• Re: OT Why do people make fun of trump?

    From Alan@21:1/5 to Mittens Romney on Wed Oct 2 11:51:26 2024
    XPost: can.politics, seattle.politics, or.politics

    On 2024-10-02 11:49, Mittens Romney wrote:
    micky wrote:
    Why do people make fun of trump for saying windmills cause cancer?

    Windmills really do cause cancer.

    This is generally true:

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3653647/
    An article that doesn't so much as mention cancer...

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Mittens Romney@21:1/5 to Alan on Wed Oct 2 12:55:55 2024
    XPost: can.politics, seattle.politics, or.politics

    Alan wrote:
    On 2024-10-02 11:49, Mittens Romney wrote:
    micky wrote:
    Why do people make fun of trump for saying windmills cause cancer?

    Windmills really do cause cancer.

    This is generally true:

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3653647/
    An article that doesn't so much as mention cancer...

    Great environmental stresses over a long period of time can lead to or exacerbate cancer.

    Many of us are hoping you soon succumb and will do whatever it takes to
    speed the process along for you, asshole.

    --
    ⛨ 🥐🥖🗼🤪

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From De-Trois-Leaning@21:1/5 to Alan on Wed Oct 2 12:56:53 2024
    XPost: can.politics, seattle.politics, or.politics

    Alan wrote:
    An article that doesn't so much as mention cancer...

    You ran from a lie you made.

    Let's talk now about your craven cowardly act of running away from this
    massive aquatic lie you repeatedly tendered on Trump:


    https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2019/dec/22/delta-smelt-fish-trump-california-aoe

    "Last fall, Trump signed a memorandum directing federal agencies to
    review and roll back environmental standards slowing down the flow of
    water to farms in the Central Valley. In February this year, the
    president nominated David Bernhardt to serve as his interior secretary.

    ...turning down the pumps isn’t quite as easy as shutting off a faucet.
    The multi-story state and federal pumping plants operate in tandem and
    are powerful enough to make rivers flow backward.

    If the delta smelt go, California may be able to pump some more."

    https://envirobites.org/2019/06/24/farmers-vs-fish-the-story-of-delta-smelt/

    "To move water around, over 1,400 dams and miles of aqueducts have been constructed. A tidal wetland-turned-agricultural land, the Sacramento –
    San Joaquin Delta is the center of California’s water distribution
    system. About half of California’s developed water moves through the
    delta via two pumping plants: Central Valley Project (CVP) and the State
    Water Project."

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Central_Valley_Project

    "The Central Valley Project (CVP) is a federal power and water
    management project in the U.S. state of California under the supervision
    of the United States Bureau of Reclamation (USBR). It was devised in
    1933 in order to provide irrigation and municipal water to much of
    California's Central Valley—by regulating and storing water in
    reservoirs in the northern half of the state (once considered water-rich
    but suffering water-scarce conditions more than half the year in most
    years), and transporting it to the water-poor San Joaquin Valley and its surroundings by means of a series of canals, aqueducts and pump plants,
    some shared with the California State Water Project (SWP). Many CVP
    water users are represented by the Central Valley Project Water Association.


    Two large reservoirs, Shasta Lake and Trinity Lake, are formed by a pair
    of dams in the mountains north of the Sacramento Valley. Water from
    Shasta Lake flows into the Sacramento River which flows to the
    Sacramento-San Joaquin Delta and water from Trinity Lake flows into the
    Trinity River which leads to the Pacific Ocean. Both lakes release water
    at controlled rates. There, before it can flow on to San Francisco Bay
    and the Pacific Ocean, some of the water is intercepted by a diversion
    channel and transported to the Delta-Mendota Canal, which conveys water southwards through the San Joaquin Valley, supplying water to San Luis Reservoir (a SWP-shared facility) and the San Joaquin River at Mendota
    Pool in the process, eventually reaching canals that irrigates farms in
    the valley. Friant Dam crosses the San Joaquin River upstream of Mendota
    Pool, diverting its water southwards into canals that travel into the
    Tulare Lake area of the San Joaquin Valley, as far south as the Kern
    River. Finally, New Melones Lake, a separate facility, stores water flow
    of a San Joaquin River tributary for use during dry periods. Other
    smaller, independent facilities exist to provide water to local
    irrigation districts"

    https://water.ca.gov/programs/state-water-project

    https://water.ca.gov/Programs/State-Water-Project/Operations-and-Maintenance


    Big old shutoff valve seen = check!

