On 16/12/2024 14:39, Jeff Gaines wrote:

I had a Blu Ray which my player was struggling with. I tried to clean it
with what I thought was a clean hanky but it wasn't as clean as I hoped.

Any suggestions as to how to clean it without damaging it any more
please? They seem so much more sensitive than plain old DVDs.

tissue and ipa or lens cleaning stuff

--
Future generations will wonder in bemused amazement that the early
twenty-first century’s developed world went into hysterical panic over a globally average temperature increase of a few tenths of a degree, and,
on the basis of gross exaggerations of highly uncertain computer
projections combined into implausible chains of inference, proceeded to contemplate a rollback of the industrial age.

Richard Lindzen

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I had a Blu Ray which my player was struggling with. I tried to clean it
with what I thought was a clean hanky but it wasn't as clean as I hoped.

Any suggestions as to how to clean it without damaging it any more please?
They seem so much more sensitive than plain old DVDs.

--
Jeff Gaines Dorset UK
Most people have heard of Karl Marx the philosopher but few know of his
sister Onya the Olympic runner.
Her name is still mentioned at the start of every race.

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Jeff Gaines wrote:

I had a Blu Ray which my player was struggling with. I tried to clean it
with what I thought was a clean hanky but it wasn't as clean as I hoped.

Any suggestions as to how to clean it without damaging it any more
please? They seem so much more sensitive than plain old DVDs.

Toothpaste used to be the standard way of cleaning a DVD but I haven't
tried it on a Blu-Ray disk.

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On 16/12/2024 15:05, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

On 16/12/2024 14:39, Jeff Gaines wrote:

I had a Blu Ray which my player was struggling with. I tried to clean
it with what I thought was a clean hanky but it wasn't as clean as I
hoped.

Any suggestions as to how to clean it without damaging it any more
please? They seem so much more sensitive than plain old DVDs.

tissue and ipa or lens cleaning stuff

Yes, and always wipe from the centre hole to the edge, and never around
the disk. That way, if you scratch it while wiping it, only a tiny
amount of data is damaged in each sector which should not effect
anything. If you create a scratch along the track, that's much more
likely to be harmful.

--
Andrew Gabriel

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On 16/12/2024 14:39, Jeff Gaines wrote:

I had a Blu Ray which my player was struggling with. I tried to clean it
with what I thought was a clean hanky but it wasn't as clean as I hoped.

Any suggestions as to how to clean it without damaging it any more
please? They seem so much more sensitive than plain old DVDs.

Also try reading it on a blu ray drive on a computer if you have access
to one (preferably with older firmware that makes ripping possible) -
they sometimes have better error recovery than the normal players.

--
Cheers,

John.

/=================================================================\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk | |-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk | \=================================================================/

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On 16/12/2024 in message <xn0oumrxs1m990000m@news.individual.net> Jeff
Gaines wrote:

I had a Blu Ray which my player was struggling with. I tried to clean it
with what I thought was a clean hanky but it wasn't as clean as I hoped.

Any suggestions as to how to clean it without damaging it any more please? >They seem so much more sensitive than plain old DVDs.

Many thanks for all the suggestions :-)

I had a go at this earlier with plain water then tried to prepare an iso
from it. However, after 5 hours it was at 32% and seemed stuck so I
clearly made a right mess of the disk.

Kodi on my Nvidia Shield TV Pro will read DVD iso's and present the full
DVD menu which is brill but it can only do that for a Blu Ray iso if the
Java runtime is installed and it's not available of the Shield TV so it's
plain DVDs only in future.

Thanks again!

--
Jeff Gaines Dorset UK
Those are my principles � and if you don�t like them, well, I have others. (Groucho Marx)

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On Tue, 12/17/2024 3:39 PM, Jeff Gaines wrote:

On 16/12/2024 in message <xn0oumrxs1m990000m@news.individual.net> Jeff Gaines wrote:

I had a Blu Ray which my player was struggling with. I tried to clean it with what I thought was a clean hanky but it wasn't as clean as I hoped.

Any suggestions as to how to clean it without damaging it any more please? They seem so much more sensitive than plain old DVDs.

Many thanks for all the suggestions :-)

I had a go at this earlier with plain water then tried to prepare an iso from it. However, after 5 hours it was at 32% and seemed stuck so I clearly made a right mess of the disk.

