On 2025-05-12 14:37, pothead wrote:
On 2025-05-12, -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote:Your proof of this is... ...what?
On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote:
-hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont- >>>>> email.me:
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote:
This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week.
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if
they were sick of this shit they should get
their corps to pressure the govt.
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in
this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and
any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be
needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast.
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer
period. That's THE hub.
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate
sabotage here - maybe Vlad ???
Try DOGE.
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's contract with Verizon which >>>>>> was a systems upgrade ...
Just wait until this summer when
the travel surge hits and airport after
airport closes for lack of ATC personel.
The ones Trump fired.
So much winning!
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly wasn't controllers.
The ones who maintain the gear that's now breaking down.
-hh
While the FAA DOES have it's own tech force, much of the critical gear is maintained
by the vendors.
IBM in particular because the gear is proprietary and 3rd parties, like the FAA, do not
have access to the same materials that IBM does.
While the FAA DOES have it's own tech force, much of the critical gear is maintained
by the vendors.
IBM in particular because the gear is proprietary and 3rd parties, like the FAA, do not
have access to the same materials that IBM does.
On 2025-05-12, Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-12 14:37, pothead wrote:
On 2025-05-12, -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote:Your proof of this is... ...what?
On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote:
-hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont- >>>>>> email.me:
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote:
This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week.
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if
they were sick of this shit they should get
their corps to pressure the govt.
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in
this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and
any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be
needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast.
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer
period. That's THE hub.
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate
sabotage here - maybe Vlad ???
Try DOGE.
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's contract with Verizon which >>>>>>> was a systems upgrade ...
Just wait until this summer when
the travel surge hits and airport after
airport closes for lack of ATC personel.
The ones Trump fired.
So much winning!
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly wasn't controllers.
The ones who maintain the gear that's now breaking down.
-hh
While the FAA DOES have it's own tech force, much of the critical gear is maintained
by the vendors.
IBM in particular because the gear is proprietary and 3rd parties, like the FAA, do not
have access to the same materials that IBM does.
20+ years in the IT biz......
And you?
P.S. Anyone who is an IT professional will know this.Actually, both my parents started out their careers in IT as IBM
On 2025-05-12 16:45, pothead wrote:
On 2025-05-12, Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-12 14:37, pothead wrote:
On 2025-05-12, -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote:Your proof of this is... ...what?
On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote:
-hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont- >>>>>>> email.me:
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote:
This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week.
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if
they were sick of this shit they should get
their corps to pressure the govt.
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in
this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and
any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be
needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast.
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer
period. That's THE hub.
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate
sabotage here - maybe Vlad ???
Try DOGE.
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's contract with Verizon which
was a systems upgrade ...
Just wait until this summer when
the travel surge hits and airport after
airport closes for lack of ATC personel.
The ones Trump fired.
So much winning!
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly wasn't controllers.
The ones who maintain the gear that's now breaking down.
-hh
While the FAA DOES have it's own tech force, much of the critical gear is maintained
by the vendors.
IBM in particular because the gear is proprietary and 3rd parties, like the FAA, do not
have access to the same materials that IBM does.
20+ years in the IT biz......
And you?
(Checking...) nearly 35 years.
Actually, both my parents started out their careers in IT as IBM
P.S. Anyone who is an IT professional will know this.
mainframe programmers and analysts, and both told me on numerous
occasions that much of the support for IBM systems was done by the
customers themselves.
But whatever.
Your appeal to authority isn't proof.
It isn't even evidence.
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argument_from_authority>
On 2025-05-13, Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-12 16:45, pothead wrote:
On 2025-05-12, Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-12 14:37, pothead wrote:
On 2025-05-12, -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote:Your proof of this is... ...what?
On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote:
-hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont-
email.me:
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote:
This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week.
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if
they were sick of this shit they should get
their corps to pressure the govt.
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in
this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and
any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be
needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast.
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer
period. That's THE hub.
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate
sabotage here - maybe Vlad ???
Try DOGE.
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's contract with Verizon which
was a systems upgrade ...
Just wait until this summer when
the travel surge hits and airport after
airport closes for lack of ATC personel.
The ones Trump fired.
So much winning!
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly wasn't controllers.
The ones who maintain the gear that's now breaking down.
-hh
While the FAA DOES have it's own tech force, much of the critical gear is maintained
by the vendors.
IBM in particular because the gear is proprietary and 3rd parties, like the FAA, do not
have access to the same materials that IBM does.
20+ years in the IT biz......
And you?
(Checking...) nearly 35 years.
Actually, both my parents started out their careers in IT as IBM
P.S. Anyone who is an IT professional will know this.
mainframe programmers and analysts, and both told me on numerous
occasions that much of the support for IBM systems was done by the
customers themselves.
But whatever.
Your appeal to authority isn't proof.
It isn't even evidence.
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argument_from_authority>
Ask your parents how 3rd party companies can gain access to IBM MCL updates. Assuming they know what that is.
You can't win this one.Still you present no actual evidence.
On 2025-05-12 18:05, pothead wrote:
On 2025-05-13, Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-12 16:45, pothead wrote:
On 2025-05-12, Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-12 14:37, pothead wrote:
On 2025-05-12, -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote:Your proof of this is... ...what?
On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote:The ones who maintain the gear that's now breaking down.
-hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont-
email.me:
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote:
This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week.
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if
they were sick of this shit they should get
their corps to pressure the govt.
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in
this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and
any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be
needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast.
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer
period. That's THE hub.
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate
sabotage here - maybe Vlad ???
Try DOGE.
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's contract with Verizon which
was a systems upgrade ...
Just wait until this summer when
the travel surge hits and airport after
airport closes for lack of ATC personel.
The ones Trump fired.
So much winning!
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly wasn't controllers. >>>>>>>
-hh
While the FAA DOES have it's own tech force, much of the critical gear is maintained
by the vendors.
IBM in particular because the gear is proprietary and 3rd parties, like the FAA, do not
have access to the same materials that IBM does.
20+ years in the IT biz......
And you?
(Checking...) nearly 35 years.
Actually, both my parents started out their careers in IT as IBM
P.S. Anyone who is an IT professional will know this.
mainframe programmers and analysts, and both told me on numerous
occasions that much of the support for IBM systems was done by the
customers themselves.
But whatever.
Your appeal to authority isn't proof.
It isn't even evidence.
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argument_from_authority>
Ask your parents how 3rd party companies can gain access to IBM MCL updates. >> Assuming they know what that is.
Back in the day, my stepdad WROTE fixes for IBM operating systems...
...while working for several different IBM customers.
Still you present no actual evidence.
You can't win this one.
On 2025-05-13, Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:No one's forcing you to reply, stoner.
On 2025-05-12 18:30, pothead wrote:
On 2025-05-13, Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-12 18:05, pothead wrote:
On 2025-05-13, Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-12 16:45, pothead wrote:
On 2025-05-12, Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-12 14:37, pothead wrote:
On 2025-05-12, -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote:Your proof of this is... ...what?
On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote:The ones who maintain the gear that's now breaking down.
-hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont-
email.me:
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote:
This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week.
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if
they were sick of this shit they should get
their corps to pressure the govt.
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in
this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and
any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be
needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast.
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer
period. That's THE hub.
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate
sabotage here - maybe Vlad ???
Try DOGE.
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's contract with Verizon which
was a systems upgrade ...
Just wait until this summer when
the travel surge hits and airport after
airport closes for lack of ATC personel.
The ones Trump fired.
So much winning!
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly wasn't controllers. >>>>>>>>>>
-hh
While the FAA DOES have it's own tech force, much of the critical gear is maintained
by the vendors.
IBM in particular because the gear is proprietary and 3rd parties, like the FAA, do not
have access to the same materials that IBM does.
20+ years in the IT biz......
And you?
(Checking...) nearly 35 years.
Actually, both my parents started out their careers in IT as IBM
P.S. Anyone who is an IT professional will know this.
mainframe programmers and analysts, and both told me on numerous
occasions that much of the support for IBM systems was done by the >>>>>> customers themselves.
But whatever.
Your appeal to authority isn't proof.
It isn't even evidence.
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argument_from_authority>
Ask your parents how 3rd party companies can gain access to IBM MCL updates.
Assuming they know what that is.
Back in the day, my stepdad WROTE fixes for IBM operating systems...
...while working for several different IBM customers.
Still you present no actual evidence.
You can't win this one.
That wasn't the question.
It was the question I asked...
...and you still haven't answered it.
Again, how does a 3rd party maintainer gain access to IBM MCLS.
That's a deflection.
Neither can the FAA.I get that you can't back up your claims.
Soooooo, that is why they use vendors to maintain their equipment.
Get it now ?
Stop wasting my time Alan.
On 2025-05-12 18:30, pothead wrote:
On 2025-05-13, Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-12 18:05, pothead wrote:
On 2025-05-13, Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-12 16:45, pothead wrote:
On 2025-05-12, Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-12 14:37, pothead wrote:
On 2025-05-12, -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote:Your proof of this is... ...what?
On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote:The ones who maintain the gear that's now breaking down.
-hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont-
email.me:
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote:
This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week.
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if
they were sick of this shit they should get
their corps to pressure the govt.
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in
this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and
any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be
needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast.
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer
period. That's THE hub.
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate
sabotage here - maybe Vlad ???
Try DOGE.
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's contract with Verizon which
was a systems upgrade ...
Just wait until this summer when
the travel surge hits and airport after
airport closes for lack of ATC personel.
The ones Trump fired.
So much winning!
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly wasn't controllers. >>>>>>>>>
-hh
While the FAA DOES have it's own tech force, much of the critical gear is maintained
by the vendors.
IBM in particular because the gear is proprietary and 3rd parties, like the FAA, do not
have access to the same materials that IBM does.
20+ years in the IT biz......
And you?
(Checking...) nearly 35 years.
Actually, both my parents started out their careers in IT as IBM
P.S. Anyone who is an IT professional will know this.
mainframe programmers and analysts, and both told me on numerous
occasions that much of the support for IBM systems was done by the
customers themselves.
But whatever.
Your appeal to authority isn't proof.
It isn't even evidence.
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argument_from_authority>
Ask your parents how 3rd party companies can gain access to IBM MCL updates.
Assuming they know what that is.
Back in the day, my stepdad WROTE fixes for IBM operating systems...
...while working for several different IBM customers.
Still you present no actual evidence.
You can't win this one.
That wasn't the question.
It was the question I asked...
...and you still haven't answered it.
Again, how does a 3rd party maintainer gain access to IBM MCLS.
That's a deflection.
Neither can the FAA.I get that you can't back up your claims.
Soooooo, that is why they use vendors to maintain their equipment.
Get it now ?
On 2025-05-12 18:35, pothead wrote:
On 2025-05-13, Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:No one's forcing you to reply, stoner.
On 2025-05-12 18:30, pothead wrote:
On 2025-05-13, Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-12 18:05, pothead wrote:
On 2025-05-13, Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-12 16:45, pothead wrote:
On 2025-05-12, Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-12 14:37, pothead wrote:
On 2025-05-12, -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote:Your proof of this is... ...what?
On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote:
-hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in
news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont-
email.me:
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote:
This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week.
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if
they were sick of this shit they should get
their corps to pressure the govt.
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in
this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and
any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be
needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast.
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer
period. That's THE hub.
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate
sabotage here - maybe Vlad ???
Try DOGE.
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's contract with >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Verizon which
was a systems upgrade ...
Just wait until this summer when
the travel surge hits and airport after
airport closes for lack of ATC personel.
The ones Trump fired.
So much winning!
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly wasn't
controllers.
The ones who maintain the gear that's now breaking down. >>>>>>>>>>>
-hh
While the FAA DOES have it's own tech force, much of the
critical gear is maintained
by the vendors.
IBM in particular because the gear is proprietary and 3rd
parties, like the FAA, do not
have access to the same materials that IBM does.
20+ years in the IT biz......
And you?
(Checking...) nearly 35 years.
Actually, both my parents started out their careers in IT as IBM >>>>>>> mainframe programmers and analysts, and both told me on numerous >>>>>>> occasions that much of the support for IBM systems was done by the >>>>>>> customers themselves.
P.S. Anyone who is an IT professional will know this.
But whatever.
Your appeal to authority isn't proof.
It isn't even evidence.
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argument_from_authority>
Ask your parents how 3rd party companies can gain access to IBM
MCL updates.
Assuming they know what that is.
Back in the day, my stepdad WROTE fixes for IBM operating systems... >>>>>
...while working for several different IBM customers.
Still you present no actual evidence.
You can't win this one.
That wasn't the question.
It was the question I asked...
...and you still haven't answered it.
Again, how does a 3rd party maintainer gain access to IBM MCLS.
That's a deflection.
Neither can the FAA.I get that you can't back up your claims.
Soooooo, that is why they use vendors to maintain their equipment.
Get it now ?
Stop wasting my time Alan.
You have no evidence.
You CLAIM an argument from authority of "20+ years in the IT biz"...
...but even that is woefully short on specifics.
Face it: you know FUCK ALL about how maintenance on the FAAs technology
is done, and we DO KNOW that DOGE laid off FAA technical staff.
And you just imagine that all of the support and maintenance of FAA technology is done by the vendors.
On 2025-05-13, Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-12 18:05, pothead wrote:
On 2025-05-13, Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-12 16:45, pothead wrote:
On 2025-05-12, Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-12 14:37, pothead wrote:
On 2025-05-12, -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote:Your proof of this is... ...what?
On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote:The ones who maintain the gear that's now breaking down.
-hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont-
email.me:
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote:
This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week.
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if
they were sick of this shit they should get
their corps to pressure the govt.
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in
this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and
any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be
needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast.
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer
period. That's THE hub.
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate
sabotage here - maybe Vlad ???
Try DOGE.
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's contract with Verizon which
was a systems upgrade ...
Just wait until this summer when
the travel surge hits and airport after
airport closes for lack of ATC personel.
The ones Trump fired.
So much winning!
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly wasn't controllers. >>>>>>>>
-hh
While the FAA DOES have it's own tech force, much of the critical gear is maintained
by the vendors.
IBM in particular because the gear is proprietary and 3rd parties, like the FAA, do not
have access to the same materials that IBM does.
20+ years in the IT biz......
And you?
(Checking...) nearly 35 years.
Actually, both my parents started out their careers in IT as IBM
P.S. Anyone who is an IT professional will know this.
mainframe programmers and analysts, and both told me on numerous
occasions that much of the support for IBM systems was done by the
customers themselves.
But whatever.
Your appeal to authority isn't proof.
It isn't even evidence.
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argument_from_authority>
Ask your parents how 3rd party companies can gain access to IBM MCL updates.
Assuming they know what that is.
Back in the day, my stepdad WROTE fixes for IBM operating systems...
...while working for several different IBM customers.
Still you present no actual evidence.
You can't win this one.
That wasn't the question.
Again, how does a 3rd party maintainer gain access to IBM MCLS.
Neither can the FAA.I get that you can't back up your claims.
Soooooo, that is why they use vendors to maintain their equipment.
Get it now ?
Ask your parents how 3rd party companies can gain access to IBM MCL updates. Assuming they know what that is.
You can't win this one.
Stop wasting my time Alan.Neither can the FAA.
I get that you can't back up your claims.Soooooo, that is why they use vendors to maintain their equipment.
Get it now ?
Such a desperate wiggle!
Trump fired FAA flight safety personnel. Recently several airports
are having issues with flight control.
Hmm . . . two plus two equals . . .
This is only the start. As time marches on you'll find yourself
defending against MUCH that has gone wrong under Trump.
On Mon, 12 May 2025 15:31:19 -0400, Yak <Yak@inbox.com> wrote:
On 5/12/25 3:01 PM, Siri Cruz wrote:
On 12/5/25 9:00, Yak wrote:
Y'all make it sound like this never happened before. It has,
under Biden. Were flight safety issues laid squarely at Biden's
doorstep? Did you even know it happened under him? The only
difference now is a republican is president, so suddenly it
matters to you.
What about Obama? You also blame him.
Yup, there were several outages during his presiduncy.
But Obama hadn't just made headlines by slashing FAA budgets with a
chain saw.
On Mon, 12 May 2025 13:18:53 -0400, Yak <Yak@inbox.com> wrote:
On 5/12/25 11:21 AM, Governor Swill wrote:
On Sun, 11 May 2025 22:23:09 -0400, c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> wrote:
This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week.
I guess Musk's cuts at FAA weren't the solution after all.
Was DOGE around when it happened last year? How about in 2023? Or 2018?
Or 2015? Or 2013?
You said everything that didn't go to your liking was Biden's fault
from before he was elected right up until today.
But it's YOUR guy on the hot seat now. Everything bad that happens
now is HIS fault.
The shoe is on the other foot. Wear it.
On Mon, 12 May 2025 13:18:53 -0400, Yak <Yak@inbox.com> wrote:
On 5/12/25 11:21 AM, Governor Swill wrote:
On Sun, 11 May 2025 22:23:09 -0400, c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> wrote:
This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week.
I guess Musk's cuts at FAA weren't the solution after all.
Was DOGE around when it happened last year? How about in 2023? Or 2018?
Or 2015? Or 2013?
No, but in those years DOGE hadn't famously fired thousands of FAA
workers.
Aren't you at all concerned that Trump is now offering signing bonuses
and higher wages to get some of these people back?
On 5/12/25 4:24 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote:
-hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont- >>>> email.me:
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote:
This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week.
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if
they were sick of this shit they should get
their corps to pressure the govt.
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in
this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and
any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be
needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast.
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer
period. That's THE hub.
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate
sabotage here - maybe Vlad ???
Try DOGE.
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's contract with Verizon
which was a systems upgrade ...
Just wait until this summer when
the travel surge hits and airport after
airport closes for lack of ATC personel.
The ones Trump fired.
So much winning!
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly wasn't controllers.
The ones who maintain the gear that's now breaking down.
Such breakdowns happened in the past as well, even as recently as late
2024.
Maybe the people maintaining the gear deserve to be fired since
what they're doing apparently isn't working.
On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote:
-hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont-
email.me:
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote:
This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week.
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if
they were sick of this shit they should get
their corps to pressure the govt.
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in
this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and
any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be
needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast.
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer
period. That's THE hub.
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate
sabotage here - maybe Vlad ???
Try DOGE.
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's contract with Verizon which >>>> was a systems upgrade ...
Just wait until this summer when
the travel surge hits and airport after
airport closes for lack of ATC personel.
The ones Trump fired.
So much winning!
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly wasn't controllers.
The ones who maintain the gear that's now breaking down.
-hh
On 5/13/25 08:15, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 4:24 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote:
-hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in
news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont-
email.me:
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote:
This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week.
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if
they were sick of this shit they should get
their corps to pressure the govt.
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in
this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and
any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be
needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast.
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer
period. That's THE hub.
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate
sabotage here - maybe Vlad ???
Try DOGE.
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's contract with Verizon
which was a systems upgrade ...
Just wait until this summer when
the travel surge hits and airport after
airport closes for lack of ATC personel.
The ones Trump fired.
So much winning!
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly wasn't controllers.
The ones who maintain the gear that's now breaking down.
Such breakdowns happened in the past as well, even as recently as late
2024.
Yes, failures happen ... but at this same failure rate?
How many ATC outages did EWR have in total all of 2024?
Because for 2025, major ones which have been publicly reported already
is three (3):
April 28, 2025: outage with significant disruptions; some traumatized controllers took authorized medical leave;
May 9, 2025: outage at ~3:55AM, duration of ~90 seconds.
May 11, 2025: outage with a ground stop of ~45 minutes.
Maybe the people maintaining the gear deserve to be fired since what
they're doing apparently isn't working.
Isn't a better explanation is that because there's fewer of them working
now, the failure rate is now higher than it was in the past?
-hh
On 5/13/25 08:15, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 4:24 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote:
-hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in
news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont- email.me:
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote:
This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week.
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if
they were sick of this shit they should get
their corps to pressure the govt.
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in
this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and
any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be
needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast.
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer
period. That's THE hub.
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate
sabotage here - maybe Vlad ???
Try DOGE.
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's contract with Verizon
which was a systems upgrade ...
Just wait until this summer when
the travel surge hits and airport after
airport closes for lack of ATC personel.
The ones Trump fired.
So much winning!
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly wasn't controllers.
The ones who maintain the gear that's now breaking down.
Such breakdowns happened in the past as well, even as recently as
late 2024.
Yes, failures happen ... but at this same failure rate?
How many ATC outages did EWR have in total all of 2024?
Because for 2025, major ones which have been publicly reported already
is three (3):
April 28, 2025: outage with significant disruptions; some traumatized controllers took authorized medical leave;
May 9, 2025: outage at ~3:55AM, duration of ~90 seconds.
May 11, 2025: outage with a ground stop of ~45 minutes.
Maybe the people maintaining the gear deserve to be fired since
what they're doing apparently isn't working.
Isn't a better explanation is that because there's fewer of them
working now, the failure rate is now higher than it was in the past?
On 5/12/25 8:37 PM, Governor Swill wrote:
On Mon, 12 May 2025 13:18:53 -0400, Yak <Yak@inbox.com> wrote:
On 5/12/25 11:21 AM, Governor Swill wrote:
On Sun, 11 May 2025 22:23:09 -0400, c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> wrote: >>>>
This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week.
I guess Musk's cuts at FAA weren't the solution after all.
Was DOGE around when it happened last year? How about in 2023? Or 2018?
Or 2015? Or 2013?
You said everything that didn't go to your liking was Biden's fault
from before he was elected right up until today.
But it's YOUR guy on the hot seat now. Everything bad that happens
now is HIS fault.
The shoe is on the other foot. Wear it.
Nah, I never did that. All I am suggesting is clearing up the perception
that you lunatics have that these outages are somehow something new.
On Tue, 13 May 2025 09:32:44 -0400, Yak <Yak@inbox.com> wrote:
On 5/13/25 8:54 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 08:15, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 4:24 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote:
-hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in
news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont-
email.me:
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote:
This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week.
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if
they were sick of this shit they should get
their corps to pressure the govt.
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in
this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and
any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be
needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast.
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer
period. That's THE hub.
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate
sabotage here - maybe Vlad ???
Try DOGE.
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's contract with Verizon >>>>>>>> which was a systems upgrade ...
Just wait until this summer when
the travel surge hits and airport after
airport closes for lack of ATC personel.
The ones Trump fired.
So much winning!
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly wasn't controllers.
The ones who maintain the gear that's now breaking down.
Such breakdowns happened in the past as well, even as recently as late >>>> 2024.
Yes, failures happen ... but at this same failure rate?
How many ATC outages did EWR have in total all of 2024?
Between 2-4.
You're guessing, am I right?
Reporting isn't always comprehensive. Would require
visiting official FAA sites.
BWAAAAAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHA! <laughs and points>
Dude! Such outages are ALWAYS front page news. Who do you think
you're fooling?
By your logic, there are probably even more outages this year since
some outages could only be known by, "visiting official FAA sites."
Because for 2025, major ones which have been publicly reported already
is three (3):
April 28, 2025: outage with significant disruptions; some traumatized
controllers took authorized medical leave;
May 9, 2025: outage at ~3:55AM, duration of ~90 seconds.
May 11, 2025: outage with a ground stop of ~45 minutes.
Maybe the people maintaining the gear deserve to be fired since what
they're doing apparently isn't working.
Isn't a better explanation is that because there's fewer of them working >>> now, the failure rate is now higher than it was in the past?
-hh
Since the frequency of outages appears to be happening at a singular
airport, perhaps the better explanation is they don't know what the hell
they're doing at EWR.
"Appears to be" at one airport?
Anybody paying attention at all will know the government uses
contractors extensively and that this has long been a Republican
imperative.
In WWII, practically everything was handled by the government; it was
all GI or "government issue". Not to dismiss the private American
companies building the weapons and equipment.
Today, the troops are fed by Burger King and KFC, among others,
operating as contractors.
The government contracts out much of what it needs to private
business. In this way, it can provide service but with the
competitive advantages of private industry.
On 13/5/25 10:10, Governor Swill wrote:
Anybody paying attention at all will know the government uses
contractors extensively and that this has long been a Republican
imperative.
In WWII, practically everything was handled by the government; it was
all GI or "government issue". Not to dismiss the private American
companies building the weapons and equipment.
Today, the troops are fed by Burger King and KFC, among others,
operating as contractors.
The government contracts out much of what it needs to private
business. In this way, it can provide service but with the
competitive advantages of private industry.
And piss off base commanders.
If they want something done, they order soldiers to do it. It is
done.
They cannot give orders to contractors on the base.
On 2025-05-13, Siri Cruz <chine.bleu@yahoo.com> wrote:
On 13/5/25 10:10, Governor Swill wrote:I love yahoos like you who don't have a clue and are constantly asking
Anybody paying attention at all will know the government uses
contractors extensively and that this has long been a Republican
imperative.
In WWII, practically everything was handled by the government; it was
all GI or "government issue". Not to dismiss the private American
companies building the weapons and equipment.
Today, the troops are fed by Burger King and KFC, among others,
operating as contractors.
The government contracts out much of what it needs to private
business. In this way, it can provide service but with the
competitive advantages of private industry.
And piss off base commanders.
If they want something done, they order soldiers to do it. It is
done.
They cannot give orders to contractors on the base.
for cites.
I told you losers a couple of weeks ago how antiquated the FAA systems are and how controllers were literally passing index cards to each other when handing
off flights.
I've been to TRACON on L.I. several times in the past few years as my neighbor
was a ATC, now retired, and gave me the grand tour and I was stunned at how old the equipment was.
It was like walking through a computer museum.
So here is one article backing up my claims.
<http://sunnyday.mit.edu/16.355/faa-aas.pdf>
And it just went downhill from there.Did it really?
I love yahoos like you who don't have a clue and are constantly asking
for cites.
I told you losers a couple of weeks ago how antiquated the FAA systems are and how controllers were literally passing index cards to each other when handing
off flights.
On Tue, 13 May 2025 21:56:08 -0000 (UTC), pothead
<pothead@snakebite.com> wrote:
I love yahoos like you who don't have a clue and are constantly asking
for cites.
I told you losers a couple of weeks ago how antiquated the FAA systems are >> and how controllers were literally passing index cards to each other when handing
off flights.
I've been to TRACON on L.I. several times in the past few years as my neighbor
was a ATC, now retired, and gave me the grand tour and I was stunned at how >> old the equipment was.
It was like walking through a computer museum.
So here is one article backing up my claims.
<http://sunnyday.mit.edu/16.355/faa-aas.pdf>
And it just went downhill from there.
Yet again, how are budget cuts and mass firings supposed to remedy
this situation.
On 5/13/25 1:17 PM, Governor Swill wrote:
On Tue, 13 May 2025 09:32:44 -0400, Yak <Yak@inbox.com> wrote:
On 5/13/25 8:54 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 08:15, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 4:24 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote:
-hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in
news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont-
email.me:
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote:
This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week.
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if
they were sick of this shit they should get
their corps to pressure the govt.
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in
this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and
any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be
needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast.
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer
period. That's THE hub.
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate
sabotage here - maybe Vlad ???
Try DOGE.
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's contract with Verizon >>>>>>>>> which was a systems upgrade ...
Just wait until this summer when
the travel surge hits and airport after
airport closes for lack of ATC personel.
The ones Trump fired.
So much winning!
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly wasn't controllers.
The ones who maintain the gear that's now breaking down.
Such breakdowns happened in the past as well, even as recently as late >>>>> 2024.
Yes, failures happen ... but at this same failure rate?
How many ATC outages did EWR have in total all of 2024?
Between 2-4.
You're guessing, am I right?
Nope.
Reporting isn't always comprehensive. Would require
visiting official FAA sites.
BWAAAAAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHA! <laughs and points>
Dude! Such outages are ALWAYS front page news. Who do you think
you're fooling?
Define 'such outages.' Not all outages are the same. Some are widely reported, some aren't. Minor or brief outages may go unreported or
minimally reported to the public due to their limited impact,
operational protocols, or ongoing investigations. For example, a EWR controller reported at least two other outages since August 2024, which
the FAA didn’t confirm publicly, suggesting minor incidents are handled internally. Go ahead and see if you can find any 'front page news' on that.
By your logic, there are probably even more outages this year since
some outages could only be known by, "visiting official FAA sites."
Because for 2025, major ones which have been publicly reported already >>>> is three (3):
April 28, 2025: outage with significant disruptions; some traumatized
controllers took authorized medical leave;
May 9, 2025: outage at ~3:55AM, duration of ~90 seconds.
May 11, 2025: outage with a ground stop of ~45 minutes.
Maybe the people maintaining the gear deserve to be fired since what >>>>> they're doing apparently isn't working.
Isn't a better explanation is that because there's fewer of them
working
now, the failure rate is now higher than it was in the past?
-hh
Since the frequency of outages appears to be happening at a singular
airport, perhaps the better explanation is they don't know what the hell >>> they're doing at EWR.
"Appears to be" at one airport?
Yeah, appears. Outages aren't isolated to one airport. They have
happened a number of times before. I guess you would know that *if* they
were front page news, as you suggested.
On 5/13/25 14:34, Yak wrote:
On 5/13/25 1:17 PM, Governor Swill wrote:
On Tue, 13 May 2025 09:32:44 -0400, Yak <Yak@inbox.com> wrote:
On 5/13/25 8:54 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 08:15, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 4:24 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote:The ones who maintain the gear that's now breaking down.
-hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in
news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont-
email.me:
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote:
This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week.
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if
they were sick of this shit they should get
their corps to pressure the govt.
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in
this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and
any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be
needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast.
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer
period. That's THE hub.
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate
sabotage here - maybe Vlad ???
Try DOGE.
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's contract with Verizon >>>>>>>>>> which was a systems upgrade ...
Just wait until this summer when
the travel surge hits and airport after
airport closes for lack of ATC personel.
The ones Trump fired.
So much winning!
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly wasn't controllers. >>>>>>>
Such breakdowns happened in the past as well, even as recently as
late
2024.
Yes, failures happen ... but at this same failure rate?
How many ATC outages did EWR have in total all of 2024?
Between 2-4.
You're guessing, am I right?
Nope.
Then where's the dates of said outages, preferably with cites?
Plus note that 3 known outages to date in 2025 is a ~3x higher rate of critical failures than this alleged "2-4" over 12 months of 2024.
Reporting isn't always comprehensive. Would require
visiting official FAA sites.
BWAAAAAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHA! <laughs and points>
Dude! Such outages are ALWAYS front page news. Who do you think
you're fooling?
Define 'such outages.' Not all outages are the same. Some are widely
reported, some aren't. Minor or brief outages may go unreported or
minimally reported to the public due to their limited impact,
operational protocols, or ongoing investigations. For example, a EWR
controller reported at least two other outages since August 2024,
which the FAA didn’t confirm publicly, suggesting minor incidents are
handled internally. Go ahead and see if you can find any 'front page
news' on that.
Gosh, that's a bit spinny: try dig up those details and cross-compare
them to what's been reported on the three YTD 2025 outages to see if
they were actually as significant as we've seen over the past 3 weeks.
By your logic, there are probably even more outages this year since
some outages could only be known by, "visiting official FAA sites."
Because for 2025, major ones which have been publicly reported already >>>>> is three (3):
April 28, 2025: outage with significant disruptions; some traumatized >>>>> controllers took authorized medical leave;
May 9, 2025: outage at ~3:55AM, duration of ~90 seconds.
May 11, 2025: outage with a ground stop of ~45 minutes.
Maybe the people maintaining the gear deserve to be fired since what >>>>>> they're doing apparently isn't working.
Isn't a better explanation is that because there's fewer of them
working
now, the failure rate is now higher than it was in the past?
-hh
Since the frequency of outages appears to be happening at a singular
airport, perhaps the better explanation is they don't know what the
hell
they're doing at EWR.
"Appears to be" at one airport?
Yeah, appears. Outages aren't isolated to one airport. They have
happened a number of times before. I guess you would know that *if*
they were front page news, as you suggested.
Which also means that there may have been more 2025 failures at airports other than EWR.
Overall, we know that the ATC situation is bad when United Airlines has already *unilaterally* cut their flight schedule, without any requests
from the FAA to cut back.
-hh
On 5/14/25 12:04 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 14:34, Yak wrote:
On 5/13/25 1:17 PM, Governor Swill wrote:
On Tue, 13 May 2025 09:32:44 -0400, Yak <Yak@inbox.com> wrote:
On 5/13/25 8:54 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 08:15, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 4:24 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote:The ones who maintain the gear that's now breaking down.
-hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in
news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont-
email.me:
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote:
This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week.
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if
they were sick of this shit they should get
their corps to pressure the govt.
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in
this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and
any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be
needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast.
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer
period. That's THE hub.
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate
sabotage here - maybe Vlad ???
Try DOGE.
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's contract with >>>>>>>>>>> Verizon
which was a systems upgrade ...
Just wait until this summer when
the travel surge hits and airport after
airport closes for lack of ATC personel.
The ones Trump fired.
So much winning!
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly wasn't controllers. >>>>>>>>
Such breakdowns happened in the past as well, even as recently as >>>>>>> late
2024.
Yes, failures happen ... but at this same failure rate?
How many ATC outages did EWR have in total all of 2024?
Between 2-4.
You're guessing, am I right?
Nope.
Then where's the dates of said outages, preferably with cites?
Plus note that 3 known outages to date in 2025 is a ~3x higher rate of
critical failures than this alleged "2-4" over 12 months of 2024.
Newark (EWR), September 2, 2024 (Labor Day): A radar and radio outage at Philadelphia TRACON. https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/local/newark- flights-delays-radar-issue-faa/5757083/ Also reported by The Air
Current and CNN.
Philadelphia TRACON, November 6, 2024: Another equipment outage,
including radar and radio failures.https://www.youtube.com/watch? v=aj7RJxUIs3I&ab_channel=VASAviation-
Oakland Air Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February 22,
2024: outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center.Oakland Air Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February 22, 2024: outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center
Miami and Jacksonville ARTCC Outages: unscheduled cooperative radar
outage. https://www.faa.gov/newsroom/radar-modernization-proposal
These don't include several unreported potential outages as they were
routine or low-impact, reinforcing that only significant disruptions
gain media attention.
