On 29 Oct 2024 at 16:26:26 GMT, Theo wrote:

Much more Mini than before.
1x HDMI
1x ethernet
3x Thunderbolt / USB-C
2x USB-C

10 cores / 16GB / 256GB: £599
+£200 for 24GB
+£400 for 32GB

M4 Pro with 12 core GPU / 16 core GPU / 24GB / 512GB for £1399
goes up to 64GB / 8TB.

Add storage at £200 per 512GB.
(or just dangle an USB/Thunderbolt SSD out the back)
£100 extra for 10G ethernet.

Theo

Neat. At last a front-mounted USB socket.

£200 - 1/3 of the cost of the basic machine - to up the storage to 512GB is a bit galling . . .
--
Cheers, Rob, Sheffield UK

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Much more Mini than before.
1x HDMI
1x ethernet
3x Thunderbolt / USB-C
2x USB-C

10 cores / 16GB / 256GB: £599
+£200 for 24GB
+£400 for 32GB

M4 Pro with 12 core GPU / 16 core GPU / 24GB / 512GB for £1399
goes up to 64GB / 8TB.

Add storage at £200 per 512GB.
(or just dangle an USB/Thunderbolt SSD out the back)
£100 extra for 10G ethernet.

Theo

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On 29 Oct 2024 at 18:11:46 GMT, "Chris" <ithinkiam@gmail.com> wrote:

Theo <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> wrote:

Much more Mini than before.
1x HDMI
1x ethernet
3x Thunderbolt / USB-C
2x USB-C

10 cores / 16GB / 256GB: £599
+£200 for 24GB
+£400 for 32GB

M4 Pro with 12 core GPU / 16 core GPU / 24GB / 512GB for £1399
goes up to 64GB / 8TB.

Add storage at £200 per 512GB.
(or just dangle an USB/Thunderbolt SSD out the back)
£100 extra for 10G ethernet.

Impressive and cute.

I wonder what "top selling desktop pc" they're considered for their 6x
faster metric?

Also, how can they say it's built with 100% renewable energy? Is it made in
a different factory than other macs?

They could only say that if their factory is ONLY connected to carbon-free generation sources, which strikes me as unlikely. Otherwise it's just
marketing B/S.

For my purposes, can I treat a Thunderbird 4 port as a USB-C port - that is,in terms of plugging stuff in that, at present, IS plugged into a USB-C port?
Theo is hinting that I can, above.

--
Tim

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In article <vfr3d3$1kps7$1@dont-email.me>, RJH <patchmoney@gmx.com> wrote:

Neat. At last a front-mounted USB socket.

And a bottom-mounted switch.

I look forward to their new keyboard with the keys on the bottom so as
not to detract from the aluminium perfection of the top surface.

-- Richard

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On Tue, 29 Oct 2024 19:11:33 +0000 (UTC), richard@cogsci.ed.ac.uk
(Richard Tobin) wrote:

In article <vfr3d3$1kps7$1@dont-email.me>, RJH <patchmoney@gmx.com> wrote:

Neat. At last a front-mounted USB socket.

My 2013 PC tower has four, and two on it's roof and I think six at
the rear. Also a headphone jack. No, two jacks.

And card readers and an Ethernet port. Maybe other entry points, too.
I never did get Apple's demented obsession with minimalism.

I like my Mini and my MBP but they do have issues. :)

And a bottom-mounted switch.

That doesn't seem neat, nor functional. Indeed it seems quite a
brain-dead choice. But maybe I'm missing something? Do Mac Minis have
a history of bumping their rear or side mounted off-switches into
furniture and walls? Or into cats?

Mine hasn't. Yet.

I look forward to their new keyboard with the keys on the bottom so as
not to detract from the aluminium perfection of the top surface.

Would a touch-sensitive KB, like a touchy-screen on a tablet such as
an iPad, with an absolutely flat, perfectly smooth surface be possible
with today's technologies? One with a touchy-tab as an on-switch?

Sort of like those lift buttons that don't depress but respond to a
touch?

It's the sort of minimalist notion I'd expect Apple to try on us and
should they call it "Magic" it may even sell loads.

Or has this been tried and universally hated?

Before the complaints start: I did do online searches - I can't do
Library ones because the Library is far enough from me as to be shut
by the time I would arrive there - but all I could find were musical
KB's when I searched on "touch sensitive keyboards" and a whole lot of irrelevant cruft when I added "computer" as the third word.

Anyway, you guys, collectively *Know* *Stuff* and are often very
helpful.