Kodi on my Nvidia Shield TV Pro will read DVD iso's and present the full DVD menu which is brill but it can only do that for a Blu Ray iso if the Java runtime is installed and it's not available of the Shield TV so it's plain DVDs only in future.

Thanks again!

https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread.php?t=336195

"VSO Inspector or DVDInfoPro do a good job checking possible
surface & CRC read errors on CD/DVD/Blu-ray/UHD discs...
depending on what disc formats your PC drive is capable of reading.

VSO Inspector is freeware, and perfectly accurate with its results.
"

The Blu Ray disc has a hard-coat on it, and unless the muck on the
disc has somehow obscured the layers beneath, it's unlikely you've
scratched the shit out of it. It is supposed to have a harder finish
than the other earlier disc types.

With error correction, the biggest risk on a disc, is the loss
of the ability to follow the groove encoding. If the hardware
can focus on the groove, a lot of the read errors can be corrected.
The Reed Solomon works best with radial scratches, while tangential
scratches are a bad thing. That is why wiping in circles is not
recommended, and especially if using sandpaper :-)

You should be able to hold the media on an angle, and see if the
glare of scratches meets your eye.

Doing an error scan, is how you get some idea what is going on.

Paul

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Jeff Gaines <jgnewsid@outlook.com> wrote:

Kodi on my Nvidia Shield TV Pro will read DVD iso's and present the full
DVD menu which is brill but it can only do that for a Blu Ray iso if the
Java runtime is installed and it's not available of the Shield TV so it's plain DVDs only in future.

Supposedly: https://www.reddit.com/r/ShieldAndroidTV/comments/mj8swn/full_bluray_and_4k_uhd_bluray_menu_support_for/

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On 19/12/2024 in message <34s*Vvq2z@news.chiark.greenend.org.uk> Theo wrote:

Jeff Gaines <jgnewsid@outlook.com> wrote:

Kodi on my Nvidia Shield TV Pro will read DVD iso's and present the full >>DVD menu which is brill but it can only do that for a Blu Ray iso if the >>Java runtime is installed and it's not available of the Shield TV so it's >>plain DVDs only in future.

Supposedly: >https://www.reddit.com/r/ShieldAndroidTV/comments/mj8swn/full_bluray_and_4k_uhd_bluray_menu_support_for/

I don't think I am up to that on my Shield TV, it's controlled by a
remote, how I would install (?side load) something like that I have no idea.

I wonder if it's not made available officially for security reasons? I
think the last virus I got on Windows was a Java exploit.

--
Jeff Gaines Dorset UK
George Washington was a British subject until well after his 40th birthday. (Margaret Thatcher, speech at the White House 17 December 1979)

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On 18/12/2024 in message <vjt3pm$1vftc$1@dont-email.me> Paul wrote:

On Tue, 12/17/2024 3:39 PM, Jeff Gaines wrote:

On 16/12/2024 in message <xn0oumrxs1m990000m@news.individual.net> Jeff >>Gaines wrote:

I had a Blu Ray which my player was struggling with. I tried to clean it >>>with what I thought was a clean hanky but it wasn't as clean as I hoped.

Any suggestions as to how to clean it without damaging it any more please? >>>They seem so much more sensitive than plain old DVDs.

Many thanks for all the suggestions :-)

I had a go at this earlier with plain water then tried to prepare an iso >>from it. However, after 5 hours it was at 32% and seemed stuck so I
clearly made a right mess of the disk.

Kodi on my Nvidia Shield TV Pro will read DVD iso's and present the full >>DVD menu which is brill but it can only do that for a Blu Ray iso if the >>Java runtime is installed and it's not available of the Shield TV so it's >>plain DVDs only in future.

Thanks again!

https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread.php?t=336195

"VSO Inspector or DVDInfoPro do a good job checking possible
surface & CRC read errors on CD/DVD/Blu-ray/UHD discs...
depending on what disc formats your PC drive is capable of reading.

VSO Inspector is freeware, and perfectly accurate with its results.
"

The Blu Ray disc has a hard-coat on it, and unless the muck on the
disc has somehow obscured the layers beneath, it's unlikely you've
scratched the shit out of it. It is supposed to have a harder finish
than the other earlier disc types.

