It looks like I am in the hall of shame. To change a lightswitch, I
switched off the downstairs RCBO forgetting that the switch at the
bottom of the stairs was connected to a light fed from the upstairs
circuit. I touched one of the conductor wires and got a shock, nothing
more than a mild tingle. Is the RCBO able to prevent a significant
electric shock? I will not be recommending or repeating this.
On 18/02/2025 in message <atv8rjl72al0eln5shkjo09bnme21oite7@4ax.com>
Scott wrote:
It looks like I am in the hall of shame. To change a lightswitch, I >>switched off the downstairs RCBO forgetting that the switch at the
bottom of the stairs was connected to a light fed from the upstairs >>circuit. I touched one of the conductor wires and got a shock, nothing
more than a mild tingle. Is the RCBO able to prevent a significant
electric shock? I will not be recommending or repeating this.
I have been in this property for three years now and only recently
discovered that the downstairs study/dining room is connected to the
upstairs ring while all the other rooms are on the downstairs circuit.
On 18/02/2025 in message <atv8rjl72al0eln5shkjo09bnme21oite7@4ax.com>
Scott wrote:
It looks like I am in the hall of shame. To change a lightswitch, I
switched off the downstairs RCBO forgetting that the switch at the
bottom of the stairs was connected to a light fed from the upstairs
circuit. I touched one of the conductor wires and got a shock, nothing
more than a mild tingle. Is the RCBO able to prevent a significant
electric shock? I will not be recommending or repeating this.
I have been in this property for three years now and only recently
discovered that the downstairs study/dining room is connected to the
upstairs ring while all the other rooms are on the downstairs circuit.
On 18 Feb 2025 13:04:32 GMT, "Jeff Gaines" <jgnewsid@outlook.com>
wrote:
On 18/02/2025 in message
<atv8rjl72al0eln5shkjo09bnme21oite7@4ax.com> Scott wrote:
It looks like I am in the hall of shame. To change a lightswitch, I >>switched off the downstairs RCBO forgetting that the switch at the
bottom of the stairs was connected to a light fed from the upstairs >>circuit. I touched one of the conductor wires and got a shock,
nothing more than a mild tingle. Is the RCBO able to prevent a >>significant electric shock? I will not be recommending or repeating
this.
I have been in this property for three years now and only recently >discovered that the downstairs study/dining room is connected to the >upstairs ring while all the other rooms are on the downstairs
circuit.
As someone on the group to which I posted by mistake commented,
turning off the main switch is probably best practice (even if it does
mean resetting clocks afterwards).
On 18/02/2025 in message <atv8rjl72al0eln5shkjo09bnme21oite7@4ax.com>
Scott wrote:
It looks like I am in the hall of shame. To change a lightswitch, I >switched off the downstairs RCBO forgetting that the switch at the
bottom of the stairs was connected to a light fed from the upstairs >circuit. I touched one of the conductor wires and got a shock, nothing
more than a mild tingle. Is the RCBO able to prevent a significant
electric shock? I will not be recommending or repeating this.
I have been in this property for three years now and only recently
discovered that the downstairs study/dining room is connected to the
upstairs ring while all the other rooms are on the downstairs circuit.
On Tue, 18 Feb 2025 13:42:20 +0000
Scott <newsgroups@gefion.myzen.co.uk> wrote:
On 18 Feb 2025 13:04:32 GMT, "Jeff Gaines" <jgnewsid@outlook.com>
wrote:
On 18/02/2025 in message
<atv8rjl72al0eln5shkjo09bnme21oite7@4ax.com> Scott wrote:
It looks like I am in the hall of shame. To change a lightswitch, I
switched off the downstairs RCBO forgetting that the switch at the
bottom of the stairs was connected to a light fed from the upstairs
circuit. I touched one of the conductor wires and got a shock,
nothing more than a mild tingle. Is the RCBO able to prevent a
significant electric shock? I will not be recommending or repeating
this.
I have been in this property for three years now and only recently
discovered that the downstairs study/dining room is connected to the
upstairs ring while all the other rooms are on the downstairs
circuit.
As someone on the group to which I posted by mistake commented,
turning off the main switch is probably best practice (even if it does
mean resetting clocks afterwards).
Whatever kind of circuit you're going to work on, turn something on,
ideally the light or socket you'll be touching. Pull the fuse/breaker
and go straight back to confirm what you turned on is now dead.
Sometimes you will be surprised.
In the old days, you could carry the fuse in your pocket to ensure
nobody else plugged it back in, and the early circuit breakers plugged
into the same fuseholders for compatibility, and could also be removed.
I'd have thought that with a leakage detection breaker, you shouldn't
feel anything. I sometimes worked on an oscilloscope that had the >(unshielded) mains fuse sitting on top of the chassis at the rear. >Occasionally the workshop radio would go off, and I'd look up to see
who had turned it off, finding that it had been me. Never felt a thing.
It looks like I am in the hall of shame. To change a lightswitch, I
switched off the downstairs RCBO forgetting that the switch at the
bottom of the stairs was connected to a light fed from the upstairs
circuit. I touched one of the conductor wires and got a shock, nothing
more than a mild tingle. Is the RCBO able to prevent a significant
electric shock? I will *not* be recommending or repeating this.
On 18/02/2025 in message <atv8rjl72al0eln5shkjo09bnme21oite7@4ax.com>
Scott wrote:
It looks like I am in the hall of shame. To change a lightswitch, I
switched off the downstairs RCBO forgetting that the switch at the
bottom of the stairs was connected to a light fed from the upstairs
circuit. I touched one of the conductor wires and got a shock, nothing
more than a mild tingle. Is the RCBO able to prevent a significant
electric shock? I will not be recommending or repeating this.
I have been in this property for three years now and only recently
discovered that the downstairs study/dining room is connected to the
upstairs ring while all the other rooms are on the downstairs circuit.
