Everyone excited already about the Club World Cup? With 32 teams, this
one can't be classified as a one-off Mickey Mouse exhibition game. Plus,
FIFA is putting lots of $$$ at stake, so teams have an incentive to take
it seriously.

In case you need any help to build up your excitement, there is always
the SophCon. Fill in your entries at this link:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1CTJE5YQArkvhQuPKHmon-7NfyQUUxr-HAA4aHZF9zQc/edit?usp=sharing

TransferMarkt based prediction coming soon.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

Futbolmetrix wrote:

Everyone excited already about the Club World Cup? With 32
teams, this one can't be classified as a one-off Mickey Mouse
exhibition game.

I am quite happy to go along with anybody who says it's a
multi-game Mickey Mouse tournament.

Plus, FIFA is putting lots of $$$ at stake,
so teams have an incentive to take it seriously.

The club owners will take the money from it seriously but I
wouldn't be expecting the cut-and-thrust of normal season games
from all of the players... players that should be on holiday.

In case you need any help to build up your excitement,

I'm so excited I could rip a tissue...

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On 2025-06-12 03:25, Futbolmetrix wrote:

Everyone excited already about the Club World Cup? With 32 teams, this
one can't be classified as a one-off Mickey Mouse exhibition game. Plus,
FIFA is putting lots of $$$ at stake, so teams have an incentive to take
it seriously.

Mixed feelings here. Normally I can't resist the pull of an SPC, but I hesitate to legitimize this travesty of a contest by dignifying it with
an entry.

As you say, at least the big UEFA powers will have to win more than a
game or two to carry off the trophy. The champions of England, Spain,
and Italy are not involved, though. Come to think of it, nor are the
champions of Portugal and the Netherlands, and the second best teams in England, Germany, the Netherlands and France.

In case you need any help to build up your excitement, there is always
the SophCon. Fill in your entries at this link:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1CTJE5YQArkvhQuPKHmon-7NfyQUUxr- HAA4aHZF9zQc/edit?usp=sharing

TransferMarkt based prediction coming soon.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

MH wrote:

On 2025-06-12 03:25, Futbolmetrix wrote:

Everyone excited already about the Club World Cup? With 32
teams, this one can't be classified as a one-off Mickey
Mouse exhibition game. Plus, FIFA is putting lots of $$$ at
stake, so teams have an incentive to take it seriously.

Mixed feelings here. Normally I can't resist the pull of an
SPC, but I hesitate to legitimize this travesty of a contest
by dignifying it with an entry.

As you say, at least the big UEFA powers will have to win more
than a game or two to carry off the trophy. The champions of
England, Spain, and Italy are not involved, though. Come to
think of it, nor are the champions of Portugal and the
Netherlands, and the second best teams in England, Germany,
the Netherlands and France.

But the UEFA Conference League Champions are in it... and Lionel
Messi. I reckon two major attractions like that should be enough
to put some bums on seats.

:-)

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On Thu, 12 Jun 2025 13:58:26 +0000, MH wrote:

On 2025-06-12 03:25, Futbolmetrix wrote:

Mixed feelings here. Normally I can't resist the pull of an SPC, but I hesitate to legitimize this travesty of a contest by dignifying it with
an entry.

I pretty strongly disagree with your harsh characterization of this
tournament, but then again I always rated the
Intercontinental/Toyota/old CWC more than you did, despite its one-off
nature.

In the end, a lot of the opposition to the CWC is due football fans'
strong resistance to any type of innovation, and a fair dose of
Euro-snobbery (fairly justified given the last 15 years of the CWC, but still...)

As you say, at least the big UEFA powers will have to win more than a
game or two to carry off the trophy. The champions of England, Spain,
and Italy are not involved, though. Come to think of it, nor are the champions of Portugal and the Netherlands, and the second best teams in England, Germany, the Netherlands and France.

The nature of the tournament makes it almost impossible to include the
most recent national champions. It's maybe a bit more backward-looking
than one would have liked, but then again, if Barcelona or Liverpool
didn't make it, they only have themselves to blame for not doing as well
as they should have in European competitions in recent years (on the
other hand, one could argue that the ranking is more than a bit
iffy...no idea how Barca and Liverpool ended up below Juve or Salzburg).

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On 2025-06-12 10:31, Futbolmetrix wrote:

On Thu, 12 Jun 2025 13:58:26 +0000, MH wrote:

On 2025-06-12 03:25, Futbolmetrix wrote:

Mixed feelings here.  Normally I can't resist the pull of an SPC, but I
hesitate to legitimize this travesty of a contest by dignifying it with
an entry.

I pretty strongly disagree with your harsh characterization of this tournament, but then again I always rated the
Intercontinental/Toyota/old CWC more than you did, despite its one-off nature.

In the end, a lot of the opposition to the CWC is due football fans'
strong resistance  to any type of innovation, and a fair dose of Euro-snobbery (fairly justified given the last 15 years of the CWC, but still...)

