• OT: Unwanted AI intrusion

    From Davey@21:1/5 to All on Tue Mar 4 18:02:18 2025
    I, in the UK, recently sent a message to a friend in Michigan, USA,
    describing my recent medical event, which was a burst varicose vein
    blood blister. Blood everywhere, neighbour came over to help, went to
    clinic yesterday to get it seen to and bandaged properly, follow-up
    next week.
    When he received the message on his Yahoo! e-mail screen, it was
    preceded by an AI-generated summary. It was not totally accurate. I
    have suggested that he look hard and deep for a setting or switch
    somewhere in the Settings to turn it off, pronto. He insists that there
    was no suggestion that this was going to happen.

    Is this what we have to expect now?

    Help.........

    --
    Davey.

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  • From John Rumm@21:1/5 to Davey on Tue Mar 4 18:11:22 2025
    On 04/03/2025 18:02, Davey wrote:
    I, in the UK, recently sent a message to a friend in Michigan, USA, describing my recent medical event, which was a burst varicose vein
    blood blister. Blood everywhere, neighbour came over to help, went to
    clinic yesterday to get it seen to and bandaged properly, follow-up
    next week.
    When he received the message on his Yahoo! e-mail screen, it was
    preceded by an AI-generated summary. It was not totally accurate. I
    have suggested that he look hard and deep for a setting or switch
    somewhere in the Settings to turn it off, pronto. He insists that there
    was no suggestion that this was going to happen.

    Is this what we have to expect now?

    Help.........


    You can see the "logic" - "some people get 1000's of messages a day and
    can't keep up with them, with our snazzy AI we can highlight the
    important ones, and then summarise those to make them quicker to read"

    Of course the reality is that they will now either fail to see the
    important ones at all since they have been categorised into some smart
    folder they would not think of looking in, and when they do find them
    they now have to spend even longer reading through the AI summary *and*
    the whole original message to work out how the AI got the wrong end of
    the stick.


    --
    Cheers,

    John.

    /=================================================================\
    | Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk | |-----------------------------------------------------------------|
    | John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk | \=================================================================/

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  • From mm0fmf@21:1/5 to Davey on Tue Mar 4 18:08:24 2025
    On 04/03/2025 18:02, Davey wrote:
    as no suggestion that this was going to happen.

    Is this what we have to expect now?


    It is if you use shitbag services like Yahoo.

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  • From Paul@21:1/5 to Davey on Tue Mar 4 14:18:53 2025
    On Tue, 3/4/2025 1:02 PM, Davey wrote:
    I, in the UK, recently sent a message to a friend in Michigan, USA, describing my recent medical event, which was a burst varicose vein
    blood blister. Blood everywhere, neighbour came over to help, went to
    clinic yesterday to get it seen to and bandaged properly, follow-up
    next week.
    When he received the message on his Yahoo! e-mail screen, it was
    preceded by an AI-generated summary. It was not totally accurate. I
    have suggested that he look hard and deep for a setting or switch
    somewhere in the Settings to turn it off, pronto. He insists that there
    was no suggestion that this was going to happen.

    Is this what we have to expect now?

    Help.........


    Reddit says:

    "I turned it off by going to
    settings->message preview->then toggle off AI summaries"

    at the recipient (Yahoo) end.

    Paul

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  • From Davey@21:1/5 to Paul on Tue Mar 4 19:29:33 2025
    On Tue, 4 Mar 2025 14:18:53 -0500
    Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> wrote:

    On Tue, 3/4/2025 1:02 PM, Davey wrote:
    I, in the UK, recently sent a message to a friend in Michigan, USA, describing my recent medical event, which was a burst varicose vein
    blood blister. Blood everywhere, neighbour came over to help, went
    to clinic yesterday to get it seen to and bandaged properly,
    follow-up next week.
    When he received the message on his Yahoo! e-mail screen, it was
    preceded by an AI-generated summary. It was not totally accurate. I
    have suggested that he look hard and deep for a setting or switch
    somewhere in the Settings to turn it off, pronto. He insists that
    there was no suggestion that this was going to happen.

    Is this what we have to expect now?

    Help.........


    Reddit says:

    "I turned it off by going to
    settings->message preview->then toggle off AI summaries"

    at the recipient (Yahoo) end.

    Paul


    Thanks, I will pass that to him post-haste.
    --
    Davey.

