I Googled "When did The Copyright and Rights in Performances (Personal
Copies for Private Use) Regulations 2014 come into effect".
Ignoring the annoying AI
Does anybody know if the situation has changed since then and if so what
it is now, please
Jeff Gaines wrote:
I Googled "When did The Copyright and Rights in Performances (Personal >>Copies for Private Use) Regulations 2014 come into effect".
Ignoring the annoying AI
The best thing to do with AI
Does anybody know if the situation has changed since then and if so what
it is now, please
If you go to the horse's mouth
<https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2014/2361/made>
It tells you
Coming into force: 1st October 2014
But also that it was quashed by the High Court on 17 July 2015
<https://www.judiciary.uk/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/basca-v-sofs-bis-judgment.pdf>
Jeff Gaines wrote:
I Googled "When did The Copyright and Rights in Performances (Personal
Copies for Private Use) Regulations 2014 come into effect".
Ignoring the annoying AI
The best thing to do with AI
Does anybody know if the situation has changed since then and if so what
it is now, please
If you go to the horse's mouth
<https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2014/2361/made>
It tells you
Coming into force: 1st October 2014
But also that it was quashed by the High Court on 17 July 2015
<https://www.judiciary.uk/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/basca-v-sofs-bis-judgment.pdf>
On Wed, 18 Dec 2024 11:44:18 +0000, Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk>
wrote:
Jeff Gaines wrote:
I Googled "When did The Copyright and Rights in Performances (Personal >>>Copies for Private Use) Regulations 2014 come into effect".
Ignoring the annoying AI
The best thing to do with AI
Does anybody know if the situation has changed since then and if so what >>>it is now, please
If you go to the horse's mouth
<https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2014/2361/made>
It tells you
Coming into force: 1st October 2014
But also that it was quashed by the High Court on 17 July 2015
<https://www.judiciary.uk/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/basca-v-sofs-bis-judgment.pdf>
I've tried to follow that judgement but get lost in the arguments.
What is the basic reason I shouldn't make a copy of a DVD I own? Does
it apply to CDs, Vinyl records, Cassette tapes? And what about music
I've recorded from the radio or downloaded for instance from BBC Radio
3?
Where do I turn myself in? Or does "find \music; del \music\*.*"
absolve me?
On 18/12/2024 in message <lsfqsmFd7dqU1@mid.individual.net> Andy Burns
wrote:
<https://www.judiciary.uk/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/basca-v-sofs-bis-judgment.pdf>
Indeed, I saw that and just wondered if there had been any movement since.
On 18 Dec 2024 11:52:55 GMT, "Jeff Gaines" <jgnewsid@outlook.com> wrote:
On 18/12/2024 in message <lsfqsmFd7dqU1@mid.individual.net> Andy Burns
wrote:
<https://www.judiciary.uk/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/basca-v-sofs-bis-judgment.pdf>
Indeed, I saw that and just wondered if there had been any movement since.
No, there hasn't.
Reforming Intellectual Property legislation, following the Hargreaves Review published in 2011, was one of David Cameron's pet projects. The Copyright
and Rights in Performances (Personal Copies for Private Use) Regulations
2014 was one outcome of that. When that was subsquently quashed by judicial review, Cameron promised to revisit it with a more robust approach, this
time using primary legislation in order to address the objections upheld by the judge. But that hadn't got as far as a draft Bill by the time of the EU referendum a year later, following which Cameron resigned when the result didn't go his way. None of Cameron's successors have shown any interest in pursuing it.
To be honest, technology has overtaken the SI anyway. It was primarily intended to allow people to rip CDs to mp3 and DVDs to mp4. But the growth
of streaming has rendered that moot for most people. And the relatively
small number of people who still buy and rip are pretty much de minimis now as far as the rightsholder organisations are concerned. The focus now is all on unofficial streams and the hardware and software which facilitates them.
Mark
On Wed, 18 Dec 2024 12:34:57 GMT, nospam@please.invalid (AnthonyL)
wrote:
On Wed, 18 Dec 2024 11:44:18 +0000, Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk>
wrote:
Jeff Gaines wrote:
I Googled "When did The Copyright and Rights in Performances (Personal >>>> Copies for Private Use) Regulations 2014 come into effect".