With error correction, the biggest risk on a disc, is the loss
of the ability to follow the groove encoding. If the hardware
can focus on the groove, a lot of the read errors can be corrected.
The Reed Solomon works best with radial scratches, while tangential
scratches are a bad thing. That is why wiping in circles is not
recommended, and especially if using sandpaper :-)

You should be able to hold the media on an angle, and see if the
glare of scratches meets your eye.

Doing an error scan, is how you get some idea what is going on.

Paul

Than you :-)

I tried VSO Inspector on a DVD that my computer just couldn't read. VSO Inspector can't read single byte from it. It actually looks clean and not scratched but there's something wrong clearly!

--
Jeff Gaines Dorset UK
The fact that there's a highway to hell and only a stairway to heaven says
a lot about anticipated traffic numbers.

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Jeff Gaines <jgnewsid@outlook.com> wrote:

On 19/12/2024 in message <34s*Vvq2z@news.chiark.greenend.org.uk> Theo wrote:

Jeff Gaines <jgnewsid@outlook.com> wrote:

Kodi on my Nvidia Shield TV Pro will read DVD iso's and present the full >>DVD menu which is brill but it can only do that for a Blu Ray iso if the >>Java runtime is installed and it's not available of the Shield TV so it's >>plain DVDs only in future.

Supposedly: >https://www.reddit.com/r/ShieldAndroidTV/comments/mj8swn/full_bluray_and_4k_uhd_bluray_menu_support_for/

I don't think I am up to that on my Shield TV, it's controlled by a
remote, how I would install (?side load) something like that I have no idea.

You'd probably use 'adb' to push .apk files from a PC over USB.

Or install an alternative app store like Obtainium and tell it the URLs of
the Github releases.

You may need to use a mouse and/or keyboard to set such things up - I've never used Android TV to know how that works (seems that Obtainium's Android TV
UI still wants a keyboard)

I wonder if it's not made available officially for security reasons? I
think the last virus I got on Windows was a Java exploit.

It probably wouldn't meet Play Store vetting, given it's designed to do something the Blu Ray people don't want you to do.

Theo

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On 19/12/2024 16:13, Jeff Gaines wrote:

I tried VSO Inspector on a DVD that my computer just couldn't read. VSO Inspector can't read single byte from it. It actually looks clean and
not scratched but there's something wrong clearly!

Some DVDs will only play on players that have legal DRM read ability.

Mots of that has been cracked, but not all.

You may do better using a 'live linux' boot disk to read them

--
"Women actually are capable of being far more than the feminists will
let them."

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On 19/12/2024 in message <vk1n9b$2vb3a$3@dont-email.me> The Natural
Philosopher wrote:

On 19/12/2024 16:13, Jeff Gaines wrote:

I tried VSO Inspector on a DVD that my computer just couldn't read. VSO >>Inspector can't read single byte from it. It actually looks clean and not >>scratched but there's something wrong clearly!

Some DVDs will only play on players that have legal DRM read ability.

Mots of that has been cracked, but not all.

You may do better using a 'live linux' boot disk to read them

I run a Linux box with Brasero to create iso files, that didn't want to
know either!

I'll try my Panasonic DVD player later.

--
Jeff Gaines Dorset UK
Those are my principles – and if you don’t like them, well, I have
others.
(Groucho Marx)

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On Thu, 12/19/2024 2:33 PM, Jeff Gaines wrote:

On 19/12/2024 in message <vk1n9b$2vb3a$3@dont-email.me> The Natural Philosopher wrote:

On 19/12/2024 16:13, Jeff Gaines wrote:

I tried VSO Inspector on a DVD that my computer just couldn't read. VSO  Inspector can't read single byte from it. It actually looks clean and  not scratched but there's something wrong clearly!

Some DVDs will only play on players that have legal  DRM read ability.

Mots of that has been cracked, but not all.

You may do better using a 'live linux' boot disk to read them

I run a Linux box with Brasero to create iso files, that didn't want to know either!

I'll try my Panasonic DVD player later.

Please give the exact title and information about the SKU.

We need to run a Google and check for "exotic" protection
methods, such as weak sector or something. Sometimes,
there will be long discussion threads, about what happens
to particular titles.