As you say, at least the big UEFA powers will have to win more than a
game or two to carry off the trophy.  The champions of England, Spain,
and Italy are not involved, though. Come to think of it, nor are the
champions of Portugal and the Netherlands, and the second best teams in
England, Germany, the Netherlands and France.

The nature of the tournament makes it almost impossible to include the
most recent national champions.

The most recent ones would be hard, sure.

It's maybe a bit more backward-looking

than one would have liked, but then again, if Barcelona or Liverpool
didn't make it, they only have themselves to blame for not doing as well
as they should have in European competitions in recent years (on the
other hand, one could argue that the ranking is more than a bit
iffy...no idea how Barca and Liverpool ended up below Juve or Salzburg).

They didn't. They are victims of an arbitrary 2 team limit per country,
as I understand it. Liverpool rank higher in the 4 year ranking than
Porto and Atletico Madrid, and both Liverpool and Barca rank higher than
all of Juve, Benfica and Salzburg.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

Futbolmetrix wrote:

On Thu, 12 Jun 2025 13:58:26 +0000, MH wrote:

On 2025-06-12 03:25, Futbolmetrix wrote:

Mixed feelings here. Normally I can't resist the pull of an
SPC, but I hesitate to legitimize this travesty of a contest
by dignifying it with an entry.

I pretty strongly disagree with your harsh characterization
of this tournament, but then again I always rated the Intercontinental/Toyota/old CWC more than you did, despite
its one-off nature.

It's a cash-grabbing vanity tournament to massage the ego of
Gianni Infantile.

In the end, a lot of the opposition to the CWC is due football
fans' strong resistance to any type of innovation, and a fair
dose of Euro-snobbery (fairly justified given the last 15
years of the CWC, but still...)

Or the fact it's the summer and European players have had a
long domestic season, followed by International games
(WCQ/Nations League) and then a few days later some of them
have to play in the CWC... all in the name of $$$.

Football has been destroyed by corporate greed and FIFA...
The CWC was fine as a six/seven team tournament, but Uncle
Gianni wants more games... for every tournament possible. So the
game has prostituted itself to the highest bidder.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

MH wrote:

On 2025-06-12 10:31, Futbolmetrix wrote:

On Thu, 12 Jun 2025 13:58:26 +0000, MH wrote:

On 2025-06-12 03:25, Futbolmetrix wrote:

Mixed feelings here.  Normally I can't resist the pull of
an SPC, but I hesitate to legitimize this travesty of a
contest by dignifying it with an entry.

I pretty strongly disagree with your harsh characterization
of this tournament, but then again I always rated the Intercontinental/Toyota/old CWC more than you did, despite
its one-off nature.

In the end, a lot of the opposition to the CWC is due
football fans' strong resistance  to any type of innovation,
and a fair dose of Euro-snobbery (fairly justified given the
last 15 years of the CWC, but still...)

As you say, at least the big UEFA powers will have to win
more than a game or two to carry off the trophy. The
champions of England, Spain, and Italy are not involved,
though. Come to think of it, nor are the champions of
Portugal and the Netherlands, and the second best teams in
England, Germany, the Netherlands and France.

The nature of the tournament makes it almost impossible to
include the most recent national champions.

The most recent ones would be hard, sure.

It's maybe a bit more backward-looking than one
would have liked, but then again, if Barcelona or
Liverpool didn't make it, they only have themselves to blame
for not doing as well as they should have in European
competitions in recent years (on the other hand, one could
argue that the ranking is more than a bit iffy...no idea how
Barca and Liverpool ended up below Juve or Salzburg).

They didn't. They are victims of an arbitrary 2 team limit
per country, as I understand it.

There are three teams from the USA though... FIFA generously
allowed them an extra team because the US are hosting the
tournament.

However, the last five winners of the UEFA Champions League are
included, so that's fair enough from that point of view.
(Chelsea, Manchester City, Real Madrid and Paris-St Germain)
Personally I'd have thrown in the Europa League winners as
opposed to using the ranking system for qualification, make it
a tournament of Champions.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On Thu, 12 Jun 2025 9:25:23 +0000, Futbolmetrix wrote:

Everyone excited already about the Club World Cup? With 32 teams, this
one can't be classified as a one-off Mickey Mouse exhibition game. Plus,
FIFA is putting lots of $$$ at stake, so teams have an incentive to take
it seriously.

In case you need any help to build up your excitement, there is always
the SophCon. Fill in your entries at this link:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1CTJE5YQArkvhQuPKHmon-7NfyQUUxr-HAA4aHZF9zQc/edit?usp=sharing

TransferMarkt based prediction coming soon.