Ignoring the annoying AI
The best thing to do with AI
Does anybody know if the situation has changed since then and if so what >>>> it is now, please
If you go to the horse's mouth
<https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2014/2361/made>
It tells you
Coming into force: 1st October 2014
But also that it was quashed by the High Court on 17 July 2015
<https://www.judiciary.uk/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/basca-v-sofs-bis-judgment.pdf>
I've tried to follow that judgement but get lost in the arguments.
What is the basic reason I shouldn't make a copy of a DVD I own? Does
it apply to CDs, Vinyl records, Cassette tapes? And what about music
I've recorded from the radio or downloaded for instance from BBC Radio
3?
Where do I turn myself in? Or does "find \music; del \music\*.*"
absolve me?
That's the bit I can't understand - if I copy something for my own
use, how does the copyright holder even know I did that or, more to
the point, prove I did so without a confession from me which I would
be most unlikely to provide?
Also, if I understand it right, the penalty for copyright infringement
is tied to the revenue loss for the copyright holder. What loss is
there if I have paid for the original copy?
if I copy something for my own use, how does the copyright holder
even know I did that or, more to the point, prove I did so without a confession from me which I would be most unlikely to provide?
Also, if I understand it right, the penalty for copyright
infringement is tied to the revenue loss for the copyright holder.
What loss is there if I have paid for the original copy?
Is the latest form of BluRay, version 2 of whatever copy protection, actually rippable yet? It would be useful to put the ones I have in storage.
if I copy something for my own use, how does the copyright holder even
know I did that or, more to the point, prove I did so without a
confession from me which I would be most unlikely to provide?
Also, if I understand it right, the penalty for copyright infringement
is tied to the revenue loss for the copyright holder. What loss is
there if I have paid for the original copy?
Roger Hayter <roger@hayter.org> wrote:
Is the latest form of BluRay, version 2 of whatever copy protection, actually
rippable yet? It would be useful to put the ones I have in storage.
Don't quote me on it (I've never even seen a BluRay disc)
but I think you
can if you have the right drive with the right firmware: >https://forum.makemkv.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=19634
Theo
Roger Hayter <roger@hayter.org> wrote:
Is the latest form of BluRay, version 2 of whatever copy protection, actually
rippable yet? It would be useful to put the ones I have in storage.
Don't quote me on it (I've never even seen a BluRay disc) but I think you
can if you have the right drive with the right firmware: https://forum.makemkv.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=19634
Theo
In message <14s*60l2z@news.chiark.greenend.org.uk>, at 16:14:33 on Wed,
18 Dec 2024, Theo <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> remarked:
Roger Hayter <roger@hayter.org> wrote:
Is the latest form of BluRay, version 2 of whatever copy protection, actually
rippable yet? It would be useful to put the ones I have in storage.
Don't quote me on it (I've never even seen a BluRay disc)
A lot of "DVD's" with feature films on have been BluRay for a decade.
They just don't ram that information down your throat.
but I think you
can if you have the right drive with the right firmware:
https://forum.makemkv.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=19634
Theo
On 18 Dec 2024 16:04:00 GMT, Roger Hayter <roger@hayter.org> wrote:
On 18 Dec 2024 at 14:59:05 GMT, "Martin Harran" <martinharran@gmail.com>
wrote:
On Wed, 18 Dec 2024 12:34:57 GMT, nospam@please.invalid (AnthonyL)
wrote:
On Wed, 18 Dec 2024 11:44:18 +0000, Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk>
wrote:
Jeff Gaines wrote:
I Googled "When did The Copyright and Rights in Performances (Personal >>>>>> Copies for Private Use) Regulations 2014 come into effect".
Ignoring the annoying AI
The best thing to do with AI
Does anybody know if the situation has changed since then and if so what >>>>>> it is now, please
If you go to the horse's mouth
<https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2014/2361/made>
It tells you
Coming into force: 1st October 2014
But also that it was quashed by the High Court on 17 July 2015
<https://www.judiciary.uk/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/basca-v-sofs-bis-judgment.pdf>
I've tried to follow that judgement but get lost in the arguments.
