• The moshiach they want, versus the moshiach they need.

    From Jos Boersema@21:1/5 to All on Wed Nov 22 18:41:39 2023
    The moshiach they want.

    The top Rabbis of mainstream Judaism all together see someone who
    impresse everyone a lot, including their followers and all of Israel, by
    doing something that is publicly known, ideally something that is hardly humanly possible. He is following mainstream Judaism, at least more or
    less, and can more or less appeal to most / all Rabbis that way. He
    supports what they believe generally, their Sages, everything. He in
    turn is very nice to them, and praises them. They declare him
    "moshiach", he gets at the head of Israel, conqueres all necessary land,
    turns all non-religious Jews to be part of mainstream Judaism, and he is
    so overpowering in his glory that he is able to smooth out all the
    differences between the schisms. The Rabbis are all so besides
    themselves with happiness, that they finally manage to all be one. This
    King moshiach will establish a new ruling dynasty of Kings, and they all
    live happy ever after, full of joy and laughter.

    The reason they want this, is because it validates what they are doing
    right now, it removes every challenge to them, and any threat to their authority. Their authority only increases, because "their moshiach"
    brings the non-believers to them to be ruled by them. Their Yeshiva's
    swell, etc. There is more Torah study. There is also more money coming
    in. I'll leave it to whatever Rabbi to decide for themselves which they
    find more important. No challenges to them, nothing they have to admit,
    nothing they have to change except a few minor things to smooth out the differences between the schisms. They did nothing wrong. This is what
    probably most of them hope for. You cannot entirely hold it against
    them, because it is natural for a person to do what they think is right,
    and by extension of that, they think they are right and deserve
    strengthening. They think the only problem is the non-believers. They
    are not the problem. In some sense that is even true. I wonder if the
    whole world completely consisted of Jewish Rabbis, no goyim at all, no non-believer Jews either, all 100% Rabbis of mainstream Judaism. It is
    possible that war would be reduced to a heartfelt argument. If that is
    true, humanity could live.

    Anyway ... if only it was that easy. The "moshiach" that they need, is
    the one who points out also *their* mistakes. I know a few of their
    mistakes, there may be many more. The "moshiach" will likely have to
    address every single one of the mistakes of the Rabbis. To challenge
    them to change their behavior, to give up their sins and give up on misdirecting Am Israel. Rather than the Rabbis finally being vindicated,
    they get put down. It is a let down for them, to a degree. They need to
    confess and regret at least two thousand years of prosbul lying, admit
    that their great sage Hillel the Elder was a liar. They have to admit
    they fell into Sun disk worship, with their Lamp of Helena idol. They
    have to admit something which is potentially the most painful of all:
    their beloved Rambam, he is guilty over creating the Heter Iska, which
    is a ritual by which it is invented that someone can gain money by
    lending money out "supposeldy now part owner of the business" cough
    cough, and sprinkle a bit more fairy dust here, and a side ritual there,
    and it all looks so "official". Well, it is fishy at best. The prosbul
    was probably worse, so I'll give you that at least.

    What is perhaps among the worst, is they legislated to make working on the Shabbos possible, by pretending the day ends at sundown, when they blow
    out the Shabbos candles. I'm sorry but ... what is a "day of rest" worth,
    if you wait for the duration the sun is up, and the moment the Shabbos
    candles go out you work as hard you can to make up for lost time, deep in
    the night if you want "because it is the next day, day 1". How is that a
    day of rest ? Because on the previous evening you also took a breather,
    after a day of work ? I thought normal people already came to the camp
    fire in the evening, and much of that is to relax from the day's work.

    The "real moshiach" (whomever, whatever, it isn't the person that
    counts, it is the law that counts, what-is-good is what is important)
    will possibly have a long laundry list, which probably includes most or
    all of these problems. If this is already wrong, it means the Rabbis
    have created the current exile. They prevented Israel from leaving the
    exile, by having made false law which creates a rule by the rich within
    Israel, rather than a rule by Justice. The failure to distribute the
    land to all is now added to that, since Jewish Sovereignty began in
    Israel, and at least that Rabbi whom you could clam this against started
    to support this Zionist experiment. Once you support that as a Jewish Sovereignty, then why do you not demand the Torah is kept upon those
    lands ?

