tariff on all imported goods,
20% state tax on that, 50% for the reseller and salaries are much
lower than the US, so it's relative. A month's minimum salary will buy
you 6-8 tires.
During the military dictatorship there was a 200% tariff on
just about any import, except Scotch whiskey - the economy minister
was an alcoholic(Simonsen)
The Pirelli tires cost about double, and are made by "Zhongce
Rubber Group Co. LTD. , China". No idea who they are. Pirelli used to
have several factories in Brazil, but the last real ones closed after
the 2015 coup...
<https://www.cnnbrasil.com.br/economia/macroeconomia/apos-2-anos-pirelli-conclui-fechamento-de-fabrica-de-pneus-em-gravatai-rs/>
The Sao Paulo/Campinas "factories" just package imported
tires...
I don't need "excellent" tires. If one blows out the sidewall,
I can push the bike home...
[]'s
On 2/9/2025 3:54 PM, cyclintom wrote:
On Sat Feb 8 22:29:16 2025 Roger Merriman wrote:
That Dylan Johnson has been doing some limited testing to find the
fastest
Gravel tyres, which is larger than most folks would think.
though does as he notes depend on you and your riding, my Gravel
riding is
often mixed use, and I like it?s adaptability, which would be
compromised
with much larger tyres ie be more draggy on the tarmac.
Though if you?re just riding on the trails then a 2.1/50mm tyre is
almost
certainly a better choice, I personally like being able to ride
tarmac/mud/roots etc which the all road/Gravel bike I have does fine, it >>> gives a bit to mates with newer bikes with wider clearances but it?s
certainly not enough to tempt me to a new bike!
And if it?s really narly can just use the MTB which just flattens stuff! >>>
<https://youtu.be/iq9ydwkRt0Q?si=eX_6lRdPWtLwjh4k>
On my gravel bike I had 38 mm tires. Going fatter would have gained
nothing unless the terrain changed from gravel to wild MTB.
As noted, we all have our political preferences and our own analyses of agreed facts. Such is life.
On 2/9/2025 5:32 PM, AMuzi wrote:
On 2/9/2025 3:54 PM, cyclintom wrote:
On Sat Feb 8 22:29:16 2025 Roger Merriman wrote:
That Dylan Johnson has been doing some limited testing
to find the fastest
Gravel tyres, which is larger than most folks would think.
though does as he notes depend on you and your riding,
my Gravel riding is
often mixed use, and I like it?s adaptability, which
would be compromised
with much larger tyres ie be more draggy on the tarmac.
Though if you?re just riding on the trails then a
2.1/50mm tyre is almost
certainly a better choice, I personally like being able
to ride
tarmac/mud/roots etc which the all road/Gravel bike I
have does fine, it
gives a bit to mates with newer bikes with wider
clearances but it?s
certainly not enough to tempt me to a new bike!
And if it?s really narly can just use the MTB which just
flattens stuff!
<https://youtu.be/iq9ydwkRt0Q?si=eX_6lRdPWtLwjh4k>
On my gravel bike I had 38 mm tires. Going fatter would
have gained nothing unless the terrain changed from
gravel to wild MTB.
As noted, we all have our political preferences and our
own analyses of agreed facts. Such is life.
I'll note, as usual, that some things actually are measurable.
On 2/11/2025 8:11 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 2/9/2025 5:32 PM, AMuzi wrote:
On 2/9/2025 3:54 PM, cyclintom wrote:
On Sat Feb 8 22:29:16 2025 Roger Merriman wrote:
That Dylan Johnson has been doing some limited testing to find the
fastest
Gravel tyres, which is larger than most folks would think.
though does as he notes depend on you and your riding, my Gravel
riding is
often mixed use, and I like it?s adaptability, which would be
compromised
with much larger tyres ie be more draggy on the tarmac.