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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  • From Mittens Romney@21:1/5 to micky on Wed Oct 2 12:49:02 2024
    XPost: can.politics, seattle.politics, or.politics

    micky wrote:
    Why do people make fun of trump for saying windmills cause cancer?

    Windmills really do cause cancer.

    This is generally true:

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3653647/

    Canadian family physicians can expect to see increasing numbers of rural patients reporting adverse effects from exposure to industrial wind
    turbines (IWTs). People who live or work in close proximity to IWTs have experienced symptoms that include decreased quality of life, annoyance,
    stress, sleep disturbance, headache, anxiety, depression, and cognitive dysfunction. Some have also felt anger, grief, or a sense of injustice. Suggested causes of symptoms include a combination of wind turbine
    noise, infrasound, dirty electricity, ground current, and shadow
    flicker.1 Family physicians should be aware that patients reporting
    adverse effects from IWTs might experience symptoms that are intense and pervasive and might feel further victimized by a lack of caregiver understanding.

    Go to:
    Background
    There is increasing concern that energy generation from fossil fuels contributes to climate change and air pollution. In response to these
    concerns, governments around the world are encouraging the installation
    of renewable energy projects including IWTs. In Ontario, the Green
    Energy Act was designed, in part, to remove barriers to the installation
    of IWTs.2 Noise regulations can be a considerable barrier to IWT
    development, as they can have a substantial effect on wind turbine
    spacing, and therefore the cost of wind-generated electricity.3
    Industrial wind turbines are being placed in close proximity to family
    homes in order to have access to transmission infrastructure.4

    In Ontario and elsewhere,5 some individuals have reported experiencing
    adverse health effects resulting from living near IWTs. Reports of
    IWT-induced adverse health effects have been dismissed by some
    commentators including government authorities and other organizations. Physicians have been exposed to efforts to convince the public of the
    benefits of IWTs while minimizing the health risks. Those concerned
    about adverse effects of IWTs have been stereotyped as “NIMBYs” (not in
    my backyard).6,7

    Go to:
    Global reports of effects
    During the past few years there have been case reports of adverse
    effects. A 2006 Académie Nationale de Médecine working group report
    notes that noise is the most frequent complaint. The noise is described
    as piercing, preoccupying, and continually surprising, as it is
    irregular in intensity. The noise includes grating and incongruous
    sounds that distract the attention or disturb rest. The spontaneous
    recurrence of these noises disturbs the sleep, suddenly awakening the
    subject when the wind rises and preventing the subject from going back
    to sleep. Wind turbines have been blamed for other problems experienced
    by people living nearby. These are less precise and less well described,
    and consist of subjective (headaches, fatigue, temporary feelings of
    dizziness, nausea) and sometimes objective (vomiting, insomnia,
    palpitations) manifestations.8

    A 2009 literature review prepared by the Minnesota Department of Health9 summarized case reports by Harry (2007),10 Phipps et al (2007),11 the
    Large Wind Turbine Citizens Committee for the Town of Union (2008),12
    and Pierpont (2009).13 These case studies catalogued complaints of
    annoyance, reduced quality of life, and health effects associated with
    IWTs, such as sleeplessness and headaches.9

    In 2010, Nissenbaum et al used validated questionnaires in a controlled
    study of 2 Maine wind energy projects. They concluded that “the noise emissions of IWTs disturbed the sleep and caused daytime sleepiness and impaired mental health in residents living within 1.4 km of the two IWT installations studied.”14

    Reports of adverse health effects15 and reduced quality of life16 are
    also documented in IWT projects in Australia and New Zealand.