Thanks. :)

J

-- Richard

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On Tue, 29 Oct 2024 20:03:05 +0000, John <Man@the.keyboard> wrote:

On Tue, 29 Oct 2024 19:11:33 +0000 (UTC), richard@cogsci.ed.ac.uk
(Richard Tobin) wrote:

In article <vfr3d3$1kps7$1@dont-email.me>, RJH <patchmoney@gmx.com> wrote: >>

Neat. At last a front-mounted USB socket.

My 2013 PC tower has four, and two on it's roof and I think six at
the rear. Also a headphone jack. No, two jacks.

And card readers and an Ethernet port. Maybe other entry points, too.
I never did get Apple's demented obsession with minimalism.

I like my Mini and my MBP but they do have issues. :)

And a bottom-mounted switch.

That doesn't seem neat, nor functional. Indeed it seems quite a
brain-dead choice. But maybe I'm missing something? Do Mac Minis have
a history of bumping their rear or side mounted off-switches into
furniture and walls? Or into cats?

I managed to get the Apple website (UKlander version) to run on the
Mini, and apparently the bottom-placed off-switch is slightly
recessed. That still seems like an idiot idea.

Still, it does mean that the lovely silvery border to the box has one
fewer interruption which is possibly why the did it. If so, then I'm
wondering why they didn't put all of the ports on the bottom surface?
Maybe they couldn't do that one without suffering from fraying of the
bended cabling?

Apple are making some daft decisions.

"Intelligence" is a major one.

I don't see anything on their website that tells us how to *not* have
this installed. Maybe it's like Microsoft's Internet Exploder browsers
and *can't* be deleted?

Mine hasn't. Yet.

I look forward to their new keyboard with the keys on the bottom so as
not to detract from the aluminium perfection of the top surface.

Would a touch-sensitive KB, like a touchy-screen on a tablet such as
an iPad, with an absolutely flat, perfectly smooth surface be possible
with today's technologies? One with a touchy-tab as an on-switch?

Sort of like those lift buttons that don't depress but respond to a
touch?

It's the sort of minimalist notion I'd expect Apple to try on us and
should they call it "Magic" it may even sell loads.

Or has this been tried and universally hated?

Before the complaints start: I did do online searches - I can't do
Library ones because the Library is far enough from me as to be shut
by the time I would arrive there - but all I could find were musical
KB's when I searched on "touch sensitive keyboards" and a whole lot of >irrelevant cruft when I added "computer" as the third word.

Anyway, you guys, collectively *Know* *Stuff* and are often very
helpful.

Thanks. :)

J

-- Richard

Sorry if I sound whiny. I'm tired, I'm cold, I'm hungry, I need a cup
of tea and my ribs and back hurt.

Also, I genuinely no longer understand this planet.

Still, I did make a nice doggy friend today, so that's nice. :)

J.

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On 29 Oct 2024 at 20:51:52 GMT, "Chris" <ithinkiam@gmail.com> wrote:

Richard Tobin <richard@cogsci.ed.ac.uk> wrote:

In article <vfr3d3$1kps7$1@dont-email.me>, RJH <patchmoney@gmx.com> wrote: >>

Neat. At last a front-mounted USB socket.

And a bottom-mounted switch.

Who turns off their Mac?

I don't, generally speaking.

--
Tim

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On 29 Oct 2024 at 20:51:51 GMT, "Chris" <ithinkiam@gmail.com> wrote:

For my purposes, can I treat a Thunderbird 4 port as a USB-C port - that
is,in terms of plugging stuff in that,
at present, IS plugged into a USB-C port? Theo is hinting that I can, above.

Well, yes. USB-C is just the form factor. The I/O protocol that flows
through the port is dependent on what is on each end.

Typically external SSD like Crucial X6 and X8.

--
Tim

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On Tue, 29 Oct 2024 21:19:55 +0000 (UTC), richard@cogsci.ed.ac.uk
(Richard Tobin) wrote:

In article <gif2ijp8aqq0hjduadlsk15d0eo90assic@4ax.com>,
John <Anyone.but.me@this.time> wrote:

Would a touch-sensitive KB, like a touchy-screen on a tablet such as
an iPad, with an absolutely flat, perfectly smooth surface be possible
with today's technologies? One with a touchy-tab as an on-switch?

15 years ago or more someone showed me a device that just projected an
image of a keyboard onto your desktop, and used a sensor of some kind
to detect where your fingers were. It was rubbish.