I have been in this property for three years now and only recently
discovered that the downstairs study/dining room is connected to the
upstairs ring while all the other rooms are on the downstairs circuit.
It looks like I am in the hall of shame. To change a lightswitch, I
switched off the downstairs RCBO forgetting that the switch at the
bottom of the stairs was connected to a light fed from the upstairs
circuit. I touched one of the conductor wires and got a shock, nothing
more than a mild tingle. Is the RCBO able to prevent a significant
electric shock?
Scott wrote:
It looks like I am in the hall of shame. To change a lightswitch, I
switched off the downstairs RCBO forgetting that the switch at the
bottom of the stairs was connected to a light fed from the upstairs
circuit. I touched one of the conductor wires and got a shock, nothing
more than a mild tingle. Is the RCBO able to prevent a significant
electric shock?
Disconnect time for 30µA RCD/RCBO should be under 300ms, often they're faster than that ...
Jeff Gaines <jgnewsid@outlook.com> wrote:
On 18/02/2025 in message <atv8rjl72al0eln5shkjo09bnme21oite7@4ax.com>
Scott wrote:
It looks like I am in the hall of shame. To change a lightswitch, I
switched off the downstairs RCBO forgetting that the switch at the
bottom of the stairs was connected to a light fed from the upstairs
circuit. I touched one of the conductor wires and got a shock, nothing
more than a mild tingle. Is the RCBO able to prevent a significant
electric shock? I will not be recommending or repeating this.
I have been in this property for three years now and only recently
discovered that the downstairs study/dining room is connected to the
upstairs ring while all the other rooms are on the downstairs circuit.
I tend to find extensions are often wired in peculiar ways. Our
conservatory lighting is wired off the main ring main which was extended
into the conservatory, at least there they used a FSU for the lights but
left a 13A fuse in which I replaced with a 5A. Our last house which had a kitchen extension also had some peculiar wiring which was in keeping with
the total mess the rest of the house was in when we moved in.
On 18 Feb 2025 13:04:32 GMT, "Jeff Gaines" <jgnewsid@outlook.com>
wrote:
On 18/02/2025 in message <atv8rjl72al0eln5shkjo09bnme21oite7@4ax.com>
Scott wrote:
It looks like I am in the hall of shame. To change a lightswitch, I
switched off the downstairs RCBO forgetting that the switch at the
bottom of the stairs was connected to a light fed from the upstairs
circuit. I touched one of the conductor wires and got a shock, nothing
more than a mild tingle. Is the RCBO able to prevent a significant
electric shock? I will not be recommending or repeating this.
I have been in this property for three years now and only recently
discovered that the downstairs study/dining room is connected to the
upstairs ring while all the other rooms are on the downstairs circuit.
As someone on the group to which I posted by mistake commented,
turning off the main switch is probably best practice (even if it does
mean resetting clocks afterwards).
On Tue, 18 Feb 2025 13:42:20 +0000
Scott <newsgroups@gefion.myzen.co.uk> wrote:
On 18 Feb 2025 13:04:32 GMT, "Jeff Gaines" <jgnewsid@outlook.com>
wrote:
On 18/02/2025 in message
<atv8rjl72al0eln5shkjo09bnme21oite7@4ax.com> Scott wrote:
It looks like I am in the hall of shame. To change a lightswitch, I
switched off the downstairs RCBO forgetting that the switch at the
bottom of the stairs was connected to a light fed from the upstairs
circuit. I touched one of the conductor wires and got a shock,
nothing more than a mild tingle. Is the RCBO able to prevent a
significant electric shock? I will not be recommending or repeating
this.
I have been in this property for three years now and only recently
discovered that the downstairs study/dining room is connected to the
upstairs ring while all the other rooms are on the downstairs
circuit.
As someone on the group to which I posted by mistake commented,
turning off the main switch is probably best practice (even if it does
mean resetting clocks afterwards).
Whatever kind of circuit you're going to work on, turn something on,
ideally the light or socket you'll be touching. Pull the fuse/breaker
and go straight back to confirm what you turned on is now dead.
Sometimes you will be surprised.
On 18/02/2025 13:42, Scott wrote:
On 18 Feb 2025 13:04:32 GMT, "Jeff Gaines" <jgnewsid@outlook.com>
wrote:
On 18/02/2025 in message <atv8rjl72al0eln5shkjo09bnme21oite7@4ax.com>
Scott wrote:
It looks like I am in the hall of shame. To change a lightswitch, I
switched off the downstairs RCBO forgetting that the switch at the
bottom of the stairs was connected to a light fed from the upstairs
circuit. I touched one of the conductor wires and got a shock, nothing >>>> more than a mild tingle. Is the RCBO able to prevent a significant
electric shock? I will not be recommending or repeating this.
I have been in this property for three years now and only recently
discovered that the downstairs study/dining room is connected to the
upstairs ring while all the other rooms are on the downstairs circuit.
As someone on the group to which I posted by mistake commented,
turning off the main switch is probably best practice (even if it does
mean resetting clocks afterwards).
People on ADSL might find that their download speeds suffer while
the line 're-learns' the correct speed though. Happened to me.
I have added a double socket downstairs next to the BT master
socket where the builder never put a power socket. I fed it
from the upstairs ring but via a fusible spur. The cable is
fixed to the surface of the wall which is then covered with
80mm of celotex which means that it should not be rated at
30A with the ring hence the fused spur with a 10A fuse.
On 18/02/2025 13:04, Jeff Gaines wrote:
On 18/02/2025 in message <atv8rjl72al0eln5shkjo09bnme21oite7@4ax.com>
Scott wrote:
It looks like I am in the hall of shame. To change a lightswitch, I >>>switched off the downstairs RCBO forgetting that the switch at the
bottom of the stairs was connected to a light fed from the upstairs >>>circuit. I touched one of the conductor wires and got a shock, nothing >>>more than a mild tingle. Is the RCBO able to prevent a significant >>>electric shock? I will not be recommending or repeating this.
