• [I want to be in that number] <-- i've not heard this idiom elsewhere

    From HenHanna@21:1/5 to All on Sat Nov 2 17:09:42 2024
    XPost: alt.usage.english, alt.language.latin

    [Yes, I want to be in that number] <-- i've never heard this idiom
    anywhere else


    The phrase "I want to be in that number" is an idiomatic
    expression that conveys a desire to be included in a particular group or experience, often associated with something positive or significant. ...........


    This kind of phrasing can be found in various songs and
    traditions, especially in spirituals and gospel music

    ________________________________


    Yes, the idiom "I want to be in that number" could have
    connections to Latin, particularly in the way classical texts often
    emphasize collective groups or communities.

    The concept of "number" in this context refers to a group of
    people, which can be seen in various Latin phrases that highlight
    community and belonging.

    For example, the Latin word "numerus" means "number," and in literature, it is often used to refer to groups of people or to indicate
    a count. Additionally, in religious contexts, Latin hymns and texts
    often speak of being part of a divine assembly or congregation

    ____________________________


    A well-known Latin maxim that includes "in numerum" is:

    "In numerum iis qui adsumus"

    This translates to "In the number of those who are present."

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From LionelEdwards@21:1/5 to HenHanna on Sat Nov 2 17:18:42 2024
    XPost: alt.usage.english, alt.language.latin

    On Sat, 2 Nov 2024 17:09:42 +0000, HenHanna wrote:

    [Yes, I want to be in that number] <-- i've never heard this idiom
    anywhere else

    <snip>

    It is a direct quote from the best known song by the
    most recognisable singer ever. Sit back and enjoy:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wyLjbMBpGDA

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Ross Clark@21:1/5 to LionelEdwards on Sun Nov 3 23:00:37 2024
    On 3/11/2024 6:18 a.m., LionelEdwards wrote:
    On Sat, 2 Nov 2024 17:09:42 +0000, HenHanna wrote:

    [Yes, I want to be in that number] <-- i've never heard this idiom
    anywhere else

    <snip>

    It is a direct quote from the best known song by the
    most recognisable singer ever. Sit back and enjoy:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wyLjbMBpGDA

    Without looking, I can guess the song and the singer.
    Just sticking to that theme, I looked at the uses of "number" in the old
    Bible concordance I keep in a cupboard. There is a lot of numbering of
    groups of people in the Bible -- tribes, armies, the elect... (There's
    even a whole book in the OT called Numbers.) You can easily see the
    extension from the number (the figure) to the list or roll of names of
    people in the group. "When the roll is called up yonder, I'll be there"
    -- from another old song -- refers to the same situation.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From HenHanna@21:1/5 to Ross Clark on Sun Nov 3 19:20:32 2024
    On Sun, 3 Nov 2024 10:00:37 +0000, Ross Clark wrote:

    On 3/11/2024 6:18 a.m., LionelEdwards wrote:
    On Sat, 2 Nov 2024 17:09:42 +0000, HenHanna wrote:

    [Yes, I want to be in that number] <-- i've never heard this idiom
    anywhere else

    <snip>

    It is a direct quote from the best known song by the
    most recognisable singer ever. Sit back and enjoy:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wyLjbMBpGDA

    Without looking, I can guess the song and the singer.
    Just sticking to that theme, I looked at the uses of "number" in the old Bible concordance I keep in a cupboard. There is a lot of numbering of
    groups of people in the Bible -- tribes, armies, the elect... (There's
    even a whole book in the OT called Numbers.) You can easily see the
    extension from the number (the figure) to the list or roll of names of
    people in the group. "When the roll is called up yonder, I'll be there"
    -- from another old song -- refers to the same situation.


    Who's the drummer? He looks like young Jacky Chan.

    ______________

    >>> While "number" and "numb" do not share a direct lineage, they
    derive from different roots that have been influenced by similar sounds
    and concepts over time. The connection might be more phonetic than
    semantic.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From LionelEdwards@21:1/5 to LionelEdwards on Mon Nov 4 00:17:39 2024
    XPost: alt.usage.english, alt.language.latin

    On Sat, 2 Nov 2024 17:18:42 +0000, LionelEdwards wrote:

    On Sat, 2 Nov 2024 17:09:42 +0000, HenHanna wrote:

    [Yes, I want to be in that number] <-- i've never heard this idiom
    anywhere else

    <snip>

    It is a direct quote from the best known song by the
    most recognisable singer ever. Sit back and enjoy:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wyLjbMBpGDA

    I see Jewel Brown died in June of this year.