Though if you?re just riding on the trails then a 2.1/50mm tyre is
almost
certainly a better choice, I personally like being able to ride
tarmac/mud/roots etc which the all road/Gravel bike I have does
fine, it
gives a bit to mates with newer bikes with wider clearances but it?s >>>>> certainly not enough to tempt me to a new bike!
And if it?s really narly can just use the MTB which just flattens
stuff!
<https://youtu.be/iq9ydwkRt0Q?si=eX_6lRdPWtLwjh4k>
On my gravel bike I had 38 mm tires. Going fatter would have gained
nothing unless the terrain changed from gravel to wild MTB.
As noted, we all have our political preferences and our own analyses
of agreed facts. Such is life.
I'll note, as usual, that some things actually are measurable.
For whatever criteria you deem significant.
On 2/11/2025 9:28 PM, AMuzi wrote:
On 2/11/2025 8:11 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 2/9/2025 5:32 PM, AMuzi wrote:
On 2/9/2025 3:54 PM, cyclintom wrote:
On Sat Feb 8 22:29:16 2025 Roger Merriman wrote:
That Dylan Johnson has been doing some limited testing
to find the fastest
Gravel tyres, which is larger than most folks would
think.
though does as he notes depend on you and your riding,
my Gravel riding is
often mixed use, and I like it?s adaptability, which
would be compromised
with much larger tyres ie be more draggy on the tarmac.
Though if you?re just riding on the trails then a
2.1/50mm tyre is almost
certainly a better choice, I personally like being
able to ride
tarmac/mud/roots etc which the all road/Gravel bike I
have does fine, it
gives a bit to mates with newer bikes with wider
clearances but it?s
certainly not enough to tempt me to a new bike!
And if it?s really narly can just use the MTB which
just flattens stuff!
<https://youtu.be/iq9ydwkRt0Q?si=eX_6lRdPWtLwjh4k>
On my gravel bike I had 38 mm tires. Going fatter would
have gained nothing unless the terrain changed from
gravel to wild MTB.
As noted, we all have our political preferences and our
own analyses of agreed facts. Such is life.
I'll note, as usual, that some things actually are
measurable.
For whatever criteria you deem significant.
Of course. For tires, it's commonly (but not always) rolling
resistance in the real world on a specific type of surface.
Traction might be another.
Sometimes it can be tricky to specify the criteria or design
the tests, but some things are certainly measurable. And I
tend to trust measured data more than mere opinions.
See also years of tire comments here. Some riders express
small interest in weight while pursuing longer mileage.
Others discount all that in favor of low price. Others
pursue handling/cornering over other factors, price be damned.
On 2/11/2025 9:28 PM, AMuzi wrote:
On 2/11/2025 8:11 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 2/9/2025 5:32 PM, AMuzi wrote:
On 2/9/2025 3:54 PM, cyclintom wrote:
On Sat Feb 8 22:29:16 2025 Roger Merriman wrote:
That Dylan Johnson has been doing some limited testing to find the >>>>>> fastest
Gravel tyres, which is larger than most folks would think.
though does as he notes depend on you and your riding, my Gravel
riding is
often mixed use, and I like it?s adaptability, which would be
compromised
with much larger tyres ie be more draggy on the tarmac.
Though if you?re just riding on the trails then a 2.1/50mm tyre is >>>>>> almost
certainly a better choice, I personally like being able to ride
tarmac/mud/roots etc which the all road/Gravel bike I have does
fine, it
gives a bit to mates with newer bikes with wider clearances but it?s >>>>>> certainly not enough to tempt me to a new bike!
And if it?s really narly can just use the MTB which just flattens
stuff!
<https://youtu.be/iq9ydwkRt0Q?si=eX_6lRdPWtLwjh4k>
On my gravel bike I had 38 mm tires. Going fatter would have gained
nothing unless the terrain changed from gravel to wild MTB.
As noted, we all have our political preferences and our own analyses
of agreed facts. Such is life.
I'll note, as usual, that some things actually are measurable.