What is the basic reason I shouldn't make a copy of a DVD I own? Does >>>> it apply to CDs, Vinyl records, Cassette tapes? And what about music
I've recorded from the radio or downloaded for instance from BBC Radio >>>> 3?
Where do I turn myself in? Or does "find \music; del \music\*.*"
absolve me?
That's the bit I can't understand - if I copy something for my own
use, how does the copyright holder even know I did that or, more to
the point, prove I did so without a confession from me which I would
be most unlikely to provide?
Also, if I understand it right, the penalty for copyright infringement
is tied to the revenue loss for the copyright holder. What loss is
there if I have paid for the original copy?
You could, if you so desired, put the copy you have made somewhere other
people who have not purchased the DVD could download it. That is why the
copyright holders go after people who provide copying software, so they say.
I specifically qualified it *for my own use*.
On Wed, 18 Dec 2024 12:34:57 GMT, nospam@please.invalid (AnthonyL)
wrote:
On Wed, 18 Dec 2024 11:44:18 +0000, Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk>
wrote:
Jeff Gaines wrote:
I Googled "When did The Copyright and Rights in Performances (Personal >>>> Copies for Private Use) Regulations 2014 come into effect".
Ignoring the annoying AI
The best thing to do with AI
Does anybody know if the situation has changed since then and if so what >>>> it is now, please
If you go to the horse's mouth
<https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2014/2361/made>
It tells you
Coming into force: 1st October 2014
But also that it was quashed by the High Court on 17 July 2015
<https://www.judiciary.uk/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/basca-v-sofs-bis-judgment.pdf>
I've tried to follow that judgement but get lost in the arguments.
What is the basic reason I shouldn't make a copy of a DVD I own? Does
it apply to CDs, Vinyl records, Cassette tapes? And what about music
I've recorded from the radio or downloaded for instance from BBC Radio
3?
Where do I turn myself in? Or does "find \music; del \music\*.*"
absolve me?
That's the bit I can't understand - if I copy something for my own
use, how does the copyright holder even know I did that or, more to
the point, prove I did so without a confession from me which I would
be most unlikely to provide?
Also, if I understand it right, the penalty for copyright infringement
is tied to the revenue loss for the copyright holder. What loss is
there if I have paid for the original copy?
Roger Hayter <roger@hayter.org> wrote:
Is the latest form of BluRay, version 2 of whatever copy protection, >>actually
rippable yet? It would be useful to put the ones I have in storage.
Don't quote me on it (I've never even seen a BluRay disc) but I think you
can if you have the right drive with the right firmware: >https://forum.makemkv.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=19634
Theo
On 18 Dec 2024 at 16:23:08 GMT, "Roland Perry" <roland@perry.uk> wrote:
In message <14s*60l2z@news.chiark.greenend.org.uk>, at 16:14:33 on Wed,
18 Dec 2024, Theo <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> remarked:
Roger Hayter <roger@hayter.org> wrote:
Is the latest form of BluRay, version 2 of whatever copy
protection, actually
rippable yet? It would be useful to put the ones I have in storage.
Don't quote me on it (I've never even seen a BluRay disc)
A lot of "DVD's" with feature films on have been BluRay for a decade.
They just don't ram that information down your throat.
There are two kinds of BluRay, and most DVDs are *not* the latest kind.
On Wed, 18 Dec 2024 16:12:25 +0000, Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk>
wrote:
In message <7ho5mjtgvco2lndfhrul09tilqlv4tfuv3@4ax.com>, at 14:59:05 on >>Wed, 18 Dec 2024, Martin Harran <martinharran@gmail.com> remarked:
if I copy something for my own use, how does the copyright holder even >>>know I did that or, more to the point, prove I did so without a >>>confession from me which I would be most unlikely to provide?
Also, if I understand it right, the penalty for copyright infringement
is tied to the revenue loss for the copyright holder. What loss is
there if I have paid for the original copy?
I have recently acquired a newly-written 8-bit computer game, which the >>writer donated to me - but most people have to buy the cassette.
