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  • Dinosaur DNA!!!!!

    From JTEM is my hero@21:1/5 to All on Sun Sep 10 15:17:24 2023
    Okay so there are people who claim to have found
    Dinosaur DNA but...

    Can we not just infer it?

    So DNA falls apart... so what?

    Look at a Dinosaur reconstruction. It is literally an
    animal that fell apart. We dig up the pieces and put
    them together as best we can.

    Even what they call a "Fully articulated Skeleton"
    is actually in pieces. The ribs aren't floating in the
    air, or rock, occupying the exact same position in
    relation to all the other bones that they had occupied
    in life.

    Isn't this true for DNA?

    We pluck things like adenine, guanine, cytosine and
    thymine in meteorites! One presumes these things
    are older than last week. One presumes.

    Maybe one (and two, me and you) are too
    presumptuous? Or maybe this stuff lasts for a "Good
    long time."

    The point is, even if the DNA has completely fallen
    apart, there are component pieces that remain. And
    we could recreate that DNA, at least in theory, from
    those component pieces.

    Oh, it would take *Years* at least, and would be best
    done by teams -- plural -- but it's possible that large
    chunks of DNA could be reconstructed.

    Someone may already be doing this...

    I'm skeptical. No, not about this ever happening but
    about the value to science. We as a species seem
    extremely good at comparing two samples of DNA
    and determining how they're different. But our
    science is also ruthlessly incompetent at
    determining HOW those differences came about.
    And when it comes to evolution, THAT is the
    important question.

    But, "Dino DNA!" That is the take-away here. It's
    coming.





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  • From jillery@21:1/5 to jtem01@gmail.com on Mon Sep 11 06:38:45 2023
    On Sun, 10 Sep 2023 15:17:24 -0700 (PDT), JTEM is my hero
    <jtem01@gmail.com> wrote:

    Okay so there are people who claim to have found
    Dinosaur DNA but...


    Yes, Spielberg found dino DNA on the Lost Ark.

    --
    To know less than we don't know is the nature of most knowledge

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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  • From JTEM is my hero@21:1/5 to jillery on Mon Sep 11 05:26:41 2023
    jillery wrote:

    Yes

    You're not funny, you're not intelligent and you can't
    read much less understand the cites you post. So,
    why do you bother?

    I get that some people need abuse. That, for them
    it's what was substituted for love when they were a
    kid but, can't you just get some therapy?




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  • From =?UTF-8?B?w5bDtiBUaWli?=@21:1/5 to JTEM is my hero on Mon Sep 11 08:22:15 2023
    On Monday, 11 September 2023 at 01:20:32 UTC+3, JTEM is my hero wrote:
    Okay so there are people who claim to have found
    Dinosaur DNA but...

    Can we not just infer it?

    So DNA falls apart... so what?

    DNA is typically 2 meters nucleotide chain folded into ∼10 μm
    ball of yarn. If that polymer fell apart then how you figure in
    what order the pieces were there? Something far shorter and
    simpler as illustration to help to think: <https://www.sciencenews.org/article/art-dna-folding>

    Oldest authentic DNA sequence is dated 1.1 - 1.6 millions
    years old and that thanks to being deep frozen in permafrost.
    Someone can probably double that to 2.6 my as that is oldest
    permafrost. They will get lot of fame for that despite acting
    by our current understanding.

    Say someone invents some new trick how to double that.
    Piles of fame for new trick ... but still ... it is only 5 mya.
    Dinos went extinct 66 mya ... so that is quite far out of reach
    for our current understanding + that hypothetical new trick.

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  • From JTEM is my hero@21:1/5 to All on Tue Sep 12 15:12:07 2023
    Öö Tiib wrote:

    DNA is typically 2 meters nucleotide chain folded into ∼10 μm
    ball of yarn. If that polymer fell apart then how you figure in
    what order the pieces were there? Something far shorter and
    simpler as illustration to help to think: <https://www.sciencenews.org/article/art-dna-folding>

    If it was easy it would already have been done.

    The point is that constituent parts remain. It's not a case were
    there is nothing there. We do have something to work with, and
    with enough time and effort we could sequence some dinosaur
    DNA.