For whatever criteria you deem significant.
Of course. For tires, it's commonly (but not always) rolling resistance
in the real world on a specific type of surface. Traction might be another.
Sometimes it can be tricky to specify the criteria or design the tests,
but some things are certainly measurable. And I tend to trust measured
data more than mere opinions.
Frank Krygowski <frkrygow@gXXmail.com> wrote:
On 2/11/2025 9:28 PM, AMuzi wrote:That’s a roadie perspective, my MTB tyres are slow rolling, on roads be that tarmac or even fire roads they are pigs to pedal each one is 1KG plus, have soft tacky compounds and so on, but once in the terrain they are designed for they shine, Magic Mary (Front) is total grip monster, particularly in wet loamy conditions. Hans Dampf is bit quicker rolling and more middle of the road in terms of wet or hard pack terrain, hence it’s a common pairing with the Mary up front.
On 2/11/2025 8:11 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 2/9/2025 5:32 PM, AMuzi wrote:
On 2/9/2025 3:54 PM, cyclintom wrote:
On Sat Feb 8 22:29:16 2025 Roger Merriman wrote:
That Dylan Johnson has been doing some limited testing to find the >>>>>>> fastest
Gravel tyres, which is larger than most folks would think.
though does as he notes depend on you and your riding, my Gravel >>>>>>> riding is
often mixed use, and I like it?s adaptability, which would be
compromised
with much larger tyres ie be more draggy on the tarmac.
Though if you?re just riding on the trails then a 2.1/50mm tyre is >>>>>>> almost
certainly a better choice, I personally like being able to ride
tarmac/mud/roots etc which the all road/Gravel bike I have does
fine, it
gives a bit to mates with newer bikes with wider clearances but it?s >>>>>>> certainly not enough to tempt me to a new bike!
And if it?s really narly can just use the MTB which just flattens >>>>>>> stuff!
<https://youtu.be/iq9ydwkRt0Q?si=eX_6lRdPWtLwjh4k>
On my gravel bike I had 38 mm tires. Going fatter would have gained >>>>>> nothing unless the terrain changed from gravel to wild MTB.
As noted, we all have our political preferences and our own analyses >>>>> of agreed facts. Such is life.
I'll note, as usual, that some things actually are measurable.
For whatever criteria you deem significant.
Of course. For tires, it's commonly (but not always) rolling resistance
in the real world on a specific type of surface. Traction might be another. >>
Sometimes it can be tricky to specify the criteria or design the tests,Certainly with MTB tyres can be feel or predictability, the Maxxis Minion
but some things are certainly measurable. And I tend to trust measured
data more than mere opinions.
DHF has a gap between the shoulders and the main tread the grip levels are huge, but you have to commit ie bank the bike on to the shoulders and trust that it will grip, it’s one of the reasons for their newer DH/Burly trail tyre the Assegai which has like most tyres transition nobs and the DHF doesn’t though it’s absolute grip is very high no evidence that the Assegai
has greater grip but it’s much more accessible.
Ie feel of tyre absolutely does matter in those situations, I certainly noticed the Mary squarer profile on tarmac the MTB feels even more out of
its element than it did with Hans front and rear.
Roger Merriman
On 2/12/2025 2:39 PM, Roger Merriman wrote:
Frank Krygowski <frkrygow@gXXmail.com> wrote:Right. Criteria vary. But once one's criteria are specified, a well constructed test can yield data that's far more reliable than one's seat-of-the-pants impressions.
On 2/11/2025 9:28 PM, AMuzi wrote:That’s a roadie perspective, my MTB tyres are slow rolling, on roads be
On 2/11/2025 8:11 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 2/9/2025 5:32 PM, AMuzi wrote:
On 2/9/2025 3:54 PM, cyclintom wrote:
On Sat Feb 8 22:29:16 2025 Roger Merriman wrote:
That Dylan Johnson has been doing some limited testing to find the >>>>>>>> fastest
Gravel tyres, which is larger than most folks would think.
though does as he notes depend on you and your riding, my Gravel >>>>>>>> riding is
often mixed use, and I like it?s adaptability, which would be
compromised
with much larger tyres ie be more draggy on the tarmac.