Entries so far:

Agnostic
Futbolmetrix
TransferMarkt

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On 2025-06-12 03:25, Futbolmetrix wrote:

Everyone excited already about the Club World Cup? With 32 teams, this
one can't be classified as a one-off Mickey Mouse exhibition game. Plus,
FIFA is putting lots of $$$ at stake, so teams have an incentive to take
it seriously.

In case you need any help to build up your excitement, there is always
the SophCon. Fill in your entries at this link:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1CTJE5YQArkvhQuPKHmon-7NfyQUUxr- HAA4aHZF9zQc/edit?usp=sharing

TransferMarkt based prediction coming soon.

I have entered mine. I think it is OK. It saves automatically, no ?

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

Lléo wrote:

Let's also try some unsophisticated predictions too.

[Snip]

Semifinals

Bayern Munchen - Juventus
Chelsea - Real Madrid

No idea what to call on either of these. Let's make it a
Juventus vs Chelsea final so that we still have people in rss
interested in this tournament at this point :-)

If Chelsea FC reach the Final I will be shocked... really!!!

Real Madrid or PSG would be my bet to win the trophy, just
because they should be the strongest teams. But after a long
domestic/European season, who knows?

If Gianni Infantile has paid the refs, then Inter-Miami and
Lionel Messi will win it. A US team winning it would set up
next years FIFA World Cup nicely and maybe put even more bums
on seats for that!!!

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On Sat, 14 Jun 2025 2:44:47 +0000, Lléo wrote:

I have entered mine.  I think it is OK.  It saves automatically, no ?

I can see it there. Seems ok indeed.

Yes, looks good.

Entries so far:

Agnostic
Futbolmetrix
TransferMarkt
Lleo
Werner
Jesus
MH

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On Sat, 14 Jun 2025 2:09:35 +0000, Lléo wrote:

Let's also try some unsophisticated predictions too.

Sure, why not.

A - Palmeiras, Porto, Al-Ahly, Inter Miami.

Porto should top this group. Usually I'd call Palmeiras to finish
second, but I guess Messi will weave his magic and pull Inter Miami
through.

I think Palmeiras will be OK. I'll cave in to the Infantino/Messi conspiracizing, and say Palmeiras+Inter Miami

B - Paris Saint-Germain, Atletico de Madrid, Botafogo, Seattle Sounders

Ouch for Botafogo and Seattle Sounders! PSG 1st and Atletico 2nd.
Curiously, Seattle Sounders is one of two clubs who will play all three
first round games in the same stadium (and it's their home too!).

Atletico and PSG, in that order.

C - Bayern Munchen, Auckland City, Boca Juniors, Benfica

Bayern to top this group, and though I think Benfica is favored to
finish 2nd, I'll have Boca just edging them out.

Bayern and Benfica

D - Flamengo, Esperance de Tunis, Chelsea, Los Angeles FC

Chelsea should top this group, and I don't have much hopes on Esperance
(see what I did there?) or LA to edge out the hordes of evil for 2nd.

Flamengo 1st, Chelsea second.

E - River Plate, Urawa Red Diamonds, Monterrey, Internazionale

Inter 1st, River just getting past the other two for 2nd. Monterrey is
the other club that will play all three first round games in the same
stadium (the Rose Bowl, in their case).

Monterrey will be the team with what will look the most like a fanatical
home crowd. Inter is on its knees and with a new coach, but it will be
enough to scrape through.

Inter and Monterrey.

F - Fluminense, Borussia Dortmund, Ulsan HD, Mamelodi Sundowns

Borussia to finish 1st. I would love to see Mamelodi Sundowns (whose nicknames are "The Brazilians" and "Bafana ba Style" - the Stylish Guys) getting past this group, but I guess good things don't happen and
Fluminense will make it in their stead.

Mamelodi has apparently a lot of gold and diamond minerals money behind
them. Let's go for the upset. Dortmund and the Sundowns.

G - Manchester City, Wydad AC, Al Ain, Juventus

Not too hard a group to call I suppose. Both Europeans will want to top
this group in order to avoid Real Madrid, I imagine? For a more
interesting playoff crossover, let's go with Juve 1st, Man City 2nd.

City first, Juve second.

H - Real Madrid, Al-Hilal, Pachuca, RB Salzburg

Real 1st, no idea who finishes 2nd. For unsophisticated prediction
purposes, let's go with Rasen Ballsport.

Lots of Saudi money poured into this competition you say? OK, Real
Madrid and Al-Hilal.

Eightfinals:

So I have:

Palmeiras - PSG --> PSG
Bayern - Chelsea --> Bayern
Monterrey - Mamelodi --> Monterrey (!)
Manchester City - Al Hilal --> Manchester City

Atletico - Inter Miami --> Atletico
Flamengo - Benfica --> Benfica
Dortmund - Inter --> Dortmund
Real Madrid - Juventus --> Real Madrid

QFs:
PSG - Bayern --> Bayern
Monterrey - Manchester City --> City

Atletico - Benfica --> Atletico
Dortmund - Real Madrid --> Real


SF:
Bayern - Manchester City --> Manchester City
Atletico - Real Madrid --> Atletico (!)


