On 21/01/2025 21:14, AnthonyL wrote:
Having just read some of the Harrassment thread I am currently dealing
with a Direct debit cancellation issue that neither the supplier nor
bank seem to be able to explain.
This raises the following queries to my mind:
I'll answer this based on what I have gathered, although I do not hold
myself out as an expert.
1) Who can authorise the cancellation of a DD?
You or the supplier. Or it can expire.
2) What duty do the bank have to advise the customer of a
cancelled/expired DD?
I didn't receive a notification from either the bank or the supplier.
In retrospect, I can see that the bank did notify the supplier, because
the supplier suddenly changed what they were saying to me.
3) Do DDs automaticall expire if not used within a time frame?
Yes. There's more about that here:
https://www.financial-ombudsman.org.uk/decision/DRN-4719378.pdf
"Under the BACS scheme rules, the bank is referred to as the payment
service provider (PSP) and the credit card company as the service user.
In respect of dormancy those rules say:
“All paying PSPs hold details of payer DDIs on file for a minimum period
of 24 months from lodgement of the DDI in the event of no collections or
from the date of the last collection i.e. length of time in calendar
months after which a paying PSP will drop details of a DDI
because no Direct Debit has been collected.” And:
“Rule: If a service user does not present a Direct Debit against a DDI
for 24 months, and has not requested an extended dormancy period, any subsequent Direct Debit must be preceded by a new DDI, otherwise the
Direct Debit may be returned ‘no instruction’ ”.
... certainly B shouldn’t have told him that it would collect a payment
under a DDI which hadn't been used for over 24 months."
This is the sequence of events.
Our Severn Trent water bill is setup to pay DD, and the bills are 6
monthly approximately. The DD is purely to pay the actual bill, not a rolling amount taken out every period.
However their system allows payment by credit card on which we get
cashback so for the past couple of years on receipt of the bill we pay
it off in full with the credit card.
Last November Severn Trent started to send emails advising the bill
was due to be paid by DD in the near future. As we had paid the bill
by credit card, for which I received an emailed acknowledgement, there
was no further action needed on my behalf, and the on-line system
showed that the balance due was Ł0.
On the due date I receive an email from Severn Trent:
"Your bank has returned your recent Direct Debit payment of Ł281.51 as unpaid on 31st December 2024. They’ve told us that they don’t
recognise the bank account details. "
According to the FOS ruling, Severn Trent should not have told you they
would collect the payment by DD, as the DD had not been used for ages,
so was expired.
Severn Trent should have asked you for a new DD instruction.
Weird I thought. Check with the Nationwide on-line and there is no
record of the DD, either current, or cancelled. I phone Severn Trent
who agree nothing is due and suggest if I intend to pay by credit card
that I so do. Severn Trent could not explain why they still attempted
to take the bill amount by DD when the amount due was nil.
I check with Nationwide and they cannot explain why the DD has been cancelled, nor whether they have a mechanism to advise me if one has
been cancelled. I raised the issue of why isn't the DD in an Expired
list but that isn't in their script so I raised it as an issue. I've
had a letter dated 9th Jan from Nationwide acknowledging my complaint
(I hadn't made a complaint, merely raised an issue) but had no further information.
The scenario may in due course arise with our Telecoms supplier as we
have a DD setup but pay the amount due monthly on Credit card. I seem
to recall we had to have a DD for the deal we were on.
Note that for us the DD is a handy backstop in the event we forget or
it is inconvenient for us to pay by credit card that month eg if we
are away and have better things to do.
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