Though if you?re just riding on the trails then a 2.1/50mm tyre is >>>>>>>> almost
certainly a better choice, I personally like being able to ride >>>>>>>> tarmac/mud/roots etc which the all road/Gravel bike I have does >>>>>>>> fine, it
gives a bit to mates with newer bikes with wider clearances but it?s >>>>>>>> certainly not enough to tempt me to a new bike!
And if it?s really narly can just use the MTB which just flattens >>>>>>>> stuff!
<https://youtu.be/iq9ydwkRt0Q?si=eX_6lRdPWtLwjh4k>
On my gravel bike I had 38 mm tires. Going fatter would have gained >>>>>>> nothing unless the terrain changed from gravel to wild MTB.
As noted, we all have our political preferences and our own analyses >>>>>> of agreed facts. Such is life.
I'll note, as usual, that some things actually are measurable.
For whatever criteria you deem significant.
Of course. For tires, it's commonly (but not always) rolling resistance
in the real world on a specific type of surface. Traction might be another. >>>
that tarmac or even fire roads they are pigs to pedal each one is 1KG plus, >> have soft tacky compounds and so on, but once in the terrain they are
designed for they shine, Magic Mary (Front) is total grip monster,
particularly in wet loamy conditions. Hans Dampf is bit quicker rolling and >> more middle of the road in terms of wet or hard pack terrain, hence it’s a >> common pairing with the Mary up front.
Sometimes it can be tricky to specify the criteria or design the tests,Certainly with MTB tyres can be feel or predictability, the Maxxis Minion
but some things are certainly measurable. And I tend to trust measured
data more than mere opinions.
DHF has a gap between the shoulders and the main tread the grip levels are >> huge, but you have to commit ie bank the bike on to the shoulders and trust >> that it will grip, it’s one of the reasons for their newer DH/Burly trail >> tyre the Assegai which has like most tyres transition nobs and the DHF
doesn’t though it’s absolute grip is very high no evidence that the Assegai
has greater grip but it’s much more accessible.
Ie feel of tyre absolutely does matter in those situations, I certainly
noticed the Mary squarer profile on tarmac the MTB feels even more out of
its element than it did with Hans front and rear.
Frank Krygowski <frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 2/12/2025 2:39 PM, Roger Merriman wrote:
Frank Krygowski <frkrygow@gXXmail.com> wrote:Right. Criteria vary. But once one's criteria are specified, a well
On 2/11/2025 9:28 PM, AMuzi wrote:That’s a roadie perspective, my MTB tyres are slow rolling, on roads be >>> that tarmac or even fire roads they are pigs to pedal each one is 1KG plus, >>> have soft tacky compounds and so on, but once in the terrain they are
On 2/11/2025 8:11 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 2/9/2025 5:32 PM, AMuzi wrote:
On 2/9/2025 3:54 PM, cyclintom wrote:
On Sat Feb 8 22:29:16 2025 Roger Merriman wrote:
That Dylan Johnson has been doing some limited testing to find the >>>>>>>>> fastest
Gravel tyres, which is larger than most folks would think.
though does as he notes depend on you and your riding, my Gravel >>>>>>>>> riding is
often mixed use, and I like it?s adaptability, which would be >>>>>>>>> compromised
with much larger tyres ie be more draggy on the tarmac.
Though if you?re just riding on the trails then a 2.1/50mm tyre is >>>>>>>>> almost
certainly a better choice, I personally like being able to ride >>>>>>>>> tarmac/mud/roots etc which the all road/Gravel bike I have does >>>>>>>>> fine, it
gives a bit to mates with newer bikes with wider clearances but it?s >>>>>>>>> certainly not enough to tempt me to a new bike!