So we have Guardiola against Simeone in the final, and the Colchoneros
to win it all!

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On Sat, 14 Jun 2025 12:05:49 +0000, Futbolmetrix wrote:

Yes, looks good.

Entries so far:

Agnostic
Futbolmetrix
TransferMarkt
Lleo
Werner
Jesus
MH

Add to that Collective Consciousness, and we have this year's
participants. Master spreadsheet and standings spreadsheet now included
on the Google sheet:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1CTJE5YQArkvhQuPKHmon-7NfyQUUxr-HAA4aHZF9zQc/edit?usp=sharing

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On Sat, 14 Jun 2025 12:22:51 +0000, Futbolmetrix wrote:

So we have Guardiola against Simeone in the final, and the Colchoneros
to win it all!

Atletico Madrid haters, I'll send you my bank details separately.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On Mon, 16 Jun 2025 15:01:31 +0000, Futbolmetrix wrote:

On Sat, 14 Jun 2025 12:05:49 +0000, Futbolmetrix wrote:

Yes, looks good.

Entries so far:

Agnostic
Futbolmetrix
TransferMarkt
Lleo
Werner
Jesus
MH

Add to that Collective Consciousness, and we have this year's
participants. Master spreadsheet and standings spreadsheet now included
on the Google sheet:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1CTJE5YQArkvhQuPKHmon-7NfyQUUxr-HAA4aHZF9zQc/edit?usp=sharing

Spreadsheet updated with a couple of late BOT entries: ClubElo
(developed by the original Club Elo) and Opta.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On Wed, 18 Jun 2025 11:47:11 +0000, Futbolmetrix wrote:

Spreadsheet updated with a couple of late BOT entries: ClubElo
(developed by the original Club Elo) and Opta.

Standings after the MD1 and the first two matches of MD2:

-13.221 ClubElo
-13.680 Jesus Petry
-13.736 Opta
-14.256 TransferMarkt
-14.395 Collective Consciousness
-16.377 Werner Pichler
-16.572 MH
-16.842 Futbolmetrix
-18.595 Lléo
-22.181 Agnostic

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On Thu, 19 Jun 2025 21:18:15 +0000, Futbolmetrix wrote:

-13.221 ClubElo
-13.680 Jesus Petry
-13.736 Opta
-14.256 TransferMarkt
-14.395 Collective Consciousness
-16.377 Werner Pichler
-16.572 MH
-16.842 Futbolmetrix
-18.595 Lléo
-22.181 Agnostic

Standings after MD2:

R1 Player
-10.683 MH
-11.447 Jesus Petry
-11.745 ClubElo
-12.639 Collective Consciousness
-13.020 TransferMarkt
-13.605 Werner Pichler
-14.040 Opta
-14.085 Futbolmetrix
-18.153 Lléo
-22.181 Agnostic

Mamelodi Sundowns losing their qualifying position to Dortmund/Flu puts
the humans back on top.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On Mon, 16 Jun 2025 14:57:57 +0000, Futbolmetrix wrote:

On Sat, 14 Jun 2025 12:22:51 +0000, Futbolmetrix wrote:

So we have Guardiola against Simeone in the final, and the Colchoneros
to win it all!

Atletico Madrid haters, I'll send you my bank details separately.

Maybe I really should start a business?

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On 6/23/2025 11:00 AM, Futbolmetrix wrote:

On Thu, 19 Jun 2025 21:18:15 +0000, Futbolmetrix wrote:

-13.221    ClubElo
-13.680    Jesus Petry
-13.736    Opta
-14.256    TransferMarkt
-14.395    Collective Consciousness
-16.377    Werner Pichler
-16.572    MH
-16.842    Futbolmetrix
-18.595    Lléo
-22.181    Agnostic

Standings after MD2:

R1    Player
-10.683    MH
-11.447    Jesus Petry
-11.745    ClubElo
-12.639    Collective Consciousness
-13.020    TransferMarkt
-13.605    Werner Pichler
-14.040    Opta
-14.085    Futbolmetrix
-18.153    Lléo
-22.181    Agnostic

Standings at the end of the group stage:

-10.679 MH
-12.412 ClubElo
-12.427 TransferMarkt
-13.266 Collective Consciousness
-13.956 Opta
-14.163 Futbolmetrix
-14.892 Jesus Petry
-15.322 Werner Pichler
-18.595 Lléo
-22.181 Agnostic

Despite his semi-boycott, MH rules the roost.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On 6/27/2025 7:57 AM, Futbolmetrix wrote:

On 6/23/2025 11:00 AM, Futbolmetrix wrote:

On Thu, 19 Jun 2025 21:18:15 +0000, Futbolmetrix wrote:

-13.221    ClubElo
-13.680    Jesus Petry
-13.736    Opta
-14.256    TransferMarkt
-14.395    Collective Consciousness
-16.377    Werner Pichler
-16.572    MH
-16.842    Futbolmetrix
-18.595    Lléo
-22.181    Agnostic

Standings after MD2:

R1    Player
-10.683    MH
-11.447    Jesus Petry
-11.745    ClubElo
-12.639    Collective Consciousness
-13.020    TransferMarkt
-13.605    Werner Pichler
-14.040    Opta
-14.085    Futbolmetrix
-18.153    Lléo
-22.181    Agnostic

Standings at the end of the group stage:

-10.679    MH
-12.412    ClubElo
-12.427    TransferMarkt
-13.266    Collective Consciousness
-13.956    Opta
-14.163    Futbolmetrix
-14.892    Jesus Petry
-15.322    Werner Pichler
-18.595    Lléo
-22.181    Agnostic

Despite his semi-boycott, MH rules the roost.

MH also seem poised to capture top spot if the favorites (ManCity, Real
Madrid, PSG and Chelsea) get to the semifinals.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On 2025-06-27 06:02, Futbolmetrix wrote:

On 6/27/2025 7:57 AM, Futbolmetrix wrote:

On 6/23/2025 11:00 AM, Futbolmetrix wrote:

On Thu, 19 Jun 2025 21:18:15 +0000, Futbolmetrix wrote:

-13.221    ClubElo
-13.680    Jesus Petry
-13.736    Opta
-14.256    TransferMarkt
-14.395    Collective Consciousness
-16.377    Werner Pichler
-16.572    MH
-16.842    Futbolmetrix
-18.595    Lléo
-22.181    Agnostic

Standings after MD2:

R1    Player
-10.683    MH
-11.447    Jesus Petry
-11.745    ClubElo
-12.639    Collective Consciousness
-13.020    TransferMarkt
-13.605    Werner Pichler
-14.040    Opta
-14.085    Futbolmetrix
-18.153    Lléo
-22.181    Agnostic

Standings at the end of the group stage:

-10.679    MH
-12.412    ClubElo
-12.427    TransferMarkt
-13.266    Collective Consciousness
-13.956    Opta
-14.163    Futbolmetrix
-14.892    Jesus Petry
-15.322    Werner Pichler
-18.595    Lléo
-22.181    Agnostic

Despite his semi-boycott, MH rules the roost.

MH also seem poised to capture top spot if the favorites (ManCity, Real Madrid, PSG and Chelsea) get to the semifinals.

Very surprised as I overestimated Pachuca, and underestimated Inter
Miami and Al Hilal, I think.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On Wed, 18 Jun 2025 11:47:11 +0000, Futbolmetrix wrote:

On Mon, 16 Jun 2025 15:01:31 +0000, Futbolmetrix wrote:

On Sat, 14 Jun 2025 12:05:49 +0000, Futbolmetrix wrote:

Yes, looks good.

Entries so far:

Agnostic
Futbolmetrix
TransferMarkt
Lleo
Werner
Jesus
MH

Add to that Collective Consciousness, and we have this year's
participants. Master spreadsheet and standings spreadsheet now included
on the Google sheet:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1CTJE5YQArkvhQuPKHmon-7NfyQUUxr-HAA4aHZF9zQc/edit?usp=sharing

Spreadsheet updated with a couple of late BOT entries: ClubElo
(developed by the original Club Elo) and Opta.

They should be disqualified because they missed the deadline.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On Fri, 27 Jun 2025 15:39:45 +0000, MH wrote:

Very surprised as I overestimated Pachuca, and underestimated Inter
Miami and Al Hilal, I think.

Inter Miami was indeed the team that penalized you the most (-0.232
relative to Collective Consciousness). You were also slightly below par
on Pachuca and Al Hilal, but not by much.

On the other hand, you won big on Botafogo (+0.787) and Atletico Madrid (+0.490), and to a slightly lesser extent on Fluminense (+0.374) and
Porto (+0.341)

--

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On Fri, 27 Jun 2025 11:57:43 +0000, Futbolmetrix wrote:

On 6/23/2025 11:00 AM, Futbolmetrix wrote:

On Thu, 19 Jun 2025 21:18:15 +0000, Futbolmetrix wrote:

-13.221    ClubElo
-13.680    Jesus Petry
-13.736    Opta
-14.256    TransferMarkt
-14.395    Collective Consciousness
-16.377    Werner Pichler
-16.572    MH
-16.842    Futbolmetrix
-18.595    Lléo
-22.181    Agnostic

Standings after MD2:

R1    Player
-10.683    MH
-11.447    Jesus Petry
-11.745    ClubElo
-12.639    Collective Consciousness
-13.020    TransferMarkt
-13.605    Werner Pichler
-14.040    Opta
-14.085    Futbolmetrix
-18.153    Lléo
-22.181    Agnostic