I have been in this property for three years now and only recently >>discovered that the downstairs study/dining room is connected to the >>upstairs ring while all the other rooms are on the downstairs circuit.
Is it a bungalow ? :-)
In article <xn0p277nz21g1ve000@news.individual.net>,
Jeff Gaines <jgnewsid@outlook.com> wrote:
On 18/02/2025 in message <atv8rjl72al0eln5shkjo09bnme21oite7@4ax.com>
Scott wrote:
It looks like I am in the hall of shame. To change a lightswitch, I
switched off the downstairs RCBO forgetting that the switch at the
bottom of the stairs was connected to a light fed from the upstairs
circuit. I touched one of the conductor wires and got a shock, nothing
more than a mild tingle. Is the RCBO able to prevent a significant
electric shock? I will not be recommending or repeating this.
I have been in this property for three years now and only recently
discovered that the downstairs study/dining room is connected to the
upstairs ring while all the other rooms are on the downstairs circuit.
I have a couple of sockets downstairs which are fed from the "upstairs
ring". I have labelled them to this effect for someone in the future.
It looks like I am in the hall of shame. To change a lightswitch, I
switched off the downstairs RCBO forgetting that the switch at the
bottom of the stairs was connected to a light fed from the upstairs
circuit. I touched one of the conductor wires and got a shock, nothing
more than a mild tingle. Is the RCBO able to prevent a significant
electric shock? I will *not* be recommending or repeating this.
Andy Burns wrote:
Disconnect time for 30µA RCD/RCBO should be under 300ms, often they're
faster than that ...
since when did 30µA RCD/RCBOs exist?
On 18/02/2025 in message <vp2833$1obr3$1@dont-email.me> Andrew wrote:
On 18/02/2025 13:04, Jeff Gaines wrote:
On 18/02/2025 in message <atv8rjl72al0eln5shkjo09bnme21oite7@4ax.com>
Scott wrote:
It looks like I am in the hall of shame. To change a lightswitch, I
switched off the downstairs RCBO forgetting that the switch at the
bottom of the stairs was connected to a light fed from the upstairs
circuit. I touched one of the conductor wires and got a shock, nothing >>>> more than a mild tingle. Is the RCBO able to prevent a significant
electric shock? I will not be recommending or repeating this.
I have been in this property for three years now and only recently
discovered that the downstairs study/dining room is connected to the
upstairs ring while all the other rooms are on the downstairs circuit.
Is it a bungalow ? :-)
Chalet bungalow :-)
On Tue, 18 Feb 2025 15:21:36 +0000
Andrew <Andrew97d@btinternet.com> wrote:
I have added a double socket downstairs next to the BT master
socket where the builder never put a power socket. I fed it
from the upstairs ring but via a fusible spur. The cable is
fixed to the surface of the wall which is then covered with
80mm of celotex which means that it should not be rated at
30A with the ring hence the fused spur with a 10A fuse.
From what I remember, 2.5mm T&E is rated at 23A in conduit, I think it
is about 18A fully enclosed e.g. in insulation or thin plaster.
The ring is only rated at 30/32A as there are two paths anywhere, it's
still 23A cable.
On 18/02/2025 15:24, Andrew wrote:
On 18/02/2025 13:42, Scott wrote:
On 18 Feb 2025 13:04:32 GMT, "Jeff Gaines" <jgnewsid@outlook.com>
wrote:
On 18/02/2025 in message <atv8rjl72al0eln5shkjo09bnme21oite7@4ax.com>
Scott wrote:
It looks like I am in the hall of shame. To change a lightswitch, I
switched off the downstairs RCBO forgetting that the switch at the
bottom of the stairs was connected to a light fed from the upstairs
circuit. I touched one of the conductor wires and got a shock, nothing >>>> more than a mild tingle. Is the RCBO able to prevent a significant
electric shock? I will not be recommending or repeating this.
I have been in this property for three years now and only recently
discovered that the downstairs study/dining room is connected to the
upstairs ring while all the other rooms are on the downstairs circuit.
As someone on the group to which I posted by mistake commented,
turning off the main switch is probably best practice (even if it does
mean resetting clocks afterwards).
People on ADSL might find that their download speeds suffer while
the line 're-learns' the correct speed though. Happened to me.
For us, we don't want to shutdown our home server, network switch and
router - as that kills email for all our phones, including two of our
sons away at university and stops their access to our network, where
they store their university work. It also disables the "landline" and
often the server does not reboot first time (a race condition between
devices starting) and as it has no monitor connected, it's a pain to see what's happened.
Scott wrote:
It looks like I am in the hall of shame. To change a lightswitch, I switched off the downstairs RCBO forgetting that the switch at the
bottom of the stairs was connected to a light fed from the upstairs circuit. I touched one of the conductor wires and got a shock, nothing
more than a mild tingle. Is the RCBO able to prevent a significant
electric shock?
Disconnect time for 30µA RCD/RCBO should be under 300ms, often they're faster than that ...
On 18/02/2025 15:55, Jeff Gaines wrote:
On 18/02/2025 in message <vp2833$1obr3$1@dont-email.me> Andrew wrote:
On 18/02/2025 13:04, Jeff Gaines wrote:
On 18/02/2025 in message <atv8rjl72al0eln5shkjo09bnme21oite7@4ax.com> >>>>Scott wrote:
It looks like I am in the hall of shame. To change a lightswitch, I >>>>>switched off the downstairs RCBO forgetting that the switch at the >>>>>bottom of the stairs was connected to a light fed from the upstairs >>>>>circuit. I touched one of the conductor wires and got a shock, nothing >>>>>more than a mild tingle. Is the RCBO able to prevent a significant >>>>>electric shock? I will not be recommending or repeating this.
I have been in this property for three years now and only recently >>>>discovered that the downstairs study/dining room is connected to the >>>>upstairs ring while all the other rooms are on the downstairs circuit.