    I think that is more or less the situation. The "moshiach" that they
    want, versus the "moshiach" that they need. Also keep in mind the
    interesting words of the Alter Rebbe, who said that moshiach would be
    secular (!). So now add that to the mix. Here you have a secular
    moshiach, who is demanding of these "holy Rabbis" to admit to breaking
    the Torah and causing the exile, with a laundry list of mistakes they
    made from which they need to repent. If I already see these mistakes,
    then so much more someone who spends even more time on it. (While I'm
    fine with anyone debating my charges here, the prosbul is undebatable,
    and you know it; I'm personally also probably never going to change my
    mind on the Shabbos - a day of rest is a day of rest, and not a half day
    here and a half day there, I just humanly cannot accept that as a day
    of rest, sorry ... but prosbul ?! NO NO and NO. Outright fraud, a child
    sees that.)

    So, ... that's the situation. It's kindof childish but I guess this is
    where things will get stuck. The Rabbis want to do their thing and get validated. There is probably also a bit of a thing going on which we
    always had with the Kings of all Nations, and that is that they more or
    less are a tool of the palace cliques. An idol, if you will. Especially
    the son of a powerful King, what is he ? A product of the palace
    cliques, the whole thing around it. A weak King is just a tool for his
    top advisors, who where making a good living out of it all, didn't they.
    Not entirely without risk I suppose. I suspect that some of this, is
    also what the Rabbis are after. A King to their liking, one they can
    approve and disapprove if necessary. Someone to at least influence to a
    degree. A point of power in their establishment. That would make
    everything so much easier for them. The idea that they have broken the
    Torah themselves, clearly does not and cannot easily occur to them,
    unless they dare go against their upbringing and what they have been
    taught.

    Clearly, they are no Moshe Rabbeinu who went against his entire
    upbringing at the Egyptian court, and they are no Abraham either, who
    went against all his people did and his family in particular. No, that's
    a level of commitment and courage they don't seem to possess. It is more
    like festering in the given establishment. Perhaps not festering, they
    do a lot of teaching and much of it is quite interesting, even
    entertaining, but you get the point. They expect someone to be "their
    man", the moshiach they want, so that if the moshiach they need will
    come around, calling them down on frauds and lies, that's one icy bucket
    of water in your face when you expected apple pie and hot choco milk,
    isn't it. With the ice cubes rolling down their spine, will they have
    the honesty or even wisdom to acknowledge they where wrong, and go with
    the truth no matter what ?

    It seems, they do not, they can not, and they will not. So it will come
    true what Isaiah has said ... the teachers are misleading Israel, and
    will all be removed by heaven. Once that is done, the field is open, and
    we get this generation with hunger for the truth. Only the remnant might
    still survive that long. The mainstream Rabbis, gone and/or their
    authority broken already. I hope many of them survive it, and that only
    their authority will be reduced, so they stop blocking the Redemption.
    I hope all of them survive, I hope everyone survives - but it seems that
    this is not likely, given what the Prophets have said, and what the
    Torah says, and the current state of Israel and it's Torah law breaking.

    Then we would have a situation, with maybe 5% of world Jewry surviving, Rabbinical Judaism broken by the sheer death toll upon Israel, the sheer slaughtering and dying of millions of Jewish people, and the Jewish
    people crying and reeling from the disaster ... perhaps they then
    finally can deal with the moshiach they need. This seems to be how it is written in the Torah and the prophets, and it is also proven that the
    Rabbis cannot admit they are wrong, no matter how obvious it gets. I
    guess they lack humility.

    *

    Dani18.com is constantly arguing for people to humble themselves, which
    I find quite interesting ... how accurate and good the things are which
    come out of that website; I was always a bit of a fan of Benyamin ben
    Golden, by the way. That's a strong dude with a clean insight. I think
    of him like a General of Israel. Also even seemingly mundaine things
    like cars. They decried Jewish people driving cars. I thought I was the
    nutter here, with my car hatred. I see cars like this: a car is an
    Imperial carry along throne. The Chinese Emperor had one, maybe a few of
    his Kings had one too. Behind may be some music, and so on. It is the
    height of human arrogance in some ways, isn't it. Who is more arrogant
    in the entire world, than an Emperor believing himself to be a god,
    being carried around in a covered chair, with music behind and food to
    the side. Well, that is a car in the old days.