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  • From Davey@21:1/5 to none@invalid.com on Tue Mar 4 19:30:21 2025
    On Tue, 4 Mar 2025 18:08:24 +0000
    mm0fmf <none@invalid.com> wrote:

    On 04/03/2025 18:02, Davey wrote:
    as no suggestion that this was going to happen.

    Is this what we have to expect now?


    It is if you use shitbag services like Yahoo.



    Quite likely. But it is not me that is using Yahoo!, it is the other
    guy.

    --
    Davey.

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  • From Jethro_uk@21:1/5 to Davey on Tue Mar 4 21:05:39 2025
    On Tue, 04 Mar 2025 18:02:18 +0000, Davey wrote:

    I, in the UK, recently sent a message to a friend in Michigan, USA, describing my recent medical event, which was a burst varicose vein
    blood blister. Blood everywhere, neighbour came over to help, went to
    clinic yesterday to get it seen to and bandaged properly, follow-up next week.
    When he received the message on his Yahoo! e-mail screen, it was
    preceded by an AI-generated summary. It was not totally accurate. I have suggested that he look hard and deep for a setting or switch somewhere
    in the Settings to turn it off, pronto. He insists that there was no suggestion that this was going to happen.

    Is this what we have to expect now?

    Help.........

    Ask ChatGPT ?

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  • From mm0fmf@21:1/5 to Davey on Tue Mar 4 22:02:36 2025
    On 04/03/2025 19:30, Davey wrote:
    On Tue, 4 Mar 2025 18:08:24 +0000
    mm0fmf <none@invalid.com> wrote:

    On 04/03/2025 18:02, Davey wrote:
    as no suggestion that this was going to happen.

    Is this what we have to expect now?


    It is if you use shitbag services like Yahoo.



    Quite likely. But it is not me that is using Yahoo!, it is the other
    guy.


    Yes but saying "if one uses shitbag services" sounded a bit poncy.

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  • From mm0fmf@21:1/5 to All on Tue Mar 4 22:01:44 2025
    On 04/03/2025 21:05, Jethro_uk wrote:


    Ask ChatGPT ?
    LOL

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  • From Davey@21:1/5 to Paul on Tue Mar 4 23:12:32 2025
    On Tue, 4 Mar 2025 14:18:53 -0500
    Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> wrote:

    On Tue, 3/4/2025 1:02 PM, Davey wrote:
    I, in the UK, recently sent a message to a friend in Michigan, USA, describing my recent medical event, which was a burst varicose vein
    blood blister. Blood everywhere, neighbour came over to help, went
    to clinic yesterday to get it seen to and bandaged properly,
    follow-up next week.
    When he received the message on his Yahoo! e-mail screen, it was
    preceded by an AI-generated summary. It was not totally accurate. I
    have suggested that he look hard and deep for a setting or switch
    somewhere in the Settings to turn it off, pronto. He insists that
    there was no suggestion that this was going to happen.

    Is this what we have to expect now?

    Help.........


    Reddit says:

    "I turned it off by going to
    settings->message preview->then toggle off AI summaries"

    at the recipient (Yahoo) end.

    Paul


    And this is his reply:

    "Okay, I followed what you found:
    Settings > message preview.... and there is NO message preview.

    That is exactly the nightmare of any 'site', that offers 'assistance'.
    To find what's needed is a stinking nightmare.

    So, I called Yahoo.
    And guess what?
    The prompt says have the credit card ready, for 'assistance'.
    Unbelievable.
    And, have the driver license ready, too.

    None of that. I got hold of an agent, and let him have it.
    AI, the 'summary' is an intrusion on privacy. NO site can, and should
    assume it can 'summarize. anyone's e-mail messages. He seemed to have
    'got' it.

    I asked where, to click off this AI summary crap, and he doesn't seem
    to know. Just, he says, it's the 'enhanced' version of Yahoo.

    I said, show me where, since it's not at all clear and easy to find,
    where to go back to the original, BASIIC mail appearance page. I did
    that. And, asked, will this eliminate, will that AI summary stuff
    disappear. He said it should."

    And so it goes on, They "know" what We want, but don't bother to ask us.
    We will see what happens. If anything.

    --
    Davey.

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  • From Adrian Caspersz@21:1/5 to John Rumm on Tue Mar 4 22:39:24 2025
    On 04/03/2025 18:11, John Rumm wrote:
    Is this what we have to expect now?

    Help.........