Reporting isn't always comprehensive. Would require
visiting official FAA sites.
BWAAAAAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHA! <laughs and points>
Dude! Such outages are ALWAYS front page news. Who do you think
you're fooling?
Define 'such outages.' Not all outages are the same. Some are widely
reported, some aren't. Minor or brief outages may go unreported or
minimally reported to the public due to their limited impact,
operational protocols, or ongoing investigations. For example, a EWR
controller reported at least two other outages since August 2024,
which the FAA didn’t confirm publicly, suggesting minor incidents are
handled internally. Go ahead and see if you can find any 'front page
news' on that.
Gosh, that's a bit spinny: try dig up those details and cross-compare
them to what's been reported on the three YTD 2025 outages to see if
they were actually as significant as we've seen over the past 3 weeks.
One person's spin is another's outage. Fact is these outages have been happening for years. And many less impactful one's are often not reported.
By your logic, there are probably even more outages this year since
some outages could only be known by, "visiting official FAA sites."
Because for 2025, major ones which have been publicly reported
already
is three (3):
April 28, 2025: outage with significant disruptions; some traumatized >>>>>> controllers took authorized medical leave;
May 9, 2025: outage at ~3:55AM, duration of ~90 seconds.
May 11, 2025: outage with a ground stop of ~45 minutes.
Maybe the people maintaining the gear deserve to be fired since what >>>>>>> they're doing apparently isn't working.
Isn't a better explanation is that because there's fewer of them
working
now, the failure rate is now higher than it was in the past?
-hh
Since the frequency of outages appears to be happening at a singular >>>>> airport, perhaps the better explanation is they don't know what the
hell
they're doing at EWR.
"Appears to be" at one airport?
Yeah, appears. Outages aren't isolated to one airport. They have
happened a number of times before. I guess you would know that *if*
they were front page news, as you suggested.
Which also means that there may have been more 2025 failures at
airports other than EWR.
Overall, we know that the ATC situation is bad when United Airlines
has already *unilaterally* cut their flight schedule, without any
requests from the FAA to cut back.
Right. And???
On 5/14/25 13:51, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 12:04 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 14:34, Yak wrote:
On 5/13/25 1:17 PM, Governor Swill wrote:
On Tue, 13 May 2025 09:32:44 -0400, Yak <Yak@inbox.com> wrote:
On 5/13/25 8:54 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 08:15, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 4:24 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote:The ones who maintain the gear that's now breaking down.
-hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in
news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont-
email.me:
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote:
This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week.
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if
they were sick of this shit they should get
their corps to pressure the govt.
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in
this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and
any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be
needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast.
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer
period. That's THE hub.
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate
sabotage here - maybe Vlad ???
Try DOGE.
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's contract with >>>>>>>>>>>> Verizon
which was a systems upgrade ...
Just wait until this summer when
the travel surge hits and airport after
airport closes for lack of ATC personel.
The ones Trump fired.
So much winning!
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly wasn't controllers. >>>>>>>>>
Such breakdowns happened in the past as well, even as recently >>>>>>>> as late
2024.
Yes, failures happen ... but at this same failure rate?
How many ATC outages did EWR have in total all of 2024?
Between 2-4.
You're guessing, am I right?
Nope.
Then where's the dates of said outages, preferably with cites?
Plus note that 3 known outages to date in 2025 is a ~3x higher rate
of critical failures than this alleged "2-4" over 12 months of 2024.
Newark (EWR), September 2, 2024 (Labor Day): A radar and radio outage
at Philadelphia TRACON. https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/local/newark-
flights-delays-radar-issue-faa/5757083/ Also reported by The Air
Current and CNN.
Philadelphia TRACON, November 6, 2024: Another equipment outage,
including radar and radio failures.https://www.youtube.com/watch?
v=aj7RJxUIs3I&ab_channel=VASAviation-
Oakland Air Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February 22,
2024: outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center.Oakland Air Route
Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February 22, 2024: outage at
the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center
Miami and Jacksonville ARTCC Outages: unscheduled cooperative radar
outage. https://www.faa.gov/newsroom/radar-modernization-proposal
These don't include several unreported potential outages as they were
routine or low-impact, reinforcing that only significant disruptions
gain media attention.
That's five ... but it is also from a nationwide search. We know that there's 3 just from EWR in 2025 .. what about the rest of the country?
Reporting isn't always comprehensive. Would require
visiting official FAA sites.
BWAAAAAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHA! <laughs and points>
Dude! Such outages are ALWAYS front page news. Who do you think
you're fooling?
Define 'such outages.' Not all outages are the same. Some are widely
reported, some aren't. Minor or brief outages may go unreported or
minimally reported to the public due to their limited impact,
operational protocols, or ongoing investigations. For example, a EWR
controller reported at least two other outages since August 2024,
which the FAA didn’t confirm publicly, suggesting minor incidents
are handled internally. Go ahead and see if you can find any 'front
page news' on that.
Gosh, that's a bit spinny: try dig up those details and cross-
compare them to what's been reported on the three YTD 2025 outages to
see if they were actually as significant as we've seen over the past
3 weeks.
One person's spin is another's outage. Fact is these outages have been
happening for years. And many less impactful one's are often not
reported.
By your own deep count attempt, 5 nationwide in 2024, for 0.42/month,
versus a 2025 pace of 3 in <4.5 months = 0.67/mo = a +60% rate increase.
By your logic, there are probably even more outages this year since
some outages could only be known by, "visiting official FAA sites." >>>>>>> Because for 2025, major ones which have been publicly reported
already
is three (3):
April 28, 2025: outage with significant disruptions; some
traumatized
controllers took authorized medical leave;
May 9, 2025: outage at ~3:55AM, duration of ~90 seconds.
May 11, 2025: outage with a ground stop of ~45 minutes.
Maybe the people maintaining the gear deserve to be fired since >>>>>>>> what
they're doing apparently isn't working.
Isn't a better explanation is that because there's fewer of them >>>>>>> working
now, the failure rate is now higher than it was in the past?
-hh
Since the frequency of outages appears to be happening at a singular >>>>>> airport, perhaps the better explanation is they don't know what
the hell
they're doing at EWR.
"Appears to be" at one airport?
Yeah, appears. Outages aren't isolated to one airport. They have
happened a number of times before. I guess you would know that *if*
they were front page news, as you suggested.
Which also means that there may have been more 2025 failures at
airports other than EWR.
Overall, we know that the ATC situation is bad when United Airlines
has already *unilaterally* cut their flight schedule, without any
requests from the FAA to cut back.
Right. And???
So why is a capitalistic corporation choosing to curtail profit-making?
-hh
Overall, we know that the ATC situation is bad when United
Airlines has already *unilaterally* cut their flight
schedule, without any requests from the FAA to cut back.
Right. And???
So why is a capitalistic corporation choosing to curtail
profit-making?
Because aviation accidents aren't good for business.
On 5/14/25 2:03 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 13:51, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 12:04 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 14:34, Yak wrote:
On 5/13/25 1:17 PM, Governor Swill wrote:
On Tue, 13 May 2025 09:32:44 -0400, Yak <Yak@inbox.com> wrote:
On 5/13/25 8:54 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 08:15, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 4:24 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote:The ones who maintain the gear that's now breaking down.
-hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in
news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont-
email.me:
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote:
This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week.
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if
they were sick of this shit they should get
their corps to pressure the govt.
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in
this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and
any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be
needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast.
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer
period. That's THE hub.
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate
sabotage here - maybe Vlad ???
Try DOGE.
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's contract with >>>>>>>>>>>>> Verizon
which was a systems upgrade ...
Just wait until this summer when
the travel surge hits and airport after
airport closes for lack of ATC personel.
The ones Trump fired.
So much winning!
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly wasn't controllers. >>>>>>>>>>
Such breakdowns happened in the past as well, even as recently >>>>>>>>> as late
2024.
Yes, failures happen ... but at this same failure rate?
How many ATC outages did EWR have in total all of 2024?
Between 2-4.
You're guessing, am I right?
Nope.
Then where's the dates of said outages, preferably with cites?
Plus note that 3 known outages to date in 2025 is a ~3x higher rate
of critical failures than this alleged "2-4" over 12 months of 2024.
Newark (EWR), September 2, 2024 (Labor Day): A radar and radio outage
at Philadelphia TRACON. https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/local/newark-
flights-delays-radar-issue-faa/5757083/ Also reported by The Air
Current and CNN.
Philadelphia TRACON, November 6, 2024: Another equipment outage,
including radar and radio failures.https://www.youtube.com/watch?
v=aj7RJxUIs3I&ab_channel=VASAviation-
Oakland Air Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February 22,
2024: outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center.Oakland Air Route
Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February 22, 2024: outage at
the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center
Miami and Jacksonville ARTCC Outages: unscheduled cooperative radar
outage. https://www.faa.gov/newsroom/radar-modernization-proposal
These don't include several unreported potential outages as they were
routine or low-impact, reinforcing that only significant disruptions
gain media attention.
That's five ... but it is also from a nationwide search. We know that
there's 3 just from EWR in 2025 .. what about the rest of the country?
So now we're moving the goalposts.
Reporting isn't always comprehensive. Would require
visiting official FAA sites.
BWAAAAAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHA! <laughs and points>
Dude! Such outages are ALWAYS front page news. Who do you think >>>>>> you're fooling?
Define 'such outages.' Not all outages are the same. Some are widely >>>>> reported, some aren't. Minor or brief outages may go unreported or
minimally reported to the public due to their limited impact,
operational protocols, or ongoing investigations. For example, a EWR >>>>> controller reported at least two other outages since August 2024,
which the FAA didn’t confirm publicly, suggesting minor incidents
are handled internally. Go ahead and see if you can find any 'front
page news' on that.
Gosh, that's a bit spinny: try dig up those details and cross-
compare them to what's been reported on the three YTD 2025 outages to
see if they were actually as significant as we've seen over the past
3 weeks.
One person's spin is another's outage. Fact is these outages have been
happening for years. And many less impactful one's are often not
reported.
By your own deep count attempt, 5 nationwide in 2024, for 0.42/month,
versus a 2025 pace of 3 in <4.5 months = 0.67/mo = a +60% rate increase.
Not deep count. Just a quick search. I'm not inclined to spend a lot of
time doing research on something we know has been an issue for a number
of years. Frankly, I'm not sure what we're even debating here. I think
we agree that aviation systems are due for some serious upgrades, but no conclusive connection has been established between the latest events and
the DOGE cuts.
By your logic, there are probably even more outages this year since >>>>>> some outages could only be known by, "visiting official FAA sites." >>>>>>>> Because for 2025, major ones which have been publicly reported >>>>>>>> already
is three (3):
April 28, 2025: outage with significant disruptions; some
traumatized
controllers took authorized medical leave;
May 9, 2025: outage at ~3:55AM, duration of ~90 seconds.
May 11, 2025: outage with a ground stop of ~45 minutes.
Maybe the people maintaining the gear deserve to be fired since >>>>>>>>> what
they're doing apparently isn't working.
Isn't a better explanation is that because there's fewer of them >>>>>>>> working
now, the failure rate is now higher than it was in the past?
-hh
Since the frequency of outages appears to be happening at a singular >>>>>>> airport, perhaps the better explanation is they don't know what
the hell
they're doing at EWR.
"Appears to be" at one airport?
Yeah, appears. Outages aren't isolated to one airport. They have
happened a number of times before. I guess you would know that *if*
they were front page news, as you suggested.
Which also means that there may have been more 2025 failures at
airports other than EWR.
Overall, we know that the ATC situation is bad when United Airlines
has already *unilaterally* cut their flight schedule, without any
requests from the FAA to cut back.
Right. And???
So why is a capitalistic corporation choosing to curtail profit-making?
Because aviation accidents aren't good for business.
-hh
On 5/14/25 2:03 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 13:51, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 12:04 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 14:34, Yak wrote:
On 5/13/25 1:17 PM, Governor Swill wrote:
On Tue, 13 May 2025 09:32:44 -0400, Yak <Yak@inbox.com> wrote:
On 5/13/25 8:54 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 08:15, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 4:24 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote:The ones who maintain the gear that's now breaking down.
-hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in
news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont-
email.me:
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote:
This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week.
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if
they were sick of this shit they should get
their corps to pressure the govt.
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in
this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and
any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be
needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast.
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer
period. That's THE hub.
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate
sabotage here - maybe Vlad ???
Try DOGE.
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's contract with >>>>>>>>>>>>> Verizon
which was a systems upgrade ...
Just wait until this summer when
the travel surge hits and airport after
airport closes for lack of ATC personel.
The ones Trump fired.
So much winning!
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly wasn't controllers. >>>>>>>>>>
Such breakdowns happened in the past as well, even as recently >>>>>>>>> as late
2024.
Yes, failures happen ... but at this same failure rate?
How many ATC outages did EWR have in total all of 2024?
Between 2-4.
You're guessing, am I right?
Nope.
Then where's the dates of said outages, preferably with cites?
Plus note that 3 known outages to date in 2025 is a ~3x higher rate
of critical failures than this alleged "2-4" over 12 months of 2024.
Newark (EWR), September 2, 2024 (Labor Day): A radar and radio outage
at Philadelphia TRACON. https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/local/newark-
flights-delays-radar-issue-faa/5757083/ Also reported by The Air
Current and CNN.
Philadelphia TRACON, November 6, 2024: Another equipment outage,
including radar and radio failures.https://www.youtube.com/watch?
v=aj7RJxUIs3I&ab_channel=VASAviation-
Oakland Air Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February 22,
2024: outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center.Oakland Air Route
Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February 22, 2024: outage at
the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center
Miami and Jacksonville ARTCC Outages: unscheduled cooperative radar
outage. https://www.faa.gov/newsroom/radar-modernization-proposal
These don't include several unreported potential outages as they were
routine or low-impact, reinforcing that only significant disruptions
gain media attention.
That's five ... but it is also from a nationwide search. We know that
there's 3 just from EWR in 2025 .. what about the rest of the country?
So now we're moving the goalposts.
Reporting isn't always comprehensive. Would require
visiting official FAA sites.
BWAAAAAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHA! <laughs and points>
Dude! Such outages are ALWAYS front page news. Who do you think >>>>>> you're fooling?
Define 'such outages.' Not all outages are the same. Some are
widely reported, some aren't. Minor or brief outages may go
unreported or minimally reported to the public due to their limited
impact, operational protocols, or ongoing investigations. For
example, a EWR controller reported at least two other outages since
August 2024, which the FAA didn’t confirm publicly, suggesting
minor incidents are handled internally. Go ahead and see if you can
find any 'front page news' on that.
Gosh, that's a bit spinny: try dig up those details and cross-
compare them to what's been reported on the three YTD 2025 outages
to see if they were actually as significant as we've seen over the
past 3 weeks.
One person's spin is another's outage. Fact is these outages have
been happening for years. And many less impactful one's are often not
reported.
By your own deep count attempt, 5 nationwide in 2024, for 0.42/month,
versus a 2025 pace of 3 in <4.5 months = 0.67/mo = a +60% rate increase.
Not deep count. Just a quick search. I'm not inclined to spend a lot of
time doing research on something we know has been an issue for a number
of years. Frankly, I'm not sure what we're even debating here. I think
we agree that aviation systems are due for some serious upgrades, but no conclusive connection has been established between the latest events and
the DOGE cuts.
By your logic, there are probably even more outages this year since >>>>>> some outages could only be known by, "visiting official FAA sites." >>>>>>>> Because for 2025, major ones which have been publicly reported >>>>>>>> already
is three (3):
April 28, 2025: outage with significant disruptions; some
traumatized
controllers took authorized medical leave;
May 9, 2025: outage at ~3:55AM, duration of ~90 seconds.
May 11, 2025: outage with a ground stop of ~45 minutes.
Maybe the people maintaining the gear deserve to be fired since >>>>>>>>> what
they're doing apparently isn't working.
Isn't a better explanation is that because there's fewer of them >>>>>>>> working
now, the failure rate is now higher than it was in the past?
-hh
Since the frequency of outages appears to be happening at a singular >>>>>>> airport, perhaps the better explanation is they don't know what
the hell
they're doing at EWR.
"Appears to be" at one airport?
Yeah, appears. Outages aren't isolated to one airport. They have
happened a number of times before. I guess you would know that *if*
they were front page news, as you suggested.
Which also means that there may have been more 2025 failures at
airports other than EWR.
Overall, we know that the ATC situation is bad when United Airlines
has already *unilaterally* cut their flight schedule, without any
requests from the FAA to cut back.
Right. And???
So why is a capitalistic corporation choosing to curtail profit-making?
Because aviation accidents aren't good for business.
On Wed, 14 May 2025 13:51:57 -0400, Yak <Yak@inbox.com> wrote:
One person's spin is another's outage. Fact is these outages have been
happening for years. And many less impactful one's are often not reported.
So stipulated.
But THOSE events didn't happen immediately after a big political drama
about budget cuts and firings that has a lot of people um, angry.
It's not personal, it's just politics.
Thanks for looking that stuff up. I got a lot out of <https://www.faa.gov/newsroom/radar-modernization-proposal>
On 5/14/25 14:25, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 2:03 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 13:51, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 12:04 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 14:34, Yak wrote:
On 5/13/25 1:17 PM, Governor Swill wrote:
On Tue, 13 May 2025 09:32:44 -0400, Yak <Yak@inbox.com> wrote:
On 5/13/25 8:54 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 08:15, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 4:24 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote:
-hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in
news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont-
email.me:
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote:
This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week.
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if
they were sick of this shit they should get
their corps to pressure the govt.
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in
this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and
any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be
needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast.
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer
period. That's THE hub.
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate
sabotage here - maybe Vlad ???
Try DOGE.
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's contract with >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Verizon
which was a systems upgrade ...
Just wait until this summer when
the travel surge hits and airport after
airport closes for lack of ATC personel.
The ones Trump fired.
So much winning!
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly wasn't
controllers.
The ones who maintain the gear that's now breaking down.
Such breakdowns happened in the past as well, even as recently >>>>>>>>>> as late
2024.
Yes, failures happen ... but at this same failure rate?
How many ATC outages did EWR have in total all of 2024?
Between 2-4.
You're guessing, am I right?
Nope.
Then where's the dates of said outages, preferably with cites?
Plus note that 3 known outages to date in 2025 is a ~3x higher rate
of critical failures than this alleged "2-4" over 12 months of 2024.
Newark (EWR), September 2, 2024 (Labor Day): A radar and radio
outage at Philadelphia TRACON. https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/
local/newark- flights-delays-radar-issue-faa/5757083/ Also reported
by The Air Current and CNN.
Philadelphia TRACON, November 6, 2024: Another equipment outage,
including radar and radio failures.https://www.youtube.com/watch?
v=aj7RJxUIs3I&ab_channel=VASAviation-
Oakland Air Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February
22, 2024: outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center.Oakland Air Route
Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February 22, 2024: outage at
the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center
Miami and Jacksonville ARTCC Outages: unscheduled cooperative radar
outage. https://www.faa.gov/newsroom/radar-modernization-proposal
These don't include several unreported potential outages as they
were routine or low-impact, reinforcing that only significant
disruptions gain media attention.
That's five ... but it is also from a nationwide search. We know
that there's 3 just from EWR in 2025 .. what about the rest of the
country?
So now we're moving the goalposts.
Where that move was your's, buy citing 2024 failures beyond EWR.
I'm fine with casting a broader net but since you're protesting your own goalpost move attempt, fine! Thus, your comparison attempt has found
*zero* EWR failures in 2024, compared to 3 (so far) in 2025.
Reporting isn't always comprehensive. Would require
visiting official FAA sites.
BWAAAAAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHA! <laughs and points>
Dude! Such outages are ALWAYS front page news. Who do you think >>>>>>> you're fooling?
Define 'such outages.' Not all outages are the same. Some are
widely reported, some aren't. Minor or brief outages may go
unreported or minimally reported to the public due to their
limited impact, operational protocols, or ongoing investigations.
For example, a EWR controller reported at least two other outages
since August 2024, which the FAA didn’t confirm publicly,
suggesting minor incidents are handled internally. Go ahead and
see if you can find any 'front page news' on that.
Gosh, that's a bit spinny: try dig up those details and cross-
compare them to what's been reported on the three YTD 2025 outages
to see if they were actually as significant as we've seen over the
past 3 weeks.
One person's spin is another's outage. Fact is these outages have
been happening for years. And many less impactful one's are often
not reported.
By your own deep count attempt, 5 nationwide in 2024, for 0.42/month,
versus a 2025 pace of 3 in <4.5 months = 0.67/mo = a +60% rate increase.
Not deep count. Just a quick search. I'm not inclined to spend a lot
of time doing research on something we know has been an issue for a
number of years. Frankly, I'm not sure what we're even debating here.
I think we agree that aviation systems are due for some serious
upgrades, but no conclusive connection has been established between
the latest events and the DOGE cuts.
Its pretty damn obvious when the GOP voted down upgrades in 2019, Elon cancelled the Verizon upgrade contract in 2025 *and* fired hundreds of
FAA ATC workers that the system was made worse, not better.
By your logic, there are probably even more outages this year since >>>>>>> some outages could only be known by, "visiting official FAA sites." >>>>>>>>> Because for 2025, major ones which have been publicly reported >>>>>>>>> already
is three (3):
April 28, 2025: outage with significant disruptions; some
traumatized
controllers took authorized medical leave;
May 9, 2025: outage at ~3:55AM, duration of ~90 seconds.
May 11, 2025: outage with a ground stop of ~45 minutes.
Maybe the people maintaining the gear deserve to be fired
since what
they're doing apparently isn't working.
Isn't a better explanation is that because there's fewer of
them working
now, the failure rate is now higher than it was in the past? >>>>>>>>>
-hh
Since the frequency of outages appears to be happening at a
singular
airport, perhaps the better explanation is they don't know what >>>>>>>> the hell
they're doing at EWR.
"Appears to be" at one airport?
Yeah, appears. Outages aren't isolated to one airport. They have
happened a number of times before. I guess you would know that
*if* they were front page news, as you suggested.
Which also means that there may have been more 2025 failures at
airports other than EWR.
Overall, we know that the ATC situation is bad when United Airlines
has already *unilaterally* cut their flight schedule, without any
requests from the FAA to cut back.
Right. And???
So why is a capitalistic corporation choosing to curtail profit-making?
Because aviation accidents aren't good for business.
Which should tell you something.
-hh
In article <1008b3f$3v4u8$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 05:09, Yak wrote:
On 5/15/25 9:12 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 14:25, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 2:03 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 13:51, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 12:04 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 14:34, Yak wrote:
On 5/13/25 1:17 PM, Governor Swill wrote:
On Tue, 13 May 2025 09:32:44 -0400, Yak <Yak@inbox.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>
On 5/13/25 8:54 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 08:15, Yak wrote:Between 2-4.
On 5/12/25 4:24 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote:Such breakdowns happened in the past as well, even as >>>>>>>>>>>>> recently as late
On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote:
-hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in
news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont-
email.me:
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote:
This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they were sick of this shit they should get >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> their corps to pressure the govt.
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and
any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be
needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer
period. That's THE hub.
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate
sabotage here - maybe Vlad ???
Try DOGE.
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's contract with >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Verizon
which was a systems upgrade ...
Just wait until this summer when
the travel surge hits and airport after
airport closes for lack of ATC personel.
The ones Trump fired.
So much winning!
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly wasn't >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> controllers.
The ones who maintain the gear that's now breaking down. >>>>>>>>>>>>>
2024.
Yes, failures happen ... but at this same failure rate? >>>>>>>>>>>>
How many ATC outages did EWR have in total all of 2024? >>>>>>>>>>>
You're guessing, am I right?
Nope.
Then where's the dates of said outages, preferably with cites? >>>>>>>>
Plus note that 3 known outages to date in 2025 is a ~3x higher >>>>>>>> rate of critical failures than this alleged "2-4" over 12 months >>>>>>>> of 2024.
Newark (EWR), September 2, 2024 (Labor Day): A radar and radio
outage at Philadelphia TRACON. https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/
local/newark- flights-delays-radar-issue-faa/5757083/ Also
reported by The Air Current and CNN.
Philadelphia TRACON, November 6, 2024: Another equipment outage, >>>>>>> including radar and radio failures.https://www.youtube.com/watch? >>>>>>> v=aj7RJxUIs3I&ab_channel=VASAviation-
Oakland Air Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February >>>>>>> 22, 2024: outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center.Oakland Air
Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February 22, 2024:
outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center
Miami and Jacksonville ARTCC Outages: unscheduled cooperative radar >>>>>>> outage. https://www.faa.gov/newsroom/radar-modernization-proposal >>>>>>>
These don't include several unreported potential outages as they >>>>>>> were routine or low-impact, reinforcing that only significant
disruptions gain media attention.
That's five ... but it is also from a nationwide search. We know >>>>>> that there's 3 just from EWR in 2025 .. what about the rest of the >>>>>> country?
So now we're moving the goalposts.
Where that move was your's, buy citing 2024 failures beyond EWR.
I'm fine with casting a broader net but since you're protesting your
own goalpost move attempt, fine! Thus, your comparison attempt has
found *zero* EWR failures in 2024, compared to 3 (so far) in 2025.
Nope, I was asked to provide other instances of outages in 2024. There
was no requirement to limit it to Newark (although it was the subject of >>> one of them).
My whole point is that you all are acting like these outages are
something new. They aren't
Then let's look at little more at 2025, shall we?
To the three in Newark, let's add:
February 2025, Oakland:
<https://www.aerotime.aero/articles/oakland-air-traffic-control-disruption> >>
May 16, 2025, Denver:
<https://www.aeronewsjournal.com/2025/05/denver-air-traffic-control-outage.html>
It happenes all the time. They want to make it public now.
On 2025-05-16, Yak <Yak@inbox.com> wrote:
On 5/15/25 9:12 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 14:25, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 2:03 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 13:51, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 12:04 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 14:34, Yak wrote:Newark (EWR), September 2, 2024 (Labor Day): A radar and radio
On 5/13/25 1:17 PM, Governor Swill wrote:
On Tue, 13 May 2025 09:32:44 -0400, Yak <Yak@inbox.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>>
On 5/13/25 8:54 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 08:15, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 4:24 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote:Such breakdowns happened in the past as well, even as recently >>>>>>>>>>>> as late
On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote:
-hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in
news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont-
email.me:
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote:
This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they were sick of this shit they should get
their corps to pressure the govt.
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in
this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and
any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be
needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer
period. That's THE hub.
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate
sabotage here - maybe Vlad ???
Try DOGE.
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's contract with >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Verizon
which was a systems upgrade ...
Just wait until this summer when
the travel surge hits and airport after
airport closes for lack of ATC personel.
The ones Trump fired.
So much winning!
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly wasn't >>>>>>>>>>>>>> controllers.
The ones who maintain the gear that's now breaking down. >>>>>>>>>>>>
2024.
Yes, failures happen ... but at this same failure rate?
How many ATC outages did EWR have in total all of 2024?
Between 2-4.
You're guessing, am I right?
Nope.
Then where's the dates of said outages, preferably with cites?
Plus note that 3 known outages to date in 2025 is a ~3x higher rate >>>>>>> of critical failures than this alleged "2-4" over 12 months of 2024. >>>>>>
outage at Philadelphia TRACON. https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/
local/newark- flights-delays-radar-issue-faa/5757083/ Also reported >>>>>> by The Air Current and CNN.
Philadelphia TRACON, November 6, 2024: Another equipment outage,
including radar and radio failures.https://www.youtube.com/watch?
v=aj7RJxUIs3I&ab_channel=VASAviation-
Oakland Air Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February
22, 2024: outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center.Oakland Air Route >>>>>> Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February 22, 2024: outage at >>>>>> the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center
Miami and Jacksonville ARTCC Outages: unscheduled cooperative radar >>>>>> outage. https://www.faa.gov/newsroom/radar-modernization-proposal
These don't include several unreported potential outages as they
were routine or low-impact, reinforcing that only significant
disruptions gain media attention.
That's five ... but it is also from a nationwide search. We know
that there's 3 just from EWR in 2025 .. what about the rest of the
country?
So now we're moving the goalposts.
Where that move was your's, buy citing 2024 failures beyond EWR.
I'm fine with casting a broader net but since you're protesting your own >>> goalpost move attempt, fine! Thus, your comparison attempt has found
*zero* EWR failures in 2024, compared to 3 (so far) in 2025.
Nope, I was asked to provide other instances of outages in 2024. There
was no requirement to limit it to Newark (although it was the subject of
one of them).
My whole point is that you all are acting like these outages are
something new. They aren't
Not deep count. Just a quick search. I'm not inclined to spend a lotReporting isn't always comprehensive. Would require
visiting official FAA sites.
BWAAAAAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHA! <laughs and points>
Dude! Such outages are ALWAYS front page news. Who do you think >>>>>>>>> you're fooling?
Define 'such outages.' Not all outages are the same. Some are
widely reported, some aren't. Minor or brief outages may go
unreported or minimally reported to the public due to their
limited impact, operational protocols, or ongoing investigations. >>>>>>>> For example, a EWR controller reported at least two other outages >>>>>>>> since August 2024, which the FAA didn’t confirm publicly,
suggesting minor incidents are handled internally. Go ahead and >>>>>>>> see if you can find any 'front page news' on that.
Gosh, that's a bit spinny: try dig up those details and cross- >>>>>>> compare them to what's been reported on the three YTD 2025 outages >>>>>>> to see if they were actually as significant as we've seen over the >>>>>>> past 3 weeks.
One person's spin is another's outage. Fact is these outages have
been happening for years. And many less impactful one's are often
not reported.
By your own deep count attempt, 5 nationwide in 2024, for 0.42/month, >>>>> versus a 2025 pace of 3 in <4.5 months = 0.67/mo = a +60% rate increase. >>>>
of time doing research on something we know has been an issue for a
number of years. Frankly, I'm not sure what we're even debating here.
I think we agree that aviation systems are due for some serious
upgrades, but no conclusive connection has been established between
the latest events and the DOGE cuts.
Its pretty damn obvious when the GOP voted down upgrades in 2019, Elon
cancelled the Verizon upgrade contract in 2025 *and* fired hundreds of
FAA ATC workers that the system was made worse, not better.
Verizon upgrades are not canceled. They are on hold pending further
investigation. Draw your own conclusion.
If the system is worse, which it may be, then cite the evidence making
the causal connection. Coincidence doesn't count.
Well seeing as a direct link hotline between Pentagon and DCA hasn't worked since 2022 I would say Verizon is not doing their job.
<https://www.npr.org/2025/05/14/nx-s1-5398581/hotline-dca-airport-pentagon-disconnected-army>
On 5/15/25 9:12 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 14:25, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 2:03 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 13:51, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 12:04 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 14:34, Yak wrote:Newark (EWR), September 2, 2024 (Labor Day): A radar and radio
On 5/13/25 1:17 PM, Governor Swill wrote:
On Tue, 13 May 2025 09:32:44 -0400, Yak <Yak@inbox.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>
On 5/13/25 8:54 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 08:15, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 4:24 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote:Such breakdowns happened in the past as well, even as recently >>>>>>>>>>> as late
On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote:
-hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in
news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont-
email.me:
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote:
This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if
they were sick of this shit they should get
their corps to pressure the govt.
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in
this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and
any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be
needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast.
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer
period. That's THE hub.
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate
sabotage here - maybe Vlad ???
Try DOGE.
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's contract with >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Verizon
which was a systems upgrade ...
Just wait until this summer when
the travel surge hits and airport after
airport closes for lack of ATC personel.
The ones Trump fired.
So much winning!
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly wasn't
controllers.
The ones who maintain the gear that's now breaking down. >>>>>>>>>>>
2024.
Yes, failures happen ... but at this same failure rate?
How many ATC outages did EWR have in total all of 2024?
Between 2-4.
You're guessing, am I right?
Nope.
Then where's the dates of said outages, preferably with cites?
Plus note that 3 known outages to date in 2025 is a ~3x higher rate >>>>>> of critical failures than this alleged "2-4" over 12 months of 2024. >>>>>
outage at Philadelphia TRACON. https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/
local/newark- flights-delays-radar-issue-faa/5757083/ Also reported >>>>> by The Air Current and CNN.
Philadelphia TRACON, November 6, 2024: Another equipment outage,
including radar and radio failures.https://www.youtube.com/watch?
v=aj7RJxUIs3I&ab_channel=VASAviation-
Oakland Air Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February
22, 2024: outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center.Oakland Air Route >>>>> Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February 22, 2024: outage at
the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center
Miami and Jacksonville ARTCC Outages: unscheduled cooperative radar
outage. https://www.faa.gov/newsroom/radar-modernization-proposal
These don't include several unreported potential outages as they
were routine or low-impact, reinforcing that only significant
disruptions gain media attention.
That's five ... but it is also from a nationwide search. We know
that there's 3 just from EWR in 2025 .. what about the rest of the
country?
So now we're moving the goalposts.
Where that move was your's, buy citing 2024 failures beyond EWR.
I'm fine with casting a broader net but since you're protesting your own
goalpost move attempt, fine! Thus, your comparison attempt has found
*zero* EWR failures in 2024, compared to 3 (so far) in 2025.
Nope, I was asked to provide other instances of outages in 2024. There
was no requirement to limit it to Newark (although it was the subject of
one of them).
My whole point is that you all are acting like these outages are
something new. They aren't
Not deep count. Just a quick search. I'm not inclined to spend a lotReporting isn't always comprehensive. Would require
visiting official FAA sites.
BWAAAAAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHA! <laughs and points>
Dude! Such outages are ALWAYS front page news. Who do you think >>>>>>>> you're fooling?
Define 'such outages.' Not all outages are the same. Some are
widely reported, some aren't. Minor or brief outages may go
unreported or minimally reported to the public due to their
limited impact, operational protocols, or ongoing investigations. >>>>>>> For example, a EWR controller reported at least two other outages >>>>>>> since August 2024, which the FAA didn’t confirm publicly,
suggesting minor incidents are handled internally. Go ahead and
see if you can find any 'front page news' on that.
Gosh, that's a bit spinny: try dig up those details and cross-
compare them to what's been reported on the three YTD 2025 outages >>>>>> to see if they were actually as significant as we've seen over the >>>>>> past 3 weeks.