    A 2012 board of health resolution in Brown County in Wisconsin formally requested financial relocation assistance for “families that are
    suffering adverse health effects and undue hardships caused by the irresponsible placement of industrial wind turbines around their homes
    and property.”17

    An Ontario community-based self-reporting health survey, WindVOiCe,
    identified the most commonly reported IWT-induced symptoms as altered
    quality of life, sleep disturbance, excessive tiredness, headache,
    stress, and distress. Other reported effects include migraines, hearing problems, tinnitus, heart palpitations, anxiety, and depression.18 In
    addition, degraded living conditions and adverse socioeconomic effects
    have been reported. In some cases the effects were severe enough that individuals in Ontario abandoned their homes or reached financial
    agreements with wind energy developers.19

    After considering the evidence and testimony presented by 26 witnesses,
    a 2011 Ontario environmental review tribunal decision acknowledged IWTs
    can harm human health:

    This case has successfully shown that the debate should not be
    simplified to one about whether wind turbines can cause harm to humans.
    The evidence presented to the Tribunal demonstrates that they can, if facilities are placed too close to residents. The debate has now evolved
    to one of degree.20

    Go to:
    Indirect effects and annoyance
    When assessing the adverse effects of IWTs it is important to consider
    what constitutes human health. The World Health Organization (WHO)
    defines health as “a state of complete physical, mental and social
    well-being and not merely the absence of disease or infirmity.”21

    Despite being widely accepted, the WHO definition of health is
    frequently overlooked when assessing the health effects of IWTs.
    Literature reviews commenting on the health effects of IWTs have been
    produced with varying degrees of completeness, accuracy, and
    objectivity.22 Some of these commentators accept the plausibility of the reported IWT health effects and acknowledge that IWT noise and visual
    effects might cause annoyance, stress, or sleep disturbance, which can
    have other consequences. However, these IWT health effects are often
    discounted because “direct pathological effects” or a “direct causal link” have not been established. In 2010, the Ontario Chief Medical
    Officer of Health released The Potential Health Impact of Wind Turbines,
    which acknowledged that some people living near wind turbines report
    symptoms such as dizziness, headaches, and sleep disturbance but
    concluded “the scientific evidence available to date does not
    demonstrate a direct causal link between wind turbine noise and adverse
    health effects.”23 The lead author of the report,23 Dr Gloria Rachamin, acknowledged under oath that the literature review looked only at direct
    links to human health.24

    Focusing on “direct” causal links limits the discussion to a small slice
    of the potential health effects of IWTs. The 2011 environmental review
    tribunal decision found that serious harm to human health includes
    “indirect impacts (e.g., a person being exposed to noise and then
    exhibiting stress and developing other related symptoms).”20

    According to the night noise guidelines for Europe:

    Physiological experiments on humans have shown that noise of a moderate
    level acts via an indirect pathway and has health outcomes similar to
    those caused by high noise exposures on the direct pathway. The indirect pathway starts with noise-induced disturbances of activities such as communication or sleep.25

    Pierpont documented symptoms reported by individuals exposed to wind
    turbines, which include sleep disturbance, headache, tinnitus, ear
    pressure, dizziness, vertigo, nausea, visual blurring, tachycardia, irritability, problems with concentration and memory, and panic episodes associated with sensations of internal pulsation or quivering when awake
    or asleep.13 The American Wind Energy Association and the Canadian Wind
    Energy Association convened a panel literature review that determined
    these symptoms are the “well-known stress effects of exposure to noise,”
    or in other words, are “a subset of annoyance reactions.”26

    Noise-induced annoyance is acknowledged to be an adverse health
    effect.27–30 Chronic severe noise annoyance should be classified as a
    serious health risk.31 According to the WHO guidelines for community
    noise, “[t]he capacity of a noise to induce annoyance depends upon many
    of its physical characteristics, including its sound pressure level and spectral characteristics, as well as the variations of these properties
    over time.”32 Industrial wind turbine noise is perceived to be more
    annoying than transportation noise or industrial noise at comparable
    sound pressure levels.33 Industrial wind turbine amplitude modulation,34 audible low frequency noise,35 tonal noise, infrasound,36 and lack of
    nighttime abatement have been identified as plausible noise
    characteristics that could cause annoyance and other health effects.

    Go to:
    Health effects in Ontario expected
    Evidence-based health studies were not conducted to determine adequate
    setbacks and noise levels for the siting of IWTs before the
    implementation of the Ontario renewable energy policy. In addition,
    provision for vigilance monitoring was not made. It is now clear that
    the regulations are not adequate to protect the health of all exposed individuals.

    A 2010 report commissioned by the Ontario Ministry of the Environment concludes:

    The audible sound from wind turbines, at the levels experienced at
    typical receptor distances in Ontario, is nonetheless expected to result
    in a non-trivial percentage of persons being highly annoyed .…
    [R]esearch has shown that annoyance associated with sound from wind
    turbines can be expected to contribute to stress related health impacts
    in some persons.37

    Consequently, physicians will likely be presented with patients
    reporting health effects.