Last weekend he also donated me a copy of the same game on floppy disc, >>which again most people would have to buy afresh.
That's not what I asked about, I specifically asked about where I have
paid for the original and made a copy for my own use.
--[Biographical note:, the game's name is "Roland in RetroAlacant", and >>features myself, Clive Sinclair, and somewhat bizarrely, Bill Gates;
should be Chris Curry]
On Wed, 18 Dec 2024 18:15:20 +0000, Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk>
wrote:
In message <8iu5mj5a0tpql57hoi4su7gtrjkf2ebtc7@4ax.com>, at 16:39:23 on >>Wed, 18 Dec 2024, Martin Harran <martinharran@gmail.com> remarked:
On Wed, 18 Dec 2024 16:12:25 +0000, Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk>
wrote:
In message <7ho5mjtgvco2lndfhrul09tilqlv4tfuv3@4ax.com>, at 14:59:05 on >>>>Wed, 18 Dec 2024, Martin Harran <martinharran@gmail.com> remarked:
if I copy something for my own use, how does the copyright holder even >>>>>know I did that or, more to the point, prove I did so without a >>>>>confession from me which I would be most unlikely to provide?
Also, if I understand it right, the penalty for copyright infringement >>>>>is tied to the revenue loss for the copyright holder. What loss is >>>>>there if I have paid for the original copy?
I have recently acquired a newly-written 8-bit computer game, which the >>>>writer donated to me - but most people have to buy the cassette.
Last weekend he also donated me a copy of the same game on floppy disc, >>>>which again most people would have to buy afresh.
That's not what I asked about, I specifically asked about where I have >>>paid for the original and made a copy for my own use.
The implication was "I've paid for one format, what's the loss if I >>format-shift it myself". And I gave an example of that.
In your example, the copyright holder donated his copy to you so there
was no revenue loss to him if you shift-formatted it *for your own
use*, the same as in my example so your example didn't really add
anything new to my question
[Biographical note:, the game's name is "Roland in RetroAlacant", and >>>>features myself, Clive Sinclair, and somewhat bizarrely, Bill Gates; >>>>should be Chris Curry]
On Wed, 18 Dec 2024 12:34:57 GMT, nospam@please.invalid (AnthonyL)
wrote:
On Wed, 18 Dec 2024 11:44:18 +0000, Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk>
wrote:
Jeff Gaines wrote:
I Googled "When did The Copyright and Rights in Performances (Personal >>>> Copies for Private Use) Regulations 2014 come into effect".
Ignoring the annoying AI
The best thing to do with AI
Does anybody know if the situation has changed since then and if so what >>>> it is now, please
If you go to the horse's mouth
<https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2014/2361/made>
It tells you
Coming into force: 1st October 2014
But also that it was quashed by the High Court on 17 July 2015
<https://www.judiciary.uk/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/basca-v-sofs-bis-judgment.pdf>
I've tried to follow that judgement but get lost in the arguments.
What is the basic reason I shouldn't make a copy of a DVD I own? Does
it apply to CDs, Vinyl records, Cassette tapes? And what about music
I've recorded from the radio or downloaded for instance from BBC Radio
3?
Where do I turn myself in? Or does "find \music; del \music\*.*"
absolve me?
That's the bit I can't understand - if I copy something for my own
use, how does the copyright holder even know I did that or, more to
the point, prove I did so without a confession from me which I would
be most unlikely to provide?
Also, if I understand it right, the penalty for copyright infringement
is tied to the revenue loss for the copyright holder. What loss is
there if I have paid for the original copy?
