Curious how they *know* a customer is in the UK ?


https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cgj54eq4vejo

Apple is taking the unprecedented step of removing its highest level data security tool from customers in the UK, after the government demanded
access to user data.

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On 2025-02-21, Jethro_uk <jethro_uk@hotmailbin.com> wrote:

Curious how they *know* a customer is in the UK ?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cgj54eq4vejo

Apple is taking the unprecedented step of removing its highest level data security tool from customers in the UK, after the government demanded
access to user data.

Apple Accounts are already tied to countries. There's loads of ways they
can know the country, not least by asking the customer - and yes, the
customer could lie, but then things can quickly become very difficult
what with payment cards being issued by the wrong country, goods
delivered to the wrong address, the phone being connected to the wrong country's mobile network, etc etc.

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On 21/02/2025 16:47, Jethro_uk wrote:

Curious how they *know* a customer is in the UK ?

Using a UK keyboard where shift 3 is £ is a bit of a give away.
Likewise connecting to the internet with an IP address in a UK range
(although the cognoscenti can easily spoof that).

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cgj54eq4vejo

Apple is taking the unprecedented step of removing its highest level data security tool from customers in the UK, after the government demanded
access to user data.

I expect the upshot of all this will be that some previously secure top
secret UK government documents in the Apple cloud will end up in plain
sight to bad actors and/or indexed by Google at some later stage.

--
Martin Brown

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On 21 Feb 2025 at 18:07:08 GMT, "Jon Ribbens" <jon+usenet@unequivocal.eu> wrote:

On 2025-02-21, Jethro_uk <jethro_uk@hotmailbin.com> wrote:

Curious how they *know* a customer is in the UK ?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cgj54eq4vejo

Apple is taking the unprecedented step of removing its highest level data
security tool from customers in the UK, after the government demanded
access to user data.

Apple Accounts are already tied to countries. There's loads of ways they
can know the country, not least by asking the customer - and yes, the customer could lie, but then things can quickly become very difficult
what with payment cards being issued by the wrong country, goods
delivered to the wrong address, the phone being connected to the wrong country's mobile network, etc etc.

They must already have similar arrangements in place for their sales to China.

--

Roger Hayter

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On Fri, 21 Feb 2025 16:47:26 -0000 (UTC), Jethro_uk
<jethro_uk@hotmailbin.com> wrote:

Curious how they *know* a customer is in the UK ?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cgj54eq4vejo

Apple is taking the unprecedented step of removing its highest level data >security tool from customers in the UK, after the government demanded
access to user data.

You have to set up an Apple account in order to use cloud-based services, including ADP. While there are ways to register your account in a different country to the one where you actually are, the reality is that the vast majority of people do not. And unless you have reliable access to a VPN, you can't avoid your IP address being geolocated in the UK.

Mark

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On 2025-02-21, Roger Hayter <roger@hayter.org> wrote:

On 21 Feb 2025 at 18:07:08 GMT, "Jon Ribbens" <jon+usenet@unequivocal.eu> wrote:

On 2025-02-21, Jethro_uk <jethro_uk@hotmailbin.com> wrote:

Curious how they *know* a customer is in the UK ?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cgj54eq4vejo

Apple is taking the unprecedented step of removing its highest level data >>> security tool from customers in the UK, after the government demanded
access to user data.

Apple Accounts are already tied to countries. There's loads of ways they
can know the country, not least by asking the customer - and yes, the
customer could lie, but then things can quickly become very difficult
what with payment cards being issued by the wrong country, goods
delivered to the wrong address, the phone being connected to the wrong
country's mobile network, etc etc.

They must already have similar arrangements in place for their sales
to China.

There's already all sorts of things which depend on all sorts of
countries, depending on local regulations and other considerations.
e.g. "Apple Intelligence" is only available in some countries, the
health features available vary by country, some apps are only
available in some countries, etc. Disabling something specific in
a specific country or region is not at all a new innovation.

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Mark Goodge wrote:

You have to set up an Apple account in order to use cloud-based services, including ADP. While there are ways to register your account in a different country to the one where you actually are, the reality is that the vast majority of people do not. And unless you have reliable access to a VPN, you can't avoid your IP address being geolocated in the UK.

If you sign into that Apple account from an iPhone, that phone will know
where it is (from the MCC/MNC, or GPS) if you claim not to be in the UK,
yet the phone reveals itself to be in the UK the vast majority of the
time, it could get flagged ...

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In message <slrnvrhjob.27v.jon+usenet@raven.unequivocal.eu>, at 19:07:55
on Fri, 21 Feb 2025, Jon Ribbens <jon+usenet@unequivocal.eu> remarked:

Apple is taking the unprecedented step of removing its highest level data >>>> security tool from customers in the UK, after the government demanded
access to user data.