One person's spin is another's outage. Fact is these outages have
been happening for years. And many less impactful one's are often
not reported.
By your own deep count attempt, 5 nationwide in 2024, for 0.42/month,
versus a 2025 pace of 3 in <4.5 months = 0.67/mo = a +60% rate increase. >>>
of time doing research on something we know has been an issue for a
number of years. Frankly, I'm not sure what we're even debating here.
I think we agree that aviation systems are due for some serious
upgrades, but no conclusive connection has been established between
the latest events and the DOGE cuts.
Its pretty damn obvious when the GOP voted down upgrades in 2019, Elon
cancelled the Verizon upgrade contract in 2025 *and* fired hundreds of
FAA ATC workers that the system was made worse, not better.
Verizon upgrades are not canceled. They are on hold pending further investigation. Draw your own conclusion.
If the system is worse, which it may be, then cite the evidence making
the causal connection. Coincidence doesn't count.
On 5/15/25 9:12 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 14:25, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 2:03 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 13:51, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 12:04 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 14:34, Yak wrote:
On 5/13/25 1:17 PM, Governor Swill wrote:
On Tue, 13 May 2025 09:32:44 -0400, Yak <Yak@inbox.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>
On 5/13/25 8:54 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 08:15, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 4:24 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote:Such breakdowns happened in the past as well, even as
On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote:
-hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in
news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont-
email.me:
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote:
This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if
they were sick of this shit they should get
their corps to pressure the govt.
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in
this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and
any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be
needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast.
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer
period. That's THE hub.
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate
sabotage here - maybe Vlad ???
Try DOGE.
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's contract with >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Verizon
which was a systems upgrade ...
Just wait until this summer when
the travel surge hits and airport after
airport closes for lack of ATC personel.
The ones Trump fired.
So much winning!
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly wasn't
controllers.
The ones who maintain the gear that's now breaking down. >>>>>>>>>>>
recently as late
2024.
Yes, failures happen ... but at this same failure rate?
How many ATC outages did EWR have in total all of 2024?
Between 2-4.
You're guessing, am I right?
Nope.
Then where's the dates of said outages, preferably with cites?
Plus note that 3 known outages to date in 2025 is a ~3x higher
rate of critical failures than this alleged "2-4" over 12 months
of 2024.
Newark (EWR), September 2, 2024 (Labor Day): A radar and radio
outage at Philadelphia TRACON. https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/
local/newark- flights-delays-radar-issue-faa/5757083/ Also
reported by The Air Current and CNN.
Philadelphia TRACON, November 6, 2024: Another equipment outage,
including radar and radio failures.https://www.youtube.com/watch?
v=aj7RJxUIs3I&ab_channel=VASAviation-
Oakland Air Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February
22, 2024: outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center.Oakland Air
Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February 22, 2024:
outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center
Miami and Jacksonville ARTCC Outages: unscheduled cooperative radar
outage. https://www.faa.gov/newsroom/radar-modernization-proposal
These don't include several unreported potential outages as they
were routine or low-impact, reinforcing that only significant
disruptions gain media attention.
That's five ... but it is also from a nationwide search. We know
that there's 3 just from EWR in 2025 .. what about the rest of the
country?
So now we're moving the goalposts.
Where that move was your's, buy citing 2024 failures beyond EWR.
I'm fine with casting a broader net but since you're protesting your
own goalpost move attempt, fine! Thus, your comparison attempt has
found *zero* EWR failures in 2024, compared to 3 (so far) in 2025.
Nope, I was asked to provide other instances of outages in 2024. There
was no requirement to limit it to Newark (although it was the subject of
one of them).
My whole point is that you all are acting like these outages are
something new. They aren't
On 2025-05-16 05:09, Yak wrote:
On 5/15/25 9:12 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 14:25, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 2:03 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 13:51, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 12:04 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 14:34, Yak wrote:
On 5/13/25 1:17 PM, Governor Swill wrote:
On Tue, 13 May 2025 09:32:44 -0400, Yak <Yak@inbox.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>
On 5/13/25 8:54 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 08:15, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 4:24 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote:Such breakdowns happened in the past as well, even as
On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote:
-hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in
news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont-
email.me:
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote:
This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they were sick of this shit they should get
their corps to pressure the govt.
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in
this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and
any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be
needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer
period. That's THE hub.
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate
sabotage here - maybe Vlad ???
Try DOGE.
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's contract with >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Verizon
which was a systems upgrade ...
Just wait until this summer when
the travel surge hits and airport after
airport closes for lack of ATC personel.
The ones Trump fired.
So much winning!
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly wasn't >>>>>>>>>>>>> controllers.
The ones who maintain the gear that's now breaking down. >>>>>>>>>>>
recently as late
2024.
Yes, failures happen ... but at this same failure rate?
How many ATC outages did EWR have in total all of 2024?
Between 2-4.
You're guessing, am I right?
Nope.
Then where's the dates of said outages, preferably with cites?
Plus note that 3 known outages to date in 2025 is a ~3x higher
rate of critical failures than this alleged "2-4" over 12 months >>>>>> of 2024.
Newark (EWR), September 2, 2024 (Labor Day): A radar and radio
outage at Philadelphia TRACON. https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/
local/newark- flights-delays-radar-issue-faa/5757083/ Also
reported by The Air Current and CNN.
Philadelphia TRACON, November 6, 2024: Another equipment outage,
including radar and radio failures.https://www.youtube.com/watch?
v=aj7RJxUIs3I&ab_channel=VASAviation-
Oakland Air Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February
22, 2024: outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center.Oakland Air
Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February 22, 2024:
outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center
Miami and Jacksonville ARTCC Outages: unscheduled cooperative radar >>>>> outage. https://www.faa.gov/newsroom/radar-modernization-proposal
These don't include several unreported potential outages as they
were routine or low-impact, reinforcing that only significant
disruptions gain media attention.
That's five ... but it is also from a nationwide search. We know
that there's 3 just from EWR in 2025 .. what about the rest of the
country?
So now we're moving the goalposts.
Where that move was your's, buy citing 2024 failures beyond EWR.
I'm fine with casting a broader net but since you're protesting your
own goalpost move attempt, fine! Thus, your comparison attempt has
found *zero* EWR failures in 2024, compared to 3 (so far) in 2025.
Nope, I was asked to provide other instances of outages in 2024. There
was no requirement to limit it to Newark (although it was the subject of one of them).
My whole point is that you all are acting like these outages are
something new. They aren't
Then let's look at little more at 2025, shall we?
To the three in Newark, let's add:
February 2025, Oakland:
<https://www.aerotime.aero/articles/oakland-air-traffic-control-disruption>
May 16, 2025, Denver:
<https://www.aeronewsjournal.com/2025/05/denver-air-traffic-control-outage.html>
On 2025-05-16, Yak <Yak@inbox.com> wrote:
On 5/15/25 9:12 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 14:25, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 2:03 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 13:51, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 12:04 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 14:34, Yak wrote:Newark (EWR), September 2, 2024 (Labor Day): A radar and radio
On 5/13/25 1:17 PM, Governor Swill wrote:
On Tue, 13 May 2025 09:32:44 -0400, Yak <Yak@inbox.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>>
On 5/13/25 8:54 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 08:15, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 4:24 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote:Such breakdowns happened in the past as well, even as recently >>>>>>>>>>>> as late
On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote:
-hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in
news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont-
email.me:
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote:
This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they were sick of this shit they should get
their corps to pressure the govt.
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in
this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and
any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be
needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer
period. That's THE hub.
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate
sabotage here - maybe Vlad ???
Try DOGE.
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's contract with >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Verizon
which was a systems upgrade ...
Just wait until this summer when
the travel surge hits and airport after
airport closes for lack of ATC personel.
The ones Trump fired.
So much winning!
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly wasn't >>>>>>>>>>>>>> controllers.
The ones who maintain the gear that's now breaking down. >>>>>>>>>>>>
2024.
Yes, failures happen ... but at this same failure rate?
How many ATC outages did EWR have in total all of 2024?
Between 2-4.
You're guessing, am I right?
Nope.
Then where's the dates of said outages, preferably with cites?
Plus note that 3 known outages to date in 2025 is a ~3x higher rate >>>>>>> of critical failures than this alleged "2-4" over 12 months of 2024. >>>>>>
outage at Philadelphia TRACON. https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/
local/newark- flights-delays-radar-issue-faa/5757083/ Also reported >>>>>> by The Air Current and CNN.
Philadelphia TRACON, November 6, 2024: Another equipment outage,
including radar and radio failures.https://www.youtube.com/watch?
v=aj7RJxUIs3I&ab_channel=VASAviation-
Oakland Air Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February
22, 2024: outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center.Oakland Air Route >>>>>> Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February 22, 2024: outage at >>>>>> the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center
Miami and Jacksonville ARTCC Outages: unscheduled cooperative radar >>>>>> outage. https://www.faa.gov/newsroom/radar-modernization-proposal
These don't include several unreported potential outages as they
were routine or low-impact, reinforcing that only significant
disruptions gain media attention.
That's five ... but it is also from a nationwide search. We know
that there's 3 just from EWR in 2025 .. what about the rest of the
country?
So now we're moving the goalposts.
Where that move was your's, buy citing 2024 failures beyond EWR.
I'm fine with casting a broader net but since you're protesting your own >>> goalpost move attempt, fine! Thus, your comparison attempt has found
*zero* EWR failures in 2024, compared to 3 (so far) in 2025.
Nope, I was asked to provide other instances of outages in 2024. There
was no requirement to limit it to Newark (although it was the subject of
one of them).
My whole point is that you all are acting like these outages are
something new. They aren't
Not deep count. Just a quick search. I'm not inclined to spend a lotReporting isn't always comprehensive. Would require
visiting official FAA sites.
BWAAAAAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHA! <laughs and points>
Dude! Such outages are ALWAYS front page news. Who do you think >>>>>>>>> you're fooling?
Define 'such outages.' Not all outages are the same. Some are
widely reported, some aren't. Minor or brief outages may go
unreported or minimally reported to the public due to their
limited impact, operational protocols, or ongoing investigations. >>>>>>>> For example, a EWR controller reported at least two other outages >>>>>>>> since August 2024, which the FAA didn’t confirm publicly,
suggesting minor incidents are handled internally. Go ahead and >>>>>>>> see if you can find any 'front page news' on that.
Gosh, that's a bit spinny: try dig up those details and cross-
compare them to what's been reported on the three YTD 2025 outages >>>>>>> to see if they were actually as significant as we've seen over the >>>>>>> past 3 weeks.
One person's spin is another's outage. Fact is these outages have
been happening for years. And many less impactful one's are often
not reported.
By your own deep count attempt, 5 nationwide in 2024, for 0.42/month, >>>>> versus a 2025 pace of 3 in <4.5 months = 0.67/mo = a +60% rate increase. >>>>
of time doing research on something we know has been an issue for a
number of years. Frankly, I'm not sure what we're even debating here.
I think we agree that aviation systems are due for some serious
upgrades, but no conclusive connection has been established between
the latest events and the DOGE cuts.
Its pretty damn obvious when the GOP voted down upgrades in 2019, Elon
cancelled the Verizon upgrade contract in 2025 *and* fired hundreds of
FAA ATC workers that the system was made worse, not better.
Verizon upgrades are not canceled. They are on hold pending further
investigation. Draw your own conclusion.
If the system is worse, which it may be, then cite the evidence making
the causal connection. Coincidence doesn't count.
Well seeing as a direct link hotline between Pentagon and DCA hasn't worked since 2022 I would say Verizon is not doing their job.
On 2025-05-16 14:49, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008b3f$3v4u8$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 05:09, Yak wrote:
On 5/15/25 9:12 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 14:25, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 2:03 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 13:51, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 12:04 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 14:34, Yak wrote:
On 5/13/25 1:17 PM, Governor Swill wrote:
On Tue, 13 May 2025 09:32:44 -0400, Yak <Yak@inbox.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>
On 5/13/25 8:54 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 08:15, Yak wrote:Between 2-4.
On 5/12/25 4:24 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote:Such breakdowns happened in the past as well, even as >>>>>>>>>>>>> recently as late
On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote:
-hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont-
email.me:
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote:
This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they were sick of this shit they should get >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> their corps to pressure the govt.
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be
needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> period. That's THE hub.
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate
sabotage here - maybe Vlad ???
Try DOGE.
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's contract with >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Verizon
which was a systems upgrade ...
Just wait until this summer when
the travel surge hits and airport after
airport closes for lack of ATC personel.
The ones Trump fired.
So much winning!
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly wasn't >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> controllers.
The ones who maintain the gear that's now breaking down. >>>>>>>>>>>>>
2024.
Yes, failures happen ... but at this same failure rate? >>>>>>>>>>>>
How many ATC outages did EWR have in total all of 2024? >>>>>>>>>>>
You're guessing, am I right?
Nope.
Then where's the dates of said outages, preferably with cites? >>>>>>>>
Plus note that 3 known outages to date in 2025 is a ~3x higher >>>>>>>> rate of critical failures than this alleged "2-4" over 12 months >>>>>>>> of 2024.
Newark (EWR), September 2, 2024 (Labor Day): A radar and radio >>>>>>> outage at Philadelphia TRACON. https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/ >>>>>>> local/newark- flights-delays-radar-issue-faa/5757083/ Also
reported by The Air Current and CNN.
Philadelphia TRACON, November 6, 2024: Another equipment outage, >>>>>>> including radar and radio failures.https://www.youtube.com/watch? >>>>>>> v=aj7RJxUIs3I&ab_channel=VASAviation-
Oakland Air Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February >>>>>>> 22, 2024: outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center.Oakland Air >>>>>>> Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February 22, 2024: >>>>>>> outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center
Miami and Jacksonville ARTCC Outages: unscheduled cooperative radar >>>>>>> outage. https://www.faa.gov/newsroom/radar-modernization-proposal >>>>>>>
These don't include several unreported potential outages as they >>>>>>> were routine or low-impact, reinforcing that only significant
disruptions gain media attention.
That's five ... but it is also from a nationwide search. We know >>>>>> that there's 3 just from EWR in 2025 .. what about the rest of the >>>>>> country?
So now we're moving the goalposts.
Where that move was your's, buy citing 2024 failures beyond EWR.
I'm fine with casting a broader net but since you're protesting your >>>> own goalpost move attempt, fine! Thus, your comparison attempt has
found *zero* EWR failures in 2024, compared to 3 (so far) in 2025.
Nope, I was asked to provide other instances of outages in 2024. There >>> was no requirement to limit it to Newark (although it was the subject of >>> one of them).
My whole point is that you all are acting like these outages are
something new. They aren't
Then let's look at little more at 2025, shall we?
To the three in Newark, let's add:
February 2025, Oakland:
<https://www.aerotime.aero/articles/oakland-air-traffic-control-disruption>
May 16, 2025, Denver:
<https://www.aeronewsjournal.com/2025/05/denver-air-traffic-control-outage.html>
It happenes all the time. They want to make it public now.
Does it happen all the time? Really?
In article <1008chb$3v4st$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 14:49, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008b3f$3v4u8$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 05:09, Yak wrote:
On 5/15/25 9:12 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 14:25, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 2:03 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 13:51, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 12:04 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 14:34, Yak wrote:
On 5/13/25 1:17 PM, Governor Swill wrote:
On Tue, 13 May 2025 09:32:44 -0400, Yak <Yak@inbox.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>
On 5/13/25 8:54 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 08:15, Yak wrote:Between 2-4.
On 5/12/25 4:24 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote:Such breakdowns happened in the past as well, even as >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> recently as late
On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote:
-hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont-
email.me:
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote:
This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they were sick of this shit they should get >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> their corps to pressure the govt.
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> period. That's THE hub.
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sabotage here - maybe Vlad ???
Try DOGE.
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's contract with >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Verizon
which was a systems upgrade ...
Just wait until this summer when >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the travel surge hits and airport after
airport closes for lack of ATC personel.
The ones Trump fired.
So much winning!
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly wasn't >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> controllers.
The ones who maintain the gear that's now breaking down. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
2024.
Yes, failures happen ... but at this same failure rate? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
How many ATC outages did EWR have in total all of 2024? >>>>>>>>>>>>>
You're guessing, am I right?
Nope.
Then where's the dates of said outages, preferably with cites? >>>>>>>>>>
Plus note that 3 known outages to date in 2025 is a ~3x higher >>>>>>>>>> rate of critical failures than this alleged "2-4" over 12 months >>>>>>>>>> of 2024.
Newark (EWR), September 2, 2024 (Labor Day): A radar and radio >>>>>>>>> outage at Philadelphia TRACON. https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/ >>>>>>>>> local/newark- flights-delays-radar-issue-faa/5757083/ Also >>>>>>>>> reported by The Air Current and CNN.
Philadelphia TRACON, November 6, 2024: Another equipment outage, >>>>>>>>> including radar and radio failures.https://www.youtube.com/watch? >>>>>>>>> v=aj7RJxUIs3I&ab_channel=VASAviation-
Oakland Air Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February >>>>>>>>> 22, 2024: outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center.Oakland Air >>>>>>>>> Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February 22, 2024: >>>>>>>>> outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center
Miami and Jacksonville ARTCC Outages: unscheduled cooperative radar >>>>>>>>> outage. https://www.faa.gov/newsroom/radar-modernization-proposal >>>>>>>>>
These don't include several unreported potential outages as they >>>>>>>>> were routine or low-impact, reinforcing that only significant >>>>>>>>> disruptions gain media attention.
That's five ... but it is also from a nationwide search. We know >>>>>>>> that there's 3 just from EWR in 2025 .. what about the rest of the >>>>>>>> country?
So now we're moving the goalposts.
Where that move was your's, buy citing 2024 failures beyond EWR.
I'm fine with casting a broader net but since you're protesting your >>>>>> own goalpost move attempt, fine! Thus, your comparison attempt has >>>>>> found *zero* EWR failures in 2024, compared to 3 (so far) in 2025.
Nope, I was asked to provide other instances of outages in 2024. There >>>>> was no requirement to limit it to Newark (although it was the subject of >>>>> one of them).
My whole point is that you all are acting like these outages are
something new. They aren't
Then let's look at little more at 2025, shall we?
To the three in Newark, let's add:
February 2025, Oakland:
<https://www.aerotime.aero/articles/oakland-air-traffic-control-disruption>
May 16, 2025, Denver:
<https://www.aeronewsjournal.com/2025/05/denver-air-traffic-control-outage.html>
It happenes all the time. They want to make it public now.
Does it happen all the time? Really?
Yup, Did you notice you only started hearing about them
after the libs got butthurt.
On 5/15/25 9:12 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 14:25, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 2:03 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 13:51, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 12:04 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 14:34, Yak wrote:Newark (EWR), September 2, 2024 (Labor Day): A radar and radio
On 5/13/25 1:17 PM, Governor Swill wrote:
On Tue, 13 May 2025 09:32:44 -0400, Yak <Yak@inbox.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>
On 5/13/25 8:54 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 08:15, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 4:24 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote:Such breakdowns happened in the past as well, even as recently >>>>>>>>>>> as late
On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote:
-hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in
news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont-
email.me:
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote:
This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if
they were sick of this shit they should get
their corps to pressure the govt.
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in
this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and
any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be
needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast.
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer
period. That's THE hub.
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate
sabotage here - maybe Vlad ???
Try DOGE.
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's contract with >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Verizon
which was a systems upgrade ...
Just wait until this summer when
the travel surge hits and airport after
airport closes for lack of ATC personel.
The ones Trump fired.
So much winning!
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly wasn't
controllers.
The ones who maintain the gear that's now breaking down. >>>>>>>>>>>
2024.
Yes, failures happen ... but at this same failure rate?
How many ATC outages did EWR have in total all of 2024?
Between 2-4.
You're guessing, am I right?
Nope.
Then where's the dates of said outages, preferably with cites?
Plus note that 3 known outages to date in 2025 is a ~3x higher rate >>>>>> of critical failures than this alleged "2-4" over 12 months of 2024. >>>>>
outage at Philadelphia TRACON. https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/
local/newark- flights-delays-radar-issue-faa/5757083/ Also reported >>>>> by The Air Current and CNN.
Philadelphia TRACON, November 6, 2024: Another equipment outage,
including radar and radio failures.https://www.youtube.com/watch?
v=aj7RJxUIs3I&ab_channel=VASAviation-
Oakland Air Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February
22, 2024: outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center.Oakland Air Route >>>>> Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February 22, 2024: outage at
the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center
Miami and Jacksonville ARTCC Outages: unscheduled cooperative radar
outage. https://www.faa.gov/newsroom/radar-modernization-proposal
These don't include several unreported potential outages as they
were routine or low-impact, reinforcing that only significant
disruptions gain media attention.
That's five ... but it is also from a nationwide search. We know
that there's 3 just from EWR in 2025 .. what about the rest of the
country?
So now we're moving the goalposts.
Where that move was your's, buy citing 2024 failures beyond EWR.
I'm fine with casting a broader net but since you're protesting your own
goalpost move attempt, fine! Thus, your comparison attempt has found
*zero* EWR failures in 2024, compared to 3 (so far) in 2025.
Nope, I was asked to provide other instances of outages in 2024. There
was no requirement to limit it to Newark (although it was the subject of
one of them).
My whole point is that you all are acting like these outages are
something new. They aren't
Not deep count. Just a quick search. I'm not inclined to spend a lotReporting isn't always comprehensive. Would require
visiting official FAA sites.
BWAAAAAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHA! <laughs and points>
Dude! Such outages are ALWAYS front page news. Who do you think >>>>>>>> you're fooling?
Define 'such outages.' Not all outages are the same. Some are
widely reported, some aren't. Minor or brief outages may go
unreported or minimally reported to the public due to their
limited impact, operational protocols, or ongoing investigations. >>>>>>> For example, a EWR controller reported at least two other outages >>>>>>> since August 2024, which the FAA didnt confirm publicly,
suggesting minor incidents are handled internally. Go ahead and
see if you can find any 'front page news' on that.
Gosh, that's a bit spinny: try dig up those details and cross-
compare them to what's been reported on the three YTD 2025 outages >>>>>> to see if they were actually as significant as we've seen over the >>>>>> past 3 weeks.
One person's spin is another's outage. Fact is these outages have
been happening for years. And many less impactful one's are often
not reported.
By your own deep count attempt, 5 nationwide in 2024, for 0.42/month,
versus a 2025 pace of 3 in <4.5 months = 0.67/mo = a +60% rate increase. >>>
of time doing research on something we know has been an issue for a
number of years. Frankly, I'm not sure what we're even debating here.
I think we agree that aviation systems are due for some serious
upgrades, but no conclusive connection has been established between
the latest events and the DOGE cuts.
Its pretty damn obvious when the GOP voted down upgrades in 2019, Elon
cancelled the Verizon upgrade contract in 2025 *and* fired hundreds of
FAA ATC workers that the system was made worse, not better.
Verizon upgrades are not canceled. They are on hold pending further >investigation. Draw your own conclusion.
If the system is worse, which it may be, then cite the evidence making
the causal connection. Coincidence doesn't count.
On 17/5/25 5:24, NoBody wrote:
They only care now because Trump is President. Everything is blamed
on him, even if the technology is over 50 years and was ignored by
previous Presidents.
All previous presidemts?
On 2025-05-16 16:47, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008chb$3v4st$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 14:49, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008b3f$3v4u8$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 05:09, Yak wrote:
On 5/15/25 9:12 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 14:25, Yak wrote:Nope, I was asked to provide other instances of outages in 2024. There >>>>> was no requirement to limit it to Newark (although it was the subject of
On 5/14/25 2:03 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 13:51, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 12:04 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 14:34, Yak wrote:
On 5/13/25 1:17 PM, Governor Swill wrote:
On Tue, 13 May 2025 09:32:44 -0400, Yak <Yak@inbox.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>
On 5/13/25 8:54 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 08:15, Yak wrote:Between 2-4.
On 5/12/25 4:24 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote:Such breakdowns happened in the past as well, even as >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> recently as late
On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont-
email.me:
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote:
This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they were sick of this shit they should get >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> their corps to pressure the govt.
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> period. That's THE hub.
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sabotage here - maybe Vlad ???
Try DOGE.
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's contract with >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Verizon
which was a systems upgrade ...
Just wait until this summer when >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the travel surge hits and airport after
airport closes for lack of ATC personel. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The ones Trump fired.
So much winning!
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly wasn't >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> controllers.
The ones who maintain the gear that's now breaking down. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
2024.
Yes, failures happen ... but at this same failure rate? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
How many ATC outages did EWR have in total all of 2024? >>>>>>>>>>>>>
You're guessing, am I right?
Nope.
Then where's the dates of said outages, preferably with cites? >>>>>>>>>>
Plus note that 3 known outages to date in 2025 is a ~3x higher >>>>>>>>>> rate of critical failures than this alleged "2-4" over 12 months >>>>>>>>>> of 2024.
Newark (EWR), September 2, 2024 (Labor Day): A radar and radio >>>>>>>>> outage at Philadelphia TRACON. https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/ >>>>>>>>> local/newark- flights-delays-radar-issue-faa/5757083/ Also >>>>>>>>> reported by The Air Current and CNN.
Philadelphia TRACON, November 6, 2024: Another equipment outage, >>>>>>>>> including radar and radio failures.https://www.youtube.com/watch? >>>>>>>>> v=aj7RJxUIs3I&ab_channel=VASAviation-
Oakland Air Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February >>>>>>>>> 22, 2024: outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center.Oakland Air >>>>>>>>> Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February 22, 2024: >>>>>>>>> outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center
Miami and Jacksonville ARTCC Outages: unscheduled cooperative radar >>>>>>>>> outage. https://www.faa.gov/newsroom/radar-modernization-proposal >>>>>>>>>
These don't include several unreported potential outages as they >>>>>>>>> were routine or low-impact, reinforcing that only significant >>>>>>>>> disruptions gain media attention.
That's five ... but it is also from a nationwide search. We know >>>>>>>> that there's 3 just from EWR in 2025 .. what about the rest of the >>>>>>>> country?
So now we're moving the goalposts.
Where that move was your's, buy citing 2024 failures beyond EWR. >>>>>>
I'm fine with casting a broader net but since you're protesting your >>>>>> own goalpost move attempt, fine! Thus, your comparison attempt has >>>>>> found *zero* EWR failures in 2024, compared to 3 (so far) in 2025. >>>>>
one of them).
My whole point is that you all are acting like these outages are
something new. They aren't
Then let's look at little more at 2025, shall we?
To the three in Newark, let's add:
February 2025, Oakland:
<https://www.aerotime.aero/articles/oakland-air-traffic-control-disruption>
May 16, 2025, Denver:
<https://www.aeronewsjournal.com/2025/05/denver-air-traffic-control-outage.html>
It happenes all the time. They want to make it public now.
Does it happen all the time? Really?
Yup, Did you notice you only started hearing about them
after the libs got butthurt.
Then you'll have no problem pointing out all the times it's happened.
:-)
They only care now because Trump is President. Everything is blamed
on him, even if the technology is over 50 years and was ignored by
previous Presidents.
In article <1008kqb$vnt$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-uh@nope.com
says...
On 2025-05-16 16:47, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008chb$3v4st$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 14:49, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008b3f$3v4u8$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 05:09, Yak wrote:
On 5/15/25 9:12 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 14:25, Yak wrote:Nope, I was asked to provide other instances of outages in 2024. There >>>>>>> was no requirement to limit it to Newark (although it was the subject of
On 5/14/25 2:03 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 13:51, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 12:04 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 14:34, Yak wrote:
On 5/13/25 1:17 PM, Governor Swill wrote:
On Tue, 13 May 2025 09:32:44 -0400, Yak <Yak@inbox.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
On 5/13/25 8:54 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 08:15, Yak wrote:Between 2-4.
On 5/12/25 4:24 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote:Such breakdowns happened in the past as well, even as >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> recently as late
On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont-
email.me:
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote:
This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they were sick of this shit they should get >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> their corps to pressure the govt.
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> period. That's THE hub.
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sabotage here - maybe Vlad ???
Try DOGE.
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's contract with >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Verizon
which was a systems upgrade ...
Just wait until this summer when >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the travel surge hits and airport after >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> airport closes for lack of ATC personel. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The ones Trump fired.
So much winning!
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly wasn't >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> controllers.
The ones who maintain the gear that's now breaking down. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
2024.
Yes, failures happen ... but at this same failure rate? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
How many ATC outages did EWR have in total all of 2024? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
You're guessing, am I right?
Nope.
Then where's the dates of said outages, preferably with cites? >>>>>>>>>>>>
Plus note that 3 known outages to date in 2025 is a ~3x higher >>>>>>>>>>>> rate of critical failures than this alleged "2-4" over 12 months >>>>>>>>>>>> of 2024.
Newark (EWR), September 2, 2024 (Labor Day): A radar and radio >>>>>>>>>>> outage at Philadelphia TRACON. https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/ >>>>>>>>>>> local/newark- flights-delays-radar-issue-faa/5757083/ Also >>>>>>>>>>> reported by The Air Current and CNN.
Philadelphia TRACON, November 6, 2024: Another equipment outage, >>>>>>>>>>> including radar and radio failures.https://www.youtube.com/watch? >>>>>>>>>>> v=aj7RJxUIs3I&ab_channel=VASAviation-
Oakland Air Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February >>>>>>>>>>> 22, 2024: outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center.Oakland Air >>>>>>>>>>> Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February 22, 2024: >>>>>>>>>>> outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center
Miami and Jacksonville ARTCC Outages: unscheduled cooperative radar >>>>>>>>>>> outage. https://www.faa.gov/newsroom/radar-modernization-proposal >>>>>>>>>>>
These don't include several unreported potential outages as they >>>>>>>>>>> were routine or low-impact, reinforcing that only significant >>>>>>>>>>> disruptions gain media attention.
That's five ... but it is also from a nationwide search. We know >>>>>>>>>> that there's 3 just from EWR in 2025 .. what about the rest of the >>>>>>>>>> country?
So now we're moving the goalposts.
Where that move was your's, buy citing 2024 failures beyond EWR. >>>>>>>>
I'm fine with casting a broader net but since you're protesting your >>>>>>>> own goalpost move attempt, fine! Thus, your comparison attempt has >>>>>>>> found *zero* EWR failures in 2024, compared to 3 (so far) in 2025. >>>>>>>
one of them).
My whole point is that you all are acting like these outages are >>>>>>> something new. They aren't
Then let's look at little more at 2025, shall we?
To the three in Newark, let's add:
February 2025, Oakland:
<https://www.aerotime.aero/articles/oakland-air-traffic-control-disruption>
May 16, 2025, Denver:
<https://www.aeronewsjournal.com/2025/05/denver-air-traffic-control-outage.html>
It happenes all the time. They want to make it public now.
Does it happen all the time? Really?
Yup, Did you notice you only started hearing about them
after the libs got butthurt.
Then you'll have no problem pointing out all the times it's happened.
:-)
Read the news moron.
On 2025-05-17 06:19, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008kqb$vnt$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-uh@nope.com
says...
On 2025-05-16 16:47, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008chb$3v4st$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 14:49, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008b3f$3v4u8$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 05:09, Yak wrote:
On 5/15/25 9:12 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 14:25, Yak wrote:Nope, I was asked to provide other instances of outages in 2024. There >>>>>>>> was no requirement to limit it to Newark (although it was the subject of
On 5/14/25 2:03 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 13:51, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 12:04 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 14:34, Yak wrote:
On 5/13/25 1:17 PM, Governor Swill wrote:
On Tue, 13 May 2025 09:32:44 -0400, Yak <Yak@inbox.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
On 5/13/25 8:54 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 08:15, Yak wrote:Between 2-4.
On 5/12/25 4:24 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote:Such breakdowns happened in the past as well, even as >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> recently as late
On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont-
email.me:
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote:
This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they were sick of this shit they should get >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> their corps to pressure the govt. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> period. That's THE hub.
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sabotage here - maybe Vlad ???
Try DOGE.
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's contract with
Verizon
which was a systems upgrade ...
Just wait until this summer when >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the travel surge hits and airport after >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> airport closes for lack of ATC personel. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The ones Trump fired.
So much winning!
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly wasn't >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> controllers.
The ones who maintain the gear that's now breaking down. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
2024.
Yes, failures happen ... but at this same failure rate? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
How many ATC outages did EWR have in total all of 2024? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
You're guessing, am I right?
Nope.
Then where's the dates of said outages, preferably with cites? >>>>>>>>>>>>>
Plus note that 3 known outages to date in 2025 is a ~3x higher >>>>>>>>>>>>> rate of critical failures than this alleged "2-4" over 12 months >>>>>>>>>>>>> of 2024.
Newark (EWR), September 2, 2024 (Labor Day): A radar and radio >>>>>>>>>>>> outage at Philadelphia TRACON. https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/ >>>>>>>>>>>> local/newark- flights-delays-radar-issue-faa/5757083/ Also >>>>>>>>>>>> reported by The Air Current and CNN.
Philadelphia TRACON, November 6, 2024: Another equipment outage, >>>>>>>>>>>> including radar and radio failures.https://www.youtube.com/watch? >>>>>>>>>>>> v=aj7RJxUIs3I&ab_channel=VASAviation-
Oakland Air Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February >>>>>>>>>>>> 22, 2024: outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center.Oakland Air >>>>>>>>>>>> Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February 22, 2024: >>>>>>>>>>>> outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center
Miami and Jacksonville ARTCC Outages: unscheduled cooperative radar
outage. https://www.faa.gov/newsroom/radar-modernization-proposal >>>>>>>>>>>>
These don't include several unreported potential outages as they >>>>>>>>>>>> were routine or low-impact, reinforcing that only significant >>>>>>>>>>>> disruptions gain media attention.
That's five ... but it is also from a nationwide search. We know >>>>>>>>>>> that there's 3 just from EWR in 2025 .. what about the rest of the >>>>>>>>>>> country?
So now we're moving the goalposts.
Where that move was your's, buy citing 2024 failures beyond EWR. >>>>>>>>>
I'm fine with casting a broader net but since you're protesting your >>>>>>>>> own goalpost move attempt, fine! Thus, your comparison attempt has >>>>>>>>> found *zero* EWR failures in 2024, compared to 3 (so far) in 2025. >>>>>>>>
one of them).