On Wed, 18 Dec 2024 19:36:35 +0000, Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk>
wrote:
In message <0s56mj90fg20baf5u77pq9isjq7889pfoc@4ax.com>, at 18:46:33 on >>Wed, 18 Dec 2024, Martin Harran <martinharran@gmail.com> remarked:
On Wed, 18 Dec 2024 18:15:20 +0000, Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk>
wrote:
In message <8iu5mj5a0tpql57hoi4su7gtrjkf2ebtc7@4ax.com>, at 16:39:23 on >>>>Wed, 18 Dec 2024, Martin Harran <martinharran@gmail.com> remarked:
On Wed, 18 Dec 2024 16:12:25 +0000, Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> >>>>>wrote:
In message <7ho5mjtgvco2lndfhrul09tilqlv4tfuv3@4ax.com>, at 14:59:05 on >>>>>>Wed, 18 Dec 2024, Martin Harran <martinharran@gmail.com> remarked:
if I copy something for my own use, how does the copyright holder even >>>>>>>know I did that or, more to the point, prove I did so without a >>>>>>>confession from me which I would be most unlikely to provide?
Also, if I understand it right, the penalty for copyright infringement >>>>>>>is tied to the revenue loss for the copyright holder. What loss is >>>>>>>there if I have paid for the original copy?
I have recently acquired a newly-written 8-bit computer game, which the >>>>>>writer donated to me - but most people have to buy the cassette.
Last weekend he also donated me a copy of the same game on floppy disc, >>>>>>which again most people would have to buy afresh.
That's not what I asked about, I specifically asked about where I have >>>>>paid for the original and made a copy for my own use.
The implication was "I've paid for one format, what's the loss if I >>>>format-shift it myself". And I gave an example of that.
In your example, the copyright holder donated his copy to you so there >>>was no revenue loss to him if you shift-formatted it *for your own
use*, the same as in my example so your example didn't really add >>>anything new to my question
But if anyone else in the whole world had bought a cassette version,
then later decided they wanted a floppy version too, doing their own >>format-shifting would have deprived the publisher of that second sale.
How does this relate to backing up software?. As I understood it,
backing up a piece of software onto an external device is totally
legal as long as it is not distributed to anyone else for use. I'm
fairly sure I have seen that in some software FAQs.
[Biographical note:, the game's name is "Roland in RetroAlacant", and >>>>>>features myself, Clive Sinclair, and somewhat bizarrely, Bill Gates; >>>>>>should be Chris Curry]
In message <qovcmjl325vjkfjkrofb88ocobo4ekdrcp@4ax.com>, at 08:43:39 on
Sat, 21 Dec 2024, Martin Harran <martinharran@gmail.com> remarked:
On Wed, 18 Dec 2024 19:36:35 +0000, Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk>
wrote:
In message <0s56mj90fg20baf5u77pq9isjq7889pfoc@4ax.com>, at 18:46:33 on >>>Wed, 18 Dec 2024, Martin Harran <martinharran@gmail.com> remarked:
On Wed, 18 Dec 2024 18:15:20 +0000, Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> >>>>wrote:
In message <8iu5mj5a0tpql57hoi4su7gtrjkf2ebtc7@4ax.com>, at 16:39:23 >>>>>on Wed, 18 Dec 2024, Martin Harran <martinharran@gmail.com> remarked: >>>>>>On Wed, 18 Dec 2024 16:12:25 +0000, Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> >>>>>>wrote:
In message <7ho5mjtgvco2lndfhrul09tilqlv4tfuv3@4ax.com>, at >>>>>>>14:59:05 on Wed, 18 Dec 2024, Martin Harran >>>>>>><martinharran@gmail.com> remarked:
if I copy something for my own use, how does the copyright holder >>>>>>>>even know I did that or, more to the point, prove I did so without >>>>>>>>a confession from me which I would be most unlikely to provide? >>>>>>>>
Also, if I understand it right, the penalty for copyright >>>>>>>>infringement is tied to the revenue loss for the copyright holder. >>>>>>>>What loss is there if I have paid for the original copy?
I have recently acquired a newly-written 8-bit computer game, which >>>>>>>the writer donated to me - but most people have to buy the >>>>>>>cassette.
Last weekend he also donated me a copy of the same game on floppy >>>>>>>disc,
which again most people would have to buy afresh.
That's not what I asked about, I specifically asked about where I >>>>>>have paid for the original and made a copy for my own use.
The implication was "I've paid for one format, what's the loss if I >>>>>format-shift it myself". And I gave an example of that.