    Other backing singers who came close to eclipsing the
    band they were accompanying? Merry Clayton?

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QeglgSWKSIY

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From LionelEdwards@21:1/5 to HenHanna on Mon Nov 4 00:53:25 2024
    XPost: alt.usage.english, alt.language.latin

    On Mon, 4 Nov 2024 0:24:04 +0000, HenHanna wrote:

    On Sun, 3 Nov 2024 19:20:32 +0000, HenHanna wrote:

    On Sun, 3 Nov 2024 10:00:37 +0000, Ross Clark wrote:

    On 3/11/2024 6:18 a.m., LionelEdwards wrote:
    On Sat, 2 Nov 2024 17:09:42 +0000, HenHanna wrote:

    [Yes, I want to be in that number] <-- i've never heard this idiom
    anywhere else

    <snip>

    It is a direct quote from the best known song by the
    most recognisable singer ever. Sit back and enjoy:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wyLjbMBpGDA

    Without looking, I can guess the song and the singer.
    Just sticking to that theme, I looked at the uses of "number" in the old >>> Bible concordance I keep in a cupboard. There is a lot of numbering of
    groups of people in the Bible -- tribes, armies, the elect... (There's
    even a whole book in the OT called Numbers.) You can easily see the
    extension from the number (the figure) to the list or roll of names of
    people in the group. "When the roll is called up yonder, I'll be there"
    -- from another old song -- refers to the same situation.



    Who's the drummer? (looks a bit Asian) He looks like young Jacky Chan.

    "Danny Barcelona a little Filipino boy on the drums", says
    the little Caribbean boy Sachmo.

    "Boy" in those days was a derogatory term for negro.
    He is claiming ownership of the insult, much as the Tories
    in the UK took ownership of their insulting epithet.

    "Old Contemptibles" in WWI did the same.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From HenHanna@21:1/5 to HenHanna on Mon Nov 4 00:24:04 2024
    XPost: alt.usage.english, alt.language.latin

    On Sun, 3 Nov 2024 19:20:32 +0000, HenHanna wrote:

    On Sun, 3 Nov 2024 10:00:37 +0000, Ross Clark wrote:

    On 3/11/2024 6:18 a.m., LionelEdwards wrote:
    On Sat, 2 Nov 2024 17:09:42 +0000, HenHanna wrote:

    [Yes, I want to be in that number] <-- i've never heard this idiom
    anywhere else

    <snip>

    It is a direct quote from the best known song by the
    most recognisable singer ever. Sit back and enjoy:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wyLjbMBpGDA

    Without looking, I can guess the song and the singer.
    Just sticking to that theme, I looked at the uses of "number" in the old
    Bible concordance I keep in a cupboard. There is a lot of numbering of
    groups of people in the Bible -- tribes, armies, the elect... (There's
    even a whole book in the OT called Numbers.) You can easily see the
    extension from the number (the figure) to the list or roll of names of
    people in the group. "When the roll is called up yonder, I'll be there"
    -- from another old song -- refers to the same situation.



    Who's the drummer? (looks a bit Asian) He looks like young Jacky Chan.



    ______________

    >>> While "number" and "numb" do not share a direct lineage, they
    derive from different roots that have been influenced by similar sounds
    and concepts over time. The connection might be more phonetic than
    semantic.


    german Zahl seems to be related to Tally. but not to Dollar.

    prob. not to Tailor (tailler)


    "Il faut tailler les rosiers au printemps pour qu'ils fleurissent
    mieux."

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Ed Cryer@21:1/5 to All on Mon Nov 4 12:05:00 2024
    XPost: alt.usage.english, alt.language.latin

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    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Ross Clark@21:1/5 to Ed Cryer on Tue Nov 5 13:01:04 2024
    On 5/11/2024 1:05 a.m., Ed Cryer wrote:
    HenHanna wrote:
    [Yes, I want to be in that number] <-- i've never heard this idiom
    anywhere else


               The phrase "I want to be in that number" is an idiomatic
    expression that conveys a desire to be included in a particular group or
    experience, often associated with something positive or significant.
    ...........


               This kind of phrasing can be found in various songs and >> traditions, especially in spirituals and gospel music

    I should think that the most likely source of that "number" in "Oh When
    The Saints Go Marching In" is the last book of the New Testament in the Bible; the Apocalypse.
    That book is full of numbers; 4 and 7 occur a lot, 666 will be the
    number of the Antichrist (I once read that that pointed to the Roman
    emperor Nero, but can't recall the convoluted reasoning; something to do
    with the letters of Nero's name), and then, of course, the 144,000 who
    will be saved because of their righteousness (12,000 from each of the
    tribes of Israel). Those are the saints who'll go marching into heaven.
    And, yeah, I'd like to be there, too, but I doubt I'm half good enough.