My whole point is that you all are acting like these outages are >>>>>>>> something new. They aren't
Then let's look at little more at 2025, shall we?
To the three in Newark, let's add:
February 2025, Oakland:
<https://www.aerotime.aero/articles/oakland-air-traffic-control-disruption>
May 16, 2025, Denver:
<https://www.aeronewsjournal.com/2025/05/denver-air-traffic-control-outage.html>
It happenes all the time. They want to make it public now.
Does it happen all the time? Really?
Yup, Did you notice you only started hearing about them
after the libs got butthurt.
Then you'll have no problem pointing out all the times it's happened.
:-)
Read the news moron.
So you can't point out any incidents.
Got it.
On 2025-05-17 06:19, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008kqb$vnt$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-uh@nope.com
says...
On 2025-05-16 16:47, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008chb$3v4st$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 14:49, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008b3f$3v4u8$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 05:09, Yak wrote:
On 5/15/25 9:12 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 14:25, Yak wrote:Nope, I was asked to provide other instances of outages in 2024. There
On 5/14/25 2:03 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 13:51, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 12:04 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 14:34, Yak wrote:
On 5/13/25 1:17 PM, Governor Swill wrote:
On Tue, 13 May 2025 09:32:44 -0400, Yak <Yak@inbox.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
On 5/13/25 8:54 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 08:15, Yak wrote:Between 2-4.
On 5/12/25 4:24 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote:Such breakdowns happened in the past as well, even as >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> recently as late
On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont-
email.me:
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote:
This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they were sick of this shit they should get >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> their corps to pressure the govt. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> period. That's THE hub.
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sabotage here - maybe Vlad ???
Try DOGE.
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's contract with
Verizon
which was a systems upgrade ...
Just wait until this summer when >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the travel surge hits and airport after >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> airport closes for lack of ATC personel. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The ones Trump fired.
So much winning!
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly wasn't >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> controllers.
The ones who maintain the gear that's now breaking down. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
2024.
Yes, failures happen ... but at this same failure rate? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
How many ATC outages did EWR have in total all of 2024? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
You're guessing, am I right?
Nope.
Then where's the dates of said outages, preferably with cites? >>>>>>>>>>>>
Plus note that 3 known outages to date in 2025 is a ~3x higher >>>>>>>>>>>> rate of critical failures than this alleged "2-4" over 12 months >>>>>>>>>>>> of 2024.
Newark (EWR), September 2, 2024 (Labor Day): A radar and radio >>>>>>>>>>> outage at Philadelphia TRACON. https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/ >>>>>>>>>>> local/newark- flights-delays-radar-issue-faa/5757083/ Also >>>>>>>>>>> reported by The Air Current and CNN.
Philadelphia TRACON, November 6, 2024: Another equipment outage, >>>>>>>>>>> including radar and radio failures.https://www.youtube.com/watch? >>>>>>>>>>> v=aj7RJxUIs3I&ab_channel=VASAviation-
Oakland Air Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February >>>>>>>>>>> 22, 2024: outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center.Oakland Air >>>>>>>>>>> Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February 22, 2024: >>>>>>>>>>> outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center
Miami and Jacksonville ARTCC Outages: unscheduled cooperative radar
outage. https://www.faa.gov/newsroom/radar-modernization-proposal >>>>>>>>>>>
These don't include several unreported potential outages as they >>>>>>>>>>> were routine or low-impact, reinforcing that only significant >>>>>>>>>>> disruptions gain media attention.
That's five ... but it is also from a nationwide search. We know >>>>>>>>>> that there's 3 just from EWR in 2025 .. what about the rest of the >>>>>>>>>> country?
So now we're moving the goalposts.
Where that move was your's, buy citing 2024 failures beyond EWR. >>>>>>>>
I'm fine with casting a broader net but since you're protesting your >>>>>>>> own goalpost move attempt, fine! Thus, your comparison attempt has >>>>>>>> found *zero* EWR failures in 2024, compared to 3 (so far) in 2025. >>>>>>>
was no requirement to limit it to Newark (although it was the subject of
one of them).
My whole point is that you all are acting like these outages are >>>>>>> something new. They aren't
Then let's look at little more at 2025, shall we?
To the three in Newark, let's add:
February 2025, Oakland:
<https://www.aerotime.aero/articles/oakland-air-traffic-control-disruption>
May 16, 2025, Denver:
<https://www.aeronewsjournal.com/2025/05/denver-air-traffic-control-outage.html>
It happenes all the time. They want to make it public now.
Does it happen all the time? Really?
Yup, Did you notice you only started hearing about them
after the libs got butthurt.
Then you'll have no problem pointing out all the times it's happened.
:-)
Read the news moron.
So you can't point out any incidents.
Got it.
Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-17 06:19, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008kqb$vnt$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-uh@nope.com
says...
On 2025-05-16 16:47, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008chb$3v4st$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 14:49, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008b3f$3v4u8$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 05:09, Yak wrote:
On 5/15/25 9:12 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 14:25, Yak wrote:Nope, I was asked to provide other instances of outages in 2024. There
On 5/14/25 2:03 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 13:51, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 12:04 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 14:34, Yak wrote:
On 5/13/25 1:17 PM, Governor Swill wrote:
On Tue, 13 May 2025 09:32:44 -0400, Yak <Yak@inbox.com> wrote:
On 5/13/25 8:54 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 08:15, Yak wrote:Between 2-4.
On 5/12/25 4:24 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote:Such breakdowns happened in the past as well, even as >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> recently as late
On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont-
email.me:
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they were sick of this shit they should get >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> their corps to pressure the govt. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> period. That's THE hub.
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sabotage here - maybe Vlad ???
Try DOGE.
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's contract with
Verizon
which was a systems upgrade ...
Just wait until this summer when >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the travel surge hits and airport after >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> airport closes for lack of ATC personel. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The ones Trump fired.
So much winning!
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly wasn't >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> controllers.
The ones who maintain the gear that's now breaking down. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
2024.
Yes, failures happen ... but at this same failure rate? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
How many ATC outages did EWR have in total all of 2024? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
You're guessing, am I right?
Nope.
Then where's the dates of said outages, preferably with cites? >>>>>>>>>>>>>
Plus note that 3 known outages to date in 2025 is a ~3x higher >>>>>>>>>>>>> rate of critical failures than this alleged "2-4" over 12 months
of 2024.
Newark (EWR), September 2, 2024 (Labor Day): A radar and radio >>>>>>>>>>>> outage at Philadelphia TRACON. https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/ >>>>>>>>>>>> local/newark- flights-delays-radar-issue-faa/5757083/ Also >>>>>>>>>>>> reported by The Air Current and CNN.
Philadelphia TRACON, November 6, 2024: Another equipment outage, >>>>>>>>>>>> including radar and radio failures.https://www.youtube.com/watch?
v=aj7RJxUIs3I&ab_channel=VASAviation-
Oakland Air Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February
22, 2024: outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center.Oakland Air >>>>>>>>>>>> Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February 22, 2024: >>>>>>>>>>>> outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center
Miami and Jacksonville ARTCC Outages: unscheduled cooperative radar
outage. https://www.faa.gov/newsroom/radar-modernization-proposal
These don't include several unreported potential outages as they >>>>>>>>>>>> were routine or low-impact, reinforcing that only significant >>>>>>>>>>>> disruptions gain media attention.
That's five ... but it is also from a nationwide search. We know >>>>>>>>>>> that there's 3 just from EWR in 2025 .. what about the rest of the
country?
So now we're moving the goalposts.
Where that move was your's, buy citing 2024 failures beyond EWR. >>>>>>>>>
I'm fine with casting a broader net but since you're protesting your
own goalpost move attempt, fine! Thus, your comparison attempt has >>>>>>>>> found *zero* EWR failures in 2024, compared to 3 (so far) in 2025. >>>>>>>>
was no requirement to limit it to Newark (although it was the subject of
one of them).
My whole point is that you all are acting like these outages are >>>>>>>> something new. They aren't
Then let's look at little more at 2025, shall we?
To the three in Newark, let's add:
February 2025, Oakland:
<https://www.aerotime.aero/articles/oakland-air-traffic-control-disruption>
May 16, 2025, Denver:
<https://www.aeronewsjournal.com/2025/05/denver-air-traffic-control-outage.html>
It happenes all the time. They want to make it public now.
Does it happen all the time? Really?
Yup, Did you notice you only started hearing about them
after the libs got butthurt.
Then you'll have no problem pointing out all the times it's happened.
:-)
Read the news moron.
So you can't point out any incidents.
Got it.
He was never going to, because he?s afraid of what it may reveal.
It was obvious from his libs butthurt bit .. even though a third of US air traffic goes thru the NYC metro airspace daily?
-hh
In article <116564867.769193901.182918.recscuba_google- huntzinger.com@news.eternal-september.org>,
recscuba_google@huntzinger.com says...
Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-17 06:19, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008kqb$vnt$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-uh@nope.com
says...
On 2025-05-16 16:47, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008chb$3v4st$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 14:49, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008b3f$3v4u8$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 05:09, Yak wrote:
On 5/15/25 9:12 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 14:25, Yak wrote:Nope, I was asked to provide other instances of outages in 2024. There
On 5/14/25 2:03 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 13:51, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 12:04 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 14:34, Yak wrote:
On 5/13/25 1:17 PM, Governor Swill wrote:
On Tue, 13 May 2025 09:32:44 -0400, Yak <Yak@inbox.com> wrote:
On 5/13/25 8:54 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 08:15, Yak wrote:Between 2-4.
On 5/12/25 4:24 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote:Such breakdowns happened in the past as well, even as >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> recently as late
On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont-
email.me:
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Just wait until this summer when >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the travel surge hits and airport after >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> airport closes for lack of ATC personel. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The ones Trump fired.
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they were sick of this shit they should get >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> their corps to pressure the govt. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Try DOGE.
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> period. That's THE hub.
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sabotage here - maybe Vlad ??? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's contract with
Verizon
which was a systems upgrade ... >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
So much winning!
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly wasn't >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> controllers.
The ones who maintain the gear that's now breaking down. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
2024.
Yes, failures happen ... but at this same failure rate? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
How many ATC outages did EWR have in total all of 2024? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
You're guessing, am I right?
Nope.
Then where's the dates of said outages, preferably with cites? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Plus note that 3 known outages to date in 2025 is a ~3x higher >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rate of critical failures than this alleged "2-4" over 12 months
of 2024.
Newark (EWR), September 2, 2024 (Labor Day): A radar and radio >>>>>>>>>>>>>> outage at Philadelphia TRACON. https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/ >>>>>>>>>>>>>> local/newark- flights-delays-radar-issue-faa/5757083/ Also >>>>>>>>>>>>>> reported by The Air Current and CNN.
Philadelphia TRACON, November 6, 2024: Another equipment outage, >>>>>>>>>>>>>> including radar and radio failures.https://www.youtube.com/watch?
v=aj7RJxUIs3I&ab_channel=VASAviation-
Oakland Air Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February
22, 2024: outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center.Oakland Air >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February 22, 2024: >>>>>>>>>>>>>> outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center
Miami and Jacksonville ARTCC Outages: unscheduled cooperative radar
outage. https://www.faa.gov/newsroom/radar-modernization-proposal
These don't include several unreported potential outages as they >>>>>>>>>>>>>> were routine or low-impact, reinforcing that only significant >>>>>>>>>>>>>> disruptions gain media attention.
That's five ... but it is also from a nationwide search. We know
that there's 3 just from EWR in 2025 .. what about the rest of the
country?
So now we're moving the goalposts.
Where that move was your's, buy citing 2024 failures beyond EWR. >>>>>>>>>>>
I'm fine with casting a broader net but since you're protesting your
own goalpost move attempt, fine! Thus, your comparison attempt has
found *zero* EWR failures in 2024, compared to 3 (so far) in 2025. >>>>>>>>>>
was no requirement to limit it to Newark (although it was the subject of
one of them).
My whole point is that you all are acting like these outages are >>>>>>>>>> something new. They aren't
Then let's look at little more at 2025, shall we?
To the three in Newark, let's add:
February 2025, Oakland:
<https://www.aerotime.aero/articles/oakland-air-traffic-control-disruption>
May 16, 2025, Denver:
<https://www.aeronewsjournal.com/2025/05/denver-air-traffic-control-outage.html>
It happenes all the time. They want to make it public now.
Does it happen all the time? Really?
Yup, Did you notice you only started hearing about them
after the libs got butthurt.
Then you'll have no problem pointing out all the times it's happened. >>>>>
:-)
Read the news moron.
So you can't point out any incidents.
Got it.
He was never going to, because he?s afraid of what it may reveal.
It was obvious from his libs butthurt bit .. even though a third of US air >> traffic goes thru the NYC metro airspace daily?
-hh
I am still right. It's only news now because you want to
blame Trump and Musk.
In article <100aakm$f2r0$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-uh@nope.com
says...
On 2025-05-17 06:19, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008kqb$vnt$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-uh@nope.com
says...
On 2025-05-16 16:47, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008chb$3v4st$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 14:49, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008b3f$3v4u8$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 05:09, Yak wrote:
On 5/15/25 9:12 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 14:25, Yak wrote:Nope, I was asked to provide other instances of outages in 2024. There
On 5/14/25 2:03 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 13:51, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 12:04 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 14:34, Yak wrote:
On 5/13/25 1:17 PM, Governor Swill wrote:
On Tue, 13 May 2025 09:32:44 -0400, Yak <Yak@inbox.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
On 5/13/25 8:54 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 08:15, Yak wrote:Between 2-4.
On 5/12/25 4:24 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote:Such breakdowns happened in the past as well, even as >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> recently as late
On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont-
email.me:
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they were sick of this shit they should get >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> their corps to pressure the govt. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> period. That's THE hub.
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sabotage here - maybe Vlad ???
Try DOGE.
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's contract with
Verizon
which was a systems upgrade ...
Just wait until this summer when >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the travel surge hits and airport after >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> airport closes for lack of ATC personel. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The ones Trump fired.
So much winning!
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly wasn't >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> controllers.
The ones who maintain the gear that's now breaking down. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
2024.
Yes, failures happen ... but at this same failure rate? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
How many ATC outages did EWR have in total all of 2024? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
You're guessing, am I right?
Nope.
Then where's the dates of said outages, preferably with cites? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Plus note that 3 known outages to date in 2025 is a ~3x higher >>>>>>>>>>>>>> rate of critical failures than this alleged "2-4" over 12 months >>>>>>>>>>>>>> of 2024.
Newark (EWR), September 2, 2024 (Labor Day): A radar and radio >>>>>>>>>>>>> outage at Philadelphia TRACON. https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/ >>>>>>>>>>>>> local/newark- flights-delays-radar-issue-faa/5757083/ Also >>>>>>>>>>>>> reported by The Air Current and CNN.
Philadelphia TRACON, November 6, 2024: Another equipment outage, >>>>>>>>>>>>> including radar and radio failures.https://www.youtube.com/watch? >>>>>>>>>>>>> v=aj7RJxUIs3I&ab_channel=VASAviation-
Oakland Air Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February >>>>>>>>>>>>> 22, 2024: outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center.Oakland Air >>>>>>>>>>>>> Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February 22, 2024: >>>>>>>>>>>>> outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center
Miami and Jacksonville ARTCC Outages: unscheduled cooperative radar
outage. https://www.faa.gov/newsroom/radar-modernization-proposal >>>>>>>>>>>>>
These don't include several unreported potential outages as they >>>>>>>>>>>>> were routine or low-impact, reinforcing that only significant >>>>>>>>>>>>> disruptions gain media attention.
That's five ... but it is also from a nationwide search. We know >>>>>>>>>>>> that there's 3 just from EWR in 2025 .. what about the rest of the >>>>>>>>>>>> country?
So now we're moving the goalposts.
Where that move was your's, buy citing 2024 failures beyond EWR. >>>>>>>>>>
I'm fine with casting a broader net but since you're protesting your >>>>>>>>>> own goalpost move attempt, fine! Thus, your comparison attempt has >>>>>>>>>> found *zero* EWR failures in 2024, compared to 3 (so far) in 2025. >>>>>>>>>
was no requirement to limit it to Newark (although it was the subject of
one of them).
My whole point is that you all are acting like these outages are >>>>>>>>> something new. They aren't
Then let's look at little more at 2025, shall we?
To the three in Newark, let's add:
February 2025, Oakland:
<https://www.aerotime.aero/articles/oakland-air-traffic-control-disruption>
May 16, 2025, Denver:
<https://www.aeronewsjournal.com/2025/05/denver-air-traffic-control-outage.html>
It happenes all the time. They want to make it public now.
Does it happen all the time? Really?
Yup, Did you notice you only started hearing about them
after the libs got butthurt.
Then you'll have no problem pointing out all the times it's happened.
:-)
Read the news moron.
So you can't point out any incidents.
Got it.
You could yourself if you weren't in denial.
This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week.
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if
they were sick of this shit they should get
their corps to pressure the govt.
On 5/15/25 9:12 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 14:25, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 2:03 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 13:51, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 12:04 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 14:34, Yak wrote:Newark (EWR), September 2, 2024 (Labor Day): A radar and radio
On 5/13/25 1:17 PM, Governor Swill wrote:
On Tue, 13 May 2025 09:32:44 -0400, Yak <Yak@inbox.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>
On 5/13/25 8:54 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 08:15, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 4:24 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote:Such breakdowns happened in the past as well, even as recently >>>>>>>>>>> as late
On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote:
-hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in
news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont-
email.me:
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote:
This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if
they were sick of this shit they should get
their corps to pressure the govt.
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in
this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and
any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be
needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast.
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer
period. That's THE hub.
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate
sabotage here - maybe Vlad ???
Try DOGE.
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's contract with >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Verizon
which was a systems upgrade ...
Just wait until this summer when
the travel surge hits and airport after
airport closes for lack of ATC personel.
The ones Trump fired.
So much winning!
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly wasn't
controllers.
The ones who maintain the gear that's now breaking down. >>>>>>>>>>>
2024.
Yes, failures happen ... but at this same failure rate?
How many ATC outages did EWR have in total all of 2024?
Between 2-4.
You're guessing, am I right?
Nope.
Then where's the dates of said outages, preferably with cites?
Plus note that 3 known outages to date in 2025 is a ~3x higher rate >>>>>> of critical failures than this alleged "2-4" over 12 months of 2024. >>>>>
outage at Philadelphia TRACON. https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/
local/newark- flights-delays-radar-issue-faa/5757083/ Also reported >>>>> by The Air Current and CNN.
Philadelphia TRACON, November 6, 2024: Another equipment outage,
including radar and radio failures.https://www.youtube.com/watch?
v=aj7RJxUIs3I&ab_channel=VASAviation-
Oakland Air Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February
22, 2024: outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center.Oakland Air Route >>>>> Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February 22, 2024: outage at
the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center
Miami and Jacksonville ARTCC Outages: unscheduled cooperative radar
outage. https://www.faa.gov/newsroom/radar-modernization-proposal
These don't include several unreported potential outages as they
were routine or low-impact, reinforcing that only significant
disruptions gain media attention.
That's five ... but it is also from a nationwide search. We know
that there's 3 just from EWR in 2025 .. what about the rest of the
country?
So now we're moving the goalposts.
Where that move was your's, buy citing 2024 failures beyond EWR.
I'm fine with casting a broader net but since you're protesting your own
goalpost move attempt, fine! Thus, your comparison attempt has found
*zero* EWR failures in 2024, compared to 3 (so far) in 2025.
Nope, I was asked to provide other instances of outages in 2024. There
was no requirement to limit it to Newark (although it was the subject of
one of them).
My whole point is that you all are acting like these outages are
something new. They aren't
Not deep count. Just a quick search. I'm not inclined to spend a lotReporting isn't always comprehensive. Would require
visiting official FAA sites.
BWAAAAAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHA! <laughs and points>
Dude! Such outages are ALWAYS front page news. Who do you think >>>>>>>> you're fooling?
Define 'such outages.' Not all outages are the same. Some are
widely reported, some aren't. Minor or brief outages may go
unreported or minimally reported to the public due to their
limited impact, operational protocols, or ongoing investigations. >>>>>>> For example, a EWR controller reported at least two other outages >>>>>>> since August 2024, which the FAA didn’t confirm publicly,
suggesting minor incidents are handled internally. Go ahead and
see if you can find any 'front page news' on that.
Gosh, that's a bit spinny: try dig up those details and cross-
compare them to what's been reported on the three YTD 2025 outages >>>>>> to see if they were actually as significant as we've seen over the >>>>>> past 3 weeks.
One person's spin is another's outage. Fact is these outages have
been happening for years. And many less impactful one's are often
not reported.
By your own deep count attempt, 5 nationwide in 2024, for 0.42/month,
versus a 2025 pace of 3 in <4.5 months = 0.67/mo = a +60% rate increase. >>>
of time doing research on something we know has been an issue for a
number of years. Frankly, I'm not sure what we're even debating here.
I think we agree that aviation systems are due for some serious
upgrades, but no conclusive connection has been established between
the latest events and the DOGE cuts.
Its pretty damn obvious when the GOP voted down upgrades in 2019, Elon
cancelled the Verizon upgrade contract in 2025 *and* fired hundreds of
FAA ATC workers that the system was made worse, not better.
Verizon upgrades are not canceled. They are on hold pending further investigation. Draw your own conclusion.
If the system is worse, which it may be, then cite the evidence making
the causal connection. Coincidence doesn't count.
Because aviation accidents aren't good for business.By your logic, there are probably even more outages this year since >>>>>>>> some outages could only be known by, "visiting official FAA sites." >>>>>>>>>> Because for 2025, major ones which have been publicly reported >>>>>>>>>> already
is three (3):
April 28, 2025: outage with significant disruptions; some
traumatized
controllers took authorized medical leave;
May 9, 2025: outage at ~3:55AM, duration of ~90 seconds.
May 11, 2025: outage with a ground stop of ~45 minutes.
Maybe the people maintaining the gear deserve to be fired >>>>>>>>>>> since what
they're doing apparently isn't working.
Isn't a better explanation is that because there's fewer of >>>>>>>>>> them working
now, the failure rate is now higher than it was in the past? >>>>>>>>>>
-hh
Since the frequency of outages appears to be happening at a
singular
airport, perhaps the better explanation is they don't know what >>>>>>>>> the hell
they're doing at EWR.
"Appears to be" at one airport?
Yeah, appears. Outages aren't isolated to one airport. They have >>>>>>> happened a number of times before. I guess you would know that
*if* they were front page news, as you suggested.
Which also means that there may have been more 2025 failures at
airports other than EWR.
Overall, we know that the ATC situation is bad when United Airlines >>>>>> has already *unilaterally* cut their flight schedule, without any
requests from the FAA to cut back.
Right. And???
So why is a capitalistic corporation choosing to curtail profit-making? >>>
Which should tell you something.
-hh
On 17/5/25 5:24, NoBody wrote:
They only care now because Trump is President. Everything is blamed
on him, even if the technology is over 50 years and was ignored by
previous Presidents.
All previous presidemts?
On 2025-05-17 10:32, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <116564867.769193901.182918.recscuba_google-
huntzinger.com@news.eternal-september.org>,
recscuba_google@huntzinger.com says...
Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-17 06:19, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008kqb$vnt$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-uh@nope.com
says...
On 2025-05-16 16:47, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008chb$3v4st$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 14:49, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008b3f$3v4u8$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 05:09, Yak wrote:
On 5/15/25 9:12 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 14:25, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 2:03 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 13:51, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 12:04 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 14:34, Yak wrote:
On 5/13/25 1:17 PM, Governor Swill wrote:
On Tue, 13 May 2025 09:32:44 -0400, Yak
<Yak@inbox.com> wrote:
On 5/13/25 8:54 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 08:15, Yak wrote:Between 2-4.
On 5/12/25 4:24 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont-
email.me:
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Just wait until this summer when >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the travel surge hits and airport after >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> airport closes for lack of ATC personel. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The ones Trump fired.
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they were sick of this shit they should get >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> their corps to pressure the govt. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Try DOGE.
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> period. That's THE hub.
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sabotage here - maybe Vlad ??? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> contract with
Verizon
which was a systems upgrade ... >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
So much winning!
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly wasn't >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> controllers.
The ones who maintain the gear that's now breaking >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> down.
Such breakdowns happened in the past as well, even as >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> recently as late
2024.
Yes, failures happen ... but at this same failure rate? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
How many ATC outages did EWR have in total all of 2024? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
You're guessing, am I right?
Nope.
Then where's the dates of said outages, preferably with >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> cites?
Plus note that 3 known outages to date in 2025 is a ~3x >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> higher
rate of critical failures than this alleged "2-4" over >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 12 months
of 2024.
Newark (EWR), September 2, 2024 (Labor Day): A radar and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> radio
outage at Philadelphia TRACON. https://
www.nbcnewyork.com/news/
local/newark- flights-delays-radar-issue-faa/5757083/ Also >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> reported by The Air Current and CNN.
Philadelphia TRACON, November 6, 2024: Another equipment >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> outage,
including radar and radio failures.https://
www.youtube.com/watch?
v=aj7RJxUIs3I&ab_channel=VASAviation-
Oakland Air Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> February
22, 2024: outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC
Center.Oakland Air
Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February 22, >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 2024:
outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center
Miami and Jacksonville ARTCC Outages: unscheduled >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> cooperative radar
outage. https://www.faa.gov/newsroom/radar-modernization- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> proposal
These don't include several unreported potential outages >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> as they
were routine or low-impact, reinforcing that only >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> significant
disruptions gain media attention.
That's five ... but it is also from a nationwide search. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> We know
that there's 3 just from EWR in 2025 .. what about the >>>>>>>>>>>>>> rest of the
country?
So now we're moving the goalposts.
Where that move was your's, buy citing 2024 failures beyond >>>>>>>>>>>> EWR.
I'm fine with casting a broader net but since you're
protesting your
own goalpost move attempt, fine! Thus, your comparison >>>>>>>>>>>> attempt has
found *zero* EWR failures in 2024, compared to 3 (so far) in >>>>>>>>>>>> 2025.
Nope, I was asked to provide other instances of outages in >>>>>>>>>>> 2024. There
was no requirement to limit it to Newark (although it was the >>>>>>>>>>> subject of
one of them).
My whole point is that you all are acting like these outages are >>>>>>>>>>> something new. They aren't
Then let's look at little more at 2025, shall we?
To the three in Newark, let's add:
February 2025, Oakland:
<https://www.aerotime.aero/articles/oakland-air-traffic-
control-disruption>
May 16, 2025, Denver:
<https://www.aeronewsjournal.com/2025/05/denver-air-traffic- >>>>>>>>>> control-outage.html>
It happenes all the time. They want to make it public now.
Does it happen all the time? Really?
Yup, Did you notice you only started hearing about them
after the libs got butthurt.
Then you'll have no problem pointing out all the times it's happened. >>>>>>
:-)
Read the news moron.
So you can't point out any incidents.
Got it.
He was never going to, because he?s afraid of what it may reveal.
It was obvious from his libs butthurt bit .. even though a third of
US air
traffic goes thru the NYC metro airspace daily?
-hh
I am still right. It's only news now because you want to
blame Trump and Musk.
And you don't think firing hundreds of FAA workers played any role, huh?
On 2025-05-17 10:32, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <116564867.769193901.182918.recscuba_google- huntzinger.com@news.eternal-september.org>,
recscuba_google@huntzinger.com says...
Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-17 06:19, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008kqb$vnt$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-uh@nope.com
says...
On 2025-05-16 16:47, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008chb$3v4st$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 14:49, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008b3f$3v4u8$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 05:09, Yak wrote:
On 5/15/25 9:12 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 14:25, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 2:03 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 13:51, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 12:04 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 14:34, Yak wrote:
On 5/13/25 1:17 PM, Governor Swill wrote:
On Tue, 13 May 2025 09:32:44 -0400, Yak <Yak@inbox.com> wrote:
On 5/13/25 8:54 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 08:15, Yak wrote:Between 2-4.
On 5/12/25 4:24 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont-
email.me:
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Just wait until this summer when >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the travel surge hits and airport after >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> airport closes for lack of ATC personel. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The ones Trump fired.
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they were sick of this shit they should get >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> their corps to pressure the govt. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Try DOGE.
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> period. That's THE hub.
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sabotage here - maybe Vlad ??? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's contract with
Verizon
which was a systems upgrade ... >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
So much winning!
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly wasn't >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> controllers.
The ones who maintain the gear that's now breaking down.
Such breakdowns happened in the past as well, even as >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> recently as late
2024.
Yes, failures happen ... but at this same failure rate? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
How many ATC outages did EWR have in total all of 2024? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
You're guessing, am I right?
Nope.
Then where's the dates of said outages, preferably with cites?
Plus note that 3 known outages to date in 2025 is a ~3x higher
rate of critical failures than this alleged "2-4" over 12 months
of 2024.
Newark (EWR), September 2, 2024 (Labor Day): A radar and radio >>>>>>>>>>>>>> outage at Philadelphia TRACON. https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/
local/newark- flights-delays-radar-issue-faa/5757083/ Also >>>>>>>>>>>>>> reported by The Air Current and CNN.
Philadelphia TRACON, November 6, 2024: Another equipment outage,
including radar and radio failures.https://www.youtube.com/watch?
v=aj7RJxUIs3I&ab_channel=VASAviation-
Oakland Air Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February
22, 2024: outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center.Oakland Air >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February 22, 2024:
outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center
Miami and Jacksonville ARTCC Outages: unscheduled cooperative radar
outage. https://www.faa.gov/newsroom/radar-modernization-proposal
These don't include several unreported potential outages as they
were routine or low-impact, reinforcing that only significant >>>>>>>>>>>>>> disruptions gain media attention.
That's five ... but it is also from a nationwide search. We know
that there's 3 just from EWR in 2025 .. what about the rest of the
country?
So now we're moving the goalposts.
Where that move was your's, buy citing 2024 failures beyond EWR. >>>>>>>>>>>
I'm fine with casting a broader net but since you're protesting your
own goalpost move attempt, fine! Thus, your comparison attempt has
found *zero* EWR failures in 2024, compared to 3 (so far) in 2025.
Nope, I was asked to provide other instances of outages in 2024. There
was no requirement to limit it to Newark (although it was the subject of
one of them).
My whole point is that you all are acting like these outages are >>>>>>>>>> something new. They aren't
Then let's look at little more at 2025, shall we?
To the three in Newark, let's add:
February 2025, Oakland:
<https://www.aerotime.aero/articles/oakland-air-traffic-control-disruption>
May 16, 2025, Denver:
<https://www.aeronewsjournal.com/2025/05/denver-air-traffic-control-outage.html>
It happenes all the time. They want to make it public now.
Does it happen all the time? Really?
Yup, Did you notice you only started hearing about them
after the libs got butthurt.
Then you'll have no problem pointing out all the times it's happened. >>>>>
:-)
Read the news moron.
So you can't point out any incidents.
Got it.
He was never going to, because he?s afraid of what it may reveal.
It was obvious from his libs butthurt bit .. even though a third of US air >> traffic goes thru the NYC metro airspace daily?
-hh
I am still right. It's only news now because you want to
blame Trump and Musk.
And you don't think firing hundreds of FAA workers played any role, huh?
In article <100ah87$gd6e$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-uh@nope.com
says...
On 2025-05-17 10:32, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <116564867.769193901.182918.recscuba_google-
huntzinger.com@news.eternal-september.org>,
recscuba_google@huntzinger.com says...
Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-17 06:19, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008kqb$vnt$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-uh@nope.com
says...
On 2025-05-16 16:47, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008chb$3v4st$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 14:49, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008b3f$3v4u8$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 05:09, Yak wrote:
On 5/15/25 9:12 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 14:25, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 2:03 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 13:51, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 12:04 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 14:34, Yak wrote:
On 5/13/25 1:17 PM, Governor Swill wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Tue, 13 May 2025 09:32:44 -0400, Yak <Yak@inbox.com> wrote:
On 5/13/25 8:54 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 08:15, Yak wrote:Between 2-4.
On 5/12/25 4:24 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont-
email.me:Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly wasn't >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> controllers.
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Just wait until this summer when >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the travel surge hits and airport after >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> airport closes for lack of ATC personel. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The ones Trump fired.
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they were sick of this shit they should get >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> their corps to pressure the govt. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Try DOGE.
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> period. That's THE hub.
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sabotage here - maybe Vlad ??? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's contract with
Verizon
which was a systems upgrade ... >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
So much winning! >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
The ones who maintain the gear that's now breaking down.
Such breakdowns happened in the past as well, even as >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> recently as late
2024.
Yes, failures happen ... but at this same failure rate? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
How many ATC outages did EWR have in total all of 2024? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
You're guessing, am I right?
Nope.
Then where's the dates of said outages, preferably with cites?
Plus note that 3 known outages to date in 2025 is a ~3x higher
rate of critical failures than this alleged "2-4" over 12 months
of 2024.
Newark (EWR), September 2, 2024 (Labor Day): A radar and radio >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> outage at Philadelphia TRACON. https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/
local/newark- flights-delays-radar-issue-faa/5757083/ Also >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> reported by The Air Current and CNN.
Philadelphia TRACON, November 6, 2024: Another equipment outage,
including radar and radio failures.https://www.youtube.com/watch?
v=aj7RJxUIs3I&ab_channel=VASAviation-
Oakland Air Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February
22, 2024: outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center.Oakland Air >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February 22, 2024:
outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center
Miami and Jacksonville ARTCC Outages: unscheduled cooperative radar
outage. https://www.faa.gov/newsroom/radar-modernization-proposal
These don't include several unreported potential outages as they
were routine or low-impact, reinforcing that only significant >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> disruptions gain media attention.
That's five ... but it is also from a nationwide search. We know
that there's 3 just from EWR in 2025 .. what about the rest of the
country?
So now we're moving the goalposts.
Where that move was your's, buy citing 2024 failures beyond EWR. >>>>>>>>>>>>>
I'm fine with casting a broader net but since you're protesting your
own goalpost move attempt, fine! Thus, your comparison attempt has
found *zero* EWR failures in 2024, compared to 3 (so far) in 2025.
Nope, I was asked to provide other instances of outages in 2024. There
was no requirement to limit it to Newark (although it was the subject of
one of them).