Is it a bungalow ? :-)
Chalet bungalow :-)
BRRR. Little or no insulation inside those sloping upstairs
'walls', especially if it was built in the 50's or 60's (or
70's, or ...)
I heard a tale that many were built during periods when bricks
were expensive
It looks like I am in the hall of shame. To change a lightswitch, I
switched off the downstairs RCBO forgetting that the switch at the
bottom of the stairs was connected to a light fed from the upstairs
circuit. I touched one of the conductor wires and got a shock, nothing
more than a mild tingle. Is the RCBO able to prevent a significant
electric shock? I will *not* be recommending or repeating this.
On 18/02/2025 12:41, Scott wrote:
It looks like I am in the hall of shame. To change a lightswitch, I
switched off the downstairs RCBO forgetting that the switch at the
bottom of the stairs was connected to a light fed from the upstairs
circuit. I touched one of the conductor wires and got a shock, nothing
more than a mild tingle. Is the RCBO able to prevent a significant
electric shock? I will *not* be recommending or repeating this.
You need a neon screwdriver (if they are still available).
SH wrote:
Max Demian wrote:Ah, that little snag had passed me by ... Clive will be upset.
You need a neon screwdriver (if they are still available).
https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/neon-production-by-
country
Max Demian wrote:Ah, that little snag had passed me by ... Clive will be upset.
You need a neon screwdriver (if they are still available).
https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/neon-production-by- country
On 18/02/2025 in message <vp2br3$1obr3$2@dont-email.me> Andrew wrote:
On 18/02/2025 15:55, Jeff Gaines wrote:
On 18/02/2025 in message <vp2833$1obr3$1@dont-email.me> Andrew wrote:
On 18/02/2025 13:04, Jeff Gaines wrote:
On 18/02/2025 in message
<atv8rjl72al0eln5shkjo09bnme21oite7@4ax.com> Scott wrote:
It looks like I am in the hall of shame. To change a lightswitch, I >>>>>> switched off the downstairs RCBO forgetting that the switch at the >>>>>> bottom of the stairs was connected to a light fed from the upstairs >>>>>> circuit. I touched one of the conductor wires and got a shock,
nothing
more than a mild tingle. Is the RCBO able to prevent a significant >>>>>> electric shock? I will not be recommending or repeating this.
I have been in this property for three years now and only recently
discovered that the downstairs study/dining room is connected to
the upstairs ring while all the other rooms are on the downstairs
circuit.
Is it a bungalow ? :-)
Chalet bungalow :-)
BRRR. Little or no insulation inside those sloping upstairs
'walls', especially if it was built in the 50's or 60's (or
70's, or ...)
I heard a tale that many were built during periods when bricks
were expensive
Built 1983. Very solid, cavity insulation, dormer walls have 6" rock
wool, loft has about 12" except it's about 4' where they stacked up what
was left over. Under floor allegedly insulated and if you want to fix anything to the outside walls you put the plugs in the mortar unless you
have a diamond drill!
Avocado suites and Artex ceilings, absolutely pristine. Have to be
careful about the Artex in case it was old stock.
In article <vp29oq$1om2t$2@dont-email.me>,
SteveW <steve@walker-family.me.uk> wrote:
On 18/02/2025 15:24, Andrew wrote:
On 18/02/2025 13:42, Scott wrote:
On 18 Feb 2025 13:04:32 GMT, "Jeff Gaines" <jgnewsid@outlook.com>
wrote:
On 18/02/2025 in message <atv8rjl72al0eln5shkjo09bnme21oite7@4ax.com> >>>>> Scott wrote:As someone on the group to which I posted by mistake commented,
It looks like I am in the hall of shame. To change a lightswitch, I >>>>>> switched off the downstairs RCBO forgetting that the switch at the >>>>>> bottom of the stairs was connected to a light fed from the upstairs >>>>>> circuit. I touched one of the conductor wires and got a shock, nothing >>>>>> more than a mild tingle. Is the RCBO able to prevent a significant >>>>>> electric shock? I will not be recommending or repeating this.
I have been in this property for three years now and only recently
discovered that the downstairs study/dining room is connected to the >>>>> upstairs ring while all the other rooms are on the downstairs circuit. >>>>
turning off the main switch is probably best practice (even if it does >>>> mean resetting clocks afterwards).
People on ADSL might find that their download speeds suffer while
the line 're-learns' the correct speed though. Happened to me.
For us, we don't want to shutdown our home server, network switch and
router - as that kills email for all our phones, including two of our
sons away at university and stops their access to our network, where
they store their university work. It also disables the "landline" and
often the server does not reboot first time (a race condition between
devices starting) and as it has no monitor connected, it's a pain to see
what's happened.
If it's that important, you should have a UPS - in case of mains failure.
With an old enough installation, you could still be surprised. There was
a bang and a flash when my uncle cut a "dead" cable in the house he'd
moved into - he hadn't realised that it had fuses on both live and
neutral and he'd "isolated" the circuit by pulling the wrong one!
SteveW <steve@walker-family.me.uk> wrote:
Was it a remnant of former DC supply that had been converted?
With an old enough installation, you could still be surprised. There was
a bang and a flash when my uncle cut a "dead" cable in the house he'd
moved into - he hadn't realised that it had fuses on both live and
neutral and he'd "isolated" the circuit by pulling the wrong one!
On 19 Feb 2025 00:44:40 GMT, Marland <gemehabal@btinternet.co.uk> wrote:
SteveW <steve@walker-family.me.uk> wrote:I have never understood neutral fusing though I had an idea it was a DC feature. Was the black wire not referenced to earth then? Could you get
Was it a remnant of former DC supply that had been converted?