    I often see someone in a car racing like a madman (sometimes even a
    woman), and I ask myself: you must be the Minister of this country,
    that you are so important that you need such a vehicle ? Is your wife
    giving labor on the back seat ? Are you so important, that you need
    half a ton or more of steel and whatnot, to transport your body ? In
    some sense, they all want to be Emperor, and perhaps fittingly, in front
    of every speedy car, there is a kill zone. A zone where the car can no
    longer stop or deviate, and you cannot get out of it in time. Cars are dangerous, seem usually unneeded, and besides are destroying the natural environment. Okay, rant alert, I shall stop. lol But this related to "arrogance", and that driving a car is already an act of arrogance,
    more so that people might want to notice. It is a culture build around
    an Imperial carry along throne, and everyone must have one. Isn't that
    a culture build around arrogance, in that sense ? I admit though, that
    if i'm in one, I like it too. I get it. However, point made. I don't
    want a car, because it is bad for the environment, and unnecessary for
    regular people. Rabbis also often seem to ride cars. Many people seem to
    think that driving cars is normal. 100 years ago, cars didn't exist.

    I wonder that if the way things are going will continue, in 100 years
    there will neither be any cars anymore, and not because everyone will
    have a helicopter on their roof, but quite to the contrary. A society,
    build around decadence, carelessness and arrogance, would have
    collapsed. They didn't care for humility, but rammed their car right
    through it. Too self important I guess.

    Why would anyone even care if I, undersigned, am right about these
    things. Why is that a bother to anyone. It shouldn't be a bother. You
    can just admit it, and it's all fine. You can just say: oh there was
    this crazy person, but you know, he was right. What are you afraid off ?
    That I will take off with your Nation, and throw you to the sharks ?
    That if you say may claims against these Rabbis are correct, that this
    will somehow unleash a cataclysm upon you, or that you would be burdened
    by grave shame ? That it would upset things as they are, that you
    couldn't control it ? Rather the devil that you know, than the devil
    that you don't know ? Even when you've been shown the wrong ? When
    you've been shown the wrong, just go on with it, out of fear of what
    might occur, even though you don't even know if it will ? Those who
    thought that way, stayed in Egypt, right ? Those who took the chance,
    they went with Moshe Rabbeinu, and became Israel. Those who didn't take
    the risk, died in Egypt.

    What would happen to this world, if every time someone said the truth,
    or made a righteous claim on a grievance, raised an issue of law which
    could stop pain in the people, that people would say "... but who is this person, if we listen to his complaint he might gain a standing, and if
    he gains a standing will he use that to hurt us later ... will this
    upset the boat, change things in ways we cannot predict ... no let's not
    listen to this ... let's stick to the devils we know, the gods we
    worship and the crazy and insane rituals we perform for our Kings and
    Emperors, at least we know the suffering we can expect from them". lol

    I get the fear though, I really do understand it. I can also even agree
    with it to an extend. That being said, things became the way they
    became, thanks to your choices. You created this condition, by breaking
    law and doing idolatry (Lamp of Helena). Someone was going to complain
    about things. If it isn't me, it will be someone else. If nobody
    complaints anymore, you are only even in more trouble. You Israel
    created this problem, so now you have to fix it. If it will be risky, or
    hurt you or make you afraid, so be it. You could have stayed loyal, but
    you didn't. You thought you where, but you aren't. I don't know how I
    can make it easier on you still. Did you make it easy on the ones you
    hurt with your bad laws, such as the prosbul ? Do you even deserve this
    to be easy on you ? It is what it is, you have to deal with it one way
    or the other. You cannot go on with a corrupt Establishment out of fear
    for the truth, or those telling you the truth. This kind of weakness
    which you seem to have, it has no future. You only make it worse. You
    see the demons on the road, of your own making, even if there are none.
    Like Isaiah said, you flee and none comes after you. You are afraid of
    nothing, if you are afraid of the truth, and the fact that the Rabbis
    need to change some of their mistakes. Force them to it, and that's
    that. You might get a Redemption out of it. Isn't that worthwhile ?