They use those in movies and TV programs to indicate that the user is
either a super-genius hacker or a brilliant Scientist. If I remember
correctly, there was one in "Supervolcano" from the BBC.

They seemed to get it to work perfectly, even when {SPOILERS} dust
fell onto the desk the red light of the imaginary keeyboard was
shining onto.

I suspect the device used magic theremin or Star Trek sonic door
technologies to detect the fingers. Sort of like just about every
supermarket door in existence in the new Millennium. :)

I thought of getting one but I *like* the feel and noise of keys
being pounded. Still, the little lighty box thingy that was in
"Supernova" seemed quite cool.

J.

-- Richard

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On 29 Oct 2024 at 21:19:55 GMT, "Richard Tobin" <Richard Tobin> wrote:

In article <gif2ijp8aqq0hjduadlsk15d0eo90assic@4ax.com>,
John <Anyone.but.me@this.time> wrote:

Would a touch-sensitive KB, like a touchy-screen on a tablet such as
an iPad, with an absolutely flat, perfectly smooth surface be possible
with today's technologies? One with a touchy-tab as an on-switch?

15 years ago or more someone showed me a device that just projected an
image of a keyboard onto your desktop, and used a sensor of some kind
to detect where your fingers were. It was rubbish.

Of course. No sensory feedback via your fingers. Just like trying to set the heating on a touchscreen in your car.

--
Tim

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On Tue, 29 Oct 2024 20:51:52 -0000 (UTC), Chris <ithinkiam@gmail.com>
wrote:

Richard Tobin <richard@cogsci.ed.ac.uk> wrote:

In article <vfr3d3$1kps7$1@dont-email.me>, RJH <patchmoney@gmx.com> wrote: >>

Neat. At last a front-mounted USB socket.

And a bottom-mounted switch.

Who turns off their Mac?

I did. Once. It killed the battery pack. The pack would never charge
after it died.

It was the wife's box so I was all sad.

J.

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On Tue, 29 Oct 2024 21:50:42 +0000, John <Man@the.keyboard> wrote:

On Tue, 29 Oct 2024 21:19:55 +0000 (UTC), richard@cogsci.ed.ac.uk
(Richard Tobin) wrote:

In article <gif2ijp8aqq0hjduadlsk15d0eo90assic@4ax.com>,
John <Anyone.but.me@this.time> wrote:

Would a touch-sensitive KB, like a touchy-screen on a tablet such as
an iPad, with an absolutely flat, perfectly smooth surface be possible >>>with today's technologies? One with a touchy-tab as an on-switch?

15 years ago or more someone showed me a device that just projected an >>image of a keyboard onto your desktop, and used a sensor of some kind
to detect where your fingers were. It was rubbish.

They use those in movies and TV programs to indicate that the user is
either a super-genius hacker or a brilliant Scientist. If I remember >correctly, there was one in "Supervolcano" from the BBC.

They seemed to get it to work perfectly, even when {SPOILERS} dust
fell onto the desk the red light of the imaginary keeyboard was
shining onto.

I'm sure I've seen them elsewhere, too but I can't remember exactly.
Too much cruft in the wetware and insufficiently good search programs.

I suspect the device used magic theremin

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theremin

*1928*? I'm impressed. That's not long after electricity was
invented and it's a really cool application.

It seems like the technology is similar to some touch-screens, only
in three dimensions and without the touchy bit. Yerp, it's quite
impressive.

or Star Trek sonic door

Magic in 1967, routine in 2024.

I'm still waiting for Data's "Irish Unification in 2024". :)

technologies to detect the fingers. Sort of like just about every
supermarket door in existence in the new Millennium. :)

I thought of getting one but I *like* the feel and noise of keys
being pounded.

When *I* do it. In an open office with dozens of phones, one-sided conversations and clicking of keys it's not so cute. :)

Still, the little lighty box thingy that was in
"Supernova" seemed quite cool.

Wicked-Pee, the lazy man's goto for first level misinformation and
generally fun linkies calls it:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Projection_keyboard and they use light
bounced off of the fingers to detect key-presses, mousey touchies and
maybe even trackpad fondlings.

A real computer in a pen sounds rather cool, too, though I'd still
prefer a vambrace device.

J.

-- Richard

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In article <gif2ijp8aqq0hjduadlsk15d0eo90assic@4ax.com>,
John <Anyone.but.me@this.time> wrote:

Would a touch-sensitive KB, like a touchy-screen on a tablet such as
an iPad, with an absolutely flat, perfectly smooth surface be possible
with today's technologies? One with a touchy-tab as an on-switch?