In your example, the copyright holder donated his copy to you so there >>>>was no revenue loss to him if you shift-formatted it *for your own >>>>use*, the same as in my example so your example didn't really add >>>>anything new to my question
But if anyone else in the whole world had bought a cassette version,
then later decided they wanted a floppy version too, doing their own >>>format-shifting would have deprived the publisher of that second sale.
How does this relate to backing up software?. As I understood it,
backing up a piece of software onto an external device is totally legal
as long as it is not distributed to anyone else for use. I'm fairly sure
I have seen that in some software FAQs.
I can't see how they could expect to ban general backups (such as Norton Ghost or built into Windows), but most T&C would probably prohibit
taking a copy of the distribution media for 'backup' purposes.
[Biographical note:, the game's name is "Roland in RetroAlacant", >>>>>>>and features myself, Clive Sinclair, and somewhat bizarrely, Bill >>>>>>>Gates; should be Chris Curry]
On Wed, 18 Dec 2024 19:36:35 +0000, Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk>
wrote:
In message <0s56mj90fg20baf5u77pq9isjq7889pfoc@4ax.com>, at 18:46:33 on
Wed, 18 Dec 2024, Martin Harran <martinharran@gmail.com> remarked:
In your example, the copyright holder donated his copy to you so there
was no revenue loss to him if you shift-formatted it *for your own
use*, the same as in my example so your example didn't really add
anything new to my question
But if anyone else in the whole world had bought a cassette version,
then later decided they wanted a floppy version too, doing their own
format-shifting would have deprived the publisher of that second sale.
How does this relate to backing up software?. As I understood it,
backing up a piece of software onto an external device is totally
legal as long as it is not distributed to anyone else for use. I'm
fairly sure I have seen that in some software FAQs.
That applies to 'a copy'. A translation into any other computer format
(as opposed to physical format, eg cassette to floppy) is not 'a copy'.
How does this relate to backing up software?. As I understood it,
backing up a piece of software onto an external device is totally
legal as long as it is not distributed to anyone else for use. I'm
fairly sure I have seen that in some software FAQs.
I can't see how they could expect to ban general backups (such as Norton >Ghost or built into Windows), but most T&C would probably prohibit taking
a copy of the distribution media for 'backup' purposes.
On Sat, 21 Dec 2024 10:20:36 +0000, Norman Wells wrote:
That applies to 'a copy'. A translation into any other computer format
(as opposed to physical format, eg cassette to floppy) is not 'a copy'.
Does the law specifically define "copy" ?
If I print a photo onto a teatowel does it bypass copyright ?
On Wed, 18 Dec 2024 20:06:54 +0000, Norman Wells <hex@unseen.ac.am>
wrote:
On 18/12/2024 14:59, Martin Harran wrote:
On Wed, 18 Dec 2024 12:34:57 GMT, nospam@please.invalid (AnthonyL)
wrote:
On Wed, 18 Dec 2024 11:44:18 +0000, Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk>
wrote:
Jeff Gaines wrote:
I Googled "When did The Copyright and Rights in Performances (Personal >>>>>> Copies for Private Use) Regulations 2014 come into effect".
Ignoring the annoying AI
The best thing to do with AI
Does anybody know if the situation has changed since then and if so what >>>>>> it is now, please
If you go to the horse's mouth
<https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2014/2361/made>
It tells you
Coming into force: 1st October 2014
But also that it was quashed by the High Court on 17 July 2015
<https://www.judiciary.uk/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/basca-v-sofs-bis-judgment.pdf>
I've tried to follow that judgement but get lost in the arguments.
What is the basic reason I shouldn't make a copy of a DVD I own? Does >>>> it apply to CDs, Vinyl records, Cassette tapes? And what about music
I've recorded from the radio or downloaded for instance from BBC Radio >>>> 3?
Where do I turn myself in? Or does "find \music; del \music\*.*"
absolve me?
That's the bit I can't understand - if I copy something for my own
use, how does the copyright holder even know I did that or, more to
the point, prove I did so without a confession from me which I would
be most unlikely to provide?
Also, if I understand it right, the penalty for copyright infringement
is tied to the revenue loss for the copyright holder. What loss is
there if I have paid for the original copy?