    Also what comes to mind in all of this, is the "sin of the spies". HKB'H
    was angry that spies where spreading fear for going into the holy land
    and vanguish the enemy. Is this a similar fear as I am not talking
    about, where you are afraid of turning to Justice and the truth because
    I (undersigned) was the one who alerted you to it, so now you became
    afraid of me ? Of what could happen if I undersigned gained any sort of standing and power because of it, and what that could mean in the end ?
    If it would be another catastrophe ? You rather stay with the lie, some
    of the frauds the Rabbis of old have created and for which they where
    exiled, rather than just go with the truth and see how far it goes ?
    Like you have send spies into the future, who told you a nightmare tale
    which didn't even happen yet, and you therefore became afraid of doing
    what needed to be done. Yes, it is similar, isn't it. You remember the punishment for that, which was ... death. The entire generation died and
    did not see the Holy Land, except those with the courage to move
    forward, despite the unknowns, on faith and courage, trust in their God
    who had proven Himself already

    It is even similar in another way, because you are in the land, but you
    are not. You play Edom in the holy land, and do not keep the Torah on
    it. If you listened to my grievances against your law breaking, it would
    be like Jehoshua ben Nun after Victory, and the land would be divided to
    all. You are there, but you aren't. The land is conquered, but it isn't.
    You are again afraid to move forward along the designed path which Moshe Rabbeinu made for you, to take possession of the Promised Land, promised
    to each and every one of you, personally (!).

    A fear similar to that of leaving Egypt. A fear similar to that of
    entering the holy land. A fear for things you don't even know, and which
    may not even occur at all. This is what I feel is stopping you, and
    keeping you under the control of these falsehoods and make belief laws.
    I can almost just feel it, the hope that I will slip up and do something outrageous and obviously wrong, so that you can hold it against me
    personally, and forget about everything that I'm challenging you for.
    The easy way out, that's what most of you want, isn't it (not that
    anyone reads this, I know, but you know ... if they had ;-). lol I
    consider it a sin of idolatry, because you seem to think that I
    undersigned, a person, matter, and that's what you are afraid off. This
    is a debate on law. Persons don't matter. I don't matter, you don't
    matter, but everyone does matter. If I am wrong or you are wrong, that
    is not interesting. The topic that it is about, such as the prosbul,
    that is what the debate is about. But I feel ... these people and
    probably most of humanity, they cannot even think about content at all.
    We see that in the void of this Usenet group, and the personality cults
    of modern TV and politics. "If this persons says it, it must be ...".
    No, just judge the issue on it's own merrits, and that is all there is
    to it. The rest is for the baboons.

    They will never learn, though. Everything is colored by this mind, or
    rather thsi mindlessness of the idolatrous mind. It is like an infection
    of the mind. It is also a lack of honesty, a lack of truth, a lack of
    caring and a lack of being serious, and/or a lack of abstract thinking.
    If even Hitler said something that was true, than it doesn't become
    wrong just because he said it. It is still true. That doesn't make him a
    good person, either. You have to separate content from persons. You
    don't seem to be able to do that, and if that is true, you are basically monkeys. You should be able to think about content, without coloring
    everything heavily, so heavily you don't see anything else but the personalities you attach to this or that opinion.

    ... and that is why I more or less even oppose the whole "moshiach"
    business, which seems to be a breach of the natural way these things
    should be going. You should know the truth, without these super natural
    tricks of Prophets and all that. You should not have needed that, you
    should be able to see what is good and bad law, either straight on the
    face of it, or (more likely) after an amount of study and thinking. That
    should be all that is required for humanity to reach paradise. Instead,
    we have this mess. ;-)

    What a planet, unbelievable. Fortunately it is a pretty place,
    definitely not a hell but a paradise in waiting. Well, the flowers are
    nice, I can't say I like spiders (scary), but I guess they keep the
    bugs away. ;-) Anothre 313 lines, why O why do I do it. I should be
    playing Castlevania 1 right now. I must be a massochist, writing
    endlessly to deaf ears, pretending it matters.