15 years ago or more someone showed me a device that just projected an
image of a keyboard onto your desktop, and used a sensor of some kind
to detect where your fingers were. It was rubbish.

-- Richard

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On 29 Oct 2024 21:55:53 GMT, TimS <tim@streater.me.uk> wrote:

On 29 Oct 2024 at 21:19:55 GMT, "Richard Tobin" <Richard Tobin> wrote:

In article <gif2ijp8aqq0hjduadlsk15d0eo90assic@4ax.com>,
John <Anyone.but.me@this.time> wrote:

Would a touch-sensitive KB, like a touchy-screen on a tablet such as
an iPad, with an absolutely flat, perfectly smooth surface be possible
with today's technologies? One with a touchy-tab as an on-switch?

15 years ago or more someone showed me a device that just projected an
image of a keyboard onto your desktop, and used a sensor of some kind
to detect where your fingers were. It was rubbish.

Of course. No sensory feedback via your fingers.

Do you mean that you can't feel the I.R. lasers and their red friends
on your finger-tips? That's interesting. Also, one would suppose that
*timing* would replace pressure as the keyboard's haptics. Or
something. Maybe the laser sensor can detect the difference between a
light "touch" and a heavy one by the squishingness of the digits?

Just like trying to set the
heating on a touchscreen in your car.

Something one should only ever do once then disable the access to
forever.

Sort of like melting the rheostat on the thermostat device for the
central heating or always using the setting the little wifey left on
the washy machine. :)

J.

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On 29.10.24 16:51, Chris wrote:

Richard Tobin <richard@cogsci.ed.ac.uk> wrote:

In article <vfr3d3$1kps7$1@dont-email.me>, RJH <patchmoney@gmx.com> wrote: >>

Neat. At last a front-mounted USB socket.

And a bottom-mounted switch.

Who turns off their Mac?

All responsible users.

--
"De gustibus non est disputandum."

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On 30 Oct 2024 at 14:24:16 GMT, "Theo" <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> wrote:

TimS <tim@streater.me.uk> wrote:

For my purposes, can I treat a Thunderbird 4 port as a USB-C port - that
is,in terms of plugging stuff in that, at present, IS plugged into a USB-C >> port? Theo is hinting that I can, above.

Yes you can - all TB 3/4/5 ports carry USB, but not all USB ports can
carry TB. In this case I understand the ports on the front do USB but not TB.

Ta for that.

--
Tim

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Chris <ithinkiam@gmail.com> wrote:

Richard Tobin <richard@cogsci.ed.ac.uk> wrote:

In article <vfr3d3$1kps7$1@dont-email.me>, RJH <patchmoney@gmx.com> wrote:

Neat. At last a front-mounted USB socket.

And a bottom-mounted switch.

Who turns off their Mac?

It's not the turning off, it's the turning on.

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TimS <tim@streater.me.uk> wrote:

For my purposes, can I treat a Thunderbird 4 port as a USB-C port - that is,in terms of plugging stuff in that, at present, IS plugged into a USB-C port? Theo is hinting that I can, above.

Yes you can - all TB 3/4/5 ports carry USB, but not all USB ports can
carry TB. In this case I understand the ports on the front do USB but not
TB.

Theo

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On 30.10.24 10:28, Theo wrote:

Chris <ithinkiam@gmail.com> wrote:

Richard Tobin <richard@cogsci.ed.ac.uk> wrote:

In article <vfr3d3$1kps7$1@dont-email.me>, RJH <patchmoney@gmx.com> wrote: >>>

Neat. At last a front-mounted USB socket.

And a bottom-mounted switch.

Who turns off their Mac?

It's not the turning off, it's the turning on.

+1

--
"De gustibus non est disputandum."

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On 30 Oct 2024, Theo wrote
(in article <a+f*KbjYz@news.chiark.greenend.org.uk>):

but not all USB ports can carry TB.

And you can wear a mask if you're worried.

MST

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Theo <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> wrote:

Chris <ithinkiam@gmail.com> wrote:

Richard Tobin <richard@cogsci.ed.ac.uk> wrote:

In article <vfr3d3$1kps7$1@dont-email.me>, RJH <patchmoney@gmx.com> wrote

Neat. At last a front-mounted USB socket.

And a bottom-mounted switch.

Who turns off their Mac?

It's not the turning off, it's the turning on.

My Minis live standing on their side,
so a bottom mounted switch may be an improvement,

Jan

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