Apple Accounts are already tied to countries. There's loads of ways they >>> can know the country, not least by asking the customer - and yes, the
customer could lie, but then things can quickly become very difficult
what with payment cards being issued by the wrong country, goods
delivered to the wrong address, the phone being connected to the wrong
country's mobile network, etc etc.

They must already have similar arrangements in place for their sales
to China.

There's already all sorts of things which depend on all sorts of
countries, depending on local regulations and other considerations.
e.g. "Apple Intelligence" is only available in some countries, the
health features available vary by country, some apps are only
available in some countries, etc. Disabling something specific in
a specific country or region is not at all a new innovation.

Another example: the latest Apple Ear-Buds have a feature which allow
them to operate like a hearing-aid. But they can't sell that option in
the UK because it hasn't [yet, afaik] passed approval tests.

In other news, the Tesla van has been officially banned in the UK.
Mainly to do with "Construction and Use" regs.
--
Roland Perry

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In message <vpaga3$3gme5$1@dont-email.me>, at 18:22:56 on Fri, 21 Feb
2025, Martin Brown <'''newspam'''@nonad.co.uk> remarked:

On 21/02/2025 16:47, Jethro_uk wrote:

Curious how they *know* a customer is in the UK ?

Using a UK keyboard where shift 3 is £ is a bit of a give away.
Likewise connecting to the internet with an IP address in a UK range >(although the cognoscenti can easily spoof that).

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cgj54eq4vejo
Apple is taking the unprecedented step of removing its highest level
data
security tool from customers in the UK, after the government demanded
access to user data.

I expect the upshot of all this will be that some previously secure top >secret UK government documents in the Apple cloud will end up in plain
sight to bad actors and/or indexed by Google at some later stage.

It's unclear whether you mean documents protected by Apple's allegedly uncrackable encryption, or just normal documents in the cloud.
--
Roland Perry

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On 2025-02-21, Martin Brown wrote:

On 21/02/2025 16:47, Jethro_uk wrote:

Curious how they *know* a customer is in the UK ?

Using a UK keyboard where shift 3 is £ is a bit of a give away.
Likewise connecting to the internet with an IP address in a UK range (although the cognoscenti can easily spoof that).

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cgj54eq4vejo

Apple is taking the unprecedented step of removing its highest level data
security tool from customers in the UK, after the government demanded
access to user data.

I expect the upshot of all this will be that some previously secure top secret UK government documents in the Apple cloud will end up in plain
sight to bad actors and/or indexed by Google at some later stage.

Good. Let's hope some MPs' interesting personal tastes are exposed
too.

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On Fri, 21 Feb 2025 16:47:26 +0000, Jethro_uk wrote:

Curious how they *know* a customer is in the UK ?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cgj54eq4vejo

Apple is taking the unprecedented step of removing its highest level
data security tool from customers in the UK, after the government
demanded access to user data.

https://www.theregister.com/2025/03/05/apple_reportedly_ipt_complaint/


Apple has reportedly filed a legal complaint with the UK's Investigatory
Powers Tribunal (IPT) contesting the UK government's order that it must forcibly break the encryption of iCloud data.

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In message <vq9uoo$1r200$4@dont-email.me>, at 16:39:52 on Wed, 5 Mar
2025, Jethro_uk <jethro_uk@hotmailbin.com> remarked:

On Fri, 21 Feb 2025 16:47:26 +0000, Jethro_uk wrote:

Curious how they *know* a customer is in the UK ?


https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cgj54eq4vejo

Apple is taking the unprecedented step of removing its highest level
data security tool from customers in the UK, after the government
demanded access to user data.

https://www.theregister.com/2025/03/05/apple_reportedly_ipt_complaint/

Apple has reportedly filed a legal complaint with the UK's Investigatory >Powers Tribunal (IPT) contesting the UK government's order that it must >forcibly break the encryption of iCloud data.

Why wouldn't they, it's one of the reasons the Tribunal exists.

Disclaimer: I was one of the main lobbyists back in 2000 who insisted
that the tribunal be set up.
--
Roland Perry

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On Fri, 21 Feb 2025 16:47:26 +0000, Jethro_uk wrote:

Curious how they *know* a customer is in the UK ?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cgj54eq4vejo

Apple is taking the unprecedented step of removing its highest level
data security tool from customers in the UK, after the government
demanded access to user data.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c798xv5qwylo

Apple's appeal against a UK government demand to be able to access its customers' most highly encrypted data is set to be considered at a secret hearing at the High Court on Friday, the BBC understands.

It is due to be considered by the Investigatory Powers Tribunal - an independent court which has the power to investigate claims against the
UK intelligence services.

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