Standings at the end of the group stage:

-10.679 MH
-12.412 ClubElo
-12.427 TransferMarkt
-13.266 Collective Consciousness
-13.956 Opta
-14.163 Futbolmetrix
-14.892 Jesus Petry
-15.322 Werner Pichler
-18.595 Lléo
-22.181 Agnostic

Standings after the R16:

-23.871 TransferMarkt
-24.171 ClubElo
-24.270 Futbolmetrix
-24.339 Collective Consciousness
-25.981 Opta
-26.311 Jesus Petry
-26.666 MH
-27.985 Werner Pichler
-29.240 Lléo
-33.271 Agnostic

ManCity's shock exit at the hands of Al-Hilal changes the picture
completely. MH slides down to 7th place, while the BOTs take the lead.

--

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On Wed, 2 Jul 2025 15:23:57 +0000, Futbolmetrix wrote:

Standings after the R16:

-23.871 TransferMarkt
-24.171 ClubElo
-24.270 Futbolmetrix
-24.339 Collective Consciousness
-25.981 Opta
-26.311 Jesus Petry
-26.666 MH
-27.985 Werner Pichler
-29.240 Lléo
-33.271 Agnostic

ManCity's shock exit at the hands of Al-Hilal changes the picture
completely. MH slides down to 7th place, while the BOTs take the lead.

-29.231 TransferMarkt
-29.384 Collective Consciousness
-29.463 ClubElo
-29.842 Futbolmetrix
-31.454 Opta
-31.880 Jesus Petry
-32.361 MH
-33.178 Werner Pichler
-34.206 Lléo
-38.816 Agnostic


QFs went more or less as expected. No major changes in the standings,
other than Collective Consciousness jumping over ClubElo and
Futbolmetrix in second place.

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On Sun, 6 Jul 2025 12:07:46 +0000, Futbolmetrix wrote:

QFs went more or less as expected. No major changes in the standings,
other than Collective Consciousness jumping over ClubElo and
Futbolmetrix in second place.

If I'm reading things correctly, TransferMarkt(by Futbolmetrix *) wins
if any of the UEFA teams come out on top, Collective Consciousness if Fluminense are the champs.

Come on you UEFA!


(*) Contrary to previous SophCons, this edition's ClubElo prediction is
Lars's (the ClubElo guy) actual prediction, and not my adaptation based
on his rankings. So I take some pride if my TransferMarkt-based
prediction edges him out.

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Futbolmetrix wrote:

On Sun, 6 Jul 2025 12:07:46 +0000, Futbolmetrix wrote:

QFs went more or less as expected. No major changes in the
standings, other than Collective Consciousness jumping over
ClubElo and Futbolmetrix in second place.

If I'm reading things correctly, TransferMarkt(by Futbolmetrix
*) wins if any of the UEFA teams come out on top, Collective
Consciousness if Fluminense are the champs.

Come on you UEFA!

Well, as the CWC Final will be between the 2021 UEFA Champions
League Winners and the 2022/2024 UEFA Champions League winners
or the 2025 UEFA Champions League Winners... it looks like
TransferMarket wins.

Plus, if it turns out to be a PSG - Chelsea final, then it will
be the UEFA Champions League winners v the UEFA Conference
League winners. So, a FIFA version of the Super Cup!

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On Wed, 9 Jul 2025 9:42:42 +0000, Blueshirt wrote:

Plus, if it turns out to be a PSG - Chelsea final, then it will
be the UEFA Champions League winners v the UEFA Conference
League winners. So, a FIFA version of the Super Cup!

If Chelsea win it, I hope you'll put "Chelsea, World Champions 2025" in
your sig.

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On 2025-07-09 09:56, Futbolmetrix wrote:

On Wed, 9 Jul 2025 9:42:42 +0000, Blueshirt wrote:

Plus, if it turns out to be a PSG - Chelsea final, then it will
be the UEFA Champions League winners v the UEFA Conference
League winners.  So, a FIFA version of the Super Cup!

If Chelsea win it, I hope you'll put "Chelsea, World Champions 2025" in
your sig.

Please don't !!
Unless you qualify it somehow, like, "2025 champions of an
intercontinental tournament FIFA things is important, but which is
really just another meaningless money-spinning friendly" ;-)

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On 7/9/2025 2:32 PM, MH wrote:

On 2025-07-09 09:56, Futbolmetrix wrote:

Please don't !!
Unless you qualify it somehow, like, "2025 champions of an
intercontinental tournament FIFA things is important, but which is
really just another meaningless money-spinning friendly"   ;-)

One can't argue with the money-spinning part, but was this tournament
really a meaningless friendly? It was certainly nowhere close to
meaningless for the South American teams and fans. And I would argue
that it wasn't that meaningless for other teams either, judging by the
number of yellow and red cards, as well as the reactions of players and
staff at the final whistle.