And if it?s really narly can just use the MTB which just flattens >>>>>>>>> stuff!
<https://youtu.be/iq9ydwkRt0Q?si=eX_6lRdPWtLwjh4k>
On my gravel bike I had 38 mm tires. Going fatter would have gained >>>>>>>> nothing unless the terrain changed from gravel to wild MTB.
As noted, we all have our political preferences and our own analyses >>>>>>> of agreed facts. Such is life.
I'll note, as usual, that some things actually are measurable.
For whatever criteria you deem significant.
Of course. For tires, it's commonly (but not always) rolling resistance >>>> in the real world on a specific type of surface. Traction might be another.
designed for they shine, Magic Mary (Front) is total grip monster,
particularly in wet loamy conditions. Hans Dampf is bit quicker rolling and >>> more middle of the road in terms of wet or hard pack terrain, hence it’s a
common pairing with the Mary up front.
Sometimes it can be tricky to specify the criteria or design the tests, >>>> but some things are certainly measurable. And I tend to trust measured >>>> data more than mere opinions.Certainly with MTB tyres can be feel or predictability, the Maxxis Minion >>> DHF has a gap between the shoulders and the main tread the grip levels are >>> huge, but you have to commit ie bank the bike on to the shoulders and trust >>> that it will grip, it’s one of the reasons for their newer DH/Burly trail >>> tyre the Assegai which has like most tyres transition nobs and the DHF
doesn’t though it’s absolute grip is very high no evidence that the Assegai
has greater grip but it’s much more accessible.
Ie feel of tyre absolutely does matter in those situations, I certainly
noticed the Mary squarer profile on tarmac the MTB feels even more out of >>> its element than it did with Hans front and rear.
constructed test can yield data that's far more reliable than one's
seat-of-the-pants impressions.
Grip test are notoriously difficult, you can test a bike times down a trail but it’s not wildly useful certainly for MTB tyres grip and feel so seat of your pants impressions do matter.
For road for most part tarmac is grippy and even tyres with poor grip will
be fine mostly unless it’s very wet and even then unlikely to be catastrophic more feel though yes can be measured to a degree with tests certainly more so than off road.
That’s why tyres tend to be tested might have weights stated and any features but the rest is feel etc, also why you can tell if a review is simply reproducing marketing guff.
But you don’t get grip testing figures, though bicycle rolling resistance does have some which I’d suggest are highly suspect!
Roger Merriman
On Sun Feb 9 16:32:11 2025 AMuzi wrote:
As noted, we all have our political preferences and our own
analyses of agreed facts. Such is life.
That said, Mr Shadow is spending the day, again, amid cute
Brasilian girls and you're not.
It is my belief that shadow is really illegaly in the US. The present Brazilian government does not like communists. His posting times seem to match yours.
On 2/14/2025 1:08 PM, Roger Merriman wrote:
Frank Krygowski <frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 2/12/2025 2:39 PM, Roger Merriman wrote:
Frank Krygowski <frkrygow@gXXmail.com> wrote:Right. Criteria vary. But once one's criteria are specified, a well
On 2/11/2025 9:28 PM, AMuzi wrote:That’s a roadie perspective, my MTB tyres are slow rolling, on roads be >>>> that tarmac or even fire roads they are pigs to pedal each one is 1KG plus,
On 2/11/2025 8:11 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 2/9/2025 5:32 PM, AMuzi wrote:
On 2/9/2025 3:54 PM, cyclintom wrote:
On Sat Feb 8 22:29:16 2025 Roger Merriman wrote:
That Dylan Johnson has been doing some limited testing to find the >>>>>>>>>> fastest
Gravel tyres, which is larger than most folks would think. >>>>>>>>>>
though does as he notes depend on you and your riding, my Gravel >>>>>>>>>> riding is
often mixed use, and I like it?s adaptability, which would be >>>>>>>>>> compromised
with much larger tyres ie be more draggy on the tarmac.