I don't have a Bluray player, have no experience with the
protection methods, or anything of that sort. I know
that the ability to load the Java programs (.jar) off
the BR disc, the ability to revoke the key for the media
and so on (using a network connection to the player),
are all part of the BluRay experience. But there could
be other methods added to the media, to prevent computer
BluRay drives from reading it, and only an STB would be
designed to open and play it. Assuming the STB had
a network connection, and the media can revoke and
make itself unplayable (on that particular playback device).

With BluRay, you can buy the media, you can own the media,
you can play the title multiple times. You can buy a second
disc. The second disc communicates with the network, gets
a copy of the revocation list, the key for the encryption
on the previous disc is revoked, and suddenly... the disc
that used to play, no longer plays.

This is the BluRay customer experience. Can you see
why I do not own one of those drives ? Or any materials
associated with the methods ? Even when you are not a pirate,
you are treated like dirt. And that's not right.

Run the title and any identifying numbers through Google,
and start searching for revocation.

In the DVD era, an example of a media with a reputation,
was "Casino Royale". One release of that, had a special protection
method. If you can Google and dig up that one, then chances
are good you can dig up a story behind your BR title.

Paul

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On 19/12/2024 19:33, Jeff Gaines wrote:

On 19/12/2024 in message <vk1n9b$2vb3a$3@dont-email.me> The Natural Philosopher wrote:

On 19/12/2024 16:13, Jeff Gaines wrote:

I tried VSO Inspector on a DVD that my computer just couldn't read.
VSO Inspector can't read single byte from it. It actually looks clean
and  not scratched but there's something wrong clearly!

Some DVDs will only play on players that have legal  DRM read ability.

Mots of that has been cracked, but not all.

You may do better using a 'live linux' boot disk to read them

I run a Linux box with Brasero to create iso files, that didn't want to
know either!

I am not sure that Brasero would understand DRM encoding. You need some
ripper software like makemkv...

https://forums.linuxmint.com/viewtopic.php?t=422617

I'll try my Panasonic DVD player later.

If that works OK you definitely have run up against DRM issues.

They deliberately corrupt the data so without a special key the disk
simply looks unreadable

DVD/bluray players have the keys. Computer blue ray players may not.



--
“I know that most men, including those at ease with problems of the greatest complexity, can seldom accept even the simplest and most
obvious truth if it be such as would oblige them to admit the falsity of conclusions which they have delighted in explaining to colleagues, which
they have proudly taught to others, and which they have woven, thread by thread, into the fabric of their lives.”

― Leo Tolstoy

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On 20/12/2024 in message <vk2pn8$395mh$1@dont-email.me> The Natural
Philosopher wrote:

[snipped]

Many thanks Paul & The Natural Philosopher :-)

This became a swamps & alligators situation for me, I lost interest in the film, the challenge was somehow to create an iso!

This one is a bog standard DVD not Blu ray.

The Samsung DVD drive on the Linux box couldn't read it.

The Asus Blu ray drive on the Windows box couldn't read it.

VSO Inspector on the Windows box couldn't read it.

Next step was to try my Panasonic Blu ray player but a thought came to me
last night. I have a very old external DVD player that can read/write
anything, I bought it years ago to back up to DVD RAM. Separate PSU, USB2, really old.

Plugged it into the Linux box, put the DVD in, iso created as sweet as a
nut!

I must stencil "do not throw away" on the top of that drive!

Incidentally I agree with the comments about Blu ray, just not worth the effort.

--
Jeff Gaines Dorset UK
Greater love hath no man than this, that he lay down his friends for his
life.
(Jeremy Thorpe, 1962)

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Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> wrote:

With BluRay, you can buy the media, you can own the media,
you can play the title multiple times. You can buy a second
disc. The second disc communicates with the network, gets
a copy of the revocation list, the key for the encryption
on the previous disc is revoked, and suddenly... the disc
that used to play, no longer plays.

This is the BluRay customer experience. Can you see
why I do not own one of those drives ? Or any materials
associated with the methods ? Even when you are not a pirate,
you are treated like dirt. And that's not right.

I'd be tempted to look into a 'LibreDrive', which is one that just reads the raw bits and doesn't care about DRM or anything: https://forum.makemkv.com/forum/viewforum.php?f=19

But if you just want to back up a disc you already own, you may get a better user experience by sailing the high seas...

Theo

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