With an old enough installation, you could still be surprised. There
was a bang and a flash when my uncle cut a "dead" cable in the house
he'd moved into - he hadn't realised that it had fuses on both live
and neutral and he'd "isolated" the circuit by pulling the wrong one!
an electric shock from the black wire? Were three pin plugs with an
earth used in DC supplies? Would the whole house need to be rewired for conversion from DC to AC?
There has never been DC supplies to UK homes.
On Wed, 19 Feb 2025 11:07:24 +0000, crn wrote:
There has never been DC supplies to UK homes.
Wrong.
I grew up in Brighton and the whole town was DC until the late 1950s.
We had sockets with socking great switches that opened fast to
minimise the arc. And my model train set ran off 12v from a small
rotary converter.
There has never been DC supplies to UK homes.
On Wed, 19 Feb 2025 09:20:47 +0000, Scott wrote:
On 19 Feb 2025 00:44:40 GMT, Marland <gemehabal@btinternet.co.uk> wrote:
SteveW <steve@walker-family.me.uk> wrote:I have never understood neutral fusing though I had an idea it was a DC
Was it a remnant of former DC supply that had been converted?
With an old enough installation, you could still be surprised. There
was a bang and a flash when my uncle cut a "dead" cable in the house
he'd moved into - he hadn't realised that it had fuses on both live
and neutral and he'd "isolated" the circuit by pulling the wrong one!
feature. Was the black wire not referenced to earth then? Could you get
an electric shock from the black wire? Were three pin plugs with an
earth used in DC supplies? Would the whole house need to be rewired for
conversion from DC to AC?
There has never been DC supplies to UK homes.
Some off-grid rural places used farm systems which were on site 32 volt DC >gererators with batteries. Now very rare.
The Radiospares (not RS) catalogue
On Wed, 19 Feb 2025 11:07:24 +0000, crn wrote:
There has never been DC supplies to UK homes.
Wrong.
I grew up in Brighton and the whole town was DC until the late 1950s.
We had sockets with socking great switches that opened fast to minimise
the arc. And my model train set ran off 12v from a small rotary converter.
On Wed, 19 Feb 2025 11:07:24 +0000, crn wrote:
There has never been DC supplies to UK homes.
Wrong.
I grew up in Brighton and the whole town was DC until the late 1950s.
We had sockets with socking great switches that opened fast to minimise
the arc. And my model train set ran off 12v from a small rotary converter.
On 19/02/2025 11:13, Bob Eager wrote:
my model train set ran off 12v from a small rotary converter.
I thought that originally they were connected to 100 VDC via a bulb
that dropped the voltage. Until the train derailed and the middle rail
went up to 100V.
Joe wrote:
The Radiospares (not RS) catalogue
I thought RS *is* the evolution of Radiospares?
On 19/02/2025 11:13, Bob Eager wrote:
On Wed, 19 Feb 2025 11:07:24 +0000, crn wrote:Volks railway still is :-)
There has never been DC supplies to UK homes.
Wrong.
I grew up in Brighton and the whole town was DC until the late 1950s.
In message <vp4j6c$28b33$2@dont-email.me>, Max Demian <max_demian@bigfoot.com> writes
On 19/02/2025 11:13, Bob Eager wrote:
my model train set ran off 12v from a small rotary converter.
I thought that originally they were connected to 100 VDC via a bulb that >>dropped the voltage. Until the train derailed and the middle rail went
up to 100V.
That was the earlier (1930s) Hornby, and others. The Hornby 0 gauge Metropolitan loco was issued as High Voltage then 6v, then the more
usual 20v.
Bob's, in the 50s, was probably Hornby Dublo. Possibly Trix or even
early Tri-ang.
On 19/02/2025 11:13, Bob Eager wrote:
On Wed, 19 Feb 2025 11:07:24 +0000, crn wrote:
There has never been DC supplies to UK homes.
Wrong.
I grew up in Brighton and the whole town was DC until the late 1950s.
We had sockets with socking great switches that opened fast to minimise
the arc. And my model train set ran off 12v from a small rotary converter.
I thought that originally they were connected to 100 VDC via a bulb that dropped the voltage. Until the train derailed and the middle rail went
up to 100V.
(Good job kids were tough in those days.)
On Wed, 19 Feb 2025 11:50:49 +0000
Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> wrote:
Joe wrote:
The Radiospares (not RS) catalogue
I thought RS *is* the evolution of Radiospares?
Yes, I was just pointing out that it really was a supplier of radio and
TV spares then, the catalogue was stapled, and about 8mm thick.
There has never been DC supplies to UK homes.
SteveW <steve@walker-family.me.uk> wrote:
With an old enough installation, you could still be surprised. There was
a bang and a flash when my uncle cut a "dead" cable in the house he'd
moved into - he hadn't realised that it had fuses on both live and
neutral and he'd "isolated" the circuit by pulling the wrong one!
Was it a remnant of former DC supply that had been converted?
On Wed, 19 Feb 2025 09:20:47 +0000, Scott wrote:
On 19 Feb 2025 00:44:40 GMT, Marland <gemehabal@btinternet.co.uk> wrote:
SteveW <steve@walker-family.me.uk> wrote:I have never understood neutral fusing though I had an idea it was a DC
Was it a remnant of former DC supply that had been converted?
With an old enough installation, you could still be surprised. There
was a bang and a flash when my uncle cut a "dead" cable in the house
he'd moved into - he hadn't realised that it had fuses on both live
and neutral and he'd "isolated" the circuit by pulling the wrong one!
feature. Was the black wire not referenced to earth then? Could you get
an electric shock from the black wire? Were three pin plugs with an
earth used in DC supplies? Would the whole house need to be rewired for
conversion from DC to AC?
There has never been DC supplies to UK homes.
Some off-grid rural places used farm systems which were on site 32 volt DC gererators with batteries. Now very rare.
On 19/02/2025 11:13, Bob Eager wrote:
On Wed, 19 Feb 2025 11:07:24 +0000, crn wrote:
There has never been DC supplies to UK homes.
Wrong.