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Futbolmetrix wrote:

On Wed, 9 Jul 2025 9:42:42 +0000, Blueshirt wrote:

Plus, if it turns out to be a PSG - Chelsea final, then it
will be the UEFA Champions League winners v the UEFA
Conference League winners. So, a FIFA version of the Super
Cup!

If Chelsea win it, I hope you'll put "Chelsea, World Champions
2025" in your sig.

1) I think it's highly unlikely Chelsea will beat PSG.

2) I really don't consider the CWC to be THAT important in the
big scheme of things. (I do think this upgraded version to be an
improvement on its previous incarnations though.)

After saying that, IF Chelsea FC did win the CWC on Sunday then
I would be nominating Chelsea FC for our infamous all-time best
club side list when somebody organises a vote... as being the
"World Champions" twice in just over three years would have to
mean something. A gold badge on your jersey is one thing, but to
make the RSS All-time club list, well... that would just be
something for them to be really proud about...

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MH wrote:

On 2025-07-09 09:56, Futbolmetrix wrote:

On Wed, 9 Jul 2025 9:42:42 +0000, Blueshirt wrote:

Plus, if it turns out to be a PSG - Chelsea final, then it
will be the UEFA Champions League winners v the UEFA
Conference League winners.  So, a FIFA version of the
Super Cup!

If Chelsea win it, I hope you'll put "Chelsea, World
Champions 2025" in your sig.

Please don't !!
Unless you qualify it somehow, like, "2025 champions of an
intercontinental tournament FIFA things is important, but
which is really just another meaningless money-spinning
friendly" ;-)

Well... in all-fairness, I didn't go overboard in 2022 when they
beat Palmeiras in the UAE to become "World Champions" and I have
referred to this CWC as the FIFA Club World Casino... so that
should give you a fair idea of what I think of this type of
tournament.

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Futbolmetrix wrote:

On 7/9/2025 2:32 PM, MH wrote:

Please don't !!
Unless you qualify it somehow, like, "2025 champions of an
intercontinental tournament FIFA things is important, but
which is really just another meaningless money-spinning
friendly"   ;-)

One can't argue with the money-spinning part, but was this
tournament really a meaningless friendly? It was certainly
nowhere close to meaningless for the South American teams and
fans. And I would argue that it wasn't that meaningless for
other teams either, judging by the number of yellow and red
cards, as well as the reactions of players and staff at the
final whistle.

On reflection I wouldn't say meaningless friendly either. Even
though I have sarcastically called it an exhibition tour, it's
quite clear the teams have taken it very seriously on the
pitch... even if the European teams would have preferred to have
been on holiday during what is normally their off-season. I
doubt many fans flew from London to the USA for Chelsea's
matches, but the fans over there seemed to enjoy the games...
the South American ones especially. So if the paying supporters
that go to the games are happy, then fair enough.

Chelsea certainly gave it their best shot anyway... they looked
a bit out of sorts early on in the group stage, and tired and
leggy in the second half of that match where they were down to
ten men, but on the whole they have played to a decent level. A
level that has seen them through to the final after a long
domestic/European season. (Sunday's CWC Final will be their 64th
game of the season.) So they have taken it seriously and for
them it has paid off.

Generally I believe the way this expanded tournament has been
forced into the football calendar by FIFA and the lengths Gianni
Infantino went to get Lionel Messi involved (and tried to get
Ronaldo involved too) have contributed to some of the negative
press... The image that this tournament is more about Infantino
and his ego, and a money-making racket for FIFA, is a hard one
to shake off but if the players are happy to play in it then
everyone else will have to get used to it.

What the title actually means in the big scheme of things is
another matter. For me, I am used to the term "world champions"
being used to refer to an international team. It's not something
I use in general talk with other football fans in regards to
club sides. For the football fans of the future, that might
change...

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Futbolmetrix wrote:

On 7/9/2025 2:32 PM, MH wrote:

On 2025-07-09 09:56, Futbolmetrix wrote:

Please don't !!
Unless you qualify it somehow, like, "2025 champions of an
intercontinental tournament FIFA things is important, but which is
really just another meaningless money-spinning friendly"   ;-)

One can't argue with the money-spinning part, but was this tournament
really a meaningless friendly? It was certainly nowhere close to
meaningless for the South American teams and fans. And I would argue
that it wasn't that meaningless for other teams either, judging by
the number of yellow and red cards, as well as the reactions of
players and staff at the final whistle.

It seems to be about the money more than the football, yes. But not a meaningless friendly.

There's too many teams from Europe in the other World Cup, I don't know
whether that's anything to do with making money though. What's the
relevant difference between a World Cup with too many European teams in
it and a Club World Cup with too many European teams in it?