Though if you?re just riding on the trails then a 2.1/50mm tyre is >>>>>>>>>> almost
certainly a better choice, I personally like being able to ride >>>>>>>>>> tarmac/mud/roots etc which the all road/Gravel bike I have does >>>>>>>>>> fine, it
gives a bit to mates with newer bikes with wider clearances but it?s >>>>>>>>>> certainly not enough to tempt me to a new bike!
And if it?s really narly can just use the MTB which just flattens >>>>>>>>>> stuff!
<https://youtu.be/iq9ydwkRt0Q?si=eX_6lRdPWtLwjh4k>
On my gravel bike I had 38 mm tires. Going fatter would have gained >>>>>>>>> nothing unless the terrain changed from gravel to wild MTB.
As noted, we all have our political preferences and our own analyses >>>>>>>> of agreed facts. Such is life.
I'll note, as usual, that some things actually are measurable.
For whatever criteria you deem significant.
Of course. For tires, it's commonly (but not always) rolling resistance >>>>> in the real world on a specific type of surface. Traction might be another.
have soft tacky compounds and so on, but once in the terrain they are
designed for they shine, Magic Mary (Front) is total grip monster,
particularly in wet loamy conditions. Hans Dampf is bit quicker rolling and
more middle of the road in terms of wet or hard pack terrain, hence it’s a >>>> common pairing with the Mary up front.
Sometimes it can be tricky to specify the criteria or design the tests, >>>>> but some things are certainly measurable. And I tend to trust measured >>>>> data more than mere opinions.Certainly with MTB tyres can be feel or predictability, the Maxxis Minion >>>> DHF has a gap between the shoulders and the main tread the grip levels are >>>> huge, but you have to commit ie bank the bike on to the shoulders and trust
that it will grip, it’s one of the reasons for their newer DH/Burly trail >>>> tyre the Assegai which has like most tyres transition nobs and the DHF >>>> doesn’t though it’s absolute grip is very high no evidence that the Assegai
has greater grip but it’s much more accessible.
Ie feel of tyre absolutely does matter in those situations, I certainly >>>> noticed the Mary squarer profile on tarmac the MTB feels even more out of >>>> its element than it did with Hans front and rear.
constructed test can yield data that's far more reliable than one's
seat-of-the-pants impressions.
Grip test are notoriously difficult, you can test a bike times down a trail >> but it’s not wildly useful certainly for MTB tyres grip and feel so seat of >> your pants impressions do matter.
For road for most part tarmac is grippy and even tyres with poor grip will >> be fine mostly unless it’s very wet and even then unlikely to be
catastrophic more feel though yes can be measured to a degree with tests
certainly more so than off road.
That’s why tyres tend to be tested might have weights stated and any
features but the rest is feel etc, also why you can tell if a review is
simply reproducing marketing guff.
But you don’t get grip testing figures, though bicycle rolling resistance
does have some which I’d suggest are highly suspect!
Roger Merriman
+1
On 2/14/2025 2:08 PM, Roger Merriman wrote:
I don't doubt that tests for off-road grip would be difficult. But I doGrip test are notoriously difficult, you can test a bike times down a trail >> but it’s not wildly useful certainly for MTB tyres grip and feel so seat of >> your pants impressions do matter.
doubt that "feel" is really reliable in many cases.
Of course, the unreliability of "feel" has been discussed at length here
for many, many years.
On 2/14/2025 2:08 PM, Roger Merriman wrote:
I don't doubt that tests for off-road grip would be difficult. But I doGrip test are notoriously difficult, you can test a bike times down a trail >> but it’s not wildly useful certainly for MTB tyres grip and feel so seat of
your pants impressions do matter.
doubt that "feel" is really reliable in many cases.
Of course, the unreliability of "feel" has been discussed at length here
for many, many years.
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