    You can see the "logic" - "some people get 1000's of messages a day and
    can't keep up with them, with our snazzy AI we can highlight the
    important ones, and then summarise those to make them quicker to read"

    Of course the reality is that they will now either fail to see the
    important ones at all since they have been categorised into some smart
    folder they would not think of looking in, and when they do find them
    they now have to spend even longer reading through the AI summary *and*
    the whole original message to work out how the AI got the wrong end of
    the stick.


    I think out of courtesy, some header feature should be given to senders
    that disables this receiving retranslation, and allows handling of
    messages with privacy.

    Actually, the OP could almost do that.

    I wonder if ye set PGP encryption on the email, would that bypass the AI translation on the client? A quick google suggests the yahoo client
    supports PGP, and so does Thunderbird etc...

    One of the features for encryption is to avoid man-in-the-middle
    attacks. I suppose and hope this excludes AI-in-the-middle.

    Worth testing!

    --
    Adrian C

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  • From The Natural Philosopher@21:1/5 to Davey on Wed Mar 5 01:11:26 2025
    On 04/03/2025 19:30, Davey wrote:
    On Tue, 4 Mar 2025 18:08:24 +0000
    mm0fmf <none@invalid.com> wrote:

    On 04/03/2025 18:02, Davey wrote:
    as no suggestion that this was going to happen.

    Is this what we have to expect now?


    It is if you use shitbag services like Yahoo.



    Quite likely. But it is not me that is using Yahoo!, it is the other
    guy.

    Nobody said it was you personally.
    Once upon a grammar one might have said 'if one were to use Yahoo'
    But times have changed
    --
    Climate Change: Socialism wearing a lab coat.

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  • From The Natural Philosopher@21:1/5 to All on Wed Mar 5 01:10:05 2025
    On 04/03/2025 18:08, mm0fmf wrote:
    On 04/03/2025 18:02, Davey wrote:
    as no suggestion that this was going to happen.

    Is this what we have to expect now?


    It is if you use shitbag services like Yahoo.


    +1

    --
    Climate Change: Socialism wearing a lab coat.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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  • From Paul@21:1/5 to Davey on Tue Mar 4 22:31:00 2025
    On Tue, 3/4/2025 6:12 PM, Davey wrote:
    On Tue, 4 Mar 2025 14:18:53 -0500
    Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> wrote:

    On Tue, 3/4/2025 1:02 PM, Davey wrote:
    I, in the UK, recently sent a message to a friend in Michigan, USA,
    describing my recent medical event, which was a burst varicose vein
    blood blister. Blood everywhere, neighbour came over to help, went
    to clinic yesterday to get it seen to and bandaged properly,
    follow-up next week.
    When he received the message on his Yahoo! e-mail screen, it was
    preceded by an AI-generated summary. It was not totally accurate. I
    have suggested that he look hard and deep for a setting or switch
    somewhere in the Settings to turn it off, pronto. He insists that
    there was no suggestion that this was going to happen.

    Is this what we have to expect now?

    Help.........


    Reddit says:

    "I turned it off by going to
    settings->message preview->then toggle off AI summaries"

    at the recipient (Yahoo) end.

    Paul


    And this is his reply:

    "Okay, I followed what you found:
    Settings > message preview.... and there is NO message preview.

    That is exactly the nightmare of any 'site', that offers 'assistance'.
    To find what's needed is a stinking nightmare.

    So, I called Yahoo.
    And guess what?
    The prompt says have the credit card ready, for 'assistance'.
    Unbelievable.
    And, have the driver license ready, too.

    None of that. I got hold of an agent, and let him have it.
    AI, the 'summary' is an intrusion on privacy. NO site can, and should
    assume it can 'summarize. anyone's e-mail messages. He seemed to have
    'got' it.

    I asked where, to click off this AI summary crap, and he doesn't seem
    to know. Just, he says, it's the 'enhanced' version of Yahoo.

    I said, show me where, since it's not at all clear and easy to find,
    where to go back to the original, BASIIC mail appearance page. I did
    that. And, asked, will this eliminate, will that AI summary stuff
    disappear. He said it should."

    And so it goes on, They "know" what We want, but don't bother to ask us.
    We will see what happens. If anything.