The loss is of the payment you would have had to make to buy a
legitimate copy in the format you really want. Copyright holders are
naturally a bit grasping and would like you to do that whatever you've
paid for already. In fact they are actually entitled to demand it under
the basic provisions of the Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988.
Otherwise making any copy, other than of a broadcast for time-shifting
purposes, is an infringement.
This sounds like one of those useless decisions that will never be
used in practice. If I copy an old CD onto my MP3 player, the
*potential* loss to the copyright holders is typically less than £10,
often substantially less allowing for the fact that most of my CDs are
50s and 60s stuff available on cheap collections and it would cost
them a lot more than that to take me to court to recover that in
damages. I say *potential loss* because I would argue in court that
the copyright holders have not demonstrated that there was ever any likelihood of me purchasing it on different media.
Mind you, as you
say, copyright holders are a bit grasping and it seems to me that
there is no limit to their desire to intimidate people - remember the
emails that were sent out to multiple users of file--sharing some
years ago, threatening to go after them for piracy even though there
were no legal grounds to do so at the time..
Many people have complied more or less willingly with that already.
Have you never bought a digital copy of a book you already own so you
can read it on a Kindle for example?
I have never felt the least bit guilty for obtaining for my Kindle,
without payment, an electronic copy of a book that I have already
purchased in hardback or paperback.
On 21/12/2024 in message <9zs04eA+joZnFA7c@perry.uk> Roland Perry wrote:
How does this relate to backing up software?. As I understood it,
backing up a piece of software onto an external device is totally
legal as long as it is not distributed to anyone else for use. I'm
fairly sure I have seen that in some software FAQs.
I can't see how they could expect to ban general backups (such as
Norton Ghost or built into Windows), but most T&C would probably
prohibit taking a copy of the distribution media for 'backup' purposes.
There is no value in the distribution media nowadays as you need a key
to activate it,
it took Microsoft a long time to realise that but now they have you can >download Windows freely.
The best software requires you to un-install while online which sends a >message to the mother ship that the licence has been freed up. You then >re-install on the new (or re-built) PC and activate while online, and
again the mother ship is contacted to say the licence is now back in
use.
In message <xn0outoho8lob25011@news.individual.net>, at 11:57:57 on Sat,
21 Dec 2024, Jeff Gaines <jgnewsid@outlook.com> remarked:
On 21/12/2024 in message <9zs04eA+joZnFA7c@perry.uk> Roland Perry wrote:
How does this relate to backing up software?. As I understood it, >>>>backing up a piece of software onto an external device is totally
legal as long as it is not distributed to anyone else for use. I'm >>>>fairly sure I have seen that in some software FAQs.
I can't see how they could expect to ban general backups (such as Norton >>>Ghost or built into Windows), but most T&C would probably prohibit taking >>>a copy of the distribution media for 'backup' purposes.
There is no value in the distribution media nowadays as you need a key to >>activate it,
Only newly acquired software. Many of the legacy distribution media I have >can be installed simply by having that media. And even those with a key,
will generally have it printed on the box, so that's not secure against >'pirate' copies.
it took Microsoft a long time to realise that but now they have you can >>download Windows freely.
The best software requires you to un-install while online which sends a >>message to the mother ship that the licence has been freed up. You then >>re-install on the new (or re-built) PC and activate while online, and
again the mother ship is contacted to say the licence is now back in use.
I object to such processes, because if the mothership sinks, I have lost >access to something *I HAVE PAID FOR IN FULL*
I object to such processes, because if the mothership sinks, I have lost access to something *I HAVE PAID FOR IN FULL*
On Mon, 23 Dec 2024 08:40:46 +0000, Roland Perry wrote:
I object to such processes, because if the mothership sinks, I have lost
access to something *I HAVE PAID FOR IN FULL*
But what did you pay for ? The media, the software on it, or the right to
use the software on it ?
As I mentioned, there is a small, but possibly growing market in the sale
of "old" physical media.
And one reason explicitly given is to protect
the purchaser from being in a situation where their purchase disappears
in a licensing issue, or simple commercial decision not to supply anymore.
This also means you are safe from future revisions of the source. Whether >approved or not.
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