    Greek language, rather than Latin; Roman intellectuals tended to
    venerate classical Greek culture; and copy it.

    Ed


    OED: number (n) II.8.b.
    c1350–
    A particular body or company of persons or things. Now only in
    constructions denoting inclusion, as of (also in, etc.) the number (of).

    1785 The Emperor continues to give proofs of his desire of receiving us
    into the number of his tributaries. (T.Jefferson, letter)

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Desidarius@21:1/5 to All on Tue Nov 5 15:58:59 2024
    XPost: alt.usage.english, alt.language.latin

    Le 04/11/2024 à 13:05, Ed Cryer a écrit :
    HenHanna wrote:
    [..]
    And, yeah, I'd like to be there, too, but I doubt I'm half good enough.

    Ed


    Using ChatGPT 4.o:

    "Si opus est bono advocato, me vocate. Dicam quod, cum multum
    communicaveritis, iustum sit ut multum accipiatis."

    But on the other hand: the court-appointed lawyer is the best of all....

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Ed Cryer@21:1/5 to All on Tue Nov 5 19:16:00 2024
    XPost: alt.usage.english, alt.language.latin

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    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Hibou@21:1/5 to All on Wed Nov 6 08:47:43 2024
    XPost: alt.usage.english, alt.language.latin

    Le 04/11/2024 à 12:05, Ed Cryer a écrit :

    I should think that the most likely source of that "number" in "Oh When
    The Saints Go Marching In" is the last book of the New Testament in the Bible; the Apocalypse.
    That book is full of numbers; 4 and 7 occur a lot, 666 will be the
    number of the Antichrist (I once read that that pointed to the Roman
    emperor Nero, but can't recall the convoluted reasoning; something to do
    with the letters of Nero's name), and then, of course, the 144,000 who
    will be saved because of their righteousness (12,000 from each of the
    tribes of Israel). Those are the saints who'll go marching into heaven.

    144,000 is 395 for each day of the year. That may give calendar makers a problem.

    And, yeah, I'd like to be there, too, but I doubt I'm half good enough. [...]

    Hobnobbing with the saintly for all of eternity? Sounds perfectly frightful.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From HenHanna@21:1/5 to Ed Cryer on Wed Nov 6 08:26:11 2024
    XPost: alt.usage.english, alt.language.latin

    On Mon, 4 Nov 2024 12:05:00 +0000, Ed Cryer wrote:

    HenHanna wrote:
    [Yes, I want to be in that number] <-- i've never heard this idiom
    anywhere else


              The phrase "I want to be in that number" is an idiomatic >> expression that conveys a desire to be included in a particular group or
    experience, often associated with something positive or significant.
    ...........


              This kind of phrasing can be found in various songs and >> traditions, especially in spirituals and gospel music

    I should think that the most likely source of that "number" in "Oh When
    The Saints Go Marching In" is the last book of the New Testament in the Bible; the Apocalypse.
    That book is full of numbers; 4 and 7 occur a lot, 666 will be the
    number of the Antichrist (I once read that that pointed to the Roman
    emperor Nero, but can't recall the convoluted reasoning; something to do
    with the letters of Nero's name), and then, of course, the 144,000 who
    will be saved because of their righteousness (12,000 from each of the
    tribes of Israel). Those are the saints who'll go marching into heaven.
    And, yeah, I'd like to be there, too, but I doubt I'm half good enough.

    Greek language, rather than Latin; Roman intellectuals tended to
    venerate classical Greek culture; and copy it.

    Ed


    OED: number (n) II.8.b.
    c1350–
    A particular body or company of persons or things. Now only in
    constructions denoting inclusion, as of (also in, etc.) the number (of).


    1785 The Emperor continues to give proofs of his desire of receiving us
    into the number of his tributaries. (T.Jefferson, letter)


    --------------- THank you... Number symbolism in FW is something
    i think about pretty often.....

    esp... ---------


    ALP has three children, Roman Numeral III.
    1+1+1=3 is also Delta (a triangle), ALP's symbol.

    i don't think HCE has a number associated with him...
    except maybe 7 (?) pieces of clothing, taht he has on him.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Ed Cryer@21:1/5 to All on Wed Nov 6 09:54:20 2024
    XPost: alt.usage.english, alt.language.latin

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    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)