I grew up in Brighton and the whole town was DC until the late 1950s.
We had sockets with socking great switches that opened fast to minimise
the arc. And my model train set ran off 12v from a small rotary
converter.
I thought that originally they were connected to 100 VDC via a bulb that dropped the voltage. Until the train derailed and the middle rail went
up to 100V.
crn <crn@netunix.com> wrote:
Don’t talk bollocks .
There has never been DC supplies to UK homes.
Many places once had DC supplies at various voltages in the early days of >electric supply when power came from smaller local power stations.
The final pockets lasted until the 1970’s. One was part of Exeter around >the City Basin area
another was Reading which had some DC areas into the 1960’s.
GH
On 19/02/2025 12:35, Max Demian wrote:
On 19/02/2025 11:13, Bob Eager wrote:
On Wed, 19 Feb 2025 11:07:24 +0000, crn wrote:
There has never been DC supplies to UK homes.
Wrong.
I grew up in Brighton and the whole town was DC until the late 1950s.
We had sockets with socking great switches that opened fast to minimise
the arc. And my model train set ran off 12v from a small rotary
converter.
I thought that originally they were connected to 100 VDC via a bulb that
dropped the voltage. Until the train derailed and the middle rail went
up to 100V.
I've certainly seen one like that in a toy museum.
On Wed, 19 Feb 2025 13:35:16 +0000, Graeme wrote:
In message <vp4j6c$28b33$2@dont-email.me>, Max Demian
<max_demian@bigfoot.com> writes
On 19/02/2025 11:13, Bob Eager wrote:
my model train set ran off 12v from a small rotary converter.
I thought that originally they were connected to 100 VDC via a bulb that >>> dropped the voltage. Until the train derailed and the middle rail went
up to 100V.
That was the earlier (1930s) Hornby, and others. The Hornby 0 gauge
Metropolitan loco was issued as High Voltage then 6v, then the more
usual 20v.
Bob's, in the 50s, was probably Hornby Dublo. Possibly Trix or even
early Tri-ang.
It was definitely Tri-Ang. My father made a massive layout on a board, for
a Christmas present for my brother and me. It was on rollers and the
signals folded down so it fitted under our bunk beds.
On 19/02/2025 11:13, Bob Eager wrote:
On Wed, 19 Feb 2025 11:07:24 +0000, crn wrote:
There has never been DC supplies to UK homes.
Wrong.
I grew up in Brighton and the whole town was DC until the late 1950s.
We had sockets with socking great switches that opened fast to minimise
the arc. And my model train set ran off 12v from a small rotary converter.
I thought that originally they were connected to 100 VDC via a bulb that >dropped the voltage. Until the train derailed and the middle rail went
up to 100V.
(Good job kids were tough in those days.)
In article <m1m9v3F9umtU1@mid.individual.net>, Marland <gemehabal@btinternet.co.uk> scribeth thus
crn <crn@netunix.com> wrote:
Don‘t talk bollocks .
There has never been DC supplies to UK homes.
Many places once had DC supplies at various voltages in the early days of >electric supply when power came from smaller local power stations.
The final pockets lasted until the 1970‘s. One was part of Exeter around >the City Basin area
another was Reading which had some DC areas into the 1960‘s.
GH
This is from Cambridge in 1891. Then we had Thompson's lane next the
river( Very useful for the coal supplied by barge) come online at 200
volts AC!. I think one of the early gennies is in the science museum!..
1891 The building where the first electricity for lighting in Cambridge
was generated is now on the market. The property, No.2 Market Passage,
was the premises of Bailey, Grundy and Barrett, electrical contractors.
In 1891 the firm produced the first electricity for lighting in the city
with a gas engine and a dynamo installed in the basement. In those early
days private electrical generating plants were supplied by the company
to several of the Cambridge colleges. Until after the 1914-18 war such
plants continued to be installed in country houses in outlying
districts. As this business declined, the company moved into wireless,
the design and making of temperature control equipment for laboratories
and other specialised apparatus.
--
To
On Wed, 19 Feb 2025 16:58:06 +0000, SteveW <steve@walker-family.me.uk>
wrote:
On 19/02/2025 12:35, Max Demian wrote:
On 19/02/2025 11:13, Bob Eager wrote:
On Wed, 19 Feb 2025 11:07:24 +0000, crn wrote:
There has never been DC supplies to UK homes.
Wrong.
I grew up in Brighton and the whole town was DC until the late 1950s.
We had sockets with socking great switches that opened fast to minimise >>>> the arc. And my model train set ran off 12v from a small rotary
converter.
I thought that originally they were connected to 100 VDC via a bulb that >>> dropped the voltage. Until the train derailed and the middle rail went
up to 100V.
I've certainly seen one like that in a toy museum.
Where did the 100 Volts DC come from?
In article <PfJAZRCoUhtnFweF@bancom.co.uk>,
tony sayer <tony@bancom.co.uk> wrote:
In article <m1m9v3F9umtU1@mid.individual.net>, Marland
<gemehabal@btinternet.co.uk> scribeth thus
crn <crn@netunix.com> wrote:
Don‘t talk bollocks .
There has never been DC supplies to UK homes.
Many places once had DC supplies at various voltages in the early days of >> >electric supply when power came from smaller local power stations.
The final pockets lasted until the 1970‘s. One was part of Exeter around >> >the City Basin area
another was Reading which had some DC areas into the 1960‘s.
GH
This is from Cambridge in 1891. Then we had Thompson's lane next the
river( Very useful for the coal supplied by barge) come online at 200
volts AC!. I think one of the early gennies is in the science museum!..
In the early 1960s it was still 200v ac.
1891 The building where the first electricity for lighting in Cambridge
was generated is now on the market. The property, No.2 Market Passage,
was the premises of Bailey, Grundy and Barrett, electrical contractors.