My whole point is that you all are acting like these outages are >>>>>>>>>>>> something new. They aren't
Then let's look at little more at 2025, shall we?
To the three in Newark, let's add:
February 2025, Oakland:
<https://www.aerotime.aero/articles/oakland-air-traffic-control-disruption>
May 16, 2025, Denver:
<https://www.aeronewsjournal.com/2025/05/denver-air-traffic-control-outage.html>
It happenes all the time. They want to make it public now.
Does it happen all the time? Really?
Yup, Did you notice you only started hearing about them
after the libs got butthurt.
Then you'll have no problem pointing out all the times it's happened. >>>>>>>
:-)
Read the news moron.
So you can't point out any incidents.
Got it.
He was never going to, because he?s afraid of what it may reveal.
It was obvious from his libs butthurt bit .. even though a third of US air >>>> traffic goes thru the NYC metro airspace daily?
-hh
I am still right. It's only news now because you want to
blame Trump and Musk.
And you don't think firing hundreds of FAA workers played any role, huh?
No, there are many qualified.
On 5/17/25 1:32 PM, Alan wrote:
On 2025-05-17 10:32, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <116564867.769193901.182918.recscuba_google-
huntzinger.com@news.eternal-september.org>,
recscuba_google@huntzinger.com says...
Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-17 06:19, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008kqb$vnt$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-uh@nope.com
says...
On 2025-05-16 16:47, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008chb$3v4st$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 14:49, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008b3f$3v4u8$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 05:09, Yak wrote:
On 5/15/25 9:12 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 14:25, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 2:03 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 13:51, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 12:04 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 14:34, Yak wrote:
On 5/13/25 1:17 PM, Governor Swill wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Tue, 13 May 2025 09:32:44 -0400, Yak
<Yak@inbox.com> wrote:
On 5/13/25 8:54 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 08:15, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 4:24 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont-
email.me:Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly wasn't >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> controllers.
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Just wait until this summer when >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the travel surge hits and airport after >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> airport closes for lack of ATC personel. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The ones Trump fired.
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they were sick of this shit they should get >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> their corps to pressure the govt. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Try DOGE.
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> period. That's THE hub.
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sabotage here - maybe Vlad ??? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> contract with
Verizon
which was a systems upgrade ... >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
So much winning! >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
The ones who maintain the gear that's now >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> breaking down.
Such breakdowns happened in the past as well, even as >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> recently as late
2024.
Yes, failures happen ... but at this same failure >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rate?
How many ATC outages did EWR have in total all of >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 2024?
Between 2-4.
You're guessing, am I right?
Nope.
Then where's the dates of said outages, preferably with >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> cites?
Plus note that 3 known outages to date in 2025 is a ~3x >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> higher
rate of critical failures than this alleged "2-4" over >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 12 months
of 2024.
Newark (EWR), September 2, 2024 (Labor Day): A radar and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> radio
outage at Philadelphia TRACON. https://
www.nbcnewyork.com/news/
local/newark- flights-delays-radar-issue-faa/5757083/ Also >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> reported by The Air Current and CNN.
Philadelphia TRACON, November 6, 2024: Another equipment >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> outage,
including radar and radio failures.https://
www.youtube.com/watch?
v=aj7RJxUIs3I&ab_channel=VASAviation-
Oakland Air Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> February
22, 2024: outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC
Center.Oakland Air
Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 22, 2024:
outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center
Miami and Jacksonville ARTCC Outages: unscheduled >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> cooperative radar
outage. https://www.faa.gov/newsroom/radar-
modernization- proposal
These don't include several unreported potential outages >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> as they
were routine or low-impact, reinforcing that only >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> significant
disruptions gain media attention.
That's five ... but it is also from a nationwide search. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> We know
that there's 3 just from EWR in 2025 .. what about the >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rest of the
country?
So now we're moving the goalposts.
Where that move was your's, buy citing 2024 failures beyond >>>>>>>>>>>>> EWR.
I'm fine with casting a broader net but since you're >>>>>>>>>>>>> protesting your
own goalpost move attempt, fine! Thus, your comparison >>>>>>>>>>>>> attempt has
found *zero* EWR failures in 2024, compared to 3 (so far) >>>>>>>>>>>>> in 2025.
Nope, I was asked to provide other instances of outages in >>>>>>>>>>>> 2024. There
was no requirement to limit it to Newark (although it was >>>>>>>>>>>> the subject of
one of them).
My whole point is that you all are acting like these outages >>>>>>>>>>>> are
something new. They aren't
Then let's look at little more at 2025, shall we?
To the three in Newark, let's add:
February 2025, Oakland:
<https://www.aerotime.aero/articles/oakland-air-traffic- >>>>>>>>>>> control-disruption>
May 16, 2025, Denver:
<https://www.aeronewsjournal.com/2025/05/denver-air-traffic- >>>>>>>>>>> control-outage.html>
It happenes all the time. They want to make it public now.
Does it happen all the time? Really?
Yup, Did you notice you only started hearing about them
after the libs got butthurt.
Then you'll have no problem pointing out all the times it's
happened.
:-)
Read the news moron.
So you can't point out any incidents.
Got it.
He was never going to, because he?s afraid of what it may reveal.
It was obvious from his libs butthurt bit .. even though a third of
US air
traffic goes thru the NYC metro airspace daily?
-hh
I am still right. It's only news now because you want to
blame Trump and Musk.
And you don't think firing hundreds of FAA workers played any role, huh?
Maybe, maybe not. But you would have to explain how firing hundreds of
FAA workers now played a role in prior years outages when there was no
DOGE.
On 2025-05-19 06:52, Yak wrote:
On 5/17/25 1:32 PM, Alan wrote:
On 2025-05-17 10:32, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <116564867.769193901.182918.recscuba_google-
huntzinger.com@news.eternal-september.org>,
recscuba_google@huntzinger.com says...
Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-17 06:19, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008kqb$vnt$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-uh@nope.com
says...
On 2025-05-16 16:47, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008chb$3v4st$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 14:49, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008b3f$3v4u8$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-Does it happen all the time? Really?
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 05:09, Yak wrote:
On 5/15/25 9:12 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 14:25, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 2:03 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 13:51, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 12:04 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 14:34, Yak wrote:
On 5/13/25 1:17 PM, Governor Swill wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Tue, 13 May 2025 09:32:44 -0400, Yak >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <Yak@inbox.com> wrote:
On 5/13/25 8:54 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 08:15, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 4:24 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont-
email.me:Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wasn't
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Just wait until this summer when >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the travel surge hits and airport after >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> airport closes for lack of ATC personel. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The ones Trump fired.
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they were sick of this shit they should get >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> their corps to pressure the govt. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Try DOGE.
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> period. That's THE hub. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sabotage here - maybe Vlad ??? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> contract with
Verizon
which was a systems upgrade ... >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
So much winning! >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
controllers.
The ones who maintain the gear that's now >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> breaking down.
Such breakdowns happened in the past as well, >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> even as
recently as late
2024.
Yes, failures happen ... but at this same failure >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rate?
How many ATC outages did EWR have in total all of >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 2024?
Between 2-4.
You're guessing, am I right?
Nope.
Then where's the dates of said outages, preferably >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> with cites?
Plus note that 3 known outages to date in 2025 is a >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ~3x higher
rate of critical failures than this alleged "2-4" over >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 12 months
of 2024.
Newark (EWR), September 2, 2024 (Labor Day): A radar >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and radio
outage at Philadelphia TRACON. https://
www.nbcnewyork.com/news/
local/newark- flights-delays-radar-issue-faa/5757083/ >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Also
reported by The Air Current and CNN.
Philadelphia TRACON, November 6, 2024: Another >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> equipment outage,
including radar and radio failures.https://
www.youtube.com/watch?
v=aj7RJxUIs3I&ab_channel=VASAviation-
Oakland Air Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Outage, February
22, 2024: outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC
Center.Oakland Air
Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 22, 2024:
outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center
Miami and Jacksonville ARTCC Outages: unscheduled >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> cooperative radar
outage. https://www.faa.gov/newsroom/radar-
modernization- proposal
These don't include several unreported potential >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> outages as they
were routine or low-impact, reinforcing that only >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> significant
disruptions gain media attention.
That's five ... but it is also from a nationwide search. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> We know
that there's 3 just from EWR in 2025 .. what about the >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rest of the
country?
So now we're moving the goalposts.
Where that move was your's, buy citing 2024 failures >>>>>>>>>>>>>> beyond EWR.
I'm fine with casting a broader net but since you're >>>>>>>>>>>>>> protesting your
own goalpost move attempt, fine! Thus, your comparison >>>>>>>>>>>>>> attempt has
found *zero* EWR failures in 2024, compared to 3 (so far) >>>>>>>>>>>>>> in 2025.
Nope, I was asked to provide other instances of outages in >>>>>>>>>>>>> 2024. There
was no requirement to limit it to Newark (although it was >>>>>>>>>>>>> the subject of
one of them).
My whole point is that you all are acting like these >>>>>>>>>>>>> outages are
something new. They aren't
Then let's look at little more at 2025, shall we?
To the three in Newark, let's add:
February 2025, Oakland:
<https://www.aerotime.aero/articles/oakland-air-traffic- >>>>>>>>>>>> control-disruption>
May 16, 2025, Denver:
<https://www.aeronewsjournal.com/2025/05/denver-air-traffic- >>>>>>>>>>>> control-outage.html>
It happenes all the time. They want to make it public now. >>>>>>>>>>
Yup, Did you notice you only started hearing about them
after the libs got butthurt.
Then you'll have no problem pointing out all the times it's
happened.
:-)
Read the news moron.
So you can't point out any incidents.
Got it.
He was never going to, because he?s afraid of what it may reveal.
It was obvious from his libs butthurt bit .. even though a third of
US air
traffic goes thru the NYC metro airspace daily?
-hh
I am still right. It's only news now because you want to
blame Trump and Musk.
And you don't think firing hundreds of FAA workers played any role, huh?
Maybe, maybe not. But you would have to explain how firing hundreds of
FAA workers now played a role in prior years outages when there was no
DOGE.
You've yet to show that those outages happened with the same frequency.
On 5/17/25 1:32 PM, Alan wrote:
On 2025-05-17 10:32, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <116564867.769193901.182918.recscuba_google-
huntzinger.com@news.eternal-september.org>,
recscuba_google@huntzinger.com says...
Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-17 06:19, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008kqb$vnt$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-uh@nope.com
says...
On 2025-05-16 16:47, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008chb$3v4st$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 14:49, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008b3f$3v4u8$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 05:09, Yak wrote:
On 5/15/25 9:12 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 14:25, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 2:03 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 13:51, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 12:04 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 14:34, Yak wrote:
On 5/13/25 1:17 PM, Governor Swill wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Tue, 13 May 2025 09:32:44 -0400, Yak
<Yak@inbox.com> wrote:
On 5/13/25 8:54 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 08:15, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 4:24 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont-
email.me:Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wasn't controllers.
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> This is at least the 3rd time in barely a >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> week.Just wait until this summer when >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the travel surge hits and airport after >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> airport closes for lack of ATC personel. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The ones Trump fired.
Try DOGE.
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they were sick of this shit they should get >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> their corps to pressure the govt. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> period. That's THE hub.
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sabotage here - maybe Vlad ??? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> contract with
Verizon
which was a systems upgrade ... >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
So much winning! >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
The ones who maintain the gear that's now >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> breaking down.
Such breakdowns happened in the past as well, >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> even as recently as late
2024.
Yes, failures happen ... but at this same failure >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rate?
How many ATC outages did EWR have in total all of >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 2024?
Between 2-4.
You're guessing, am I right?
Nope.
Then where's the dates of said outages, preferably >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> with cites?
Plus note that 3 known outages to date in 2025 is a >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ~3x higher
rate of critical failures than this alleged "2-4" over >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 12 months
of 2024.
Newark (EWR), September 2, 2024 (Labor Day): A radar >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and radio
outage at Philadelphia TRACON. https://
www.nbcnewyork.com/news/
local/newark- flights-delays-radar-issue-faa/5757083/ >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Also reported by The Air Current and CNN.
Philadelphia TRACON, November 6, 2024: Another >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> equipment outage,
including radar and radio failures.https://
www.youtube.com/watch?
v=aj7RJxUIs3I&ab_channel=VASAviation-
Oakland Air Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Outage, February
22, 2024: outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC
Center.Oakland Air
Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 22, 2024:
outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center
Miami and Jacksonville ARTCC Outages: unscheduled >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> cooperative radar
outage.
https://www.faa.gov/newsroom/radar-modernization- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> proposal
These don't include several unreported potential >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> outages as they
were routine or low-impact, reinforcing that only >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> significant
disruptions gain media attention.
That's five ... but it is also from a nationwide search. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> We know
that there's 3 just from EWR in 2025 .. what about the >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rest of the
country?
So now we're moving the goalposts.
Where that move was your's, buy citing 2024 failures >>>>>>>>>>>>> beyond EWR.
I'm fine with casting a broader net but since you're >>>>>>>>>>>>> protesting your
own goalpost move attempt, fine! Thus, your comparison >>>>>>>>>>>>> attempt has
found *zero* EWR failures in 2024, compared to 3 (so far) >>>>>>>>>>>>> in 2025.
Nope, I was asked to provide other instances of outages in >>>>>>>>>>>> 2024. There
was no requirement to limit it to Newark (although it was >>>>>>>>>>>> the subject of
one of them).
My whole point is that you all are acting like these
outages are something new. They aren't
Then let's look at little more at 2025, shall we?
To the three in Newark, let's add:
February 2025, Oakland:
<https://www.aerotime.aero/articles/oakland-air-traffic- >>>>>>>>>>> control-disruption>
May 16, 2025, Denver:
<https://www.aeronewsjournal.com/2025/05/denver-air-traffic- >>>>>>>>>>> control-outage.html>
It happenes all the time. They want to make it public now.
Does it happen all the time? Really?
Yup, Did you notice you only started hearing about them
after the libs got butthurt.
Then you'll have no problem pointing out all the times it's
happened.
:-)
Read the news moron.
So you can't point out any incidents.
Got it.
He was never going to, because he?s afraid of what it may reveal.
It was obvious from his libs butthurt bit .. even though a third of
US air
traffic goes thru the NYC metro airspace daily?
-hh
I am still right. It's only news now because you want to
blame Trump and Musk.
And you don't think firing hundreds of FAA workers played any role,
huh?
Maybe, maybe not. But you would have to explain how firing hundreds of
FAA workers now played a role in prior years outages when there was no
DOGE.
On 5/19/25 12:23 PM, Alan wrote:
On 2025-05-19 06:52, Yak wrote:
On 5/17/25 1:32 PM, Alan wrote:
On 2025-05-17 10:32, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <116564867.769193901.182918.recscuba_google-
huntzinger.com@news.eternal-september.org>,
recscuba_google@huntzinger.com says...
Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-17 06:19, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008kqb$vnt$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-uh@nope.com
says...
On 2025-05-16 16:47, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008chb$3v4st$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 14:49, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008b3f$3v4u8$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-Does it happen all the time? Really?
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 05:09, Yak wrote:
On 5/15/25 9:12 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 14:25, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 2:03 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 13:51, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 12:04 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 14:34, Yak wrote:
On 5/13/25 1:17 PM, Governor Swill wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Tue, 13 May 2025 09:32:44 -0400, Yak >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <Yak@inbox.com> wrote:
On 5/13/25 8:54 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 08:15, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 4:24 PM, -hh wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> email.me:
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wasn't
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> This is at least the 3rd time in barely a >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> week.Just wait until this summer when >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the travel surge hits and airport after >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> airport closes for lack of ATC personel. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The ones Trump fired.
Try DOGE.
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they were sick of this shit they should get >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> their corps to pressure the govt. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> period. That's THE hub. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sabotage here - maybe Vlad ??? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> contract with
Verizon
which was a systems upgrade ... >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
So much winning! >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
controllers.
The ones who maintain the gear that's now >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> breaking down.
Such breakdowns happened in the past as well, >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> even as
recently as late
2024.
Yes, failures happen ... but at this same failure >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rate?
How many ATC outages did EWR have in total all of >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 2024?
Between 2-4.
You're guessing, am I right?
Nope.
Then where's the dates of said outages, preferably >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> with cites?
Plus note that 3 known outages to date in 2025 is a >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ~3x higher
rate of critical failures than this alleged "2-4" >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> over 12 months
of 2024.
Newark (EWR), September 2, 2024 (Labor Day): A radar >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and radio
outage at Philadelphia TRACON. https://
www.nbcnewyork.com/news/
local/newark- flights-delays-radar-issue-faa/5757083/ >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Also
reported by The Air Current and CNN.
Philadelphia TRACON, November 6, 2024: Another >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> equipment outage,
including radar and radio failures.https:// >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> www.youtube.com/watch?
v=aj7RJxUIs3I&ab_channel=VASAviation-
Oakland Air Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Outage, February
22, 2024: outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Center.Oakland Air
Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 22, 2024:
outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center
Miami and Jacksonville ARTCC Outages: unscheduled >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> cooperative radar
outage. https://www.faa.gov/newsroom/radar- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> modernization- proposal
These don't include several unreported potential >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> outages as they
were routine or low-impact, reinforcing that only >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> significant
disruptions gain media attention.
That's five ... but it is also from a nationwide >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> search. We know
that there's 3 just from EWR in 2025 .. what about the >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rest of the
country?
So now we're moving the goalposts.
Where that move was your's, buy citing 2024 failures >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> beyond EWR.
I'm fine with casting a broader net but since you're >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> protesting your
own goalpost move attempt, fine! Thus, your comparison >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> attempt has
found *zero* EWR failures in 2024, compared to 3 (so far) >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in 2025.
Nope, I was asked to provide other instances of outages in >>>>>>>>>>>>>> 2024. There
was no requirement to limit it to Newark (although it was >>>>>>>>>>>>>> the subject of
one of them).
My whole point is that you all are acting like these >>>>>>>>>>>>>> outages are
something new. They aren't
Then let's look at little more at 2025, shall we?
To the three in Newark, let's add:
February 2025, Oakland:
<https://www.aerotime.aero/articles/oakland-air-traffic- >>>>>>>>>>>>> control-disruption>
May 16, 2025, Denver:
<https://www.aeronewsjournal.com/2025/05/denver-air- >>>>>>>>>>>>> traffic- control-outage.html>
It happenes all the time. They want to make it public now. >>>>>>>>>>>
Yup, Did you notice you only started hearing about them
after the libs got butthurt.
Then you'll have no problem pointing out all the times it's
happened.
:-)
Read the news moron.
So you can't point out any incidents.
Got it.
He was never going to, because he?s afraid of what it may reveal.
It was obvious from his libs butthurt bit .. even though a third
of US air
traffic goes thru the NYC metro airspace daily?
-hh
I am still right. It's only news now because you want to
blame Trump and Musk.
And you don't think firing hundreds of FAA workers played any role,
huh?
Maybe, maybe not. But you would have to explain how firing hundreds
of FAA workers now played a role in prior years outages when there
was no DOGE.
You've yet to show that those outages happened with the same frequency.
You've yet to show firing hundreds of FAA workers played any role.
Yak <Yak@inbox.com> wrote in news:100fd2c$1l5qu$1@dont-email.me:
On 5/17/25 1:32 PM, Alan wrote:
On 2025-05-17 10:32, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <116564867.769193901.182918.recscuba_google-
huntzinger.com@news.eternal-september.org>,
recscuba_google@huntzinger.com says...
Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-17 06:19, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008kqb$vnt$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-uh@nope.com
says...
On 2025-05-16 16:47, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008chb$3v4st$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 14:49, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008b3f$3v4u8$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-Does it happen all the time? Really?
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 05:09, Yak wrote:
On 5/15/25 9:12 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 14:25, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 2:03 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 13:51, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 12:04 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 14:34, Yak wrote:
On 5/13/25 1:17 PM, Governor Swill wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Tue, 13 May 2025 09:32:44 -0400, Yak >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <Yak@inbox.com> wrote:
On 5/13/25 8:54 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 08:15, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 4:24 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont-
email.me:Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wasn't controllers.
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> This is at least the 3rd time in barely a >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> week.Just wait until this summer when >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the travel surge hits and airport after >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> airport closes for lack of ATC personel. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The ones Trump fired.
Try DOGE.
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they were sick of this shit they should get >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> their corps to pressure the govt. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> period. That's THE hub. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sabotage here - maybe Vlad ??? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> contract with
Verizon
which was a systems upgrade ... >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
So much winning! >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
The ones who maintain the gear that's now >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> breaking down.
Such breakdowns happened in the past as well, >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> even as recently as late
2024.
Yes, failures happen ... but at this same failure >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rate?
How many ATC outages did EWR have in total all of >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 2024?
Between 2-4.
You're guessing, am I right?
Nope.
Then where's the dates of said outages, preferably >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> with cites?
Plus note that 3 known outages to date in 2025 is a >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ~3x higher
rate of critical failures than this alleged "2-4" over >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 12 months
of 2024.
Newark (EWR), September 2, 2024 (Labor Day): A radar >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and radio
outage at Philadelphia TRACON. https://
www.nbcnewyork.com/news/
local/newark- flights-delays-radar-issue-faa/5757083/ >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Also reported by The Air Current and CNN. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Philadelphia TRACON, November 6, 2024: Another >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> equipment outage,
including radar and radio failures.https://
www.youtube.com/watch?
v=aj7RJxUIs3I&ab_channel=VASAviation-
Oakland Air Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Outage, February
22, 2024: outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC
Center.Oakland Air
Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 22, 2024:
outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center
Miami and Jacksonville ARTCC Outages: unscheduled >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> cooperative radar
outage.
https://www.faa.gov/newsroom/radar-modernization- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> proposal
These don't include several unreported potential >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> outages as they
were routine or low-impact, reinforcing that only >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> significant
disruptions gain media attention.
That's five ... but it is also from a nationwide search. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> We know
that there's 3 just from EWR in 2025 .. what about the >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rest of the
country?
So now we're moving the goalposts.
Where that move was your's, buy citing 2024 failures >>>>>>>>>>>>>> beyond EWR.
I'm fine with casting a broader net but since you're >>>>>>>>>>>>>> protesting your
own goalpost move attempt, fine! Thus, your comparison >>>>>>>>>>>>>> attempt has
found *zero* EWR failures in 2024, compared to 3 (so far) >>>>>>>>>>>>>> in 2025.
Nope, I was asked to provide other instances of outages in >>>>>>>>>>>>> 2024. There
was no requirement to limit it to Newark (although it was >>>>>>>>>>>>> the subject of
one of them).
My whole point is that you all are acting like these >>>>>>>>>>>>> outages are something new. They aren't
Then let's look at little more at 2025, shall we?
To the three in Newark, let's add:
February 2025, Oakland:
<https://www.aerotime.aero/articles/oakland-air-traffic- >>>>>>>>>>>> control-disruption>
May 16, 2025, Denver:
<https://www.aeronewsjournal.com/2025/05/denver-air-traffic- >>>>>>>>>>>> control-outage.html>
It happenes all the time. They want to make it public now. >>>>>>>>>>
Yup, Did you notice you only started hearing about them
after the libs got butthurt.
Then you'll have no problem pointing out all the times it's
happened.
:-)
Read the news moron.
So you can't point out any incidents.
Got it.
He was never going to, because he?s afraid of what it may reveal.
It was obvious from his libs butthurt bit .. even though a third of
US air
traffic goes thru the NYC metro airspace daily?
-hh
I am still right. It's only news now because you want to
blame Trump and Musk.
And you don't think firing hundreds of FAA workers played any role,
huh?
Maybe, maybe not. But you would have to explain how firing hundreds of
FAA workers now played a role in prior years outages when there was no
DOGE.
You would have to explain why the ATC worked
fine until Trump and his mass firings took place.
And you don't think firing hundreds of FAA workers played any
role, huh?
Maybe, maybe not. But you would have to explain how firing
hundreds of FAA workers now played a role in prior years
outages when there was no DOGE.
You've yet to show that those outages happened with the same
frequency.
You've yet to show firing hundreds of FAA workers played any role.
On 2025-05-19 10:43, Yak wrote:
On 5/19/25 12:23 PM, Alan wrote:
On 2025-05-19 06:52, Yak wrote:
On 5/17/25 1:32 PM, Alan wrote:
On 2025-05-17 10:32, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <116564867.769193901.182918.recscuba_google-
huntzinger.com@news.eternal-september.org>,
recscuba_google@huntzinger.com says...
Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-17 06:19, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008kqb$vnt$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-uh@nope.com
says...
On 2025-05-16 16:47, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008chb$3v4st$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 14:49, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008b3f$3v4u8$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-Does it happen all the time? Really?
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 05:09, Yak wrote:
On 5/15/25 9:12 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 14:25, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 2:03 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 13:51, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 12:04 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 14:34, Yak wrote:
On 5/13/25 1:17 PM, Governor Swill wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Tue, 13 May 2025 09:32:44 -0400, Yak >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <Yak@inbox.com> wrote:
On 5/13/25 8:54 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 08:15, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 4:24 PM, -hh wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> email.me:
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wasn't
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> This is at least the 3rd time in barely a >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> week.Just wait until this summer when >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the travel surge hits and airport after >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> airport closes for lack of ATC personel. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The ones Trump fired.
Try DOGE.
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they were sick of this shit they should get >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> their corps to pressure the govt. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> period. That's THE hub. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sabotage here - maybe Vlad ??? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> contract with
Verizon
which was a systems upgrade ... >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
So much winning! >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
controllers.
The ones who maintain the gear that's now >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> breaking down.
Such breakdowns happened in the past as well, >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> even as
recently as late
2024.
Yes, failures happen ... but at this same >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> failure rate?
How many ATC outages did EWR have in total all >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of 2024?
Between 2-4.
You're guessing, am I right?
Nope.
Then where's the dates of said outages, preferably >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> with cites?
Plus note that 3 known outages to date in 2025 is a >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ~3x higher
rate of critical failures than this alleged "2-4" >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> over 12 months
of 2024.
Newark (EWR), September 2, 2024 (Labor Day): A radar >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and radio
outage at Philadelphia TRACON. https://
www.nbcnewyork.com/news/
local/newark- flights-delays-radar-issue-faa/5757083/ >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Also
reported by The Air Current and CNN.
Philadelphia TRACON, November 6, 2024: Another >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> equipment outage,
including radar and radio failures.https:// >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> www.youtube.com/watch?
v=aj7RJxUIs3I&ab_channel=VASAviation-
Oakland Air Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Outage, February
22, 2024: outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Center.Oakland Air
Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 22, 2024:
outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Miami and Jacksonville ARTCC Outages: unscheduled >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> cooperative radar
outage. https://www.faa.gov/newsroom/radar- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> modernization- proposal
These don't include several unreported potential >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> outages as they
were routine or low-impact, reinforcing that only >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> significant
disruptions gain media attention.
That's five ... but it is also from a nationwide >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> search. We know
that there's 3 just from EWR in 2025 .. what about the >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rest of the
country?
So now we're moving the goalposts.
Where that move was your's, buy citing 2024 failures >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> beyond EWR.
I'm fine with casting a broader net but since you're >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> protesting your
own goalpost move attempt, fine! Thus, your comparison >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> attempt has
found *zero* EWR failures in 2024, compared to 3 (so >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> far) in 2025.
Nope, I was asked to provide other instances of outages >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in 2024. There
was no requirement to limit it to Newark (although it was >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the subject of
one of them).
My whole point is that you all are acting like these >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> outages are
something new. They aren't
Then let's look at little more at 2025, shall we?
To the three in Newark, let's add:
February 2025, Oakland:
<https://www.aerotime.aero/articles/oakland-air-traffic- >>>>>>>>>>>>>> control-disruption>
May 16, 2025, Denver:
<https://www.aeronewsjournal.com/2025/05/denver-air- >>>>>>>>>>>>>> traffic- control-outage.html>
It happenes all the time. They want to make it public now. >>>>>>>>>>>>
Yup, Did you notice you only started hearing about them
after the libs got butthurt.
Then you'll have no problem pointing out all the times it's >>>>>>>>>> happened.
:-)
Read the news moron.
So you can't point out any incidents.
Got it.
He was never going to, because he?s afraid of what it may reveal. >>>>>>>
It was obvious from his libs butthurt bit .. even though a third >>>>>>> of US air
traffic goes thru the NYC metro airspace daily?
-hh
I am still right. It's only news now because you want to
blame Trump and Musk.
And you don't think firing hundreds of FAA workers played any role,
huh?
Maybe, maybe not. But you would have to explain how firing hundreds
of FAA workers now played a role in prior years outages when there
was no DOGE.
You've yet to show that those outages happened with the same frequency.
You've yet to show firing hundreds of FAA workers played any role.
I asked a question.
You failed to answer.
Answer it and we can move forward.
We KNOW FAA workers were fired; hundreds of them.
We KNOW that some of them worked maintaining ATC facilities; "FAA radar, landing and navigational aid maintenance"
Those are facts.
You CLAIM that there have been outages before and IMPLY that nothing has changed.
So SHOW it.
On 5/19/25 1:49 PM, Mitchell Holman wrote:
Yak <Yak@inbox.com> wrote in news:100fd2c$1l5qu$1@dont-email.me:
On 5/17/25 1:32 PM, Alan wrote:
On 2025-05-17 10:32, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <116564867.769193901.182918.recscuba_google-
huntzinger.com@news.eternal-september.org>,
recscuba_google@huntzinger.com says...
Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-17 06:19, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008kqb$vnt$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-uh@nope.com
says...
On 2025-05-16 16:47, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008chb$3v4st$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 14:49, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008b3f$3v4u8$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-Does it happen all the time? Really?
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 05:09, Yak wrote:
On 5/15/25 9:12 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 14:25, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 2:03 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 13:51, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 12:04 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 14:34, Yak wrote:
On 5/13/25 1:17 PM, Governor Swill wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Tue, 13 May 2025 09:32:44 -0400, Yak >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <Yak@inbox.com> wrote:
On 5/13/25 8:54 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 08:15, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 4:24 PM, -hh wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> email.me:
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wasn't controllers.
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> This is at least the 3rd time in barely a >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> week.Just wait until this summer when >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the travel surge hits and airport after >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> airport closes for lack of ATC personel. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The ones Trump fired.
Try DOGE.
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they were sick of this shit they should get >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> their corps to pressure the govt. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> period. That's THE hub. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sabotage here - maybe Vlad ??? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> contract with
Verizon
which was a systems upgrade ... >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
So much winning! >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
The ones who maintain the gear that's now >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> breaking down.
Such breakdowns happened in the past as well, >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> even as recently as late
2024.
Yes, failures happen ... but at this same failure >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rate?
How many ATC outages did EWR have in total all of >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 2024?
Between 2-4.
You're guessing, am I right?
Nope.
Then where's the dates of said outages, preferably >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> with cites?
Plus note that 3 known outages to date in 2025 is a >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ~3x higher
rate of critical failures than this alleged "2-4" over >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 12 months
of 2024.
Newark (EWR), September 2, 2024 (Labor Day): A radar >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and radio
outage at Philadelphia TRACON. https://
www.nbcnewyork.com/news/
local/newark- flights-delays-radar-issue-faa/5757083/ >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Also reported by The Air Current and CNN. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Philadelphia TRACON, November 6, 2024: Another >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> equipment outage,
including radar and radio failures.https:// >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> www.youtube.com/watch?
v=aj7RJxUIs3I&ab_channel=VASAviation-
Oakland Air Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Outage, February
22, 2024: outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Center.Oakland Air
Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 22, 2024:
outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center
Miami and Jacksonville ARTCC Outages: unscheduled >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> cooperative radar
outage.
https://www.faa.gov/newsroom/radar-modernization- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> proposal
These don't include several unreported potential >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> outages as they
were routine or low-impact, reinforcing that only >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> significant
disruptions gain media attention.
That's five ... but it is also from a nationwide search. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> We know
that there's 3 just from EWR in 2025 .. what about the >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rest of the
country?
So now we're moving the goalposts.
Where that move was your's, buy citing 2024 failures >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> beyond EWR.
I'm fine with casting a broader net but since you're >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> protesting your
own goalpost move attempt, fine! Thus, your comparison >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> attempt has
found *zero* EWR failures in 2024, compared to 3 (so far) >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in 2025.
Nope, I was asked to provide other instances of outages in >>>>>>>>>>>>>> 2024. There
was no requirement to limit it to Newark (although it was >>>>>>>>>>>>>> the subject of
one of them).
My whole point is that you all are acting like these >>>>>>>>>>>>>> outages are something new. They aren't
Then let's look at little more at 2025, shall we?
To the three in Newark, let's add:
February 2025, Oakland:
<https://www.aerotime.aero/articles/oakland-air-traffic- >>>>>>>>>>>>> control-disruption>
May 16, 2025, Denver:
<https://www.aeronewsjournal.com/2025/05/denver-air-traffic- >>>>>>>>>>>>> control-outage.html>
It happenes all the time. They want to make it public now. >>>>>>>>>>>
Yup, Did you notice you only started hearing about them
after the libs got butthurt.
Then you'll have no problem pointing out all the times it's
happened.
:-)
Read the news moron.
So you can't point out any incidents.
Got it.
He was never going to, because he?s afraid of what it may reveal.
It was obvious from his libs butthurt bit .. even though a third of >>>>>> US air
traffic goes thru the NYC metro airspace daily?
-hh
I am still right. It's only news now because you want to
blame Trump and Musk.
And you don't think firing hundreds of FAA workers played any role,
huh?
Maybe, maybe not. But you would have to explain how firing hundreds of
FAA workers now played a role in prior years outages when there was no
DOGE.
You would have to explain why the ATC worked
fine until Trump and his mass firings took place.
No, I wouldn't. Because it hasn't. I have already cited instances of
similar events taking place prior to any cuts. Outages have been going
on for years.
On 5/19/25 1:58 PM, Alan wrote:
On 2025-05-19 10:43, Yak wrote:
On 5/19/25 12:23 PM, Alan wrote:
On 2025-05-19 06:52, Yak wrote:
On 5/17/25 1:32 PM, Alan wrote:
On 2025-05-17 10:32, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <116564867.769193901.182918.recscuba_google-
huntzinger.com@news.eternal-september.org>,
recscuba_google@huntzinger.com says...
Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-17 06:19, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008kqb$vnt$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-uh@nope.com
says...