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Futbolmetrix wrote:

On Wed, 9 Jul 2025 9:42:42 +0000, Blueshirt wrote:

Plus, if it turns out to be a PSG - Chelsea final, then it
will be the UEFA Champions League winners v the UEFA
Conference League winners. So, a FIFA version of the Super
Cup!

If Chelsea win it, I hope you'll put "Chelsea, World Champions
2025" in your sig.

Would I do something juvenile like that!

--
$$$ - FIFA Casino Super Cup Winners 2025 - $$$

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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Blueshirt wrote:

Futbolmetrix wrote:

If Chelsea win it, I hope you'll put "Chelsea, World
Champions 2025" in your sig.

1) I think it's highly unlikely Chelsea will beat PSG.

Well, we can't be right all the time, can we?! ;-)

--
$$$ - FIFA Casino Super Cup Winners 2025 - $$$

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On 7/13/2025 5:10 PM, Blueshirt wrote:

Futbolmetrix wrote:

On Wed, 9 Jul 2025 9:42:42 +0000, Blueshirt wrote:

Plus, if it turns out to be a PSG - Chelsea final, then it
will be the UEFA Champions League winners v the UEFA
Conference League winners. So, a FIFA version of the Super
Cup!

If Chelsea win it, I hope you'll put "Chelsea, World Champions
2025" in your sig.

Would I do something juvenile like that!

:-)

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Futbolmetrix wrote:

Some meaningless friendly shenanigans at the end of the match.
Now the big question is whether Chelsea will have an open-bus
parade in West London.

They're going on holiday... They've just finished a 64 game
season and their first pre-season friendly (25/26) is just
under four weeks away... August 8th. (Bayer Leverkusen)

--
$$$ - FIFA Casino Super Cup Winners 2025 - $$$

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On 7/13/2025 5:16 PM, Futbolmetrix wrote:

Would I do something juvenile like that!

:-)

Some meaningless friendly shenanigans at the end of the match. Now the
big question is whether Chelsea will have an open-bus parade in West London.

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In article <xn0p89c5n4qjeqh005@post.eweka.nl>,
Blueshirt <blueshirt@indigo.news> wrote:

Blueshirt wrote:

Futbolmetrix wrote:

If Chelsea win it, I hope you'll put "Chelsea, World
Champions 2025" in your sig.

1) I think it's highly unlikely Chelsea will beat PSG.

Well, we can't be right all the time, can we?! ;-)

--
$$$ - FIFA Casino Super Cup Winners 2025 - $$$

Chelsea 3 PSG 0
--
Member - Liberal International This is doctor@nk.ca Ici doctor@nk.ca
Yahweh, King & country!Never Satan President Republic!Beware AntiChrist rising! Look at Psalms 14 and 53 on Atheism ;
All I want to hear from JEsus Christ is WEll done Good and Faithful servant

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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In article <xn0p89c2a4qek98003@post.eweka.nl>,
Blueshirt <blueshirt@indigo.news> wrote:

Futbolmetrix wrote:

On Wed, 9 Jul 2025 9:42:42 +0000, Blueshirt wrote:

Plus, if it turns out to be a PSG - Chelsea final, then it
will be the UEFA Champions League winners v the UEFA
Conference League winners. So, a FIFA version of the Super
Cup!

If Chelsea win it, I hope you'll put "Chelsea, World Champions
2025" in your sig.

Would I do something juvenile like that!

--
$$$ - FIFA Casino Super Cup Winners 2025 - $$$

Nice one!
--
Member - Liberal International This is doctor@nk.ca Ici doctor@nk.ca
Yahweh, King & country!Never Satan President Republic!Beware AntiChrist rising! Look at Psalms 14 and 53 on Atheism ;
All I want to hear from JEsus Christ is WEll done Good and Faithful servant

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On Sun, 6 Jul 2025 12:07:46 +0000, Futbolmetrix wrote:

On Wed, 2 Jul 2025 15:23:57 +0000, Futbolmetrix wrote:

Standings after the R16:

Final standings (Log scoring, i.e., official SophCon standings) -------------------------------
-33.134 TransferMarkt
-33.396 Collective Consciousness
-33.414 ClubElo
-34.314 Futbolmetrix
-35.120 Opta
-35.659 Jesus Petry
-36.088 MH
-37.411 Werner Pichler
-38.681 Lléo
-42.975 Agnostic


Final standings, Brier
----------------------
15.631 MH
16.235 TransferMarkt
16.523 Futbolmetrix
16.671 Collective Consciousness
16.727 ClubElo
17.257 Jesus Petry
17.475 Opta
18.112 Werner Pichler
19.563 Lléo
21.313 Agnostic

Final standings, Ranked Probability Scoring -------------------------------------------
13.149 MH
13.891 TransferMarkt
14.121 Collective Consciousness
14.174 ClubElo
14.483 Werner Pichler
14.625 Futbolmetrix
14.934 Opta
15.269 Jesus Petry
16.720 Lléo
20.344 Agnostic

--

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