In 1891 the firm produced the first electricity for lighting in the city
with a gas engine and a dynamo installed in the basement. In those early
days private electrical generating plants were supplied by the company
to several of the Cambridge colleges. Until after the 1914-18 war such
plants continued to be installed in country houses in outlying
districts. As this business declined, the company moved into wireless,
the design and making of temperature control equipment for laboratories
and other specialised apparatus.
--
To
On 19/02/2025 18:30, charles wrote:
In article <PfJAZRCoUhtnFweF@bancom.co.uk>,
tony sayer <tony@bancom.co.uk> wrote:
In article <m1m9v3F9umtU1@mid.individual.net>, Marland
<gemehabal@btinternet.co.uk> scribeth thus
crn <crn@netunix.com> wrote:
Don‘t talk bollocks .
There has never been DC supplies to UK homes.
Many places once had DC supplies at various voltages in the early days of >>>> electric supply when power came from smaller local power stations.
The final pockets lasted until the 1970‘s. One was part of Exeter around >>>> the City Basin area
another was Reading which had some DC areas into the 1960‘s.
GH
This is from Cambridge in 1891. Then we had Thompson's lane next the
river( Very useful for the coal supplied by barge) come online at 200
volts AC!. I think one of the early gennies is in the science museum!..
The London science museum had a large dc supply provided by a
three-phase mercury arc rectifier which was itself on display
in a large glass cabinet.
On 19/02/2025 17:49, Scott wrote:
On Wed, 19 Feb 2025 16:58:06 +0000, SteveW <steve@walker-family.me.uk>
wrote:
On 19/02/2025 12:35, Max Demian wrote:
On 19/02/2025 11:13, Bob Eager wrote:
On Wed, 19 Feb 2025 11:07:24 +0000, crn wrote:
There has never been DC supplies to UK homes.
Wrong.
I grew up in Brighton and the whole town was DC until the late 1950s. >>>>>
We had sockets with socking great switches that opened fast to minimise >>>>> the arc. And my model train set ran off 12v from a small rotary
converter.
I thought that originally they were connected to 100 VDC via a bulb that >>>> dropped the voltage. Until the train derailed and the middle rail went >>>> up to 100V.
I've certainly seen one like that in a toy museum.
Where did the 100 Volts DC come from?
When houses were supplied with DC, by unplugging the light bulb,
plugging in the railway controller and plugging the light bulb into the
top of the controller as a dropper resistor.
On 19/02/2025 19:27, John R Walliker wrote:vapor_lamp#Ultraviolet_hazards>)!
On 19/02/2025 18:30, charles wrote:
In article <PfJAZRCoUhtnFweF@bancom.co.uk>,
tony sayer <tony@bancom.co.uk> wrote:
In article <m1m9v3F9umtU1@mid.individual.net>, Marland
<gemehabal@btinternet.co.uk> scribeth thus
crn <crn@netunix.com> wrote:
Don‘t talk bollocks .
There has never been DC supplies to UK homes.
Many places once had DC supplies at various voltages in the early
days of electric supply when power came from smaller local power
stations.
The final pockets lasted until the 1970‘s. One was part of Exeter
around the City Basin area another was Reading which had some DC
areas into the 1960‘s.
GH
This is from Cambridge in 1891. Then we had Thompson's lane next the
river( Very useful for the coal supplied by barge) come online at
200 volts AC!. I think one of the early gennies is in the science
museum!..
The London science museum had a large dc supply provided by a
three-phase mercury arc rectifier which was itself on display in a
large glass cabinet.
Indeed. Every time I visited the museum as a child I used to find it fascinating to watch the arc. It wasn't until much later that I wondered about the extreme amount of UV light being being generated and whether
or not it was screened off
(<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mercury-
It looks like I am in the hall of shame. To change a lightswitch, I
switched off the downstairs RCBO forgetting that the switch at the
bottom of the stairs was connected to a light fed from the upstairs
circuit. I touched one of the conductor wires and got a shock, nothing
more than a mild tingle. Is the RCBO able to prevent a significant
electric shock? I will *not* be recommending or repeating this.
In message <atv8rjl72al0eln5shkjo09bnme21oite7@4ax.com>, Scott <newsgroups@gefion.myzen.co.uk> writes
It looks like I am in the hall of shame. To change a lightswitch, I
switched off the downstairs RCBO forgetting that the switch at the
bottom of the stairs was connected to a light fed from the upstairs
circuit. I touched one of the conductor wires and got a shock, nothing
more than a mild tingle. Is the RCBO able to prevent a significant
electric shock? I will *not* be recommending or repeating this.
Not if you put your fingers across live and neutral like what I did
recently.
They only trip if you go between live and earth,
or short neutral and
earth.
Brian
On Wed, 19 Feb 2025 22:50:54 +0000, SteveW <steve@walker-family.me.uk>
wrote:
On 19/02/2025 17:49, Scott wrote:
On Wed, 19 Feb 2025 16:58:06 +0000, SteveW <steve@walker-family.me.uk>
wrote:
On 19/02/2025 12:35, Max Demian wrote:
On 19/02/2025 11:13, Bob Eager wrote:
On Wed, 19 Feb 2025 11:07:24 +0000, crn wrote:
There has never been DC supplies to UK homes.
Wrong.
I grew up in Brighton and the whole town was DC until the late 1950s. >>>>>>
We had sockets with socking great switches that opened fast to minimise >>>>>> the arc. And my model train set ran off 12v from a small rotary
converter.
I thought that originally they were connected to 100 VDC via a bulb that >>>>> dropped the voltage. Until the train derailed and the middle rail went >>>>> up to 100V.
I've certainly seen one like that in a toy museum.
Where did the 100 Volts DC come from?
When houses were supplied with DC, by unplugging the light bulb,
plugging in the railway controller and plugging the light bulb into the
top of the controller as a dropper resistor.