    Oldest authentic DNA sequence is dated 1.1 - 1.6 millions
    years old and that thanks to being deep frozen in permafrost.

    Again, constituent parts survive the heat of entry into our
    atmosphere. They do not need to be frozen.

    Someone can probably double that to 2.6 my as that is oldest
    permafrost.

    The stuff is cooked -- literally heated red hot -- coming in from
    space, and we can still crack open meteorites and find it.

    Dinosaurs had nucleated blood. The plan would be to find
    were the blood vessels used to be, crack them open and
    search.

    Say someone invents some new trick how to double that.

    Nobody was talking about getting preserved DNA.

    We find adenine (A), cytosine (C), guanine (G), and thymine
    (T) in meteorites. It lasts a *Very* long time. It survives
    entry into our atmosphere. Now assuming that microscopic
    unicorns didn't enter the fossils and move everything
    around, this adenine (A), cytosine (C), guanine (G), and
    thymine (T) can be presumed to have pretty much
    collapsed along the lines it had existed in before death.

    ...in much the same way that an articulated dinosaur
    skeleton has.

    So the trick would be to NOT find DNA but its constituent
    parts, then work out from their relationship to each other
    what they may have looked like before they fell apart.

    Nobody said it would be fast, easy or cheap.

    Instead of FINDING dinosaur DNA we infer it...

    I hope this clarifies.


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  • From jillery@21:1/5 to jtem01@gmail.com on Tue Sep 12 21:44:43 2023
    On Mon, 11 Sep 2023 05:26:41 -0700 (PDT), JTEM is my hero
    <jtem01@gmail.com> wrote:

    jillery wrote:

    Yes

    You're not funny, you're not intelligent and you can't
    read much less understand the cites you post. So,
    why do you bother?


    That's a question you should ask yourself... oh wait... you don't know
    how to cite... nevermind.


    I get that some people need abuse. That, for them
    it's what was substituted for love when they were a
    kid but, can't you just get some therapy?


    You first.

    --
    To know less than we don't know is the nature of most knowledge

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From JTEM is my hero@21:1/5 to jillery on Tue Sep 12 20:41:18 2023
    jillery wrote:

    You're not funny, you're not intelligent and you can't
    read much less understand the cites you post. So,
    why do you bother?

    That's a question you should ask yourself...

    So you just threw yourself into a tizzy because I discussed
    the idea of sequencing dinosaur DNA indirectly, and you
    think this is normal behavior?

    You're emotionally disturbed. You're so hungry to score
    some imaginary points that you routinely disgrace
    yourself like this, fly off the handle over on-topic threads,
    AND you believe this is normal behavior...

    You're fucked up.

    I have no patience for your stupid fits.




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    https://jtem.tumblr.com/post/728166607418949632

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From jillery@21:1/5 to All on Thu Sep 14 06:47:15 2023
    On Tue, 12 Sep 2023 20:41:18 -0700 (PDT), JTEM trolled:
    jillery wrote:

    You're not funny, you're not intelligent and you can't
    read much less understand the cites you post. So,
    why do you bother?

    That's a question you should ask yourself... oh wait... you don't know
    how to cite... nevermind.

    So you just threw yourself into a tizzy because I discussed
    the idea of sequencing dinosaur DNA indirectly, and you
    think this is normal behavior?


    No I didn't. No you didn't. No I don't.


    You're emotionally disturbed. You're so hungry to score
    some imaginary points that you routinely disgrace
    yourself like this, fly off the handle over on-topic threads,
    AND you believe this is normal behavior...

    You're fucked up.

    I have no patience for your stupid fits.


    Yeah, I get that a lot from willfully stupid trolls.

    --
    To know less than we don't know is the nature of most knowledge

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From JTEM is my hero@21:1/5 to jillery on Thu Sep 14 05:42:06 2023
    jillery wrote:

    No I

    Classic narcissistic even sociopathic behavior: Denying
    the goddamn obvious!

    This is a thread about sequencing dinosaur DNA indirectly.
    You jumped into this thread, acting mental, lashing out like
    the neglected brat of alcoholic parents.

    You're such a fraud!





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