    Family physicians should be aware that patients reporting adverse
    effects from IWTs might experience symptoms that are intense and
    pervasive and that they might feel further victimized by a lack of
    care-giver understanding. Those adversely affected by IWTs might have
    already pursued other avenues to mitigate the health effects with little
    or no success. It will be important to identify the possibility of
    exposure to IWTs in patients presenting with appropriate clinical
    symptoms.38

    Go to:
    Conclusion
    Industrial wind turbines can harm human health if sited too close to
    residents. Harm can be avoided if IWTs are situated at an appropriate
    distance from humans. Owing to the lack of adequately protective siting guidelines, people exposed to IWTs can be expected to present to their
    family physicians in increasing numbers. The documented symptoms are
    usually stress disorder–type diseases acting via indirect pathways and
    can represent serious harm to human health. Family physicians are in a
    position to effectively recognize the ailments and provide an empathetic response. In addition, their contributions to clinical studies are
    urgently needed to clarify the relationship between IWT exposure and
    human health and to inform regulations that will protect physical,
    mental, and social well-being.
    --
    ⛨ 🥐🥖🗼🤪

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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  • From Dhu on Gate@21:1/5 to Mittens Romney on Wed Oct 2 22:51:31 2024
    XPost: can.politics, seattle.politics, or.politics

    On Wed, 2 Oct 2024 12:49:02 -0600, Mittens Romney wrote:

    There is increasing concern that energy generation from fossil fuels

    Hydrocarbons are the safest, densest (not counting radio-isotopes)
    energy transport mechanism we have: so far batteries *ain't* up
    to snuff either way.

    It's the "fossil" part that's a problem.

    Dhu

    --
    Je suis Canadien. Ce n'est pas Francais ou Anglais.
    C'est une esp`ece de sauvage: ne obliviscaris, vix ea nostra voco;-)
    Duncan Patton a Campbell

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Dhu on Gate@21:1/5 to Mittens Romney on Wed Oct 2 22:53:53 2024
    XPost: can.politics, seattle.politics, or.politics

    On Wed, 2 Oct 2024 12:55:55 -0600, Mittens Romney wrote:

    Alan wrote:
    On 2024-10-02 11:49, Mittens Romney wrote:
    micky wrote:
    Why do people make fun of trump for saying windmills cause cancer?

    Windmills really do cause cancer.

    This is generally true:

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3653647/
    An article that doesn't so much as mention cancer...

    Great environmental stresses over a long period of time can lead to or exacerbate cancer.

    Many of us are hoping you soon succumb and will do whatever it takes to
    speed the process along for you, asshole.

    'BOTs don't get cancer. They do get virii, tho' ;-)

    Dhu



    --
    Je suis Canadien. Ce n'est pas Francais ou Anglais.
    C'est une esp`ece de sauvage: ne obliviscaris, vix ea nostra voco;-)
    Duncan Patton a Campbell

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Baxter@21:1/5 to De-Trois-Leaning on Thu Oct 3 02:46:29 2024
    XPost: can.politics, seattle.politics, or.politics

    De-Trois-Leaning <dtl@invalid.net> wrote in
    news:vdk51l$3bl9k$2@dont-email.me:

    Alan wrote:
    An article that doesn't so much as mention cancer...

    You ran from a lie you made.

    Where's the quote?

    You won't quote, because you can't quote a statement that doesn't exist.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Baxter@21:1/5 to R Kym Horsell on Thu Oct 3 14:37:23 2024
    XPost: can.politics, seattle.politics, or.politics

    R Kym Horsell <kymhorsell@gmail.com> wrote in news:vdl2st$1uhm$1 @nnrp.usenet.blueworldhosting.com:

    In sci.environment Baxter <bax02_spamblock@baxcode.com> wrote:
    De-Trois-Leaning <dtl@invalid.net> wrote in
    news:vdk51l$3bl9k$2@dont-email.me:

    Alan wrote:
    An article that doesn't so much as mention cancer...

    You ran from a lie you made.

    Where's the quote?

    You won't quote, because you can't quote a statement that doesn't exist.

    This is the 21st century! It doesnt matter if it's true!!


    tRumpWorld is built on lies - nothing but lies

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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