On 2025-05-16 16:47, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008chb$3v4st$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 14:49, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008b3f$3v4u8$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-Does it happen all the time? Really?
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 05:09, Yak wrote:
On 5/15/25 9:12 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 14:25, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 2:03 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 13:51, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 12:04 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 14:34, Yak wrote:
On 5/13/25 1:17 PM, Governor Swill wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Tue, 13 May 2025 09:32:44 -0400, Yak >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <Yak@inbox.com> wrote:
On 5/13/25 8:54 AM, -hh wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 5/13/25 08:15, Yak wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 5/12/25 4:24 PM, -hh wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> email.me:
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wasn't
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> This is at least the 3rd time in barely a >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> week.Just wait until this summer when >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the travel surge hits and airport after >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> airport closes for lack of ATC personel. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The ones Trump fired. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Try DOGE.
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they were sick of this shit they should get >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> their corps to pressure the govt. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> period. That's THE hub. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sabotage here - maybe Vlad ??? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Elon's already pulled the plug on the >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> FAA's contract with >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Verizon
which was a systems upgrade ... >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
So much winning! >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
controllers.
The ones who maintain the gear that's now >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> breaking down.
Such breakdowns happened in the past as well, >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> even as
recently as late
2024.
Yes, failures happen ... but at this same >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> failure rate?
How many ATC outages did EWR have in total all >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of 2024?
Between 2-4.
You're guessing, am I right?
Nope.
Then where's the dates of said outages, preferably >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> with cites?
Plus note that 3 known outages to date in 2025 is a >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ~3x higher
rate of critical failures than this alleged "2-4" >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> over 12 months
of 2024.
Newark (EWR), September 2, 2024 (Labor Day): A radar >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and radio
outage at Philadelphia TRACON. https:// >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> www.nbcnewyork.com/news/
local/newark- flights-delays-radar-issue- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> faa/5757083/ Also
reported by The Air Current and CNN.
Philadelphia TRACON, November 6, 2024: Another >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> equipment outage,
including radar and radio failures.https:// >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> www.youtube.com/watch?
v=aj7RJxUIs3I&ab_channel=VASAviation-
Oakland Air Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Outage, February
22, 2024: outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Center.Oakland Air
Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> February 22, 2024:
outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Miami and Jacksonville ARTCC Outages: unscheduled >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> cooperative radar
outage. https://www.faa.gov/newsroom/radar- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> modernization- proposal
These don't include several unreported potential >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> outages as they
were routine or low-impact, reinforcing that only >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> significant
disruptions gain media attention.
That's five ... but it is also from a nationwide >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> search. We know
that there's 3 just from EWR in 2025 .. what about >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the rest of the
country?
So now we're moving the goalposts.
Where that move was your's, buy citing 2024 failures >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> beyond EWR.
I'm fine with casting a broader net but since you're >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> protesting your
own goalpost move attempt, fine! Thus, your comparison >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> attempt has
found *zero* EWR failures in 2024, compared to 3 (so >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> far) in 2025.
Nope, I was asked to provide other instances of outages >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in 2024. There
was no requirement to limit it to Newark (although it >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> was the subject of
one of them).
My whole point is that you all are acting like these >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> outages are
something new. They aren't
Then let's look at little more at 2025, shall we? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
To the three in Newark, let's add:
February 2025, Oakland:
<https://www.aerotime.aero/articles/oakland-air-traffic- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> control-disruption>
May 16, 2025, Denver:
<https://www.aeronewsjournal.com/2025/05/denver-air- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> traffic- control-outage.html>
It happenes all the time. They want to make it public now. >>>>>>>>>>>>>
Yup, Did you notice you only started hearing about them >>>>>>>>>>>> after the libs got butthurt.
Then you'll have no problem pointing out all the times it's >>>>>>>>>>> happened.
:-)
Read the news moron.
So you can't point out any incidents.
Got it.
He was never going to, because he?s afraid of what it may reveal. >>>>>>>>
It was obvious from his libs butthurt bit .. even though a third >>>>>>>> of US air
traffic goes thru the NYC metro airspace daily?
-hh
I am still right. It's only news now because you want to
blame Trump and Musk.
And you don't think firing hundreds of FAA workers played any
role, huh?
Maybe, maybe not. But you would have to explain how firing hundreds
of FAA workers now played a role in prior years outages when there
was no DOGE.
You've yet to show firing hundreds of FAA workers played any role.
You've yet to show that those outages happened with the same frequency. >>>
I asked a question.
I asked you first for an explanation.
You failed to answer.
You failed to answer.
Answer it and we can move forward.
You first.
We KNOW FAA workers were fired; hundreds of them.
We KNOW that some of them worked maintaining ATC facilities; "FAA
radar, landing and navigational aid maintenance"
You have established no causal connection...none, zero, zip, zilch, nada.
Those are facts.
You CLAIM that there have been outages before and IMPLY that nothing
has changed.
The only one implying anything is you.
On 2025-05-19 11:53, Yak wrote:
On 5/19/25 1:58 PM, Alan wrote:
On 2025-05-19 10:43, Yak wrote:
On 5/19/25 12:23 PM, Alan wrote:
On 2025-05-19 06:52, Yak wrote:
On 5/17/25 1:32 PM, Alan wrote:
On 2025-05-17 10:32, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <116564867.769193901.182918.recscuba_google-
huntzinger.com@news.eternal-september.org>,
recscuba_google@huntzinger.com says...
Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-17 06:19, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008kqb$vnt$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-uh@nope.com >>>>>>>>>>> says...
On 2025-05-16 16:47, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008chb$3v4st$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 14:49, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008b3f$3v4u8$1@dont-email.me>, nuh- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> uh@nope.com says...Does it happen all the time? Really?
On 2025-05-16 05:09, Yak wrote:
On 5/15/25 9:12 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 14:25, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 2:03 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 13:51, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 12:04 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 14:34, Yak wrote:
On 5/13/25 1:17 PM, Governor Swill wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Tue, 13 May 2025 09:32:44 -0400, Yak >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <Yak@inbox.com> wrote:
On 5/13/25 8:54 AM, -hh wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 5/13/25 08:15, Yak wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 5/12/25 4:24 PM, -hh wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> email.me:
Which ATC personnel were fired? It >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> certainly wasn't
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> This is at least the 3rd time in barely >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> a week.Just wait until this summer when >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the travel surge hits and airport after >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> airport closes for lack of ATC personel. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The ones Trump fired. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Try DOGE.
One ATC was heard telling the planes >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that if
they were sick of this shit they should get >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> their corps to pressure the govt. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> needed to get fixes funded and rolling >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> fast.
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> period. That's THE hub. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sabotage here - maybe Vlad ??? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Elon's already pulled the plug on the >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> FAA's contract with >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Verizon
which was a systems upgrade ... >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
So much winning! >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
controllers.
The ones who maintain the gear that's now >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> breaking down.
Such breakdowns happened in the past as well, >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> even as
recently as late
2024.
Yes, failures happen ... but at this same >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> failure rate?
How many ATC outages did EWR have in total all >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of 2024?
Between 2-4.
You're guessing, am I right?
Nope.
Then where's the dates of said outages, preferably >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> with cites?
Plus note that 3 known outages to date in 2025 is >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> a ~3x higher
rate of critical failures than this alleged "2-4" >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> over 12 months
of 2024.
Newark (EWR), September 2, 2024 (Labor Day): A >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> radar and radio
outage at Philadelphia TRACON. https:// >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> www.nbcnewyork.com/news/
local/newark- flights-delays-radar-issue- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> faa/5757083/ Also
reported by The Air Current and CNN. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Philadelphia TRACON, November 6, 2024: Another >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> equipment outage,
including radar and radio failures.https:// >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> www.youtube.com/watch?
v=aj7RJxUIs3I&ab_channel=VASAviation- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Oakland Air Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Outage, February
22, 2024: outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Center.Oakland Air
Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> February 22, 2024:
outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Miami and Jacksonville ARTCC Outages: unscheduled >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> cooperative radar
outage. https://www.faa.gov/newsroom/radar- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> modernization- proposal
These don't include several unreported potential >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> outages as they
were routine or low-impact, reinforcing that only >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> significant
disruptions gain media attention.
That's five ... but it is also from a nationwide >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> search. We know
that there's 3 just from EWR in 2025 .. what about >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the rest of the
country?
So now we're moving the goalposts.
Where that move was your's, buy citing 2024 failures >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> beyond EWR.
I'm fine with casting a broader net but since you're >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> protesting your
own goalpost move attempt, fine! Thus, your >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> comparison attempt has
found *zero* EWR failures in 2024, compared to 3 (so >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> far) in 2025.
Nope, I was asked to provide other instances of outages >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in 2024. There
was no requirement to limit it to Newark (although it >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> was the subject of
one of them).
My whole point is that you all are acting like these >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> outages are
something new. They aren't
Then let's look at little more at 2025, shall we? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
To the three in Newark, let's add:
February 2025, Oakland:
<https://www.aerotime.aero/articles/oakland-air-traffic- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> control-disruption>
May 16, 2025, Denver:
<https://www.aeronewsjournal.com/2025/05/denver-air- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> traffic- control-outage.html>
It happenes all the time. They want to make it public now. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Yup, Did you notice you only started hearing about them >>>>>>>>>>>>> after the libs got butthurt.
Then you'll have no problem pointing out all the times it's >>>>>>>>>>>> happened.
:-)
Read the news moron.
So you can't point out any incidents.
Got it.
He was never going to, because he?s afraid of what it may reveal. >>>>>>>>>
It was obvious from his libs butthurt bit .. even though a
third of US air
traffic goes thru the NYC metro airspace daily?
-hh
I am still right. It's only news now because you want to
blame Trump and Musk.
And you don't think firing hundreds of FAA workers played any
role, huh?
My question.
Maybe, maybe not.
But you would have to explain how firing
hundreds of FAA workers now played a role in prior years outages
when there was no DOGE.
Your non-answer and your (incorrectly punctuated) question.
You've yet to show that those outages happened with the same
frequency.
You've yet to show firing hundreds of FAA workers played any role.
I asked a question.
I asked you first for an explanation.
As noted above, false.
You failed to answer.
You failed to answer.
Answer it and we can move forward.
You first.
So we agree on the rule that he who asks the question first gets
answered first!
We KNOW FAA workers were fired; hundreds of them.
We KNOW that some of them worked maintaining ATC facilities; "FAA
radar, landing and navigational aid maintenance"
You have established no causal connection...none, zero, zip, zilch, nada.
Is it a fact: yes or no?
Those are facts.
You CLAIM that there have been outages before and IMPLY that nothing
has changed.
The only one implying anything is you.
False.
Saying "it's happened before" necessarily implies things aren't
different now.
On 2025-05-19 11:03, Yak wrote:
On 5/19/25 1:49 PM, Mitchell Holman wrote:
Yak <Yak@inbox.com> wrote in news:100fd2c$1l5qu$1@dont-email.me:
On 5/17/25 1:32 PM, Alan wrote:
On 2025-05-17 10:32, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <116564867.769193901.182918.recscuba_google-
huntzinger.com@news.eternal-september.org>,
recscuba_google@huntzinger.com says...
Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-17 06:19, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008kqb$vnt$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-uh@nope.com
says...
On 2025-05-16 16:47, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008chb$3v4st$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 14:49, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008b3f$3v4u8$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-Does it happen all the time? Really?
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 05:09, Yak wrote:
On 5/15/25 9:12 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 14:25, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 2:03 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 13:51, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 12:04 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 14:34, Yak wrote:
On 5/13/25 1:17 PM, Governor Swill wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Tue, 13 May 2025 09:32:44 -0400, Yak >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <Yak@inbox.com> wrote:
On 5/13/25 8:54 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 08:15, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 4:24 PM, -hh wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> email.me:
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wasn't controllers.
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> This is at least the 3rd time in barely a >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> week.Just wait until this summer when >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the travel surge hits and airport after >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> airport closes for lack of ATC personel. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The ones Trump fired.
Try DOGE.
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they were sick of this shit they should get >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> their corps to pressure the govt. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> period. That's THE hub. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sabotage here - maybe Vlad ??? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> contract with
Verizon
which was a systems upgrade ... >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
So much winning! >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
The ones who maintain the gear that's now >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> breaking down.
Such breakdowns happened in the past as well, >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> even as recently as late
2024.
Yes, failures happen ... but at this same failure >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rate?
How many ATC outages did EWR have in total all of >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 2024?
Between 2-4.
You're guessing, am I right?
Nope.
Then where's the dates of said outages, preferably >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> with cites?
Plus note that 3 known outages to date in 2025 is a >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ~3x higher
rate of critical failures than this alleged "2-4" over >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 12 months
of 2024.
Newark (EWR), September 2, 2024 (Labor Day): A radar >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and radio
outage at Philadelphia TRACON. https://
www.nbcnewyork.com/news/
local/newark- flights-delays-radar-issue-faa/5757083/ >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Also reported by The Air Current and CNN. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Philadelphia TRACON, November 6, 2024: Another >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> equipment outage,
including radar and radio failures.https:// >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> www.youtube.com/watch?
v=aj7RJxUIs3I&ab_channel=VASAviation-
Oakland Air Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Outage, February
22, 2024: outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Center.Oakland Air
Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 22, 2024:
outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Miami and Jacksonville ARTCC Outages: unscheduled >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> cooperative radar
outage.
https://www.faa.gov/newsroom/radar-modernization- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> proposal
These don't include several unreported potential >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> outages as they
were routine or low-impact, reinforcing that only >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> significant
disruptions gain media attention.
That's five ... but it is also from a nationwide search. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> We know
that there's 3 just from EWR in 2025 .. what about the >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rest of the
country?
So now we're moving the goalposts.
Where that move was your's, buy citing 2024 failures >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> beyond EWR.
I'm fine with casting a broader net but since you're >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> protesting your
own goalpost move attempt, fine! Thus, your comparison >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> attempt has
found *zero* EWR failures in 2024, compared to 3 (so far) >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in 2025.
Nope, I was asked to provide other instances of outages in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 2024. There
was no requirement to limit it to Newark (although it was >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the subject of
one of them).
My whole point is that you all are acting like these >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> outages are something new. They aren't
Then let's look at little more at 2025, shall we?
To the three in Newark, let's add:
February 2025, Oakland:
<https://www.aerotime.aero/articles/oakland-air-traffic- >>>>>>>>>>>>>> control-disruption>
May 16, 2025, Denver:
<https://www.aeronewsjournal.com/2025/05/denver-air-traffic- >>>>>>>>>>>>>> control-outage.html>
It happenes all the time. They want to make it public now. >>>>>>>>>>>>
Yup, Did you notice you only started hearing about them
after the libs got butthurt.
Then you'll have no problem pointing out all the times it's >>>>>>>>>> happened.
:-)
Read the news moron.
So you can't point out any incidents.
Got it.
He was never going to, because he?s afraid of what it may reveal. >>>>>>>
It was obvious from his libs butthurt bit .. even though a third of >>>>>>> US air
traffic goes thru the NYC metro airspace daily?
-hh
I am still right. It's only news now because you want to
blame Trump and Musk.
And you don't think firing hundreds of FAA workers played any role,
huh?
Maybe, maybe not. But you would have to explain how firing hundreds of >>>> FAA workers now played a role in prior years outages when there was no >>>> DOGE.
You would have to explain why the ATC worked
fine until Trump and his mass firings took place.
No, I wouldn't. Because it hasn't. I have already cited instances of
similar events taking place prior to any cuts. Outages have been going
on for years.
And your implication is that things haven't changed.
So show it.
On 5/19/25 3:08 PM, Alan wrote:
On 2025-05-19 11:03, Yak wrote:
On 5/19/25 1:49 PM, Mitchell Holman wrote:
Yak <Yak@inbox.com> wrote in news:100fd2c$1l5qu$1@dont-email.me:
On 5/17/25 1:32 PM, Alan wrote:
On 2025-05-17 10:32, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <116564867.769193901.182918.recscuba_google-
huntzinger.com@news.eternal-september.org>,
recscuba_google@huntzinger.com says...
Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-17 06:19, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008kqb$vnt$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-uh@nope.com
says...
On 2025-05-16 16:47, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008chb$3v4st$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 14:49, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008b3f$3v4u8$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-Does it happen all the time? Really?
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 05:09, Yak wrote:
On 5/15/25 9:12 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 14:25, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 2:03 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 13:51, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 12:04 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 14:34, Yak wrote:
On 5/13/25 1:17 PM, Governor Swill wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Tue, 13 May 2025 09:32:44 -0400, Yak >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <Yak@inbox.com> wrote:
On 5/13/25 8:54 AM, -hh wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 5/13/25 08:15, Yak wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 5/12/25 4:24 PM, -hh wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> email.me:
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wasn't controllers.
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> This is at least the 3rd time in barely a >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> week.Just wait until this summer when >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the travel surge hits and airport after >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> airport closes for lack of ATC personel. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The ones Trump fired. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Try DOGE.
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they were sick of this shit they should get >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> their corps to pressure the govt. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> period. That's THE hub. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sabotage here - maybe Vlad ??? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> contract with
Verizon
which was a systems upgrade ... >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
So much winning! >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
The ones who maintain the gear that's now >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> breaking down.
Such breakdowns happened in the past as well, >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> even as recently as late
2024.
Yes, failures happen ... but at this same failure >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rate?
How many ATC outages did EWR have in total all of >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 2024?
Between 2-4.
You're guessing, am I right?
Nope.
Then where's the dates of said outages, preferably >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> with cites?
Plus note that 3 known outages to date in 2025 is a >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ~3x higher
rate of critical failures than this alleged "2-4" over >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 12 months
of 2024.
Newark (EWR), September 2, 2024 (Labor Day): A radar >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and radio
outage at Philadelphia TRACON. https:// >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> www.nbcnewyork.com/news/
local/newark- flights-delays-radar-issue-faa/5757083/ >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Also reported by The Air Current and CNN. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Philadelphia TRACON, November 6, 2024: Another >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> equipment outage,
including radar and radio failures.https:// >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> www.youtube.com/watch?
v=aj7RJxUIs3I&ab_channel=VASAviation-
Oakland Air Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Outage, February
22, 2024: outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Center.Oakland Air
Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 22, 2024:
outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Miami and Jacksonville ARTCC Outages: unscheduled >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> cooperative radar
outage.
https://www.faa.gov/newsroom/radar-modernization- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> proposal
These don't include several unreported potential >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> outages as they
were routine or low-impact, reinforcing that only >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> significant
disruptions gain media attention.
That's five ... but it is also from a nationwide search. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> We know
that there's 3 just from EWR in 2025 .. what about the >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rest of the
country?
So now we're moving the goalposts.
Where that move was your's, buy citing 2024 failures >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> beyond EWR.
I'm fine with casting a broader net but since you're >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> protesting your
own goalpost move attempt, fine! Thus, your comparison >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> attempt has
found *zero* EWR failures in 2024, compared to 3 (so far) >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in 2025.
Nope, I was asked to provide other instances of outages in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 2024. There
was no requirement to limit it to Newark (although it was >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the subject of
one of them).
My whole point is that you all are acting like these >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> outages are something new. They aren't
Then let's look at little more at 2025, shall we? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
To the three in Newark, let's add:
February 2025, Oakland:
<https://www.aerotime.aero/articles/oakland-air-traffic- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> control-disruption>
May 16, 2025, Denver:
<https://www.aeronewsjournal.com/2025/05/denver-air-traffic- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> control-outage.html>
It happenes all the time. They want to make it public now. >>>>>>>>>>>>>
Yup, Did you notice you only started hearing about them >>>>>>>>>>>> after the libs got butthurt.
Then you'll have no problem pointing out all the times it's >>>>>>>>>>> happened.
:-)
Read the news moron.
So you can't point out any incidents.
Got it.
He was never going to, because he?s afraid of what it may reveal. >>>>>>>>
It was obvious from his libs butthurt bit .. even though a third of >>>>>>>> US air
traffic goes thru the NYC metro airspace daily?
-hh
I am still right. It's only news now because you want to
blame Trump and Musk.
And you don't think firing hundreds of FAA workers played any role, >>>>>> huh?
Maybe, maybe not. But you would have to explain how firing hundreds of >>>>> FAA workers now played a role in prior years outages when there was no >>>>> DOGE.
You would have to explain why the ATC worked
fine until Trump and his mass firings took place.
No, I wouldn't. Because it hasn't. I have already cited instances of
similar events taking place prior to any cuts. Outages have been
going on for years.
And your implication is that things haven't changed.
So show it.
There is no implication, except by you.
On 2025-05-19 09:18, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <100ah87$gd6e$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-uh@nope.com
says...
On 2025-05-17 10:32, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <116564867.769193901.182918.recscuba_google-
huntzinger.com@news.eternal-september.org>,
recscuba_google@huntzinger.com says...
Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-17 06:19, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008kqb$vnt$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-uh@nope.com
says...
On 2025-05-16 16:47, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008chb$3v4st$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 14:49, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008b3f$3v4u8$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-Does it happen all the time? Really?
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 05:09, Yak wrote:
On 5/15/25 9:12 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 14:25, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 2:03 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 13:51, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 12:04 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 14:34, Yak wrote:
On 5/13/25 1:17 PM, Governor Swill wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Tue, 13 May 2025 09:32:44 -0400, Yak <Yak@inbox.com> wrote:
On 5/13/25 8:54 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 08:15, Yak wrote:Between 2-4.
On 5/12/25 4:24 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont-
email.me:
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Just wait until this summer when >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the travel surge hits and airport after >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> airport closes for lack of ATC personel. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The ones Trump fired.
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they were sick of this shit they should get >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> their corps to pressure the govt. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Try DOGE.
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> period. That's THE hub. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sabotage here - maybe Vlad ??? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's contract with
Verizon
which was a systems upgrade ... >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
So much winning!
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly wasn't >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> controllers.
The ones who maintain the gear that's now breaking down.
Such breakdowns happened in the past as well, even as >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> recently as late
2024.
Yes, failures happen ... but at this same failure rate? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
How many ATC outages did EWR have in total all of 2024? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
You're guessing, am I right?
Nope.
Then where's the dates of said outages, preferably with cites?
Plus note that 3 known outages to date in 2025 is a ~3x higher
rate of critical failures than this alleged "2-4" over 12 months
of 2024.
Newark (EWR), September 2, 2024 (Labor Day): A radar and radio
outage at Philadelphia TRACON. https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/
local/newark- flights-delays-radar-issue-faa/5757083/ Also >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> reported by The Air Current and CNN.
Philadelphia TRACON, November 6, 2024: Another equipment outage,
including radar and radio failures.https://www.youtube.com/watch?
v=aj7RJxUIs3I&ab_channel=VASAviation-
Oakland Air Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February
22, 2024: outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center.Oakland Air
Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February 22, 2024:
outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center
Miami and Jacksonville ARTCC Outages: unscheduled cooperative radar
outage. https://www.faa.gov/newsroom/radar-modernization-proposal
These don't include several unreported potential outages as they
were routine or low-impact, reinforcing that only significant
disruptions gain media attention.
That's five ... but it is also from a nationwide search. We know
that there's 3 just from EWR in 2025 .. what about the rest of the
country?
So now we're moving the goalposts.
Where that move was your's, buy citing 2024 failures beyond EWR.
I'm fine with casting a broader net but since you're protesting your
own goalpost move attempt, fine! Thus, your comparison attempt has
found *zero* EWR failures in 2024, compared to 3 (so far) in 2025.
Nope, I was asked to provide other instances of outages in 2024. There
was no requirement to limit it to Newark (although it was the subject of
one of them).
My whole point is that you all are acting like these outages are >>>>>>>>>>>> something new. They aren't
Then let's look at little more at 2025, shall we?
To the three in Newark, let's add:
February 2025, Oakland:
<https://www.aerotime.aero/articles/oakland-air-traffic-control-disruption>
May 16, 2025, Denver:
<https://www.aeronewsjournal.com/2025/05/denver-air-traffic-control-outage.html>
It happenes all the time. They want to make it public now. >>>>>>>>>
Yup, Did you notice you only started hearing about them
after the libs got butthurt.
Then you'll have no problem pointing out all the times it's happened. >>>>>>>
:-)
Read the news moron.
So you can't point out any incidents.
Got it.
He was never going to, because he?s afraid of what it may reveal.
It was obvious from his libs butthurt bit .. even though a third of US air
traffic goes thru the NYC metro airspace daily?
-hh
I am still right. It's only news now because you want to
blame Trump and Musk.
And you don't think firing hundreds of FAA workers played any role, huh?
No, there are many qualified.
You know that, do you?
How?
On 2025-05-19 15:19, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <100fltt$1n2od$2@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-19 09:18, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <100ah87$gd6e$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-uh@nope.com
says...
No, there are many qualified.
On 2025-05-17 10:32, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <116564867.769193901.182918.recscuba_google-
huntzinger.com@news.eternal-september.org>,
recscuba_google@huntzinger.com says...
Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-17 06:19, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008kqb$vnt$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-uh@nope.com
says...
On 2025-05-16 16:47, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008chb$3v4st$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 14:49, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008b3f$3v4u8$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-Does it happen all the time? Really?
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 05:09, Yak wrote:
On 5/15/25 9:12 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 14:25, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 2:03 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 13:51, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 12:04 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 14:34, Yak wrote:
On 5/13/25 1:17 PM, Governor Swill wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Tue, 13 May 2025 09:32:44 -0400, Yak <Yak@inbox.com> wrote:
On 5/13/25 8:54 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 08:15, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 4:24 PM, -hh wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> email.me:
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly wasn't >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> controllers.
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Just wait until this summer when >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the travel surge hits and airport after >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> airport closes for lack of ATC personel. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The ones Trump fired.
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they were sick of this shit they should get >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> their corps to pressure the govt. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Try DOGE.
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> period. That's THE hub. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sabotage here - maybe Vlad ??? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's contract with
Verizon
which was a systems upgrade ... >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
So much winning! >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
The ones who maintain the gear that's now breaking down.
Such breakdowns happened in the past as well, even as >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> recently as late
2024.
Yes, failures happen ... but at this same failure rate?
How many ATC outages did EWR have in total all of 2024?
Between 2-4.
You're guessing, am I right?
Nope.
Then where's the dates of said outages, preferably with cites?
Plus note that 3 known outages to date in 2025 is a ~3x higher
rate of critical failures than this alleged "2-4" over 12 months
of 2024.
Newark (EWR), September 2, 2024 (Labor Day): A radar and radio
outage at Philadelphia TRACON. https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/
local/newark- flights-delays-radar-issue-faa/5757083/ Also
reported by The Air Current and CNN.
Philadelphia TRACON, November 6, 2024: Another equipment outage,
including radar and radio failures.https://www.youtube.com/watch?
v=aj7RJxUIs3I&ab_channel=VASAviation-
Oakland Air Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February
22, 2024: outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center.Oakland Air
Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February 22, 2024:
outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Miami and Jacksonville ARTCC Outages: unscheduled cooperative radar
outage. https://www.faa.gov/newsroom/radar-modernization-proposal
These don't include several unreported potential outages as they
were routine or low-impact, reinforcing that only significant
disruptions gain media attention.
That's five ... but it is also from a nationwide search. We know
that there's 3 just from EWR in 2025 .. what about the rest of the
country?
So now we're moving the goalposts.
Where that move was your's, buy citing 2024 failures beyond EWR.
I'm fine with casting a broader net but since you're protesting your
own goalpost move attempt, fine! Thus, your comparison attempt has
found *zero* EWR failures in 2024, compared to 3 (so far) in 2025.
Nope, I was asked to provide other instances of outages in 2024. There
was no requirement to limit it to Newark (although it was the subject of
one of them).
My whole point is that you all are acting like these outages are
something new. They aren't
Then let's look at little more at 2025, shall we?
To the three in Newark, let's add:
February 2025, Oakland:
<https://www.aerotime.aero/articles/oakland-air-traffic-control-disruption>
May 16, 2025, Denver:
<https://www.aeronewsjournal.com/2025/05/denver-air-traffic-control-outage.html>
It happenes all the time. They want to make it public now. >>>>>>>>>>>>
Yup, Did you notice you only started hearing about them
after the libs got butthurt.
Then you'll have no problem pointing out all the times it's happened.
:-)
Read the news moron.
So you can't point out any incidents.
Got it.
He was never going to, because he?s afraid of what it may reveal. >>>>>>>
It was obvious from his libs butthurt bit .. even though a third of US air
traffic goes thru the NYC metro airspace daily?
-hh
I am still right. It's only news now because you want to
blame Trump and Musk.
And you don't think firing hundreds of FAA workers played any role, huh? >>>>
You know that, do you?
How?
I live here.
You live everywhere there are FAA technicians?
Wow!
In article <100fltt$1n2od$2@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-19 09:18, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <100ah87$gd6e$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-uh@nope.com
says...
No, there are many qualified.
On 2025-05-17 10:32, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <116564867.769193901.182918.recscuba_google-
huntzinger.com@news.eternal-september.org>,
recscuba_google@huntzinger.com says...
Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-17 06:19, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008kqb$vnt$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-uh@nope.com
says...
On 2025-05-16 16:47, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008chb$3v4st$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 14:49, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008b3f$3v4u8$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-Does it happen all the time? Really?
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 05:09, Yak wrote:
On 5/15/25 9:12 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 14:25, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 2:03 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 13:51, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 12:04 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 14:34, Yak wrote:
On 5/13/25 1:17 PM, Governor Swill wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Tue, 13 May 2025 09:32:44 -0400, Yak <Yak@inbox.com> wrote:
On 5/13/25 8:54 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 08:15, Yak wrote:Between 2-4.
On 5/12/25 4:24 PM, -hh wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> email.me:
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly wasn't >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> controllers.
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Just wait until this summer when >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the travel surge hits and airport after >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> airport closes for lack of ATC personel. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The ones Trump fired.
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they were sick of this shit they should get >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> their corps to pressure the govt. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Try DOGE.
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> period. That's THE hub. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sabotage here - maybe Vlad ??? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's contract with
Verizon
which was a systems upgrade ... >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
So much winning! >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
The ones who maintain the gear that's now breaking down.
Such breakdowns happened in the past as well, even as >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> recently as late
2024.
Yes, failures happen ... but at this same failure rate? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
How many ATC outages did EWR have in total all of 2024? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
You're guessing, am I right?
Nope.
Then where's the dates of said outages, preferably with cites?
Plus note that 3 known outages to date in 2025 is a ~3x higher
rate of critical failures than this alleged "2-4" over 12 months
of 2024.
Newark (EWR), September 2, 2024 (Labor Day): A radar and radio
outage at Philadelphia TRACON. https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/
local/newark- flights-delays-radar-issue-faa/5757083/ Also >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> reported by The Air Current and CNN.
Philadelphia TRACON, November 6, 2024: Another equipment outage,
including radar and radio failures.https://www.youtube.com/watch?
v=aj7RJxUIs3I&ab_channel=VASAviation-
Oakland Air Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February
22, 2024: outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center.Oakland Air
Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February 22, 2024:
outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center
Miami and Jacksonville ARTCC Outages: unscheduled cooperative radar
outage. https://www.faa.gov/newsroom/radar-modernization-proposal
These don't include several unreported potential outages as they
were routine or low-impact, reinforcing that only significant
disruptions gain media attention.
That's five ... but it is also from a nationwide search. We know
that there's 3 just from EWR in 2025 .. what about the rest of the
country?
So now we're moving the goalposts.
Where that move was your's, buy citing 2024 failures beyond EWR.
I'm fine with casting a broader net but since you're protesting your
own goalpost move attempt, fine! Thus, your comparison attempt has
found *zero* EWR failures in 2024, compared to 3 (so far) in 2025.
Nope, I was asked to provide other instances of outages in 2024. There
was no requirement to limit it to Newark (although it was the subject of
one of them).
My whole point is that you all are acting like these outages are >>>>>>>>>>>>>> something new. They aren't
Then let's look at little more at 2025, shall we?
To the three in Newark, let's add:
February 2025, Oakland:
<https://www.aerotime.aero/articles/oakland-air-traffic-control-disruption>
May 16, 2025, Denver:
<https://www.aeronewsjournal.com/2025/05/denver-air-traffic-control-outage.html>
It happenes all the time. They want to make it public now. >>>>>>>>>>>
Yup, Did you notice you only started hearing about them
after the libs got butthurt.
Then you'll have no problem pointing out all the times it's happened. >>>>>>>>>
:-)
Read the news moron.
So you can't point out any incidents.
Got it.
He was never going to, because he?s afraid of what it may reveal.
It was obvious from his libs butthurt bit .. even though a third of US air
traffic goes thru the NYC metro airspace daily?
-hh
I am still right. It's only news now because you want to
blame Trump and Musk.
And you don't think firing hundreds of FAA workers played any role, huh? >>>
You know that, do you?
How?
I live here.
On 2025-05-19, Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-19 15:19, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <100fltt$1n2od$2@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-19 09:18, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <100ah87$gd6e$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-uh@nope.com
says...
No, there are many qualified.
On 2025-05-17 10:32, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <116564867.769193901.182918.recscuba_google-
huntzinger.com@news.eternal-september.org>,
recscuba_google@huntzinger.com says...
Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-17 06:19, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008kqb$vnt$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-uh@nope.com
says...
On 2025-05-16 16:47, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008chb$3v4st$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 14:49, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008b3f$3v4u8$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-Does it happen all the time? Really?
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 05:09, Yak wrote:
On 5/15/25 9:12 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 14:25, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 2:03 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 13:51, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 12:04 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 14:34, Yak wrote:
On 5/13/25 1:17 PM, Governor Swill wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Tue, 13 May 2025 09:32:44 -0400, Yak <Yak@inbox.com> wrote:
On 5/13/25 8:54 AM, -hh wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 5/13/25 08:15, Yak wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 5/12/25 4:24 PM, -hh wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> email.me:
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly wasn't
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Just wait until this summer when >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the travel surge hits and airport after >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> airport closes for lack of ATC personel. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The ones Trump fired. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they were sick of this shit they should get >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> their corps to pressure the govt. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Try DOGE.
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> period. That's THE hub. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sabotage here - maybe Vlad ??? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's contract with
Verizon
which was a systems upgrade ... >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
So much winning! >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
controllers.
The ones who maintain the gear that's now breaking down.
Such breakdowns happened in the past as well, even as
recently as late
2024.
Yes, failures happen ... but at this same failure rate?