    There seem to be applications you can run for the free (Ad Supported) Yahoo
    or the Yahoo Plus (paid, monthly) version. As well, there are web browser versions of the two as well. Presumably, when you log into the web page,
    it uses your account version to create the web page for that version.

    https://www.reddit.com/r/yahoo/comments/1h47ogx/yahoo_mail_ai_summary/

    "yahoo mail

    >> top right corner click on the circle with your profile
    (profile picture or first initial of your first name)

    >> tab with a few options should pop up, click account overview

    >> now it directs you to a new page, click privacy controls at the top of the screen

    >> now click Automated Email Analysis

    >> now it gives you 3 options that you can toggle on or off,
    toggle OFF the "Use information from your emails to
    enable Smart Features so you can get the most out of your Yahoo experience:
    "

    That could mean, roughly four different "experiences" times the
    rolling-release model as they fumble with the controls on a
    daily basis.

    Simple, right ? Nothing a four-dimensional cartographer cannot handle.

    Paul

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  • From Davey@21:1/5 to Paul on Wed Mar 5 08:04:54 2025
    On Tue, 4 Mar 2025 22:31:00 -0500
    Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> wrote:

    On Tue, 3/4/2025 6:12 PM, Davey wrote:
    On Tue, 4 Mar 2025 14:18:53 -0500
    Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> wrote:

    On Tue, 3/4/2025 1:02 PM, Davey wrote:
    I, in the UK, recently sent a message to a friend in Michigan,
    USA, describing my recent medical event, which was a burst
    varicose vein blood blister. Blood everywhere, neighbour came
    over to help, went to clinic yesterday to get it seen to and
    bandaged properly, follow-up next week.
    When he received the message on his Yahoo! e-mail screen, it was
    preceded by an AI-generated summary. It was not totally accurate.
    I have suggested that he look hard and deep for a setting or
    switch somewhere in the Settings to turn it off, pronto. He
    insists that there was no suggestion that this was going to
    happen.

    Is this what we have to expect now?

    Help.........


    Reddit says:

    "I turned it off by going to
    settings->message preview->then toggle off AI summaries"

    at the recipient (Yahoo) end.

    Paul


    And this is his reply:

    "Okay, I followed what you found:
    Settings > message preview.... and there is NO message preview.

    That is exactly the nightmare of any 'site', that offers
    'assistance'. To find what's needed is a stinking nightmare.

    So, I called Yahoo.
    And guess what?
    The prompt says have the credit card ready, for 'assistance'.
    Unbelievable.
    And, have the driver license ready, too.

    None of that. I got hold of an agent, and let him have it.
    AI, the 'summary' is an intrusion on privacy. NO site can, and
    should assume it can 'summarize. anyone's e-mail messages. He
    seemed to have 'got' it.

    I asked where, to click off this AI summary crap, and he doesn't
    seem to know. Just, he says, it's the 'enhanced' version of Yahoo.

    I said, show me where, since it's not at all clear and easy to find,
    where to go back to the original, BASIIC mail appearance page. I did
    that. And, asked, will this eliminate, will that AI summary stuff disappear. He said it should."

    And so it goes on, They "know" what We want, but don't bother to
    ask us. We will see what happens. If anything.


    There seem to be applications you can run for the free (Ad Supported)
    Yahoo or the Yahoo Plus (paid, monthly) version. As well, there are
    web browser versions of the two as well. Presumably, when you log
    into the web page, it uses your account version to create the web
    page for that version.

    https://www.reddit.com/r/yahoo/comments/1h47ogx/yahoo_mail_ai_summary/

    "yahoo mail

    >> top right corner click on the circle with your profile
    (profile picture or first initial of your first name)

    >> tab with a few options should pop up, click account overview

    >> now it directs you to a new page, click privacy controls at
    >> the top of the screen

    >> now click Automated Email Analysis

    >> now it gives you 3 options that you can toggle on or off,
    toggle OFF the "Use information from your emails to
    enable Smart Features so you can get the most out of your
    Yahoo experience: "

    That could mean, roughly four different "experiences" times the rolling-release model as they fumble with the controls on a
    daily basis.

    Simple, right ? Nothing a four-dimensional cartographer cannot handle.

    Paul





    Hopefully, it has been stopped. I will be able to confirm later in the
    day, we have a 5 hour time difference.

    But he also reports that reverting to the old 'Human Intelligence'
    system has had another effect: the old method of moving messages to a
    local folder has now changed from a one-click process to a four-click
    process. Onwards and upwards! 'We are always striving to improve your Experience', Yeah, right.

    --
    Davey.

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