I still don't follow this. Are you saying the supply voltage was 100
Volts (which would surprise me greatly) or that the supply voltage was something like 200 Volts dropped to 100 Volts by the light bulb. What
is the relevance of the train being derailed? Surely this would not
affect the voltage of the live rail?
On 19/02/2025 18:30, charles wrote:
In article <PfJAZRCoUhtnFweF@bancom.co.uk>,
   tony sayer <tony@bancom.co.uk> wrote:
In article <m1m9v3F9umtU1@mid.individual.net>, Marland
<gemehabal@btinternet.co.uk> scribeth thus
crn <crn@netunix.com> wrote:
There has never been DC supplies to UK homes.Don‘t talk bollocks .
Many places once had DC supplies at various voltages in the early
days of
electric supply when power came from smaller local power stations.
The final pockets lasted until the 1970‘s. One was part of Exeter
around
the City Basin area
another was Reading which had some DC areas into the 1960‘s.
This is from Cambridge in 1891. Then we had Thompson's lane next the
river( Very useful for the coal supplied by barge)Â come online at 200
volts AC!. I think one of the early gennies is in the science museum!..
The London science museum had a large dc supply provided by a
three-phase mercury arc rectifier which was itself on display
in a large glass cabinet.
Scott wrote:
It looks like I am in the hall of shame. To change a lightswitch, IAlways confirm a circuit is dead. Easiest way is with a non-contact
switched off the downstairs RCBO forgetting that the switch at the
bottom of the stairs was connected to a light fed from the upstairs
circuit. I touched one of the conductor wires and got a shock, nothing
more than a mild tingle. Is the RCBO able to prevent a significant
electric shock? I will *not* be recommending or repeating this.
sensor. First check the sensor is working using a known live >somethingorother, then check your circuit is dead, then re-check your
sensor is still working on a live wire.
We had sockets with socking great switches that opened fast to minimise >>>>>> the arc. And my model train set ran off 12v from a small rotary
converter.
I thought that originally they were connected to 100 VDC via a bulb that >>>>> dropped the voltage. Until the train derailed and the middle rail went >>>>> up to 100V.
I've certainly seen one like that in a toy museum.
Where did the 100 Volts DC come from?
When houses were supplied with DC, by unplugging the light bulb,
plugging in the railway controller and plugging the light bulb into the
top of the controller as a dropper resistor.
I still don't follow this. Are you saying the supply voltage was 100
Volts (which would surprise me greatly) or that the supply voltage was something like 200 Volts dropped to 100 Volts by the light bulb. What
is the relevance of the train being derailed? Surely this would not
affect the voltage of the live rail?
In article <m1jlalFs7t4U1@mid.individual.net>, No mail
<nomail@aolbin.com> scribeth thus
Scott wrote:
It looks like I am in the hall of shame. To change a lightswitch, IAlways confirm a circuit is dead. Easiest way is with a non-contact
switched off the downstairs RCBO forgetting that the switch at the
bottom of the stairs was connected to a light fed from the upstairs
circuit. I touched one of the conductor wires and got a shock, nothing
more than a mild tingle. Is the RCBO able to prevent a significant
electric shock? I will *not* be recommending or repeating this.
sensor. First check the sensor is working using a known live
somethingorother, then check your circuit is dead, then re-check your
sensor is still working on a live wire.
When i used to work at Pye Television transmitters we had a three phase transformer that used to wind up the 415 volt AC mains to around 15 kV
for the high voltage Klystron supplies we were supplying these units to
Korea IIRC.
Anyway one of the Korean men showed us how to check the 15 kV supply was
off, he just banged the earthing stick across the incoming mains on the transformer.
Bloody great bang and flash and the whole factory went out, he was shall
we say shaken and stirred!...
Scott <newsgroups@gefion.myzen.co.uk> wrote:
Hornby basically copied the method already used by the German toy makers of the early 20th century who were no longer popular in Britain after WW1. Ironically just as the Germans were deciding that it was too dangerous.
We had sockets with socking great switches that opened fast to minimise >>>>>>> the arc. And my model train set ran off 12v from a small rotary
converter.
I thought that originally they were connected to 100 VDC via a bulb that >>>>>> dropped the voltage. Until the train derailed and the middle rail went >>>>>> up to 100V.
I've certainly seen one like that in a toy museum.
Where did the 100 Volts DC come from?
When houses were supplied with DC, by unplugging the light bulb,
plugging in the railway controller and plugging the light bulb into the
top of the controller as a dropper resistor.
I still don't follow this. Are you saying the supply voltage was 100
Volts (which would surprise me greatly) or that the supply voltage was
something like 200 Volts dropped to 100 Volts by the light bulb. What
is the relevance of the train being derailed? Surely this would not
affect the voltage of the live rail?
Have a read of this which may answer your questions
< https://marklinstop.com/2015/07/220-volts-to-the-present-from-life-threatening-danger-to-safety/>
In article <m1jlalFs7t4U1@mid.individual.net>, No mail
<nomail@aolbin.com> scribeth thus
Scott wrote:
It looks like I am in the hall of shame. To change a lightswitch, IAlways confirm a circuit is dead. Easiest way is with a non-contact
switched off the downstairs RCBO forgetting that the switch at the
bottom of the stairs was connected to a light fed from the upstairs
circuit. I touched one of the conductor wires and got a shock, nothing
more than a mild tingle. Is the RCBO able to prevent a significant
electric shock? I will *not* be recommending or repeating this.
sensor. First check the sensor is working using a known live
somethingorother, then check your circuit is dead, then re-check your
sensor is still working on a live wire.
When i used to work at Pye Television transmitters we had a three phase transformer that used to wind up the 415 volt AC mains to around 15 kV
for the high voltage Klystron supplies we were supplying these units to
Korea IIRC.
Anyway one of the Korean men showed us how to check the 15 kV supply was
off, he just banged the earthing stick across the incoming mains on the transformer.
Bloody great bang and flash and the whole factory went out, he was shall
we say shaken and stirred!...
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