How many ATC outages did EWR have in total all of 2024?
Between 2-4.
You're guessing, am I right?
Nope.
Then where's the dates of said outages, preferably with cites?
Plus note that 3 known outages to date in 2025 is a ~3x higher
rate of critical failures than this alleged "2-4" over 12 months
of 2024.
Newark (EWR), September 2, 2024 (Labor Day): A radar and radio
outage at Philadelphia TRACON. https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/
local/newark- flights-delays-radar-issue-faa/5757083/ Also
reported by The Air Current and CNN.
Philadelphia TRACON, November 6, 2024: Another equipment outage,
including radar and radio failures.https://www.youtube.com/watch?
v=aj7RJxUIs3I&ab_channel=VASAviation-
Oakland Air Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February
22, 2024: outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center.Oakland Air
Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February 22, 2024:
outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Miami and Jacksonville ARTCC Outages: unscheduled cooperative radar
outage. https://www.faa.gov/newsroom/radar-modernization-proposal
These don't include several unreported potential outages as they
were routine or low-impact, reinforcing that only significant
disruptions gain media attention.
That's five ... but it is also from a nationwide search. We know
that there's 3 just from EWR in 2025 .. what about the rest of the
country?
So now we're moving the goalposts.
Where that move was your's, buy citing 2024 failures beyond EWR.
I'm fine with casting a broader net but since you're protesting your
own goalpost move attempt, fine! Thus, your comparison attempt has
found *zero* EWR failures in 2024, compared to 3 (so far) in 2025.
Nope, I was asked to provide other instances of outages in 2024. There
was no requirement to limit it to Newark (although it was the subject of
one of them).
My whole point is that you all are acting like these outages are
something new. They aren't
Then let's look at little more at 2025, shall we? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
To the three in Newark, let's add:
February 2025, Oakland:
<https://www.aerotime.aero/articles/oakland-air-traffic-control-disruption>
May 16, 2025, Denver:
<https://www.aeronewsjournal.com/2025/05/denver-air-traffic-control-outage.html>
It happenes all the time. They want to make it public now. >>>>>>>>>>>>>
Yup, Did you notice you only started hearing about them >>>>>>>>>>>> after the libs got butthurt.
Then you'll have no problem pointing out all the times it's happened.
:-)
Read the news moron.
So you can't point out any incidents.
Got it.
He was never going to, because he?s afraid of what it may reveal. >>>>>>>>
It was obvious from his libs butthurt bit .. even though a third of US air
traffic goes thru the NYC metro airspace daily?
-hh
I am still right. It's only news now because you want to
blame Trump and Musk.
And you don't think firing hundreds of FAA workers played any role, huh? >>>>>
You know that, do you?
How?
I live here.
You live everywhere there are FAA technicians?
Wow!
The infrastructure is from the stone age.
Wires burning up was the cause of the Newark mess.
And since you libbys squawk about Verizon being bid against by Musk,
consider that a critical bat phone line between the FAA and the Pentagon
was not working for 2 years.
Where was Pothole Pete?
Implementing DEI policies that's where.
And again, your proof that critical maintenance staff was fired is?The infrastructure is from the stone age.And again:
Wires burning up was the cause of the Newark mess.
Do you think firing maintenance staff made that situation better or worse.
I didn't say that.And since you libbys squawk about Verizon being bid against by Musk,What makes you think that line was part of Verizon's contract?
consider that a critical bat phone line between the FAA and the Pentagon >>> was not working for 2 years.
Learn to read.
Since the Verizon connection was a PHONE LINE VOICE, that was down for 2 years
it obviously had nothing to do with wires burning up.
You fail.
Well?Where was Pothole Pete?
Implementing DEI policies that's where.
On 2025-05-19 16:28, pothead wrote:
On 2025-05-19, Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-19 15:19, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <100fltt$1n2od$2@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-19 09:18, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <100ah87$gd6e$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-uh@nope.com
says...
On 2025-05-17 10:32, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <116564867.769193901.182918.recscuba_google-
huntzinger.com@news.eternal-september.org>,
recscuba_google@huntzinger.com says...
Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-17 06:19, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008kqb$vnt$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-uh@nope.com >>>>>>>>>>> says...
On 2025-05-16 16:47, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008chb$3v4st$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 14:49, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008b3f$3v4u8$1@dont-email.me>, nuh- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> uh@nope.com says...Does it happen all the time? Really?
On 2025-05-16 05:09, Yak wrote:
On 5/15/25 9:12 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 14:25, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 2:03 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 13:51, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 12:04 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 14:34, Yak wrote:
On 5/13/25 1:17 PM, Governor Swill wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Tue, 13 May 2025 09:32:44 -0400, Yak <Yak@inbox.com> wrote:
On 5/13/25 8:54 AM, -hh wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 5/13/25 08:15, Yak wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 5/12/25 4:24 PM, -hh wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> email.me:
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly wasn't
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week.Just wait until this summer when >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the travel surge hits and airport after >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> airport closes for lack of ATC personel. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The ones Trump fired. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Try DOGE.
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they were sick of this shit they should get >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> their corps to pressure the govt. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> period. That's THE hub. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sabotage here - maybe Vlad ??? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's contract with
Verizon
which was a systems upgrade ... >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
So much winning! >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
controllers.
The ones who maintain the gear that's now breaking down.
Such breakdowns happened in the past as well, even as
recently as late
2024.
Yes, failures happen ... but at this same failure rate?
How many ATC outages did EWR have in total all of 2024?
Between 2-4.
You're guessing, am I right?
Nope.
Then where's the dates of said outages, preferably with cites?
Plus note that 3 known outages to date in 2025 is a ~3x higher
rate of critical failures than this alleged "2-4" over 12 months
of 2024.
Newark (EWR), September 2, 2024 (Labor Day): A radar and radio
outage at Philadelphia TRACON. https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/
local/newark- flights-delays-radar-issue-faa/5757083/ Also
reported by The Air Current and CNN. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Philadelphia TRACON, November 6, 2024: Another equipment outage,
including radar and radio failures.https://www.youtube.com/watch?
v=aj7RJxUIs3I&ab_channel=VASAviation- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Oakland Air Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February
22, 2024: outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center.Oakland Air
Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February 22, 2024:
outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Miami and Jacksonville ARTCC Outages: unscheduled cooperative radar
outage. https://www.faa.gov/newsroom/radar-modernization-proposal
These don't include several unreported potential outages as they
were routine or low-impact, reinforcing that only significant
disruptions gain media attention.
That's five ... but it is also from a nationwide search. We know
that there's 3 just from EWR in 2025 .. what about the rest of the
country?
So now we're moving the goalposts.
Where that move was your's, buy citing 2024 failures beyond EWR.
I'm fine with casting a broader net but since you're protesting your
own goalpost move attempt, fine! Thus, your comparison attempt has
found *zero* EWR failures in 2024, compared to 3 (so far) in 2025.
Nope, I was asked to provide other instances of outages in 2024. There
was no requirement to limit it to Newark (although it was the subject of
one of them).
My whole point is that you all are acting like these outages are
something new. They aren't
Then let's look at little more at 2025, shall we? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
To the three in Newark, let's add:
February 2025, Oakland:
<https://www.aerotime.aero/articles/oakland-air-traffic-control-disruption>
May 16, 2025, Denver:
<https://www.aeronewsjournal.com/2025/05/denver-air-traffic-control-outage.html>
It happenes all the time. They want to make it public now. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Yup, Did you notice you only started hearing about them >>>>>>>>>>>>> after the libs got butthurt.
Then you'll have no problem pointing out all the times it's happened.
:-)
Read the news moron.
So you can't point out any incidents.
Got it.
He was never going to, because he?s afraid of what it may reveal. >>>>>>>>>
It was obvious from his libs butthurt bit .. even though a third of US air
traffic goes thru the NYC metro airspace daily?
-hh
I am still right. It's only news now because you want to
blame Trump and Musk.
And you don't think firing hundreds of FAA workers played any role, huh?
No, there are many qualified.
You know that, do you?
How?
I live here.
You live everywhere there are FAA technicians?
Wow!
The infrastructure is from the stone age.
Wires burning up was the cause of the Newark mess.
And again:
Do you think firing maintenance staff made that situation better or worse.
And since you libbys squawk about Verizon being bid against by Musk,
consider that a critical bat phone line between the FAA and the Pentagon
was not working for 2 years.
What makes you think that line was part of Verizon's contract?
Where was Pothole Pete?
Implementing DEI policies that's where.
On 2025-05-19 16:46, pothead wrote:
The infrastructure is from the stone age.And again:
Wires burning up was the cause of the Newark mess.
Do you think firing maintenance staff made that situation better or worse. >> And again, your proof that critical maintenance staff was fired is?
You're kidding.
Try to keep up:
'The terminated FAA employees included workers who assist FAA
technicians administratively and logistically, according to David Spero, national president of the Professional Aviation Safety Specialists, a
union that represents about 11,000 FAA and Defense Department employees
who support air traffic controllers.
He said environmental compliance workers, aeronautical information specialists and maintenance mechanics responsible for the upkeep of
grounds, roads and facilities were among those fired.'
<https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2025/02/17/faa-workers-fired-trump-plane-helicopter-collision/78956241007/>
'The impacted workers include personnel hired for FAA radar, landing and navigational aid maintenance, one air traffic controller told The
Associated Press. The air traffic controller was not authorized to talk
to the media and spoke on condition of anonymity.'
<https://apnews.com/article/doge-faa-air-traffic-firings-safety-67981aec33b6ee72cbad8dcee31f3437>
I didn't say that.And since you libbys squawk about Verizon being bid against by Musk,What makes you think that line was part of Verizon's contract?
consider that a critical bat phone line between the FAA and the Pentagon >>>> was not working for 2 years.
Learn to read.
Since the Verizon connection was a PHONE LINE VOICE, that was down for 2 years
it obviously had nothing to do with wires burning up.
You fail.
<https://www.verizon.com/about/news/verizon-public-sector-wins-federal-aviation-administration-fens-contract>
Nothing about phone lines there...
Well?Where was Pothole Pete?
Implementing DEI policies that's where.
You have presented no evidence of DEI policies having anything to do
with it.
On 2025-05-19 17:13, pothead wrote:
On 2025-05-19, Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-19 16:46, pothead wrote:
And again, your proof that critical maintenance staff was fired is?The infrastructure is from the stone age.And again:
Wires burning up was the cause of the Newark mess.
Do you think firing maintenance staff made that situation better or worse.
You're kidding.
Try to keep up:
'The terminated FAA employees included workers who assist FAA
technicians administratively and logistically, according to David Spero, >>> national president of the Professional Aviation Safety Specialists, a
union that represents about 11,000 FAA and Defense Department employees
who support air traffic controllers.
Key word ASSIST.
Also known as gophers.
He said environmental compliance workers, aeronautical information
specialists and maintenance mechanics responsible for the upkeep of
grounds, roads and facilities were among those fired.'
<https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2025/02/17/faa-workers-fired-trump-plane-helicopter-collision/78956241007/>
Enviornmental compliance workers?
ROTFLMAO!
so green new scam BS employees.
Upkeep of grounds?
Really?
So pretty bushes help the planes to land..
Hahahahahha!
'The impacted workers include personnel hired for FAA radar, landing and >>> navigational aid maintenance, one air traffic controller told The
Associated Press. The air traffic controller was not authorized to talk
to the media and spoke on condition of anonymity.'
<https://apnews.com/article/doge-faa-air-traffic-firings-safety-67981aec33b6ee72cbad8dcee31f3437>
Was his ATC station broken?
The reason he was not allowed to talk to the media was because the FAA did not want
the facts that the ATC system is antique leaked.
Sorry but maintenance is NOT the problem.
Infrastructure IS the problem.
I didn't say that.And since you libbys squawk about Verizon being bid against by Musk, >>>>>> consider that a critical bat phone line between the FAA and the Pentagon >>>>>> was not working for 2 years.What makes you think that line was part of Verizon's contract?
Learn to read.
Since the Verizon connection was a PHONE LINE VOICE, that was down for 2 years
it obviously had nothing to do with wires burning up.
You fail.
<https://www.verizon.com/about/news/verizon-public-sector-wins-federal-aviation-administration-fens-contract>
Nothing about phone lines there...
I don't think I posted that but however here is a link:
<https://www.npr.org/2025/05/14/nx-s1-5398581/hotline-dca-airport-pentagon-disconnected-army>
No evidence that it was part of any Verizon contract.
Did you read the article I provided?
On 2025-05-20, Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-19 17:13, pothead wrote:
On 2025-05-19, Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-19 16:46, pothead wrote:
And again, your proof that critical maintenance staff was fired is?The infrastructure is from the stone age.And again:
Wires burning up was the cause of the Newark mess.
Do you think firing maintenance staff made that situation better or worse.
You're kidding.
Try to keep up:
'The terminated FAA employees included workers who assist FAA
technicians administratively and logistically, according to David Spero, >>>> national president of the Professional Aviation Safety Specialists, a
union that represents about 11,000 FAA and Defense Department employees >>>> who support air traffic controllers.
Key word ASSIST.
Also known as gophers.
He said environmental compliance workers, aeronautical information
specialists and maintenance mechanics responsible for the upkeep of
grounds, roads and facilities were among those fired.'
<https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2025/02/17/faa-workers-fired-trump-plane-helicopter-collision/78956241007/>
Enviornmental compliance workers?
ROTFLMAO!
so green new scam BS employees.
Upkeep of grounds?
Really?
So pretty bushes help the planes to land..
Hahahahahha!
'The impacted workers include personnel hired for FAA radar, landing and >>>> navigational aid maintenance, one air traffic controller told The
Associated Press. The air traffic controller was not authorized to talk >>>> to the media and spoke on condition of anonymity.'
<https://apnews.com/article/doge-faa-air-traffic-firings-safety-67981aec33b6ee72cbad8dcee31f3437>
Was his ATC station broken?
The reason he was not allowed to talk to the media was because the FAA did not want
the facts that the ATC system is antique leaked.
Sorry but maintenance is NOT the problem.
Infrastructure IS the problem.
I didn't say that.And since you libbys squawk about Verizon being bid against by Musk, >>>>>>> consider that a critical bat phone line between the FAA and the PentagonWhat makes you think that line was part of Verizon's contract?
was not working for 2 years.
Learn to read.
Since the Verizon connection was a PHONE LINE VOICE, that was down for 2 years
it obviously had nothing to do with wires burning up.
You fail.
<https://www.verizon.com/about/news/verizon-public-sector-wins-federal-aviation-administration-fens-contract>
Nothing about phone lines there...
I don't think I posted that but however here is a link:
<https://www.npr.org/2025/05/14/nx-s1-5398581/hotline-dca-airport-pentagon-disconnected-army>
No evidence that it was part of any Verizon contract.
Did you read the article I provided?
I never said it was.
That was YOUR assumption.
And either way it does not matter.
Point is, a critical line of communication was broken for TWO YEARS!Let's talk about what you just snipped:
Where was Pothole Pete?
On 2025-05-19, Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-19 16:46, pothead wrote:
The infrastructure is from the stone age.And again:
Wires burning up was the cause of the Newark mess.
Do you think firing maintenance staff made that situation better or worse. >>> And again, your proof that critical maintenance staff was fired is?
You're kidding.
Try to keep up:
'The terminated FAA employees included workers who assist FAA
technicians administratively and logistically, according to David Spero,
national president of the Professional Aviation Safety Specialists, a
union that represents about 11,000 FAA and Defense Department employees
who support air traffic controllers.
Key word ASSIST.
Also known as gophers.
He said environmental compliance workers, aeronautical information
specialists and maintenance mechanics responsible for the upkeep of
grounds, roads and facilities were among those fired.'
<https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2025/02/17/faa-workers-fired-trump-plane-helicopter-collision/78956241007/>
Enviornmental compliance workers?
ROTFLMAO!
so green new scam BS employees.
Upkeep of grounds?
Really?
So pretty bushes help the planes to land..
Hahahahahha!
'The impacted workers include personnel hired for FAA radar, landing and
navigational aid maintenance, one air traffic controller told The
Associated Press. The air traffic controller was not authorized to talk
to the media and spoke on condition of anonymity.'
<https://apnews.com/article/doge-faa-air-traffic-firings-safety-67981aec33b6ee72cbad8dcee31f3437>
Was his ATC station broken?
The reason he was not allowed to talk to the media was because the FAA did not want
the facts that the ATC system is antique leaked.
Sorry but maintenance is NOT the problem.
Infrastructure IS the problem.
I didn't say that.And since you libbys squawk about Verizon being bid against by Musk, >>>>> consider that a critical bat phone line between the FAA and the Pentagon >>>>> was not working for 2 years.What makes you think that line was part of Verizon's contract?
Learn to read.
Since the Verizon connection was a PHONE LINE VOICE, that was down for 2 years
it obviously had nothing to do with wires burning up.
You fail.
<https://www.verizon.com/about/news/verizon-public-sector-wins-federal-aviation-administration-fens-contract>
Nothing about phone lines there...
I don't think I posted that but however here is a link:
<https://www.npr.org/2025/05/14/nx-s1-5398581/hotline-dca-airport-pentagon-disconnected-army>
On 2025-05-20, Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-19 17:13, pothead wrote:
On 2025-05-19, Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-19 16:46, pothead wrote:
And again, your proof that critical maintenance staff was fired is?The infrastructure is from the stone age.And again:
Wires burning up was the cause of the Newark mess.
Do you think firing maintenance staff made that situation better or worse.
You're kidding.
Try to keep up:
'The terminated FAA employees included workers who assist FAA
technicians administratively and logistically, according to David Spero, >>>> national president of the Professional Aviation Safety Specialists, a
union that represents about 11,000 FAA and Defense Department employees >>>> who support air traffic controllers.
Key word ASSIST.
Also known as gophers.
He said environmental compliance workers, aeronautical information
specialists and maintenance mechanics responsible for the upkeep of
grounds, roads and facilities were among those fired.'
<https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2025/02/17/faa-workers-fired-trump-plane-helicopter-collision/78956241007/>
Enviornmental compliance workers?
ROTFLMAO!
so green new scam BS employees.
Upkeep of grounds?
Really?
So pretty bushes help the planes to land..
Hahahahahha!
'The impacted workers include personnel hired for FAA radar, landing and >>>> navigational aid maintenance, one air traffic controller told The
Associated Press. The air traffic controller was not authorized to talk >>>> to the media and spoke on condition of anonymity.'
<https://apnews.com/article/doge-faa-air-traffic-firings-safety-67981aec33b6ee72cbad8dcee31f3437>
Was his ATC station broken?
The reason he was not allowed to talk to the media was because the FAA did not want
the facts that the ATC system is antique leaked.
Sorry but maintenance is NOT the problem.
Infrastructure IS the problem.
I didn't say that.And since you libbys squawk about Verizon being bid against by Musk, >>>>>>> consider that a critical bat phone line between the FAA and the PentagonWhat makes you think that line was part of Verizon's contract?
was not working for 2 years.
Learn to read.
Since the Verizon connection was a PHONE LINE VOICE, that was down for 2 years
it obviously had nothing to do with wires burning up.
You fail.
<https://www.verizon.com/about/news/verizon-public-sector-wins-federal-aviation-administration-fens-contract>
Nothing about phone lines there...
I don't think I posted that but however here is a link:
<https://www.npr.org/2025/05/14/nx-s1-5398581/hotline-dca-airport-pentagon-disconnected-army>
No evidence that it was part of any Verizon contract.
Did you read the article I provided?
I never said it was.
That was YOUR assumption.
And either way it does not matter.
Point is, a critical line of communication was broken for TWO YEARS!
Where was Pothole Pete?
On 5/19/25 3:07 PM, Alan wrote:
On 2025-05-19 11:53, Yak wrote:
On 5/19/25 1:58 PM, Alan wrote:
On 2025-05-19 10:43, Yak wrote:
On 5/19/25 12:23 PM, Alan wrote:....
On 2025-05-19 06:52, Yak wrote:
On 5/17/25 1:32 PM, Alan wrote:
On 2025-05-17 10:32, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <116564867.769193901.182918.recscuba_google-
huntzinger.com@news.eternal-september.org>,
recscuba_google@huntzinger.com says...
[snip]
Those are facts.
You CLAIM that there have been outages before and IMPLY that nothing
has changed.
The only one implying anything is you.
False.
Saying "it's happened before" necessarily implies things aren't
different now.
Only to you.
In article <100fltt$1n2od$2@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-19 09:18, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <100ah87$gd6e$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-uh@nope.com
says...
No, there are many qualified.
On 2025-05-17 10:32, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <116564867.769193901.182918.recscuba_google-
huntzinger.com@news.eternal-september.org>,
recscuba_google@huntzinger.com says...
Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-17 06:19, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008kqb$vnt$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-uh@nope.com
says...
On 2025-05-16 16:47, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008chb$3v4st$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 14:49, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008b3f$3v4u8$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-Does it happen all the time? Really?
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 05:09, Yak wrote:
On 5/15/25 9:12 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 14:25, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 2:03 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 13:51, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 12:04 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 14:34, Yak wrote:
On 5/13/25 1:17 PM, Governor Swill wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Tue, 13 May 2025 09:32:44 -0400, Yak <Yak@inbox.com> wrote:
On 5/13/25 8:54 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 08:15, Yak wrote:Between 2-4.
On 5/12/25 4:24 PM, -hh wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> email.me:
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly wasn't >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> controllers.
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Just wait until this summer when >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the travel surge hits and airport after >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> airport closes for lack of ATC personel. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The ones Trump fired.
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they were sick of this shit they should get >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> their corps to pressure the govt. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Try DOGE.
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> period. That's THE hub. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sabotage here - maybe Vlad ??? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's contract with
Verizon
which was a systems upgrade ... >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
So much winning! >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
The ones who maintain the gear that's now breaking down.
Such breakdowns happened in the past as well, even as >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> recently as late
2024.
Yes, failures happen ... but at this same failure rate? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
How many ATC outages did EWR have in total all of 2024? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
You're guessing, am I right?
Nope.
Then where's the dates of said outages, preferably with cites?
Plus note that 3 known outages to date in 2025 is a ~3x higher
rate of critical failures than this alleged "2-4" over 12 months
of 2024.
Newark (EWR), September 2, 2024 (Labor Day): A radar and radio
outage at Philadelphia TRACON. https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/
local/newark- flights-delays-radar-issue-faa/5757083/ Also >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> reported by The Air Current and CNN.
Philadelphia TRACON, November 6, 2024: Another equipment outage,
including radar and radio failures.https://www.youtube.com/watch?
v=aj7RJxUIs3I&ab_channel=VASAviation-
Oakland Air Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February
22, 2024: outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center.Oakland Air
Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February 22, 2024:
outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center
Miami and Jacksonville ARTCC Outages: unscheduled cooperative radar
outage. https://www.faa.gov/newsroom/radar-modernization-proposal
These don't include several unreported potential outages as they
were routine or low-impact, reinforcing that only significant
disruptions gain media attention.
That's five ... but it is also from a nationwide search. We know
that there's 3 just from EWR in 2025 .. what about the rest of the
country?
So now we're moving the goalposts.
Where that move was your's, buy citing 2024 failures beyond EWR.
I'm fine with casting a broader net but since you're protesting your
own goalpost move attempt, fine! Thus, your comparison attempt has
found *zero* EWR failures in 2024, compared to 3 (so far) in 2025.
Nope, I was asked to provide other instances of outages in 2024. There
was no requirement to limit it to Newark (although it was the subject of
one of them).
My whole point is that you all are acting like these outages are >>>>>>>>>>>>>> something new. They aren't
Then let's look at little more at 2025, shall we?
To the three in Newark, let's add:
February 2025, Oakland:
<https://www.aerotime.aero/articles/oakland-air-traffic-control-disruption>
May 16, 2025, Denver:
<https://www.aeronewsjournal.com/2025/05/denver-air-traffic-control-outage.html>
It happenes all the time. They want to make it public now. >>>>>>>>>>>
Yup, Did you notice you only started hearing about them
after the libs got butthurt.
Then you'll have no problem pointing out all the times it's happened. >>>>>>>>>
:-)
Read the news moron.
So you can't point out any incidents.
Got it.
He was never going to, because he?s afraid of what it may reveal.
It was obvious from his libs butthurt bit .. even though a third of US air
traffic goes thru the NYC metro airspace daily?
-hh
I am still right. It's only news now because you want to
blame Trump and Musk.
And you don't think firing hundreds of FAA workers played any role, huh? >>>
You know that, do you?
How?
I live here.
On 2025-05-19, Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-19 16:46, pothead wrote:
The infrastructure is from the stone age.And again:
Wires burning up was the cause of the Newark mess.
Do you think firing maintenance staff made that situation better or worse. >>> And again, your proof that critical maintenance staff was fired is?
You're kidding.
Try to keep up:
'The terminated FAA employees included workers who assist FAA
technicians administratively and logistically, according to David Spero,
national president of the Professional Aviation Safety Specialists, a
union that represents about 11,000 FAA and Defense Department employees
who support air traffic controllers.
Key word ASSIST.
Also known as gophers.
He said environmental compliance workers, aeronautical information
specialists and maintenance mechanics responsible for the upkeep of
grounds, roads and facilities were among those fired.'
<https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2025/02/17/faa-workers-fired-trump-plane-helicopter-collision/78956241007/>
Enviornmental compliance workers?
ROTFLMAO!
so green new scam BS employees.
'The impacted workers include personnel hired for FAA radar, landing and
navigational aid maintenance, one air traffic controller told The
Associated Press. The air traffic controller was not authorized to talk
to the media and spoke on condition of anonymity.'
<https://apnews.com/article/doge-faa-air-traffic-firings-safety-67981aec33b6ee72cbad8dcee31f3437>
Was his ATC station broken?
The reason he was not allowed to talk to the media was because the FAA did not want
the facts that the ATC system is antique leaked.
Sorry but maintenance is NOT the problem.
Infrastructure IS the problem.
Well?Where was Pothole Pete?
Implementing DEI policies that's where.
You have presented no evidence of DEI policies having anything to do
with it.
I didn't say it did.
I stated that Pothole Pete's focus was NOT on infrastructure.
However, now that you mention it:
<https://www.foxnews.com/us/faas-diversity-push-includes-focus-hiring-people-severe-intellectual-psychiatric-disabilities>
Look ... the WokieComs have chosen the tact to BURY
the past. NEVER HAPPENED ...
On 5/19/25 20:13, pothead wrote:
On 2025-05-19, Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-19 16:46, pothead wrote:
And again, your proof that critical maintenance staff was fired is?The infrastructure is from the stone age.And again:
Wires burning up was the cause of the Newark mess.
Do you think firing maintenance staff made that situation better or worse.
You're kidding.
Try to keep up:
'The terminated FAA employees included workers who assist FAA
technicians administratively and logistically, according to David Spero, >>> national president of the Professional Aviation Safety Specialists, a
union that represents about 11,000 FAA and Defense Department employees
who support air traffic controllers.
Key word ASSIST.
Also known as gophers.
As well as the people who make sure to always have spare parts in
inventory for when the techs call in at 3am...
He said environmental compliance workers, aeronautical information
specialists and maintenance mechanics responsible for the upkeep of
grounds, roads and facilities were among those fired.'
<https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2025/02/17/faa-workers-fired-trump-plane-helicopter-collision/78956241007/>
Enviornmental compliance workers?
ROTFLMAO!
so green new scam BS employees.
Nope: you've clearly never had to handle or dispose (legally) of old industrial capacitors, whose fluids contained PCP's.
'The impacted workers include personnel hired for FAA radar, landing and >>> navigational aid maintenance, one air traffic controller told The
Associated Press. The air traffic controller was not authorized to talk
to the media and spoke on condition of anonymity.'
<https://apnews.com/article/doge-faa-air-traffic-firings-safety-67981aec33b6ee72cbad8dcee31f3437>
Was his ATC station broken?
The reason he was not allowed to talk to the media was because the FAA did not want
the facts that the ATC system is antique leaked.
Sorry but maintenance is NOT the problem.
It is a problem when you fire those who provision the replacement parts.
Infrastructure IS the problem.
And per the above: "...workers...responsible for the upkeep of...
facilities were among those fired.'"
^^^^^^^^^^
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^Well?Where was Pothole Pete?
Implementing DEI policies that's where.
You have presented no evidence of DEI policies having anything to do
with it.
I didn't say it did.
I stated that Pothole Pete's focus was NOT on infrastructure.
However, now that you mention it:
<https://www.foxnews.com/us/faas-diversity-push-includes-focus-hiring-people-severe-intellectual-psychiatric-disabilities>
So? Hiring the mentally disabled for things like cleaning crews has
been around for ~twenty years. I think I read somewhere that there's a
tax break for businesses, and it helps those members of society have
some semblance of a life. Or of course you could just do the Nazi thing
and send them to the gas chamber.
-hh
On 2025-05-19 18:31, pothead wrote:
On 2025-05-20, Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-19 17:13, pothead wrote:
On 2025-05-19, Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-19 16:46, pothead wrote:
You're kidding.And again, your proof that critical maintenance staff was fired is? >>>>>The infrastructure is from the stone age.And again:
Wires burning up was the cause of the Newark mess.
Do you think firing maintenance staff made that situation better or worse.
Try to keep up:
'The terminated FAA employees included workers who assist FAA
technicians administratively and logistically, according to David Spero, >>>>> national president of the Professional Aviation Safety Specialists, a >>>>> union that represents about 11,000 FAA and Defense Department employees >>>>> who support air traffic controllers.
Key word ASSIST.
Also known as gophers.
He said environmental compliance workers, aeronautical information
specialists and maintenance mechanics responsible for the upkeep of
grounds, roads and facilities were among those fired.'
<https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2025/02/17/faa-workers-fired-trump-plane-helicopter-collision/78956241007/>
Enviornmental compliance workers?
ROTFLMAO!
so green new scam BS employees.
Upkeep of grounds?
Really?
So pretty bushes help the planes to land..
Hahahahahha!
'The impacted workers include personnel hired for FAA radar, landing and >>>>> navigational aid maintenance, one air traffic controller told The
Associated Press. The air traffic controller was not authorized to talk >>>>> to the media and spoke on condition of anonymity.'
<https://apnews.com/article/doge-faa-air-traffic-firings-safety-67981aec33b6ee72cbad8dcee31f3437>
Was his ATC station broken?
The reason he was not allowed to talk to the media was because the FAA did not want
the facts that the ATC system is antique leaked.
Sorry but maintenance is NOT the problem.
Infrastructure IS the problem.
I didn't say that.And since you libbys squawk about Verizon being bid against by Musk, >>>>>>>> consider that a critical bat phone line between the FAA and the PentagonWhat makes you think that line was part of Verizon's contract?
was not working for 2 years.
Learn to read.
Since the Verizon connection was a PHONE LINE VOICE, that was down for 2 years
it obviously had nothing to do with wires burning up.
You fail.
<https://www.verizon.com/about/news/verizon-public-sector-wins-federal-aviation-administration-fens-contract>
Nothing about phone lines there...
I don't think I posted that but however here is a link:
<https://www.npr.org/2025/05/14/nx-s1-5398581/hotline-dca-airport-pentagon-disconnected-army>
No evidence that it was part of any Verizon contract.
Did you read the article I provided?
I never said it was.
That was YOUR assumption.
And either way it does not matter.
Really?
You didn't say this:
'Since the Verizon connection was a PHONE LINE VOICE, that was down for
2 years it obviously had nothing to do with wires burning up.'
Let's talk about what you just snipped:
Point is, a critical line of communication was broken for TWO YEARS!
Where was Pothole Pete?
Let's just boil down the rest. The FAA employees who were fired were:
59 employees from FAA Technical Operations
19 employees from FAA Mission Support Services (all aeronautical
information specialists we believe)
15 employees from FAA Air Traffic Services
39 employees from FAA Flight Standards Service
management and program analyst
management and program assistant
aviation safety assistant
legal instruments examiner
flight operations program specialist
aeronautical information specialist
environmental protection specialist
maintenance mechanic
telecommunications specialist
<https://www.avweb.com/aviation-news/employees-cut-include-systems-specialists-safety-inspectors-maintenance-mechanics-and-administrative-staff/>
A lot of those seem pretty important.
On 2025-05-19 15:19, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <100fltt$1n2od$2@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-19 09:18, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <100ah87$gd6e$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-uh@nope.com
says...
No, there are many qualified.
On 2025-05-17 10:32, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <116564867.769193901.182918.recscuba_google-
huntzinger.com@news.eternal-september.org>,
recscuba_google@huntzinger.com says...
Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-17 06:19, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008kqb$vnt$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-uh@nope.com
says...
On 2025-05-16 16:47, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008chb$3v4st$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 14:49, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008b3f$3v4u8$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-Does it happen all the time? Really?
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 05:09, Yak wrote:
On 5/15/25 9:12 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 14:25, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 2:03 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 13:51, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 12:04 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 14:34, Yak wrote:
On 5/13/25 1:17 PM, Governor Swill wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Tue, 13 May 2025 09:32:44 -0400, Yak <Yak@inbox.com> wrote:
On 5/13/25 8:54 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 08:15, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 4:24 PM, -hh wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> email.me:
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly wasn't
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Just wait until this summer when >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the travel surge hits and airport after >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> airport closes for lack of ATC personel. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The ones Trump fired.
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they were sick of this shit they should get >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> their corps to pressure the govt. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Try DOGE.
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> period. That's THE hub. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sabotage here - maybe Vlad ??? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's contract with
Verizon
which was a systems upgrade ... >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
So much winning! >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
controllers.
The ones who maintain the gear that's now breaking down.
Such breakdowns happened in the past as well, even as
recently as late
2024.
Yes, failures happen ... but at this same failure rate?
How many ATC outages did EWR have in total all of 2024?
Between 2-4.
You're guessing, am I right?
Nope.
Then where's the dates of said outages, preferably with cites?
Plus note that 3 known outages to date in 2025 is a ~3x higher
rate of critical failures than this alleged "2-4" over 12 months
of 2024.
Newark (EWR), September 2, 2024 (Labor Day): A radar and radio
outage at Philadelphia TRACON. https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/
local/newark- flights-delays-radar-issue-faa/5757083/ Also
reported by The Air Current and CNN.