    Yeah, have another Bagel ! The second holocaust will probably not start
    before next week, yo hear ? Don't worry, you'll be fine for the next few
    days, probably. Sigh. Hard necked and without mind, to the bitter end,
    and still thinking they are doing just fine. "It's fine, it's fine, look
    we are not dead yet." "Oh don't scare us, that's mean." You would have
    wanted Jews living in Nazi Germany in 1939, to be warned of what was to
    come, or not to be warned of what was to come. Oh, thank you for that.
    But I don't know either of what is to come ? Well, so far so good, I was
    quite close to the mark. What was your guess in 2008. The western
    Empire, USA in particular: it's done. They are burning through their
    financial system, the debt, the currency, the morality, it is all going
    down fast. The wars, the stupidity of the western people: it is done.
    This cannot last that much longer anymore. You will not be fine when
    that happens. They need a scapegoat as usual probably, etc etc, the same
    as ever. The Zionist Rebel State is also not doing well at all, and the
    decay and immorality is rising a lot there as well. Even ordinary people
    can the war coming now. THat was definitely not the case in 2008, they
    had no clue yet, although some already knew by 1970 that it was Game
    Over for morality in the western world.

    Another scary facet is that this famous letter of Albert Pike also seems
    to be coming true, in which three world wars where defined, the third
    one involving "Zionism". Why are all these Nations suddenly falling over Zionism, as far away as China, as if it means anything to them. If the
    western world financially collapses, it could lead to Revolutionary
    conditions, and for this they probably want a World War, to control
    their people. These things are happening now. The last World War also
    included the holocaust. USA did that together with the Nazis (yes, I
    know that most people don't know that, or want to know that). USA is the
    global hegemon right now, pretending to care for the Jews, but remember: Germany was the "home away from home" for the Jews - and than the Nazis happened right there. I think therefore, all in all, the situation is
    more than bleak for the Jewish Nation. The situation is a catastrophe
    waiting to happen, the risks are very high. All lights are on red.

    That means: you have to run back to your God, and do his Torah, be good
    p USA is the global hegemon right now, pretending to care for the Jews,
    but remember: Germany was the "home away from home" for the Jews - and
    than the Nazis happened right there. I think therefore, all in all, the situation is more than bleak for the Jewish Nation. The situation is a catastrophe waiting to happen, the risks are very high. All lights are
    on red. The new evil created by the ruling class already began on "9/11"
    2001. It should have been stopped there, and 2008 should have nullified
    all National Debt, no matter what - take the hit. This might have saved
    this generation from World War 3. Now ... it is richly too late for
    that. World War 3 is already humanly unstoppable. Thanks for not caring
    I suppose, you will "enjoy" the consequences. /sarcasm

    After 2012 maybe there was a short window to make it known that the
    criminals wanted to create World War 3 to deal with their looting of
    the currencies, so that the populations would be primed to react
    correctly to USA created World War 3 propaganda direction Russia, which
    started during the Obama Nazi coup in Kiev 2014. Who cared for the truth
    back then ? Almost nobody.

    Do you realize that this is the cost of the deafness of humanity ? This
    is going to be a global nuclear war, with likely Billions of dead people
    all over, and what is to come after might be even worse. All of that,
    because a bunch of ... "adults" are too childish to care about political reality, and too faint to stand up for what is right. They worship their Government, worship their TV, and that's the end of that. THis is the
    mess you all have created with your deaf ears (very few exceptions to
    that, you know who you are). Global nuclear war, probably Tyranny right
    after or shortly after, and the second holocaust might be part of all
    this, and all because Pizza and Cars where more important than National
    Debt implosion, serious politics to get the monetary system back to
    normal, and then I'm not even talking about serious economic
    restructuring for the long term, which is thousands of years over due (thousands of years !).

    People really think it is not their mistake ! But their blindless and carelessness create all this, from scratch. Who cares for these
    criminals in power, they are criminals, they do what criminals do. They
    are merely there to be dealt with, and that's it. Out of the way with
    them. Where are the serious people to do it ?! Soon you can learn the seriousness and bravery you missed, in another useless and destructive
    war. I don't see how humanity still has time for all that sort of
    nonsense. The toys have become too big.

    --
    Economic & political ideology, worked out into Constitutional models,
    with a multi-facetted implementation plan. http://market.socialism.nl

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