Philadelphia TRACON, November 6, 2024: Another equipment outage,
including radar and radio failures.https://www.youtube.com/watch?
v=aj7RJxUIs3I&ab_channel=VASAviation-
Oakland Air Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February
22, 2024: outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center.Oakland Air
Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February 22, 2024:
outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Miami and Jacksonville ARTCC Outages: unscheduled cooperative radar
outage. https://www.faa.gov/newsroom/radar-modernization-proposal
These don't include several unreported potential outages as they
were routine or low-impact, reinforcing that only significant
disruptions gain media attention.
That's five ... but it is also from a nationwide search. We know
that there's 3 just from EWR in 2025 .. what about the rest of the
country?
So now we're moving the goalposts.
Where that move was your's, buy citing 2024 failures beyond EWR.
I'm fine with casting a broader net but since you're protesting your
own goalpost move attempt, fine! Thus, your comparison attempt has
found *zero* EWR failures in 2024, compared to 3 (so far) in 2025.
Nope, I was asked to provide other instances of outages in 2024. There
was no requirement to limit it to Newark (although it was the subject of
one of them).
My whole point is that you all are acting like these outages are
something new. They aren't
Then let's look at little more at 2025, shall we?
To the three in Newark, let's add:
February 2025, Oakland:
<https://www.aerotime.aero/articles/oakland-air-traffic-control-disruption>
May 16, 2025, Denver:
<https://www.aeronewsjournal.com/2025/05/denver-air-traffic-control-outage.html>
It happenes all the time. They want to make it public now. >>>>>>>>>>>
Yup, Did you notice you only started hearing about them
after the libs got butthurt.
Then you'll have no problem pointing out all the times it's happened.
:-)
Read the news moron.
So you can't point out any incidents.
Got it.
He was never going to, because he?s afraid of what it may reveal. >>>>>>
It was obvious from his libs butthurt bit .. even though a third of US air
traffic goes thru the NYC metro airspace daily?
-hh
I am still right. It's only news now because you want to
blame Trump and Musk.
And you don't think firing hundreds of FAA workers played any role, huh? >>>
You know that, do you?
How?
I live here.
You live everywhere there are FAA technicians?
Wow!
On 5/19/25 18:19, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <100fltt$1n2od$2@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-19 09:18, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <100ah87$gd6e$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-uh@nope.com
says...
No, there are many qualified.
On 2025-05-17 10:32, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <116564867.769193901.182918.recscuba_google-
huntzinger.com@news.eternal-september.org>,
recscuba_google@huntzinger.com says...
Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-17 06:19, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008kqb$vnt$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-uh@nope.com
says...
On 2025-05-16 16:47, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008chb$3v4st$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 14:49, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008b3f$3v4u8$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-Does it happen all the time? Really?
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 05:09, Yak wrote:
On 5/15/25 9:12 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 14:25, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 2:03 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 13:51, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 12:04 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 14:34, Yak wrote:
On 5/13/25 1:17 PM, Governor Swill wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Tue, 13 May 2025 09:32:44 -0400, Yak <Yak@inbox.com> wrote:
On 5/13/25 8:54 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 08:15, Yak wrote:
On 5/12/25 4:24 PM, -hh wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> email.me:
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly wasn't
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Just wait until this summer when >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the travel surge hits and airport after >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> airport closes for lack of ATC personel. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The ones Trump fired.
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they were sick of this shit they should get >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> their corps to pressure the govt. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Try DOGE.
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> period. That's THE hub. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sabotage here - maybe Vlad ??? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's contract with
Verizon
which was a systems upgrade ... >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
So much winning! >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
controllers.
The ones who maintain the gear that's now breaking down.
Such breakdowns happened in the past as well, even as
recently as late
2024.
Yes, failures happen ... but at this same failure rate?
How many ATC outages did EWR have in total all of 2024?
Between 2-4.
You're guessing, am I right?
Nope.
Then where's the dates of said outages, preferably with cites?
Plus note that 3 known outages to date in 2025 is a ~3x higher
rate of critical failures than this alleged "2-4" over 12 months
of 2024.
Newark (EWR), September 2, 2024 (Labor Day): A radar and radio
outage at Philadelphia TRACON. https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/
local/newark- flights-delays-radar-issue-faa/5757083/ Also
reported by The Air Current and CNN.
Philadelphia TRACON, November 6, 2024: Another equipment outage,
including radar and radio failures.https://www.youtube.com/watch?
v=aj7RJxUIs3I&ab_channel=VASAviation-
Oakland Air Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February
22, 2024: outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center.Oakland Air
Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February 22, 2024:
outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Miami and Jacksonville ARTCC Outages: unscheduled cooperative radar
outage. https://www.faa.gov/newsroom/radar-modernization-proposal
These don't include several unreported potential outages as they
were routine or low-impact, reinforcing that only significant
disruptions gain media attention.
That's five ... but it is also from a nationwide search. We know
that there's 3 just from EWR in 2025 .. what about the rest of the
country?
So now we're moving the goalposts.
Where that move was your's, buy citing 2024 failures beyond EWR.
I'm fine with casting a broader net but since you're protesting your
own goalpost move attempt, fine! Thus, your comparison attempt has
found *zero* EWR failures in 2024, compared to 3 (so far) in 2025.
Nope, I was asked to provide other instances of outages in 2024. There
was no requirement to limit it to Newark (although it was the subject of
one of them).
My whole point is that you all are acting like these outages are
something new. They aren't
Then let's look at little more at 2025, shall we?
To the three in Newark, let's add:
February 2025, Oakland:
<https://www.aerotime.aero/articles/oakland-air-traffic-control-disruption>
May 16, 2025, Denver:
<https://www.aeronewsjournal.com/2025/05/denver-air-traffic-control-outage.html>
It happenes all the time. They want to make it public now. >>>>>>>>>>>
Yup, Did you notice you only started hearing about them
after the libs got butthurt.
Then you'll have no problem pointing out all the times it's happened.
:-)
Read the news moron.
So you can't point out any incidents.
Got it.
He was never going to, because he?s afraid of what it may reveal. >>>>>>
It was obvious from his libs butthurt bit .. even though a third of US air
traffic goes thru the NYC metro airspace daily?
-hh
I am still right. It's only news now because you want to
blame Trump and Musk.
And you don't think firing hundreds of FAA workers played any role, huh? >>>
You know that, do you?
How?
I live here.
You live in Newark, NJ?
-hh
On 2025-05-20, -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote:
On 5/19/25 20:13, pothead wrote:
On 2025-05-19, Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-19 16:46, pothead wrote:
And again, your proof that critical maintenance staff was fired is?The infrastructure is from the stone age.And again:
Wires burning up was the cause of the Newark mess.
Do you think firing maintenance staff made that situation better or worse.
You're kidding.
Try to keep up:
'The terminated FAA employees included workers who assist FAA
technicians administratively and logistically, according to David Spero, >>>> national president of the Professional Aviation Safety Specialists, a
union that represents about 11,000 FAA and Defense Department employees >>>> who support air traffic controllers.
Key word ASSIST.
Also known as gophers.
As well as the people who make sure to always have spare parts in
inventory for when the techs call in at 3am...
Should be automated by now.
Taking a physical inventory is only needed on occasion to true
up the inventory.
Amazon can tell me where my package currently is, where it's coming from,
and at what time it will be delivered.
He said environmental compliance workers, aeronautical information
specialists and maintenance mechanics responsible for the upkeep of
grounds, roads and facilities were among those fired.'
<https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2025/02/17/faa-workers-fired-trump-plane-helicopter-collision/78956241007/>
Enviornmental compliance workers?
ROTFLMAO!
so green new scam BS employees.
Nope: you've clearly never had to handle or dispose (legally) of old
industrial capacitors, whose fluids contained PCP's.
Actually I have.
And you can add CRT (not THAT CRT) disposal processes to my resume'.
'The impacted workers include personnel hired for FAA radar, landing and >>>> navigational aid maintenance, one air traffic controller told The
Associated Press. The air traffic controller was not authorized to talk >>>> to the media and spoke on condition of anonymity.'
<https://apnews.com/article/doge-faa-air-traffic-firings-safety-67981aec33b6ee72cbad8dcee31f3437>
Was his ATC station broken?
The reason he was not allowed to talk to the media was because the FAA did not want
the facts that the ATC system is antique leaked.
Sorry but maintenance is NOT the problem.
It is a problem when you fire those who provision the replacement parts.
From what I am reading, some critical spare parts need to be obtained from eBay
because they are obsolete and no longer manufactured.
Sounds like a minimum wage/skill level job to me.
ROTFLMAO!
Infrastructure IS the problem.
And per the above: "...workers...responsible for the upkeep of...
facilities were among those fired.'"
^^^^^^^^^^
Duplication of services.
Incompetence.
Poor reviews.
etc.
Up until DOGE, it was darn near impossible to get fired from a federal job.
And how many were fired in comparison to how many remained in those roles?
I have a problem with ATC trainees being given the answers to critical exams because
they are not intelligent enough to learn the material.
And just because they are DEI hires. <https://www.dailymail.co.uk/video/news/video-3386099/DEI-activist-heard-offering-answers-air-traffic-control-entry-exam.html>
In article <100hlj4$1q765$4@dont-email.me>,
recscuba_google@huntzinger.com says...
On 5/19/25 18:19, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <100fltt$1n2od$2@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-19 09:18, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <100ah87$gd6e$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-uh@nope.com
says...
No, there are many qualified.
On 2025-05-17 10:32, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <116564867.769193901.182918.recscuba_google-
huntzinger.com@news.eternal-september.org>,
recscuba_google@huntzinger.com says...
Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-17 06:19, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008kqb$vnt$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-uh@nope.com
says...
On 2025-05-16 16:47, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008chb$3v4st$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 14:49, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008b3f$3v4u8$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-Does it happen all the time? Really?
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 05:09, Yak wrote:
On 5/15/25 9:12 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 14:25, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 2:03 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 13:51, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 12:04 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 14:34, Yak wrote:
On 5/13/25 1:17 PM, Governor Swill wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Tue, 13 May 2025 09:32:44 -0400, Yak <Yak@inbox.com> wrote:
On 5/13/25 8:54 AM, -hh wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 5/13/25 08:15, Yak wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 5/12/25 4:24 PM, -hh wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> email.me:
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly wasn't
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Just wait until this summer when >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the travel surge hits and airport after >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> airport closes for lack of ATC personel. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The ones Trump fired. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they were sick of this shit they should get >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> their corps to pressure the govt. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Try DOGE.
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> period. That's THE hub. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sabotage here - maybe Vlad ??? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's contract with
Verizon
which was a systems upgrade ... >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
So much winning! >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
controllers.
The ones who maintain the gear that's now breaking down.
Such breakdowns happened in the past as well, even as
recently as late
2024.
Yes, failures happen ... but at this same failure rate?
How many ATC outages did EWR have in total all of 2024?
Between 2-4.
You're guessing, am I right?
Nope.
Then where's the dates of said outages, preferably with cites?
Plus note that 3 known outages to date in 2025 is a ~3x higher
rate of critical failures than this alleged "2-4" over 12 months
of 2024.
Newark (EWR), September 2, 2024 (Labor Day): A radar and radio
outage at Philadelphia TRACON. https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/
local/newark- flights-delays-radar-issue-faa/5757083/ Also
reported by The Air Current and CNN.
Philadelphia TRACON, November 6, 2024: Another equipment outage,
including radar and radio failures.https://www.youtube.com/watch?
v=aj7RJxUIs3I&ab_channel=VASAviation-
Oakland Air Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February
22, 2024: outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center.Oakland Air
Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February 22, 2024:
outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Miami and Jacksonville ARTCC Outages: unscheduled cooperative radar
outage. https://www.faa.gov/newsroom/radar-modernization-proposal
These don't include several unreported potential outages as they
were routine or low-impact, reinforcing that only significant
disruptions gain media attention.
That's five ... but it is also from a nationwide search. We know
that there's 3 just from EWR in 2025 .. what about the rest of the
country?
So now we're moving the goalposts.
Where that move was your's, buy citing 2024 failures beyond EWR.
I'm fine with casting a broader net but since you're protesting your
own goalpost move attempt, fine! Thus, your comparison attempt has
found *zero* EWR failures in 2024, compared to 3 (so far) in 2025.
Nope, I was asked to provide other instances of outages in 2024. There
was no requirement to limit it to Newark (although it was the subject of
one of them).
My whole point is that you all are acting like these outages are
something new. They aren't
Then let's look at little more at 2025, shall we? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
To the three in Newark, let's add:
February 2025, Oakland:
<https://www.aerotime.aero/articles/oakland-air-traffic-control-disruption>
May 16, 2025, Denver:
<https://www.aeronewsjournal.com/2025/05/denver-air-traffic-control-outage.html>
It happenes all the time. They want to make it public now. >>>>>>>>>>>>>
Yup, Did you notice you only started hearing about them >>>>>>>>>>>> after the libs got butthurt.
Then you'll have no problem pointing out all the times it's happened.
:-)
Read the news moron.
So you can't point out any incidents.
Got it.
He was never going to, because he?s afraid of what it may reveal. >>>>>>>>
It was obvious from his libs butthurt bit .. even though a third of US air
traffic goes thru the NYC metro airspace daily?
-hh
I am still right. It's only news now because you want to
blame Trump and Musk.
And you don't think firing hundreds of FAA workers played any role, huh? >>>>>
You know that, do you?
How?
I live here.
You live in Newark, NJ?
-hh
Is that the only airport there is?
On 5/20/25 09:38, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <100hlj4$1q765$4@dont-email.me>,
recscuba_google@huntzinger.com says...
On 5/19/25 18:19, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <100fltt$1n2od$2@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-19 09:18, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <100ah87$gd6e$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-uh@nope.com
says...
On 2025-05-17 10:32, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <116564867.769193901.182918.recscuba_google-
huntzinger.com@news.eternal-september.org>,
recscuba_google@huntzinger.com says...
Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-17 06:19, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008kqb$vnt$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-uh@nope.com >>>>>>>>>> says...
On 2025-05-16 16:47, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008chb$3v4st$1@dont-email.me>, nuh-
uh@nope.com says...
On 2025-05-16 14:49, Skeeter OG wrote:
In article <1008b3f$3v4u8$1@dont-email.me>, nuh- >>>>>>>>>>>>>> uh@nope.com says...Does it happen all the time? Really?
On 2025-05-16 05:09, Yak wrote:
On 5/15/25 9:12 AM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 14:25, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 2:03 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/14/25 13:51, Yak wrote:
On 5/14/25 12:04 PM, -hh wrote:
On 5/13/25 14:34, Yak wrote:
On 5/13/25 1:17 PM, Governor Swill wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Tue, 13 May 2025 09:32:44 -0400, Yak <Yak@inbox.com> wrote:
On 5/13/25 8:54 AM, -hh wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 5/13/25 08:15, Yak wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 5/12/25 4:24 PM, -hh wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 5/12/25 09:43, Yak wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 5/12/25 9:09 AM, Mitchell Holman wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> news:vvsoqb$fg2n$40@dont- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> email.me:
Which ATC personnel were fired? It certainly wasn't
On 5/11/25 22:23, c186282 wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> This is at least the 3rd time in barely a week.Just wait until this summer when >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the travel surge hits and airport after >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> airport closes for lack of ATC personel. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The ones Trump fired. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Try DOGE.
One ATC was heard telling the planes that if >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they were sick of this shit they should get >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> their corps to pressure the govt. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
NO ... do NOT think she should be fired in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> this case. This is getting DANGEROUS and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> any pressure from anywhere IS gonna be >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> needed to get fixes funded and rolling fast. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Also, ATLANTA went down hard for a longer >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> period. That's THE hub. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Kinda wonder if we're seeing deliberate >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sabotage here - maybe Vlad ??? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Elon's already pulled the plug on the FAA's contract with
Verizon
which was a systems upgrade ... >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
So much winning! >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
controllers.
The ones who maintain the gear that's now breaking down.
Such breakdowns happened in the past as well, even as
recently as late
2024.
Yes, failures happen ... but at this same failure rate?
How many ATC outages did EWR have in total all of 2024?
Between 2-4.
You're guessing, am I right?
Nope.
Then where's the dates of said outages, preferably with cites?
Plus note that 3 known outages to date in 2025 is a ~3x higher
rate of critical failures than this alleged "2-4" over 12 months
of 2024.
Newark (EWR), September 2, 2024 (Labor Day): A radar and radio
outage at Philadelphia TRACON. https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/
local/newark- flights-delays-radar-issue-faa/5757083/ Also
reported by The Air Current and CNN. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Philadelphia TRACON, November 6, 2024: Another equipment outage,
including radar and radio failures.https://www.youtube.com/watch?
v=aj7RJxUIs3I&ab_channel=VASAviation- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Oakland Air Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February
22, 2024: outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center.Oakland Air
Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) Outage, February 22, 2024:
outage at the Oakland Oceanic ATC Center >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Miami and Jacksonville ARTCC Outages: unscheduled cooperative radar
outage. https://www.faa.gov/newsroom/radar-modernization-proposal
These don't include several unreported potential outages as they
were routine or low-impact, reinforcing that only significant
disruptions gain media attention.
That's five ... but it is also from a nationwide search. We know
that there's 3 just from EWR in 2025 .. what about the rest of the
country?
So now we're moving the goalposts.
Where that move was your's, buy citing 2024 failures beyond EWR.
I'm fine with casting a broader net but since you're protesting your
own goalpost move attempt, fine! Thus, your comparison attempt has
found *zero* EWR failures in 2024, compared to 3 (so far) in 2025.
Nope, I was asked to provide other instances of outages in 2024. There
was no requirement to limit it to Newark (although it was the subject of
one of them).
My whole point is that you all are acting like these outages are
something new. They aren't
Then let's look at little more at 2025, shall we? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
To the three in Newark, let's add:
February 2025, Oakland:
<https://www.aerotime.aero/articles/oakland-air-traffic-control-disruption>
May 16, 2025, Denver:
<https://www.aeronewsjournal.com/2025/05/denver-air-traffic-control-outage.html>
It happenes all the time. They want to make it public now. >>>>>>>>>>>>>
Yup, Did you notice you only started hearing about them >>>>>>>>>>>> after the libs got butthurt.
Then you'll have no problem pointing out all the times it's happened.
:-)
Read the news moron.
So you can't point out any incidents.
Got it.
He was never going to, because he?s afraid of what it may reveal. >>>>>>>>
It was obvious from his libs butthurt bit .. even though a third of US air
traffic goes thru the NYC metro airspace daily?
-hh
I am still right. It's only news now because you want to
blame Trump and Musk.
And you don't think firing hundreds of FAA workers played any role, huh?
No, there are many qualified.
You know that, do you?
How?
I live here.
You live in Newark, NJ?
-hh
Is that the only airport there is?
Newark is in the subject line, is it not?
-hh
On 5/20/25 08:37, pothead wrote:
On 2025-05-20, -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote:
On 5/19/25 20:13, pothead wrote:
On 2025-05-19, Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-19 16:46, pothead wrote:
You're kidding.And again, your proof that critical maintenance staff was fired is? >>>>>The infrastructure is from the stone age.And again:
Wires burning up was the cause of the Newark mess.
Do you think firing maintenance staff made that situation better or worse.
Try to keep up:
'The terminated FAA employees included workers who assist FAA
technicians administratively and logistically, according to David Spero, >>>>> national president of the Professional Aviation Safety Specialists, a >>>>> union that represents about 11,000 FAA and Defense Department employees >>>>> who support air traffic controllers.
Key word ASSIST.
Also known as gophers.
As well as the people who make sure to always have spare parts in
inventory for when the techs call in at 3am...
Should be automated by now.
How long have you had automated grocery delivery items to keep your refrigerator stocked? We "should" have had that by now too.
Likewise, the FAA is reliant on Congress to authorize funding to make
such system upgrades. We know that the GOP has killed that repeatedly,
such as in 2019, so so much as we would like to say "should" we know
that it isn't, so firing the staff who was doing this workflow before it
gets replaced is deliberate & malicious sabotage of public services.
Taking a physical inventory is only needed on occasion to true
up the inventory.
There's that too, but this is simply having the people in the department
who track consumption to whatever degree and order the needed spares. Otherwise, the shelves run dry no matter how much (if at all) you
conduct physical inventories of them.
Amazon can tell me where my package currently is, where it's coming from,
and at what time it will be delivered.
Which is sometimes actually correct.
He said environmental compliance workers, aeronautical information
specialists and maintenance mechanics responsible for the upkeep of
grounds, roads and facilities were among those fired.'
<https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2025/02/17/faa-workers-fired-trump-plane-helicopter-collision/78956241007/>
Enviornmental compliance workers?
ROTFLMAO!
so green new scam BS employees.
Nope: you've clearly never had to handle or dispose (legally) of old
industrial capacitors, whose fluids contained PCP's.
Actually I have.
LOL, then why did you try to disregard compliance? You dumped them illegally, no doubt.
And you can add CRT (not THAT CRT) disposal processes to my resume'.
Same: dumped illegally.
'The impacted workers include personnel hired for FAA radar, landing and >>>>> navigational aid maintenance, one air traffic controller told The
Associated Press. The air traffic controller was not authorized to talk >>>>> to the media and spoke on condition of anonymity.'
<https://apnews.com/article/doge-faa-air-traffic-firings-safety-67981aec33b6ee72cbad8dcee31f3437>
Was his ATC station broken?
The reason he was not allowed to talk to the media was because the FAA did not want
the facts that the ATC system is antique leaked.
Sorry but maintenance is NOT the problem.
It is a problem when you fire those who provision the replacement parts.
From what I am reading, some critical spare parts need to be obtained from eBay
because they are obsolete and no longer manufactured.
Sounds like a minimum wage/skill level job to me.
The pay level doesn't matter, because without someone doing the work, it doesn't get done, and breakdowns can't be fixed.
ROTFLMAO!
Infrastructure IS the problem.
And per the above: "...workers...responsible for the upkeep of...
facilities were among those fired.'"
^^^^^^^^^^
Duplication of services.
Redundancy may be justified to achieve the system uptime reliability needed.
Incompetence.
Poor reviews.
etc.
More vague hand-waiving of innuendo lacking substance.
Up until DOGE, it was darn near impossible to get fired from a federal job.
Bullshit. I've seen Feds in the office get fired for nonperformance
long before DOGE existed.
And how many were fired in comparison to how many remained in those roles?
Great question, since you're who's trying to justify every individual
fired as having been incompetent: so what's the answer?
I have a problem with ATC trainees being given the answers to critical exams because
they are not intelligent enough to learn the material.
No, that's your assumption of what's happening: how many actual USAJOBS applications have you yourself personally processed?
And just because they are DEI hires.
<https://www.dailymail.co.uk/video/news/video-3386099/DEI-activist-heard-offering-answers-air-traffic-control-entry-exam.html>
Nope. Because if you actually knew how the sausage is made, you'd know
where it is broken and if you had anyone trying to apply, you'd offer
them any & all tips you knew to get them past the bullshit gates.
For example, back in 2019 I suggested a friend apply for a position and
they declined my offer of application coaching ... and they failed at
the first gate. When we discussed it, I gave them a proverbial slap
upside the head because on a language requirement they gave themselves
only a 3 on a 1-5 scale instead of 5, because the requirement was a "do
you have proficiency?", and they downgraded their score because they
knew that their proficiency was high, but that a local could determine
that they weren't a fellow local (ie, they'd have an accent).
This is an example of where honest high proficiency candidates do get themselves excluded because they hold themselves to a higher standard.
-hh
On 2025-05-20, Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-19 18:31, pothead wrote:
On 2025-05-20, Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-19 17:13, pothead wrote:
On 2025-05-19, Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-19 16:46, pothead wrote:
The infrastructure is from the stone age.
Wires burning up was the cause of the Newark mess.
Since the Verizon connection was a PHONE LINE VOICE, that was down for 2 years
it obviously had nothing to do with wires burning up.
You fail.
<https://www.verizon.com/about/news/verizon-public-sector-wins-federal-aviation-administration-fens-contract>
Nothing about phone lines there...
I don't think I posted that but however here is a link:
<https://www.npr.org/2025/05/14/nx-s1-5398581/hotline-dca-airport-pentagon-disconnected-army>
No evidence that it was part of any Verizon contract.
Did you read the article I provided?
I never said it was.
That was YOUR assumption.
And either way it does not matter.
Really?
You didn't say this:
'Since the Verizon connection was a PHONE LINE VOICE, that was down for
2 years it obviously had nothing to do with wires burning up.'
I never said it did.
Two different events, both showing a deterioration of equipment due to age.
Stop putting words in my mouth.
And I've never said that they weren't.Let's talk about what you just snipped:
Point is, a critical line of communication was broken for TWO YEARS!
Where was Pothole Pete?
Let's just boil down the rest. The FAA employees who were fired were:
59 employees from FAA Technical Operations
19 employees from FAA Mission Support Services (all aeronautical
information specialists we believe)
15 employees from FAA Air Traffic Services
39 employees from FAA Flight Standards Service
management and program analyst
management and program assistant
aviation safety assistant
legal instruments examiner
flight operations program specialist
aeronautical information specialist
environmental protection specialist
maintenance mechanic
telecommunications specialist
<https://www.avweb.com/aviation-news/employees-cut-include-systems-specialists-safety-inspectors-maintenance-mechanics-and-administrative-staff/>
A lot of those seem pretty important.
Maybe.
Maybe redundant.
Maybe obsolete positions. The government is well known for duplication
of positions.
It could be anything but it has nothing to do with an antiquated system
that is so old the people who were experts at maintaining it are retired
or dead.
If you were graduating as an engineer would YOU want to take a job working with equipment, some of which might have been built before you were born?
The failures are due in part to an ancient system.
On 2025-05-20, Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-19 18:31, pothead wrote:
On 2025-05-20, Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-19 17:13, pothead wrote:
...
I don't think I posted that but however here is a link:
<https://www.npr.org/2025/05/14/nx-s1-5398581/hotline-dca-airport-pentagon-disconnected-army>
No evidence that it was part of any Verizon contract.
Did you read the article I provided?
I never said it was.
That was YOUR assumption.
And either way it does not matter.
Really?
You didn't say this:
'Since the Verizon connection was a PHONE LINE VOICE, that was down for
2 years it obviously had nothing to do with wires burning up.'
I never said it did.
Two different events, both showing a deterioration of equipment due to age.
Stop putting words in my mouth.
Point is, a critical line of communication was broken for TWO YEARS!
Where was Pothole Pete?
Let's talk about what you just snipped:
Let's just boil down the rest. The FAA employees who were fired were:
59 employees from FAA Technical Operations
19 employees from FAA Mission Support Services (all aeronautical
information specialists we believe)
15 employees from FAA Air Traffic Services
39 employees from FAA Flight Standards Service
management and program analyst
management and program assistant
aviation safety assistant
legal instruments examiner
flight operations program specialist
aeronautical information specialist
environmental protection specialist
maintenance mechanic
telecommunications specialist
<https://www.avweb.com/aviation-news/employees-cut-include-systems-specialists-safety-inspectors-maintenance-mechanics-and-administrative-staff/>
A lot of those seem pretty important.
Maybe.
Maybe redundant.
Maybe obsolete positions. The government is well known for duplication
of positions.
It could be anything but it has nothing to do with an antiquated system
that is so old the people who were experts at maintaining it are retired
or dead.
If you were graduating as an engineer would YOU want to take a job working with equipment, some of which might have been built before you were born?
The failures are due in part to an ancient system.
On 2025-05-20, -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote:
On 5/20/25 08:37, pothead wrote:
On 2025-05-20, -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote:
On 5/19/25 20:13, pothead wrote:
On 2025-05-19, Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2025-05-19 16:46, pothead wrote:
You're kidding.And again, your proof that critical maintenance staff was fired is? >>>>>>The infrastructure is from the stone age.And again:
Wires burning up was the cause of the Newark mess.
Do you think firing maintenance staff made that situation better or worse.
Try to keep up:
'The terminated FAA employees included workers who assist FAA
technicians administratively and logistically, according to David Spero, >>>>>> national president of the Professional Aviation Safety Specialists, a >>>>>> union that represents about 11,000 FAA and Defense Department employees >>>>>> who support air traffic controllers.
Key word ASSIST.
Also known as gophers.
As well as the people who make sure to always have spare parts in
inventory for when the techs call in at 3am...
Should be automated by now.
How long have you had automated grocery delivery items to keep your
refrigerator stocked? We "should" have had that by now too.
My refrigerator isn't responsible for 400 lives on an aircraft.
But since you brought it up, those refrigerators are for sale now.
See Samsung smart appliances.
Likewise, the FAA is reliant on Congress to authorize funding to make
such system upgrades. We know that the GOP has killed that repeatedly,
such as in 2019, so so much as we would like to say "should" we know
that it isn't, so firing the staff who was doing this workflow before it
gets replaced is deliberate & malicious sabotage of public services.
I disagree.
Trimming waste has been needed for a long time.
And if Trump's FAA modernization plan goes through it will
create plenty of high tech jobs servicing, installing, designing and
so forth MODERN equipment, not something built in the early 1970's.
Taking a physical inventory is only needed on occasion to true
up the inventory.
There's that too, but this is simply having the people in the department
who track consumption to whatever degree and order the needed spares.
Otherwise, the shelves run dry no matter how much (if at all) you
conduct physical inventories of them.
So?
Were ALL of these jobs eliminated?
Amazon can tell me where my package currently is, where it's coming from, >>> and at what time it will be delivered.
Which is sometimes actually correct.
You're grasping at straws again.
He said environmental compliance workers, aeronautical information >>>>>> specialists and maintenance mechanics responsible for the upkeep of >>>>>> grounds, roads and facilities were among those fired.'
<https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2025/02/17/faa-workers-fired-trump-plane-helicopter-collision/78956241007/>
Enviornmental compliance workers?
ROTFLMAO!
so green new scam BS employees.
Nope: you've clearly never had to handle or dispose (legally) of old
industrial capacitors, whose fluids contained PCP's.
Actually I have.
LOL, then why did you try to disregard compliance? You dumped them
illegally, no doubt.
Actually I wasn't responsible for disposal, I just needed to know and understand the regulations.
You make too many false assumptions.
And you can add CRT (not THAT CRT) disposal processes to my resume'.
Same: dumped illegally.
Nope.
From what I am reading, some critical spare parts need to be obtained from eBay'The impacted workers include personnel hired for FAA radar, landing and >>>>>> navigational aid maintenance, one air traffic controller told The
Associated Press. The air traffic controller was not authorized to talk >>>>>> to the media and spoke on condition of anonymity.'
<https://apnews.com/article/doge-faa-air-traffic-firings-safety-67981aec33b6ee72cbad8dcee31f3437>
Was his ATC station broken?
The reason he was not allowed to talk to the media was because the FAA did not want
the facts that the ATC system is antique leaked.
Sorry but maintenance is NOT the problem.
It is a problem when you fire those who provision the replacement parts. >>>
because they are obsolete and no longer manufactured.
Sounds like a minimum wage/skill level job to me.
The pay level doesn't matter, because without someone doing the work, it
doesn't get done, and breakdowns can't be fixed.
ROTFLMAO!
Infrastructure IS the problem.
And per the above: "...workers...responsible for the upkeep of...
facilities were among those fired.'"
^^^^^^^^^^
Duplication of services.
Redundancy may be justified to achieve the system uptime reliability needed. >>
Incompetence.
Poor reviews.
etc.
More vague hand-waiving of innuendo lacking substance.
Up until DOGE, it was darn near impossible to get fired from a federal job. >>Bullshit. I've seen Feds in the office get fired for nonperformance
long before DOGE existed.
And how many were fired in comparison to how many remained in those roles? >>Great question, since you're who's trying to justify every individual
fired as having been incompetent: so what's the answer?
I have a problem with ATC trainees being given the answers to critical exams because
they are not intelligent enough to learn the material.
No, that's your assumption of what's happening: how many actual USAJOBS
applications have you yourself personally processed?
And just because they are DEI hires.
<https://www.dailymail.co.uk/video/news/video-3386099/DEI-activist-heard-offering-answers-air-traffic-control-entry-exam.html>
Nope. Because if you actually knew how the sausage is made, you'd know
where it is broken and if you had anyone trying to apply, you'd offer
them any & all tips you knew to get them past the bullshit gates.
For example, back in 2019 I suggested a friend apply for a position and
they declined my offer of application coaching ... and they failed at
the first gate. When we discussed it, I gave them a proverbial slap
upside the head because on a language requirement they gave themselves
only a 3 on a 1-5 scale instead of 5, because the requirement was a "do
you have proficiency?", and they downgraded their score because they
knew that their proficiency was high, but that a local could determine
that they weren't a fellow local (ie, they'd have an accent).
This is an example of where honest high proficiency candidates do get
themselves excluded because they hold themselves to a higher standard.
Didn't think I was starting such a LONG thread ....
Short version - the 60s/70s ATC system is OVER -
cannot be supported any more. No more experts,
no more parts, no more nothin'
IF we don't fix it QUICK then ANY kind of air
travel/commerce in the USA just *ENDS*
If I was an insurer ... NOPE !!!
Govt has been notoriously bad at "quick" -
not to mention "within budget".
Musk and buds CAN get it done fairly quick and
well ... BUT that's not how all the contractors
will DO it. THEY want it to take a DECADE. They
want it to cost TEN TIMES the initial estimate.
This is the NORM. Govt projects - like WOW !
We don't HAVE a decade folks.
This fix is going to take aggressive presidential
action - a big dick behind the project.
NO delays, NO over-pricing ... GET IT DONE FAST.
On Wed, 21 May 2025 01:19:52 -0400, c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> wrote:
Musk and buds CAN get it done fairly quick and
well ... BUT that's not how all the contractors
will DO it. THEY want it to take a DECADE. They
want it to cost TEN TIMES the initial estimate.
This is the NORM. Govt projects - like WOW !
All this bs and drama with Musk in Washington to cut spending and you
guys just keep talking about how we need to spend more, not less.
On Wed, 21 May 2025 23:10:54 -0400, c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> wrote:
If you JUST GOTTA then you JUST GOTTA. Really looks
like the ATC system has hit the final level of
degradation and we HAVE to have a good working system.
Bad timing, but what's new in the universe eh ?
Timing nothing. The GOP in Congress have been working overtime to
starve essential services of capital needed for efficient operation.
Then they complain about inefficiencies and claim they'll fix it
followed by an orgy of spending that drives up the debt but due to corruption, doesn't solve the problems.
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